Which 007 flick has the worst final 3rd : DAD,DAF,TND,SP ? *Edited to be a 4 way choice*

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  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Strog wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    I'd rate TND as 2nd worse. Terribly cliched and trite ending. Bond twirling the machine gun around, the horrid kiss of life under water etc. etc. A poor man's TSWLM.
    For me, if that last act had been improved, TND would put considerable distance between itself and the rest of Brosnan's entries.

    Across the board Brosnan had the weakest final acts.

    EDIT: I do hate Rambo Bond, but after reflection I'd say TWINE had a much less interesting final act than TND.
    TND from when Bond and Wai Lin are captured just descends into constant machine gun fire. Just background noise. A generic 90s action film without any of the gore or cheesiness that makes those films fun. Not memorable in the slightest. Whenever I watch TND up until the end of Hamburg I can hardly fault it. It could be one of my favourites if the last third wasn't so dull and forgettable. I do like bits of the bike chase though.
    I agree. TND is a pretty good film up to when Wai Lin and Bond find HMS Devonshire. It collapses on itself after that and loses that special Bondian aura. What we're left with is rather mundane and pedestrian.
  • Fire_and_Ice_ReturnsFire_and_Ice_Returns The Bright Side of the Road.
    Posts: 19,428
    @thelivingroyale I am a fan of Robert Carlyle though I struggle with the character Renard throughout TWINE, when Elecktra dies I feel the main threat has gone the submarine sequence feels after the fact though there are a few good underwater shots admittedly.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Even though I'm not a fan of TWINE, I don't really mind the ending actually. The torture sequence is quite thrilling and the sub section is ok. Sure it could have been better, but I've seen worse. I actually think it's quite a step up from the middle section (intro to Renard, killing of Davidov, first confrontation with Renard, mental breakdown in Baku, first meeting with Zukovsky etc.) which is where I really have issues.
  • Fire_and_Ice_ReturnsFire_and_Ice_Returns The Bright Side of the Road.
    Posts: 19,428
    TWINE just does not flow for me the action scenes and character moments all seem shoehorned into what's a borderline drama, Apted has done good work previous to TWINE though not the best choice IMO for a Bond director.
  • edited September 2017 Posts: 12,724
    @thelivingroyale I am a fan of Robert Carlyle though I struggle with the character Renard throughout TWINE, when Elecktra dies I feel the main threat has gone the submarine sequence feels after the fact though there are a few good underwater shots admittedly.

    I've read that a lot, that Elektra dying should have been the ending. And I can see where you're coming from but for me, her being dead adds a lot more to the final fight scene.

    I can see where you're coming from with Renard. I really like him and think what the film did, building him up as this big threat only to reveal that Elektra is the true villain and turns Renard into an oddly sympathetic character, was brilliant. But Robert Carlyle probably should have been saved for a bigger role in a different film. Does seem a waste to have got him and not have him be the main villain.
    bondjames wrote: »
    Strog wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    I'd rate TND as 2nd worse. Terribly cliched and trite ending. Bond twirling the machine gun around, the horrid kiss of life under water etc. etc. A poor man's TSWLM.
    For me, if that last act had been improved, TND would put considerable distance between itself and the rest of Brosnan's entries.

    Across the board Brosnan had the weakest final acts.

    EDIT: I do hate Rambo Bond, but after reflection I'd say TWINE had a much less interesting final act than TND.
    TND from when Bond and Wai Lin are captured just descends into constant machine gun fire. Just background noise. A generic 90s action film without any of the gore or cheesiness that makes those films fun. Not memorable in the slightest. Whenever I watch TND up until the end of Hamburg I can hardly fault it. It could be one of my favourites if the last third wasn't so dull and forgettable. I do like bits of the bike chase though.
    I agree. TND is a pretty good film up to when Wai Lin and Bond find HMS Devonshire. It collapses on itself after that and loses that special Bondian aura. What we're left with is rather mundane and pedestrian.

    Definitely agree and that's why I prefer DAD. It's stupid from Iceland onwards but it's at least fun and high concept. Sprinting after a moving plane, getting on board at the last minute and fighting a villain in a mech suit while two hot women in sports bras have a sword fight in the other room as the plane crashes into the Korean demilitarised zone is very OTT and the CGI is piss poor but it's still unmistakeably James Bond. But just running around shooting people in a sea of explosions? The series built its popularity on outrageous high concept scenarios (and before anyone says the books weren't, I'll just remind them of the time Bond saved London from being blown up by a nazi by redirecting the missile to the villains escape submarine, or the time he was forced to battle a giant squid). One of the worst things a Bond film can be is a generic action film imo. And that's why out of the three put forward TND is definitely the worst finale for me.
  • edited September 2017 Posts: 676
    TND is dull, but never offensive (sort of like the whole movie post-Hamburg). And DAD is just as bad as the rest of the movie. So I'll say SP. Why? Because the start of the movie is amazing, the middle is fine, and the ending is awful. It's the biggest drop in quality from the rest of the film to the ending. And with a Craig film, I actually have higher expectations. So the fact that a lot of Spectre plays like a Brosnan movie was a major disappointment to me.

    However, TWINE trumps all of these.
  • Posts: 1,841
    Count me for the TWINE write-in vote. It was challenge enough prior to and after Elektra's death it's completely anti-climactic. There just doesn't seem as much on the line as with many of the others at that point. It's just like get it over already

    One of the things that always bothered me about DAD's finale was how easily Bond and Jinx penetrated the airfield, using plain old wire cutters to get through the fence, speedily I might add, and then jogging down the taxiway to catch the plane. Great security there.

    Also, the invisible car gets all the hate, but does anybody else find those sky glider things they use to parachute to the air field pretty goofy too? They're like something you'd find more out of a G.I. Joe or Transformers movie than Bond.
  • BT3366 wrote: »
    Also, the invisible car gets all the hate, but does anybody else find those sky glider things they use to parachute to the air field pretty goofy too? They're like something you'd find more out of a G.I. Joe or Transformers movie than Bond.

    To be fair weren't they based on real tech or something? Not that it makes it less goofy mind, but people always use that to defend the jetpack in TB so I think the same applies here.
  • Posts: 19,339
    Plus it was mentioned that these were only on loan/hired to Renard,so this shows that Renard isn't exactly flush with money,so anything more 'flash' would have made that remark redundant,so it fits in well imo.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e il momento che verrà
    Posts: 6,145
    I quite liked TWINE, Bond fighting his own lungs to save Istanbul.
    No oneliner to accompany Renard's death either if I recall correctly.
  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,184
    Just a satisfying grin after shouting "She's waiting for you!" :D
  • edited September 2017 Posts: 19,339
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    I quite liked TWINE, Bond fighting his own lungs to save Istanbul.
    No oneliner to accompany Renard's death either if I recall correctly.

    No not at all,he just said "She's waiting for you ".
    A good line,in a very underrated Bond film,imo.

  • Posts: 11,175
    Renard's "welcome to my nuclear family" line is an especially Low point of the TWINE final. And Brosnan overacting.

    "So is she"
  • edited September 2017 Posts: 4,541
    I think its fair to look at both concept and execution?

    So with DAD, the idea of Bond fighting the bad guy as the transport aircraft starts to disintigrate/break up. On paper, Ive no problem with that, sounds great. Could have worked on a DC4 within a previous era?

    In comparison, SP on paper does not work...worse then on the screen.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Spectre. Easily the weakest third act in a Bond film history. Or at least one of them...

    ...Still better than Skyfall.
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,151
    I'm going with SP. The London finale does nothing for me. The crater scene should have been extended and ended there. But the whole film prevented that from happening due to the fact that Bond was on his own/rogue whatever you wanna call it. It would have been cool to see the British coming to free Bond and having a full on battle on the crater base. And it still could have left off with Blofeld escaping if they wanted to go that route.
  • BAIN123 wrote: »
    Renard's "welcome to my nuclear family" line is an especially Low point of the TWINE final. And Brosnan overacting.

    "So is she"

    Loved the nuke fambly quote. So cheesy it's marvelous. One of Perverse and Weird's best.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    edited September 2017 Posts: 38,243
    It was a tough one initially, but I'd easily say SP. At least the other two had Brosnan hamming it up and cutting foes down in a carefree way, which made for some sense of fun on top of a typical, bombastic James Bond ending.

    SP's finale is devoid of anything fun, exciting, intense, or memorable to me.
  • edited September 2017 Posts: 19,339
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    Renard's "welcome to my nuclear family" line is an especially Low point of the TWINE final. And Brosnan overacting.

    "So is she"

    Loved the nuke fambly quote. So cheesy it's marvelous. One of Perverse and Weird's best.

    Same here...and I don't think Brosnan is over-acting either,in the "haven't you heard,so is she !" moment.
    Bond is exhausted,freezing cold,wet from swimming outside the submarine twice,and is shaking with the effort of containing Renard and the aforementioned cold/wet etc.

    Not to mention the pain from the damaged shoulder,which he is forced to use.

    I like TWINE ;)

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    He looks like he's constipated when he delivers that line to me. Straining. Not his finest hour, but it's far from the worst bit of acting from him in TWINE.
  • Posts: 19,339
    bondjames wrote: »
    He looks like he's constipated when he delivers that line to me. Straining. Not his finest hour, but it's far from the worst bit of acting from him in TWINE.

    He is straining..he is straining to keep a much stronger opponent at bay with a damaged shoulder,and losing !

  • Posts: 5,863
    My take on the TWINE climax:
    - Brosnan's "So is she" is fine. At that point, Bond is half choked to death, after all!
    - The sequence in which Bond goes outside the sub and back in is a fine one. It alone disqualifies the movie from having the worst final third.
    - Elektra is dead, but there is a bomb about to destroy Istambul. That's fairly serious, I'd imagine.

    Of the other three films, I think DAD has the worst last third. The action in the plane is just not interesting and varied enough; the whole sequence is overall dull. Kenneth Tsang's acting is the best thing in it.

    Regarding Spectre, in the London scenes, the bit with the photos in the MI6 firing range is a bit too heavyhanded (why do they always uses promo stills in these types of scenes?), but I like the idea of Blofeld pushing Bond's buttons in such a theatrical, dramatic way; it's just that the sequence lived or died by its execution, and they didn't get it quite right. I do enjoy the moment in which Bond talks with Blofeld across the glass, in a stripped down set, and there is an overall surreal, oniric quality to that scene that I appreciate. Bond rescuing Madeleine and taking down Blofeld from afar feels unsatisfying, uninspired. But whatever I like or dislike about the London scenes, the film leaves me wishing there was more happening at the crater... the escape is too brief and simple. The film should've stayed there! So, second worst.

    TND is great fun; sheer uncomplicated spectacle! I love Stamper's face when he is about to blow up.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 7,574
    Brosnan's performance is the least of the TWINE finale's problems. It's poor pacing and lack of tension are bigger killers of it for me. It needed a serious kick of adrenaline.

    TND leaves it for dust. At least the shoot em' up approach there was good fun.
  • Eric_007Eric_007 Mobile
    edited September 2017 Posts: 26
    Toomorrow Never dies Spectre shouldn't even be on this list honestly. People complained SKYFALL had a home alone ending and that movie was good so don't even get started about thirds. TWINE is the best of The Brosnan Missions I doubt he had any boring endings. Spectres ending was very symbolic more than action oriented which I can respect because it's one era of MI6 ending with a new one beginning Everything he believed in Left in Ruins I believe is what Frans said. Very fitting ending made perfect sense. Neither of those films belong on the list. But. Die another Day takes the cake that whole 3rd act was pure generic Spy Action. Except for that Ice Car chase that was litty
  • edited September 2017 Posts: 832
    Spectre easily. Basically no enjoyment out of the final third, its actually terrible and a chore to watch. Tomorrow never dies doesn't belong on this list.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 6,523
    Outside of GE, all of Brosnan's final acts were generic crap and the worst thing about each of his last three films. Boring, terribly shot, awful one liners, identical set ups and execution;

    Sp was equally lazy and bankrupt of creativity. It truly is a chore to sit through-- something I will not voluntarily do again!

  • edited September 2017 Posts: 11,175
    Ottofuse8 wrote: »
    Spectre easily. Basically no enjoyment out of the final third, its actually terrible and a chore to watch. Tomorrow never dies doesn't belong on this list.

    I would agree with you if the fight between Bond and Stamper wasn't so poorly staged. I used to find it thrilling but Stamper's mugging always makes me snigger.

    I agree though that the SP ending is tough to get through btw.
  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 2,998
    Ottofuse8 wrote: »
    Spectre easily. Basically no enjoyment out of the final third, its actually terrible and a chore to watch. Tomorrow never dies doesn't belong on this list.

    This.
  • Posts: 19,339
    I have had a re-think and ,i agree with most of the members in here that TND shouldnt be part of the 3 films discussed.

    I forgot the grenade moment Bond had ,which is vintage Bond.

    Therefore,i have taken out TND and replaced it with the limp lettuce ending that belongs to DAF..

    Hope this meets with your approval fellow members !
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 7,574
    barryt007 wrote: »
    I have had a re-think and ,i agree with most of the members in here that TND shouldnt be part of the 3 films discussed.

    I forgot the grenade moment Bond had ,which is vintage Bond.

    Therefore,i have taken out TND and replaced it with the limp lettuce ending that belongs to DAF..

    Hope this meets with your approval fellow members !

    Very much so. DAF gets my vote. Not even the campy, explosive end to Mr. Wint and Mr. Kidd can save DAF from the simply rubbish final third.
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