No Time To Die: Production Diary

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  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe "I need a year off" Craig
    edited April 2017 Posts: 7,316
    Walecs wrote: »
    Or maybe they kill Bond in the pts Sean Connery style

    And the whole movie will focus on Madeleine as the main character. Wouldn't a James Bond-less movie be an ingenious thing to do?

    I have always thought another Bond-less PTS would be a great idea. I like how the early Moore era set the stage for the adventure before Bond makes his entrance.

    Regarding this writers strike issue, I heard they were asking for 3 times what was offered initially. It doesn't seem like an agreement will be reached without considerable compromise from both ends of the negotiating table. It's unclear what sort of impact a strike would have on Bond, but it can't be said to help the situation. Let's hope nothing else crops up to add to this pickle.
  • dominicgreenedominicgreene The Eternal QOS Defender
    Posts: 1,756
    How about we just ignore Madeline and maybe SP as a whole next time around
  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,094
    Nah.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 I've missed you all.
    Posts: 28,416
    How about we just ignore Madeline and maybe SP as a whole next time around

    People really need to get an idea such as this out of their heads. There is no way an era that was built and run on continuity is just going to wipe the last film from its memory, especially when that film ended with Bond turning away from his old life. It's going to be addressed; it's unavoidable at this point.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 19,983
    Yeah and I for one don't mind. They set up something interesting which, despite its flaws, could, in the hands of capable screenwriters, result in a superb film, a film that doesn't need a lot of story building but can kick into gears all at once. I'm not saying we need James Bond the soap series, but with conflicts already existing before the gun barrel sequence so to speak, we might reach impressive heights early on.
  • Posts: 5,767
    How about we just ignore Madeline and maybe SP as a whole next time around

    People really need to get an idea such as this out of their heads. There is no way an era that was built and run on continuity is just going to wipe the last film from its memory, especially when that film ended with Bond turning away from his old life. It's going to be addressed; it's unavoidable at this point.
    Why? QoS was ignored completely.

  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,094
    Not in Spectre.
  • boldfinger wrote: »
    How about we just ignore Madeline and maybe SP as a whole next time around

    People really need to get an idea such as this out of their heads. There is no way an era that was built and run on continuity is just going to wipe the last film from its memory, especially when that film ended with Bond turning away from his old life. It's going to be addressed; it's unavoidable at this point.
    Why? QoS was ignored completely.

    That's actually just what came to my mind. SF picked up from QOS with no mention of Quantum or White or Vesper or Bond officially "returning to service." What's more, SF appeared to simply leap over years' worth of Bond's career. Who's to say B25 won't do the same, especially if there's a new director or if P&W are writing for a TBD Bond actor (both terms pure speculation)?
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited April 2017 Posts: 23,883
    I personally find it quite unlikely that EON can incorporate the Madeline/Bond/Blofeld 'love and hate' triangle in a manner which I will find satisfactory. It's more likely they'll do it in a manner which I will find annoying. Still, there is a chance that they could surprise me, but I'm not holding my breath. If this group is back, I'll watch it of course, but will probably save my enthusiasm for other franchises and for B26 when there will be an inevitable and much welcome (from my perspective at least) changing of the guard.
  • Posts: 5,767
    If they make a good standalone film, they can use Blofeld, Madeline or whomever however they want.
  • Posts: 11,425
    I think a Bond film where Bond only appears a third of the way I would be quite ingenious. Tough to pull off but could be interesting.

    Alternatively why not be really original and have Bond go rogue...
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 I've missed you all.
    Posts: 28,416
    boldfinger wrote: »
    How about we just ignore Madeline and maybe SP as a whole next time around

    People really need to get an idea such as this out of their heads. There is no way an era that was built and run on continuity is just going to wipe the last film from its memory, especially when that film ended with Bond turning away from his old life. It's going to be addressed; it's unavoidable at this point.
    Why? QoS was ignored completely.

    How so? SP connected everything, with SF being a slight breather as GF was for the SPECTRE saga of the 60s. In SP, everything that'd happened to Bond since CR was addressed or was felt in impact. That's not a series of films forgetting each other. If EON wanted to forget QoS we'd have never seen White or Quantum again, for instance, much less have the newest film involve Bond protecting White's actual daughter. In many ways, SP is the sequel to QoS.

    For the people who want to use the "SF didn't follow up QoS" argument, what happened at the end of QoS that was as consequential as Bond leaving MI6 for a retired life? That's right.
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,566
    boldfinger wrote: »
    How about we just ignore Madeline and maybe SP as a whole next time around

    People really need to get an idea such as this out of their heads. There is no way an era that was built and run on continuity is just going to wipe the last film from its memory, especially when that film ended with Bond turning away from his old life. It's going to be addressed; it's unavoidable at this point.
    Why? QoS was ignored completely.

    How so? SP connected everything, with SF being a slight breather as GF was for the SPECTRE saga of the 60s. In SP, everything that'd happened to Bond since CR was addressed or was felt in impact. That's not a series of films forgetting each other. If EON wanted to forget QoS we'd have never seen White or Quantum again, for instance, much less have the newest film involve Bond protecting White's actual daughter. In many ways, SP is the sequel to QoS.

    For the people who want to use the "SF didn't follow up QoS" argument, what happened at the end of QoS that was as consequential as Bond leaving MI6 for a retired life? That's right.

    Fully agreed. It's ludicrous to say otherwise, frankly.
  • The head of the world's most dangerous criminal organization, which had successfully infiltrated MI6 for years, remained at large. If that doesn't need to be addressed, Bond returning to business as usual after a holiday with Madeleine doesn't need to be addressed (or at least not with any larger ceremony than a chipper "Good to have you back, 007" from ol' Q).
  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,094
    Tanner referenced QOS in Skyfall. "We may have a few friends left in the CIA."
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,566
    Murdock wrote: »
    Tanner referenced QOS in Skyfall. "We may have a few friends left in the CIA."

    I also find Bond's line, "I know when a woman is afraid and pretending not to be" as an implicit nod to Vesper.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 I've missed you all.
    Posts: 28,416
    The head of the world's most dangerous criminal organization, which had successfully infiltrated MI6 for years, remained at large. If that doesn't need to be addressed, Bond returning to business as usual after a holiday with Madeleine doesn't need to be addressed (or at least not with any larger ceremony than a chipper "Good to have you back, 007" from ol' Q).

    It's quite clear Quantum was pulled back, and around the time of SP was done away with entirely. With how many operations Bond was stopping, post-QoS Quantum had to hide under the blanket to avoid throwing more eyes on it and SPECTRE through association. It made no sense for them to continue operating at a fifth of their old capacity.
  • Let's face it, SPECTRE is going to be used again and again and again by Eon now that they have the rights. They're going to use SPECTRE so frequently that even the most diehard SPECTRE fans among us will be exhausted of it and will cry out for a standalone film. There's no way around that. But B25 can certainly pick things up without Waltz's Blofeld (who is incarcerated), without SPECTRE (who just lost their leader), and without Madeleine (who follows a long line of never-again mentioned Bond girls, several of whom developed far more convincing relationships with their leading men). Just as SF distinguished itself entirely apart from its predecessor, so too can B25 carry on without picking up all the threads from SP.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe "I need a year off" Craig
    Posts: 7,316
    The head of the world's most dangerous criminal organization, which had successfully infiltrated MI6 for years, remained at large. If that doesn't need to be addressed, Bond returning to business as usual after a holiday with Madeleine doesn't need to be addressed (or at least not with any larger ceremony than a chipper "Good to have you back, 007" from ol' Q).

    It's quite clear Quantum was pulled back, and around the time of SP was done away with entirely. With how many operations Bond was stopping, post-QoS Quantum had to hide under the blanket to avoid throwing more eyes on it and SPECTRE through association. It made no sense for them to continue operating at a fifth of their old capacity.

    That's not clear at all. Not from the films.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Just as SF distinguished itself entirely apart from its predecessor, so too can B25 carry on without picking up all the threads from SP.
    I agree. It definitely can, but will it? I have serious doubts, particularly if Craig is back. In that case, I'm betting on a follow up to SP. That is the primary reason to have him back actually. Otherwise it's best just to start fresh and leave the past behind entirely.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 I've missed you all.
    Posts: 28,416
    The head of the world's most dangerous criminal organization, which had successfully infiltrated MI6 for years, remained at large. If that doesn't need to be addressed, Bond returning to business as usual after a holiday with Madeleine doesn't need to be addressed (or at least not with any larger ceremony than a chipper "Good to have you back, 007" from ol' Q).

    It's quite clear Quantum was pulled back, and around the time of SP was done away with entirely. With how many operations Bond was stopping, post-QoS Quantum had to hide under the blanket to avoid throwing more eyes on it and SPECTRE through association. It made no sense for them to continue operating at a fifth of their old capacity.

    That's not clear at all. Not from the films.

    That Quantum was absorbed? Seems pretty clear to me.
  • QuantumOrganizationQuantumOrganization We have people everywhere
    Posts: 1,187
    boldfinger wrote: »
    How about we just ignore Madeline and maybe SP as a whole next time around

    People really need to get an idea such as this out of their heads. There is no way an era that was built and run on continuity is just going to wipe the last film from its memory, especially when that film ended with Bond turning away from his old life. It's going to be addressed; it's unavoidable at this point.
    Why? QoS was ignored completely.

    How so? SP connected everything, with SF being a slight breather as GF was for the SPECTRE saga of the 60s. In SP, everything that'd happened to Bond since CR was addressed or was felt in impact. That's not a series of films forgetting each other. If EON wanted to forget QoS we'd have never seen White or Quantum again, for instance, much less have the newest film involve Bond protecting White's actual daughter. In many ways, SP is the sequel to QoS.

    For the people who want to use the "SF didn't follow up QoS" argument, what happened at the end of QoS that was as consequential as Bond leaving MI6 for a retired life? That's right.
    That's not what you said, though. You stated that Craig's films are so connected that the next film always follows up on the remaining elements from the previous film. SF disproves your point.

  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,729
    I almost don't want a bond 25 the more that I think about it because EON and MGM and the creative team are so inept and just seem like they will be unable to deliver a great bond film in the next couple years.
  • QuantumOrganizationQuantumOrganization We have people everywhere
    Posts: 1,187
    I almost don't want a bond 25 the more that I think about it because EON and MGM and the creative team are so inept and just seem like they will be unable to deliver a great bond film in the next couple years.
    You Crazy.

  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 I've missed you all.
    Posts: 28,416
    boldfinger wrote: »
    How about we just ignore Madeline and maybe SP as a whole next time around

    People really need to get an idea such as this out of their heads. There is no way an era that was built and run on continuity is just going to wipe the last film from its memory, especially when that film ended with Bond turning away from his old life. It's going to be addressed; it's unavoidable at this point.
    Why? QoS was ignored completely.

    How so? SP connected everything, with SF being a slight breather as GF was for the SPECTRE saga of the 60s. In SP, everything that'd happened to Bond since CR was addressed or was felt in impact. That's not a series of films forgetting each other. If EON wanted to forget QoS we'd have never seen White or Quantum again, for instance, much less have the newest film involve Bond protecting White's actual daughter. In many ways, SP is the sequel to QoS.

    For the people who want to use the "SF didn't follow up QoS" argument, what happened at the end of QoS that was as consequential as Bond leaving MI6 for a retired life? That's right.
    That's not what you said, though. You stated that Craig's films are so connected that the next film always follows up on the remaining elements from the previous film. SF disproves your point.

    That's not exactly what I said, no. It does help to read clearly. I said the Craig era is based on continuity, which it is. You know that the man you see in SF is the same from CR and QoS, and he's developed from the man he was in those films in a way that can be empirically calculated. These films tell each leg of Bond's journey, and so the last ones matter in who he's come to be in the newest film, and onward. The angry and vulnerable Bond of CR led to the quiet and (eventually) peaceful man at the end of QoS, who led into the more professional and lively man of SF and SP. There is also a wealth of callbacks in each movie to the last ones, in not only the cinematography, but also in dialogues and little lines here and there. They're moments for the fans, and they don't beat you over the head with them, which is why it's thrilling to uncover them. Continuity isn't limited to obvious references to previous films, it's how the characters in the present relate to who they were in the past, and how far they've come in their development. Each character in the Craig era has had that sort of development, major or minor.

    I'm simply calling out the contention that films like QoS have been abandoned by the series, which couldn't be farther from the truth. SP disproves that ten times over, in more ways than one. How this randomly got onto a general continuity discussion is beyond me.
  • I believe the original point was that SF moved on from QOS without addressing any of the characters, plot points, or story threads from its predecessor, therefore there's no reason to think B25 can't do the same with SP.

    As @bondjames states, the real question here is will they? SP fared roughly the same as QOS critically (slightly poorer according to Rotten Tomatoes) and both fell quite short of their immediate predecessors.

    Just looking at recent history, the clean slate approach of Skyfall makes sense, but if creative control remains in the hands of Craig and Mendes, we very well might see Spectre, Pt. Deux instead.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 I've missed you all.
    Posts: 28,416
    I believe the original point was that SF moved on from QOS without addressing any of the characters, plot points, or story threads from its predecessor, therefore there's no reason to think B25 can't do the same with SP.

    As @bondjames states, the real question here is will they? SP fared roughly the same as QOS critically (slightly poorer according to Rotten Tomatoes) and both fell quite short of their immediate predecessors.

    Just looking at recent history, the clean slate approach of Skyfall makes sense, but if creative control remains in the hands of Craig and Mendes, we very well might see Spectre, Pt. Deux instead.

    Again, SP ended in a fashion that had to be followed up, and that basically teased another part outright, whereas QoS was the ending to the two part arc CR had set up; there wasn't any hanging thread to continue. It was the ending from which a new chapter could be written. We're still in that next chapter, which SF and SP started.

    I also think the reaction to SP has been blown out of the water, as too many people listen to American critics instead of looking internationally. There were an overwhelming number of places where SP outclassed SF, especially financially. I think QoS got hate for not being enough of a Bond film, and strangely SP got hate for being too much of a Bond film. Good luck finding the logic in that drivel.
  • I'm not saying I agree with the critical reception. I think enormously highly of QOS and there are obviously very strong supporters of SP as well. Nevertheless, QOS and SP have been at large received very differently from CR and SF.

    As for B25 having to follow up from where SP left off, I'm afraid we simply disagree on this point. What did SP tease that needs to be immediately followed on from? Blofeld is in prison. SPECTRE ostensibly is a headless snake now. Sure, they could drum up another SPECTRE story, break Blofeld out of prison or whatnot, but they don't need to. The threat is done with. Unlike QOS actually, where the threat was very much alive and out there and yet went completely ignored in SF. That's all I'm saying. There isn't anything SP started that can't be ignored for a film or two—or more.
  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    Posts: 3,126
    Love how some people talk about another franchise in this thread.

    Unfortunately when there no bond 25 news people will do that
  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    Posts: 3,126
    jake24 wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Tanner referenced QOS in Skyfall. "We may have a few friends left in the CIA."

    I also find Bond's line, "I know when a woman is afraid and pretending not to be" as an implicit nod to Vesper.
    Where was that line from?
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