SPECTRE--last Craig-era film?

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  • Posts: 4,619
    IMO, there is no way you can put a positive spin on if you announce beforehand that "SPECTRE/B25/B26..." is the last Craig Bond movie. Because everyone knows it won't mean it's the last Bond. There is in fact zero suspense. The buzz would be about who will be the next Bond.

    How about "COME AND WATCH THE ENDING OF THE CRAIG ERA"? No Bond actor before got a proper ending. DAF was just another Bond film with Connery (in fact, it was more about his return than his retirement). OHMSS had a cliffhanger ending. AVTAK was just another Bond film with Moore. LTK was just another Bond film with Dalton. DAD was just another Bond film with Brosnan.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,090
    The end of Bale's Batman was the end of everything around him too. We never expected Nolan to shoot a movie about Robin after that, and it was clear Bale was not retiring because he was getting too old and so on. An announcement that SPECTRE would be Craig's last would have 'negativity' written all over it IMO : for instance we'd hear stories about Craig's injuries while Cruise still does his own stunts, or half of his interviews would be about who will play Bond next, etc. Bale was never asked who would play Batman next.

    That's because batman isn't Bond and has nowhere near the circus type event that Bond goes through with each outing. It's a massive deal just to know who's singing the title song. The media goes into a frenzy if Bond doesn't order a vodka martini. The level of interest for various aspects of what goes into making a Bond movie are almost theatrical. How many movies and franchises put on the sort of press conferences the Bond movies have been doing consistently for 50 years? Hell, the new id4 movie tried and failed to copy the SF press announcement. Bond is just a different beast altogether and is it's own show, a quality no other movie has. When Bond number 7 is cast, that'll be the same day people will also be talking about who Bond number 8 should be. It's just one of many tricks of the Bond circus that can't be escaped so you're not entirely right to just assume nothing positive can come from it but it does all depend on how it's marketed.
  • Posts: 725
    Can't think of anything more destructive to promoting a Bond film like SP than announcing beforehand that it's Craig's last Bond. Instead if keeping the press and the net concentrated on promoting the film, the press will be 100% dedicated to an orgy of who will be Bond 7, helped along mightily by every actor and their PR machines shoving themselves into the story. And what press isn't concentrated on the next Bond stories, lead by the DM, they will be dining out on endless gossip and rumours about why Craig is leaving. Is he quitting, is he angry about something, was he pushed. If you are EON this is not the way you want your $300m film promoted.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe Still waiting for the Jena Malone Batwoman movie that's never going to be made.Moderator
    Posts: 12,068
    I don't think such an announcement will harm the film. It might even do the opposite, being his last and all.
  • The only way that I could see them advertising Spectre as Craig's last is if they had framed it as an ending to a self contained story with a definite ending right from the beginning, similar to the way they marketed The Dark Knight Rises as the "epic conclusion to the Dark Knight Trilogy."
  • Posts: 553
    It's at best a gamble. So I'd rather they didn't.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited July 2015 Posts: 23,883
    It's at best a gamble. So I'd rather they didn't.

    I agree, although I think it's possible to pull it off. I remember reading somewhere that they did this for MR (i.e. promoted it as Moore's last since he was expected to leave after that) and that film was the worldwide #1 for 1979 (not even TB, SF, or any other Bond film can boast that feat). I know we like to denigrate MR, but its incredible box office success in 1979 should not be discounted.
  • Posts: 553
    Yes, it's very possible it'll work. I'm just thinking what's the point of taking that sort of risk on a series that has had its marketing down pat in the last 20 years
  • Posts: 2,081
    The end of Bale's Batman was the end of everything around him too. We never expected Nolan to shoot a movie about Robin after that, and it was clear Bale was not retiring because he was getting too old and so on. An announcement that SPECTRE would be Craig's last would have 'negativity' written all over it IMO : for instance we'd hear stories about Craig's injuries while Cruise still does his own stunts, or half of his interviews would be about who will play Bond next, etc. Bale was never asked who would play Batman next.

    I agree the two situations can't really be compared at all. It worked perfectly there - with a particular story arch of the main character over those 3 movies, in a particular universe created for that trilogy. The actor was done with the role only because the director was and the story was written accordingly, ending that story arch, and so he couldn't have possibly continued with it for that reason. The Bond situation is entirely different.
    smitty wrote: »
    Can't think of anything more destructive to promoting a Bond film like SP than announcing beforehand that it's Craig's last Bond. Instead if keeping the press and the net concentrated on promoting the film, the press will be 100% dedicated to an orgy of who will be Bond 7, helped along mightily by every actor and their PR machines shoving themselves into the story. And what press isn't concentrated on the next Bond stories, lead by the DM, they will be dining out on endless gossip and rumours about why Craig is leaving. Is he quitting, is he angry about something, was he pushed. If you are EON this is not the way you want your $300m film promoted.

    Ugh. I can only imagine.
    The only way that I could see them advertising Spectre as Craig's last is if they had framed it as an ending to a self contained story with a definite ending right from the beginning, similar to the way they marketed The Dark Knight Rises as the "epic conclusion to the Dark Knight Trilogy."

    In theory, yes. But they'd have to have Bond either retire or die, I suppose (otherwise how could it be a definite ending), and I can't really imagine that happening with Bond, it would be pretty weird.
    It's at best a gamble. So I'd rather they didn't.

    Yup.
  • Posts: 1,082
    SP won't be Craig's last. Guaranteed. Not only has he signed on for more, but I think there is something solid in the rumors of SP being connected directly with the Bond 25. If they are setting up SPECTRE as an organization and possibly Blofeld as a character, they won't stop with one. They have a great thing going here, with a 2nd Golden Age for the franchise, and the powers that be will do everything they can to keep the train rolling and we should be thankful.

    I'd love to see a full trilogy from Mendes and if Craig's 5th is his last, so be it. It will be a nice send off for a great bond. I hope he does 6 total, though, to match Connery. I think that's what he wants deep down, because he knows he's been on that level and he wants to be known as one of the Bond greats like Sean and Rog.
  • Posts: 159
    Just a simple thought/question: How can it be his last since the next one is strongly speculated to be a continuation of SPECTRE?
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,090
    Kostas_P wrote: »
    Just a simple thought/question: How can it be his last since the next one is strongly speculated to be a continuation of SPECTRE?

    The one thing that bothers me about this situation is, if Swan gets a tragic ending in SP or in Bond 25, it's going to be a dicey situation for the actress that gets cast as the new Bond girl. I'm still salty at how QoS wasted both Arterton and Olga and I can just tell it's going to be a similar situation again. This is the problem when you put Bond in these types of romantic situations, he'll get all depressed again and the role of the next Bond girl will end up being a waste.
  • ThomasCrown76ThomasCrown76 Augusta, ks
    Posts: 757
    Who says they have to kill her? Have her break up with him.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,090
    Does that really seem likely to you?
  • Posts: 553
    Bond 25 will just be them fighting over how to divide their record collections
  • ThomasCrown76ThomasCrown76 Augusta, ks
    Posts: 757
    Just would be unexpected.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited July 2015 Posts: 23,883
    Who says they have to kill her? Have her break up with him.
    Nobody breaks up with James Bond (unless she's a villain). It's inconceivable.
  • ThomasCrown76ThomasCrown76 Augusta, ks
    Posts: 757
    She leaves him for another woman
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited July 2015 Posts: 23,883
    She leaves him for another woman
    That I can live with, and from what I've heard, Seydoux has already played a character who enjoys this sort of dalliance (in Blue is the Warmest Colour). It would still be a first though (Bond has been known to convert women to the straight and narrow.....witness Pussy).
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,021
    I think what most forget is that when Bond 25 hits the theatre (in my opinion in 2018) Craig will be 50 years old. This alone will make huge headlines and probably negative ones, the media will start to ask if he's not too old etc.

    Let's face it, Broccoli/Wilson wasted Craig.
    The 4 year gap between QOS and SF is inexcusable, the 3 year gap between SF and SP even more inexcusable.
    There will be only 5 Craig movies within a whopping 12 years. That's a first and I very hope it will not happen again.

    Never underestimate the aging process. Craig does not look that good anymore as most want to believe. It's still perfectly ok how he looks but in 2018?? Or even later???

    The main reason some want Craig to make 6 movies is because then they have another argument to put him on the same level as Connery as if that would help make Craig anything like Connery, it's just ridiculous.

    We should be thankful that Skyfall was such a success. Without the 50th anniversary and the most perfect marketing campaign SF may have just had the normal growth and made 750 million. How would people look upon the Craig era then?
    The billion dollar box office single-handedly saved Craig from becoming just another Bond actor. Let's see how Spectre does. Success is everything in the short term.
    If it does as good as SF everything is swell. If it does "only" 850 million the media will quickly write the obituary for Craig and he is done.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,090
    I think what most forget is that when Bond 25 hits the theatre (in my opinion in 2018) Craig will be 50 years old. This alone will make huge headlines and probably negative ones, the media will start to ask if he's not too old etc.

    Really? Connery and Moore We're over 50 when they made their respective last Bond movies. Brosnan was 49 when DAD was released; he and many others expected and wanted him to return which would have made him at least 50 at the earliest by the time he would have filmed his scenes for his potential 5th Bond movie. Yet, Craig who has obviously aged since 2006 still looks good, is in better physical shape than his predecessors were when they were in their prime and hasn't changed much in his appearance. If Tom Cruise is making positive headlines for being 53 and doing these leading man action movies; it's not a problem for Craig to still be in the role at 50.
    Let's face it, Broccoli/Wilson wasted Craig.
    The 4 year gap between QOS and SF is inexcusable, the 3 year gap between SF and SP even more inexcusable.

    I agree that the producers have somewhat squandered time and that's mainly from the period between SF abd SP. They wasted time by waiting for Mendes and they wasted time by not checking Logan and allowing him to go unsupervised for months with his atrocious script.
    As for QoS to SF, that couldn't be helped because MGM had filed for chapter 11 and then went under a restructuring so that was something unavoidable.
    There will be only 5 Craig movies within a whopping 12 years. That's a first and I very hope it will not happen again.

    That is unfortunate but you have to remember 4 out of those 12 years were out of EoN's control but 5 movies is still a credible and amazing run for a Bond actor who simultaneously didn't ever give off the feeling of oversaturation.
    Never underestimate the aging process. Craig does not look that good anymore as most want to believe. It's still perfectly ok how he looks but in 2018?? Or even later???

    The aging process from a certain perspective is what has helped Craig imo. Since CR people have said he looks old and as I said earlier he has obviously aged since 2006 but he more or less looks the same. His aged and burned out look for SF was intentional and if you saw him during his promo tours for SF he looked nothing like how he looked in the film. I was fortunate enough to attend the Royal Premiere of SF and stood a few feet away from him and he dud indeed looked years younger than he did in SF.
    In SP Craig looks great, again looking younger than he did in SF and as he ages over the next 2 to 3 years it's not going to be as jarring compared to how Connery, Moore and Brosnan aged while still in the role of Bond.
    The main reason some want Craig to make 6 movies is because then they have another argument to put him on the same level as Connery as if that would help make Craig anything like Connery, it's just ridiculous.

    Where are you getting your information from? I havnt seen anyone anywhere maje such claims. Doing 5 movies puts Craig on the same level as Connery? That's absurd. For starters, Connery made 7 Bond movies, 6 being with EoN so doing 5 movies would still leave Craig lacking in output. Secondly, quality over quantity, many people already regard Craig as the best ever and many were already saying that back in 2006. That's how much of an impact statement Craig made with his brilliant performance in an equally brilliant movie.
    We should be thankful that Skyfall was such a success. Without the 50th anniversary and the most perfect marketing campaign SF may have just had the normal growth and made 750 million. How would people look upon the Craig era then?

    Finances aside, the film would have been regarded the same. SF isn't perfect, far from but it's a good movie and Bond was back after a 4 year hiatus. The Craig era is so far regarded positively and that has a lot to do with him as an actor. Irrespective of the quality if his Bond movies the one constant is Craig's performances. SP will be incredibly influential particularly amongst Bond fans how the Craig era will be looked at but to the GA Bond isn't some fluffy, jokey popcorn garbage anymore.
    The billion dollar box office single-handedly saved Craig from becoming just another Bond actor.

    Wrong. His performance in CR did that. The billion dollar box office did more for the movies from there on out than it did for Craig. Craig had already been doing what he wants to do and what the movies need before the billion dollar BO came in; which is attract and work with excellent talent in front of and behind tge camera.
    Let's see how Spectre does. Success is everything in the short term.
    If it does as good as SF everything is swell. If it does "only" 850 million the media will quickly write the obituary for Craig and he is done.

    SP will do fine as long as the movie is good but you're making illinformed statements to say Craig is done if SP only makes 850 million. As it is, there are numerous medi outlets that believe SP will be a great film but aren't expecting it to be another billion dollar movie and tgat has nothing to do with the film's quality. It's a highly competitive year not just with the spy genre but in general. We'll see how things turn out but first things first, SP has to delivered the goods on screen and as long as it manages that then even if it makes 750 million Craig won't be getting the boot.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,021
    @doubleoego

    Nice reply, thanks. I don't agree with everything you say, but your points are valid of course.

    Just a word to how Craig was perceived in general.
    That's really depending on the point of view one has.
    CR did well in 2006, the steady growth that Bond movies had at the box office was continued with CR. QOS did a bitter less good than CR.
    Up to that point (QOS) Craig was by no means viewed in general as being as good as Connery or even being the best. Far from it.
    But he was accepted by about anyone as a good successor to Brosnan who keeps the franchise going in a strong way.

    Skyfall changed that quite a bit. A billion dollar is hard to beat with arguments. Now Craig is on a pedestal carried by box office success and very good critics.
    Skyfall's weight in the public's perception is so much heavier than Casino Royale even if that one is viewed as better by critics and rankings on several websites like imdb for example.
    That just shows how irrational things are viewed upon by many.
  • edited August 2015 Posts: 1,644
    Re:

    http://www.inquisitr.com/2192867/henry-cavill-as-james-bond-rumors-increase-as-daniel-craigs-departure-nears/

    Just suggesting this...

    What if Cavill could pull out of his Superman contract, risk some economic penalty by Warner (breach of contract) and sign up for (potentially) more money as Bond when Craig leaves the role?

    I'd like to think there will be a few credible contenders when Craig leaves - it won't be just Cavill - but there is there the possibility Cavill could pull out of future Superman films (such as Justice League part 3 - he's contracted to parts 1 and 2), risk the studio's wrath and any financial penalty, and go with Bond after Craig leaves (assuming Eon want him!). I dunno if he's considered this but you never know...

    If Craig quits after SPECTRE, Cavill could chance his luck and ditch Superman after the release of Justice League part 2 (release date 2019 - but likely to be filmed in 2018). A Cavill Bond film could be released in 2020.

  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Costa Mucho
    Posts: 41,948
    Yeah, and then Craig can take over as Superman. Just imagine. A Blond Superman.
  • Posts: 725
    I've watched Cavill getting interviewed and saw his Superman. He's 3 for 3. No personality, no acting talent, and if Uncle tanks (which it is possibly tracking to do) no BO appeal.
  • Posts: 1,644
    Yeah, and then Craig can take over as Superman. Just imagine. A Blond Superman.

    Your wish is answered!

    21j5d2v.jpg


    ;))
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,021
    fanbond123 wrote: »
    Yeah, and then Craig can take over as Superman. Just imagine. A Blond Superman.

    Your wish is answered!

    21j5d2v.jpg


    ;))

    a blonde Superman isn't more ridiculous than a blond James Bond
    :-O
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Costa Mucho
    Posts: 41,948
    He uses his ears to fly instead of the low gravity on Earth.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,090
    fanbond123 wrote: »
    Re:

    http://www.inquisitr.com/2192867/henry-cavill-as-james-bond-rumors-increase-as-daniel-craigs-departure-nears/

    Just suggesting this...

    What if Cavill could pull out of his Superman contract, risk some economic penalty by Warner (breach of contract) and sign up for (potentially) more money as Bond when Craig leaves the role?

    I'd like to think there will be a few credible contenders when Craig leaves - it won't be just Cavill - but there is there the possibility Cavill could pull out of future Superman films (such as Justice League part 3 - he's contracted to parts 1 and 2), risk the studio's wrath and any financial penalty, and go with Bond after Craig leaves (assuming Eon want him!). I dunno if he's considered this but you never know...

    If Craig quits after SPECTRE, Cavill could chance his luck and ditch Superman after the release of Justice League part 2 (release date 2019 - but likely to be filmed in 2018). A Cavill Bond film could be released in 2020.

    FlyingPigs.gif
  • Posts: 725
    I'd love to think that EON would never pick a minimal talent like CavIll simply because he's pretty. Craig raised the acting bar too much for them to go that route.

    But if EON is dumb enough to to pick Smith for the title theme, than yes, they are more than capable of picking Cavill.
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