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Quantum of Solace Appreciation Thread- We Found a Better Place to Meet

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  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited May 2016 Posts: 8,127
    Yeah Craig should have been in his prime during SF, like Connery in GF or Moore in TSWLM. Sometimes I think that CR was too popular for its own good. It caused EON to milk that Bond going rogue - Bond dealing with loss - Bond finding closure arc for each of his subsequent films. By the time of SF he should have put all that behind him, but instead he's locked in a kind of stasis, with the writers having to find increasingly tenuous personal trauma to him overcome: QoS " Well, Vespers dead, let's kill off Mathis next!" SF "Er, Dench is kind of a mother figure, let's run with that." SP "long lost brother?"

    I'd say that the Craig era is just as formulaic as any other when it comes down to it.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2016 Posts: 23,883
    @Creasy47, I agree with you. I was able to accept SF for what it was on the action front (underwhelming) because the character work was superb in that film imho (a Mendes specialty). However, due to the script problems we didn't get even half as good dialogue and character work in SP (imho) and so the spotlight was thrown more on the action for me, and I noticed the flaws much more.

    @Mendes4Lyfe, it's my understanding that Craig & Co. wanted to move on from the Quantum & Vesper storyline post-QoS (I remember Craig saying he was done with that, and I'm not sure if that was due to the tepid response to QoS). Mendes is the one who wanted to kill off Dench (in fact, if I'm not mistaken, it was his centrepiece proposition for becoming a Bond director - non negotiable). Given Craig's earlier desire to be done with the Vesper thing I'm not sure why they brought it all back for SP.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,692
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »

    I'd say that the Craig era is just as formulaic as any other when it comes down to it.
    And really, I don't mind that. Craig's era gave us three great ones and one okay one (which one is the 'just okay' one I'll leave up to the individual fan).
    :P
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,127
    bondjames wrote: »
    @Creasy47, I agree with you. I was able to accept SF for what it was on the action front (underwhelming) because the character work was superb in that film imho (a Mendes specialty). However, due to the script problems we didn't get even half as good dialogue and character work in SP (imho) and so the spotlight was thrown more on the action for me, and I noticed the flaws much more.

    @Mendes4Lyfe, it's my understanding that Craig & Co. wanted to move on from the Quantum & Vesper storyline post-QoS (I remember Craig saying he was done with that, and I'm not sure if that was due to the tepid response to QoS). Mendes is the one who wanted to kill off Dench (in fact, if I'm not mistaken, it was his centrepiece proposition for becoming a Bond director - non negotiable). Given Craig's earlier desire to be done with the Vesper thing I'm not sure why they brought it all back for SP.

    I'm not just talking about Vesper, it's like they took CR as the modern day GF and gave Bond the exact same emotional arc in all of them. Bond goes rogue - Bond loses someone close to him - Bond finds closure in time for the closing credits. Then the process starts over. What started as a one film arc has been strung out over an entire tenure. I'm begging EON to return to simple missions with Bond 7.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,692
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    I'm begging EON to return to simple missions with Bond 7.
    That's probably why I like SPECTRE so much; it's as close to a 'simple mission' as we've gotten in quite a few years now.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    @Creasy47, I agree with you. I was able to accept SF for what it was on the action front (underwhelming) because the character work was superb in that film imho (a Mendes specialty). However, due to the script problems we didn't get even half as good dialogue and character work in SP (imho) and so the spotlight was thrown more on the action for me, and I noticed the flaws much more.

    @Mendes4Lyfe, it's my understanding that Craig & Co. wanted to move on from the Quantum & Vesper storyline post-QoS (I remember Craig saying he was done with that, and I'm not sure if that was due to the tepid response to QoS). Mendes is the one who wanted to kill off Dench (in fact, if I'm not mistaken, it was his centrepiece proposition for becoming a Bond director - non negotiable). Given Craig's earlier desire to be done with the Vesper thing I'm not sure why they brought it all back for SP.

    I'm not just talking about Vesper, it's like they took CR as the modern day GF and gave Bond the exact same emotional arc in all of them. Bond goes rogue - Bond loses someone close to him - Bond finds closure in time for the closing credits. Then the process starts over. What started as a one film arc has been strung out over an entire tenure. I'm begging EON to return to simple missions with Bond 7.
    You do have a point. I had noticed it with SF for sure. Mendes definitely was cribbing from the CR playbook (including Bond theme for a signature moment etc.).
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,127
    chrisisall wrote: »
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    I'm begging EON to return to simple missions with Bond 7.
    That's probably why I like SPECTRE so much; it's as close to a 'simple mission' as we've gotten in quite a few years now.

    Yeah, me too. :)>-
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    edited May 2016 Posts: 40,513
    I think SP is pretty far from a simple mission to me: more unnecessary delving into Bond's past, and the fifth movie in a row involving Bond being rogue and/or untrustworthy. We need to get away from that.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,127
    bondjames wrote: »
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    @Creasy47, I agree with you. I was able to accept SF for what it was on the action front (underwhelming) because the character work was superb in that film imho (a Mendes specialty). However, due to the script problems we didn't get even half as good dialogue and character work in SP (imho) and so the spotlight was thrown more on the action for me, and I noticed the flaws much more.

    @Mendes4Lyfe, it's my understanding that Craig & Co. wanted to move on from the Quantum & Vesper storyline post-QoS (I remember Craig saying he was done with that, and I'm not sure if that was due to the tepid response to QoS). Mendes is the one who wanted to kill off Dench (in fact, if I'm not mistaken, it was his centrepiece proposition for becoming a Bond director - non negotiable). Given Craig's earlier desire to be done with the Vesper thing I'm not sure why they brought it all back for SP.

    I'm not just talking about Vesper, it's like they took CR as the modern day GF and gave Bond the exact same emotional arc in all of them. Bond goes rogue - Bond loses someone close to him - Bond finds closure in time for the closing credits. Then the process starts over. What started as a one film arc has been strung out over an entire tenure. I'm begging EON to return to simple missions with Bond 7.
    You do have a point. I had noticed it with SF for sure. Mendes definitely was cribbing from the CR playbook (including Bond theme for a signature moment etc.).

    I'm pretty sure that Mendes has admitted to using CR as a guide before, around 2012. I seem to remember an interview where he said that he followed the CR method of having an action set piece at the beginning, middle and end.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,127
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    I think SP is pretty far from a simple mission to me: more unnecessary delving into Bond's past, and the fifth movie in a row involving Bond being rogue and/or untrustworthy. We need to get away from that.

    I agree with that. Don't forget though, Bond was given a mission by M in SP, just not the current one. ;)
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,692
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    the fifth movie in a row involving Bond being rogue and/or untrustworthy. We need to get away from that.

    keep-calm-and-go-rogue-21.jpg
  • MalloryMallory Do mosquitoes have friends?
    Posts: 2,066
    I really enjoy QoS... Partly because I fancy Olga
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Mallory wrote: »
    I really enjoy QoS... Partly because I fancy Olga
    An excellent reason, and one which influences my appreciation for many Bond films as well.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,692
    "Dey all sluts." - Conan of Cimmeria
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,513
    The relationship between Bond and Olga is amazing. Their final scene together is one of my favorites.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,692
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    The relationship between Bond and Olga is amazing. Their final scene together is one of my favorites.
    It was almost brother & sister. One of the most touching moments in a Bond movie IMHO.

  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    Fair enough, I just happen to disagree. I especially dislike that bit where Craig vaults over that banister and beats up those guards in the elevator. That felt very Bourne.

    And that's the standard we should be measuring Bond against these days is it? Christ that says it all. What happened to Bond leading the way?

    Anyway just finished watching QOS (was at my uncle's and it was on Sky and he suggested we watch it. What am I gonna to say? I'm English - I'd rather watch Bond than talk about meanignful family stuff) and have to say that after how it has risen in my estimations in the past few viewings it really didn't go down well this time.

    The main problem I had was with the initial interaction with Camille. I found myself unable to understand Bond's logic at all. He meets this random woman who he knows nothing about, except that Slate is supposed to kill her, but for some reason decides to attack the boats she's on despite having no idea what is going on.

    Can anyone explain to me, give the events presented to Bond in the film, why he comes to the conclusion that he needs to ram his boat into Medrano's to rescue this girl whom, given he is not party to the dialogue between her and Gresne, he doesn't even know for sure is in any trouble when she sets off with Medrano?

  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 8,571
    if i'm not mistaken, the second unit director (in charge of set-pieces and action sequences) of QoS was the same as the Bourne series.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,692
    TheWizardOfIce wrote: »
    Can anyone explain to me, give the events presented to Bond in the film, why he comes to the conclusion that he needs to ram his boat into Medrano's to rescue this girl whom, given he is not party to the dialogue between her and Gresne, he doesn't even know for sure is in any trouble when she sets off with Medrano?
    Bond has that 'girl-in-trouble' Spidey sense. Duh.

    :))
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,513
    Is that so? I'd enjoy seeing him return, may be in the minority with that: that type of action, just dialed down a bit to work in a good story.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,692
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Is that so? I'd enjoy seeing him return, may be in the minority with that: that type of action, just dialed down a bit to work in a good story.
    Not dialed down, just photographed & edited a tad more relaxed.
    :D
  • dominicgreenedominicgreene The Eternal QOS Defender
    Posts: 1,756
    Agree with all your comments @Creasy47 . Glad to see some QoS love :D
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,513
    dominicgreene wrote: »
    Agree with all your comments @Creasy47 . Glad to see some QoS love :D

    Same to you, though I suppose the username and activity status was a dead giveaway on your end. ;)

    It's always been one of my favorites, one of those guaranteed Top 5-Top 10 entries that'll never move. On some days, I feel it ranks just a little bit higher than CR.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    edited May 2016 Posts: 28,694
    Almost a decade after its release, the opening chase, Slate fight, Tosca sequence and hotel finale remain as some of my favorite Bond moments of all time. I'll always have this movie's back, and it does some deep and fascinating things with Bond and his world that brought Dan's era that much closer to high art.
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 3,985
    QoS is the Bond film I watch the most. It gets better with each successive viewing.

    It's a lean mean Bond film. No fat on it and not one wasted scene.

    This is Craig's best performance as Bond in my opinion. He's mean and tough in this and really is a man on a mission.

    Personally I love the way the action is edited. It's fast, frenetic and razor sharp. When you've watched that car chase a few times you do realize just how well it's been shot and edited. Love it!

    So many great scenes in this. Too many to mention. But my favourite is the confrontation with M in the hotel. Great acting from Dench and Craig here.

    Love Arnold's score as well. That music when Bond enters the theatre is really memorable and I love that music as Bond and Camille walk across the desert. And as usual his action cues are superb.

    A very underrated Bond film. It's not my favourite Bond film but it's climbing up my list!
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,127
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    QoS is the Bond film I watch the most. It gets better with each successive viewing.

    It's a lean mean Bond film. No fat on it and not one wasted scene.

    This is Craig's best performance as Bond in my opinion. He's mean and tough in this and really is a man on a mission.

    Personally I love the way the action is edited. It's fast, frenetic and razor sharp. When you've watched that car chase a few times you do realize just how well it's been shot and edited. Love it!

    So many great scenes in this. Too many to mention. But my favourite is the confrontation with M in the hotel. Great acting from Dench and Craig here.

    Love Arnold's score as well. That music when Bond enters the theatre is really memorable and I love that music as Bond and Camille walk across the desert. And as usual his action cues are superb.

    A very underrated Bond film. It's not my favourite Bond film but it's climbing up my list!



    I agree with anything that is highlighted. Great post. :)
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,513
    @Mendes4Lyfe, well that was a quick turnaround! Today, you're praising how the action in QoS was handled and just how well it was shot and edited, and yet yesterday you stated it's impossible to follow, needlessly frenetic, and overly tight. Which is it?
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,127
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    @Mendes4Lyfe, well that was a quick turnaround! Today, you're praising how the action in QoS was handled and just how well it was shot and edited, and yet yesterday you stated it's impossible to follow, needlessly frenetic, and overly tight. Which is it?

    Er, if you reread my last post I said: I agree with everything that is highlighted.

    The part about the action isn't highlighted.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2016 Posts: 23,883
    I've been watching a few Bond films lately. As others have mentioned, I miss some of the immersive location work that we see in earlier films. It really was a Bond differentiator in the past, and gave some of the earlier films a travelogue element. I almost travelled vicariously through Bond, and in fact did visit many of the locations in person when I got older.

    One thing I will say about QoS is that it does take us to some great locations, and given there is limited CGI at play (unlike SP), one does really feel like one is there. The vibrant colour work also helps in this regard.

    As I said yesterday, if only they'd 'lingered' a little longer in these places (like Siena), and edited the action a little less frenetically, I'd easily have this as a top 10 film, even with the lack of romance in it, which is saying something because that is normally a key requirement for me in a highly rated Bond film.

    I guess what I'm saying is what it does well, it does really well.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,513
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    @Mendes4Lyfe, well that was a quick turnaround! Today, you're praising how the action in QoS was handled and just how well it was shot and edited, and yet yesterday you stated it's impossible to follow, needlessly frenetic, and overly tight. Which is it?

    Er, if you reread my last post I said: I agree with everything that is highlighted.

    The part about the action isn't highlighted.

    My apologies. For some reason, I was reading the bolded text as his comments, and the un-bolded parts as your replies to him. I was going to say, you must've rewatched QoS a few times yesterday and flip-flopped on your opinion rather quickly!
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