The Horror Thread II: The Return

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  • Posts: 6,682
    I'm still thinking about the exploding guy in that Pearl trailer.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,371
    I'm really looking forward to Pearl. X is one of the best horror films of the last 10 years, maybe even 20.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,882
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Scars of Dracula - I thought it was a bit too comedic and goofy and tonally all over the place in the first act, and I found the character of Simon to be weak and inconsistently performed, but the rest of the film gave me huge Hell Night vibes and I loved it more and more as I went along. The weaknesses are pretty stark but the positives are very, very strong. I think it's one of (if not the) my favorite performances from Lee as Dracula thus far too; he's way more relentless, brutal and ice cold. This one was very entertaining.

    You're approaching the final 3, where Hammer experimented with the Dracula films.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    Posts: 2,895
    Strangely, Scars of Dracula was never shown on British tv during the '70s and '80s. All the other Hammer Draculas were repeated time and again, but this one was always left out. Bond connection: Jenny Hanley and Anoushka Hempel from Scars were both among the girls at Piz Gloria in OHMSS.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489

    Anyone seen this? I remember seeing it back in the 80s, and it was really bizarre. Not very good, just unpleasant.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,371

    Anyone seen this? I remember seeing it back in the 80s, and it was really bizarre. Not very good, just unpleasant.

    Oh man, my girlfriend suggested this one about a year or two back and it totally floored me. It's now one of my all time favorite horror films, I think. What a maddening and insane experience with really, really great performances.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    Posts: 2,895
    Isabelle Adjani said it took her several years to get over making Possession, while Sam Neill said he only just escaped with his sanity intact!
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,371
    They're both brilliant in it, especially Adjani. That's one of the finest performances I think I've ever seen (that mind-numbing subway sequence is so horrifying).
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,448
    I would love to engage in some Satanic horror. On set or in real life, doesn't matter. I'm not trying to be difficult.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    Posts: 2,895
    Isabelle Adjani had to let Roman Polanski touch her up in The Tenant - she knows true horror...
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Venutius wrote: »
    Isabelle Adjani had to let Roman Polanski touch her up in The Tenant - she knows true horror...

    I think this is what @DarthDimi meant.
  • edited August 2022 Posts: 6,682
    I saw Possession, and apart from some superficial things, I didn't understand what the hell it was about. But it sure was compelling. I would totally watch it again.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,882
    mattjoes wrote: »
    I saw Possession, and apart from some superficial things, I didn't understand what the hell it was about. But it sure was compelling. I would totally watch it again.

    I think that about sums it up. The only two things I remember about Possession, are Adjani having sexy time with a tentacled monster, and the scene in the underpass.
  • Creasy47 wrote: »

    Anyone seen this? I remember seeing it back in the 80s, and it was really bizarre. Not very good, just unpleasant.

    Oh man, my girlfriend suggested this one about a year or two back and it totally floored me. It's now one of my all time favorite horror films, I think. What a maddening and insane experience with really, really great performances.

    Well, it’s an allegory for divorce so it’s kind of unpleasant by design (a great date night movie, by the way). I found it a fascinating film. It was pretty long ago when I watched it. I should revisit it someday.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    edited August 2022 Posts: 2,895
    Possession is a relentlessly and remorselessly bleak film, with few redeeming features or characters, and it leaves a nasty, lingering aftertaste. On the other hand, it's got Isabelle Adjani in it. Well, there you go...
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,371
    It took me a bit to finally start Dracula A.D. 1972 because I thought I was out of place and somehow missed an installment, given the awesome opening, only to realize it was shot for this sequel and messes up the continuity, which I found jarring. I'm glad I didn't miss anything, though, because that opening was excellent (and I'm loving seeing a baby-faced Michael Kitchen and Caroline Munro here).
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,448
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    It took me a bit to finally start Dracula A.D. 1972 because I thought I was out of place and somehow missed an installment, given the awesome opening, only to realize it was shot for this sequel and messes up the continuity, which I found jarring. I'm glad I didn't miss anything, though, because that opening was excellent (and I'm loving seeing a baby-faced Michael Kitchen and Caroline Munro here).

    I'm glad you approve of the experimental nature of the film. Next up is the final installment, Satanic Rites, which some love for its originality and others hate for its lack of originality. ;-) And then there is the Legend Of The 7 Golden Vampires, which I would call the CR67 of this series.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,371
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    It took me a bit to finally start Dracula A.D. 1972 because I thought I was out of place and somehow missed an installment, given the awesome opening, only to realize it was shot for this sequel and messes up the continuity, which I found jarring. I'm glad I didn't miss anything, though, because that opening was excellent (and I'm loving seeing a baby-faced Michael Kitchen and Caroline Munro here).

    I'm glad you approve of the experimental nature of the film. Next up is the final installment, Satanic Rites, which some love for its originality and others hate for its lack of originality. ;-) And then there is the Legend Of The 7 Golden Vampires, which I would call the CR67 of this series.

    Yeah I'm going to check out both of those over the weekend so I can finally have seen them all. Some installments are objectively better than others and some were very inviting and entertaining to me. Gotta say I've enjoyed myself so far overall!
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    edited August 2022 Posts: 13,882
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    It took me a bit to finally start Dracula A.D. 1972 because I thought I was out of place and somehow missed an installment, given the awesome opening, only to realize it was shot for this sequel and messes up the continuity, which I found jarring. I'm glad I didn't miss anything, though, because that opening was excellent (and I'm loving seeing a baby-faced Michael Kitchen and Caroline Munro here).

    Agreed with Dimi on AD 1972. Glad you liked that one, Creasy. The opening with it's minimal explanation, is one of the reasons that is is one of the better films, imo.

    The next one is the one that I can't wait to read your thoughts on it. Again, as Dimi said, it's possibly the most divisive entry in the series. I'm definitely in the former camp, though, I love it, and am not going to feel bad for doing so. Among other reasons, SATANIC RITES, has my favourite cast of the Hammer Draculas. A pity it couldn't have had Veronica Carlson, but... oh well.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,371
    Agreed! It had me itching to seek out the installment I somehow missed so I could enjoy that ending in full but glad I realized it was an original decision instead. It's a really great one.

    It is interesting to see all the chances and new opportunities they take as the series progresses, instead of falling back on the same premise over and over again (which they seemed to do when they weren't sure if Lee was returning or not).
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,882
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Agreed! It had me itching to seek out the installment I somehow missed so I could enjoy that ending in full but glad I realized it was an original decision instead. It's a really great one.

    It is interesting to see all the chances and new opportunities they take as the series progresses, instead of falling back on the same premise over and over again (which they seemed to do when they weren't sure if Lee was returning or not).

    There was a growing amount of bad blood between Lee and Hammer by this point. Lee wanted a Dracula film closer to the book (he got his wish, though not with Hammer). As for Hammer, when Lee told them he was done with their Dracula films, Hammer tried to emotionally blackmail him into returning (if Lee wasn't Dracula, the film wouldn't get made, and all those people won't be paid). For those reasons, Lee hated the last few Dracula films he did for Hammer. He also criticized the dialogue, going so far as to refuse to say the worst lines.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,371
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Agreed! It had me itching to seek out the installment I somehow missed so I could enjoy that ending in full but glad I realized it was an original decision instead. It's a really great one.

    It is interesting to see all the chances and new opportunities they take as the series progresses, instead of falling back on the same premise over and over again (which they seemed to do when they weren't sure if Lee was returning or not).

    There was a growing amount of bad blood between Lee and Hammer by this point. Lee wanted a Dracula film closer to the book (he got his wish, though not with Hammer). As for Hammer, when Lee told them he was done with their Dracula films, Hammer tried to emotionally blackmail him into returning (if Lee wasn't Dracula, the film wouldn't get made, and all those people won't be paid). For those reasons, Lee hated the last few Dracula films he did for Hammer. He also criticized the dialogue, going so far as to refuse to say the worst lines.

    That's awful to hear. I know one of the earlier installments also had a bit of controversy due to Lee claiming he refused to speak the horrible lines he was given whereas the screenwriter claimed he didn't want Dracula speaking (despite him speaking early on in the series). I wonder who was telling the truth.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,448
    Hammer was feeling the pressure of American cinema. Gothic horror was going out of style and the American distributors demanded the Hammer films to be spiced up and somewhat modernized. And so Hammer started experimenting with its formula, showed more nudity, or even tried its own "Rosemary's Baby" with To The Devil A Daughter. But there was no way that Hammer could ever compete with The Last House On The Left, The Texas Chainsaw Massacre, or The Omen. Besides, even under new management, such films were simply not Hammer's style. You can amp things up a little but you can't suddenly change the DNA of your company. While I applaud some of their mid-70s attempts at staying fresh and relevant, I can see why the plug was eventually pulled. A short-lived TV series was all that happened until a more recent (albeit unprolific) resurgence.

    It's a strange story. In the late '50s, Hammer blew in with films that were more thrilling than most American horror pictures. And for a while, Hammer kept delivering film after film after film, some of them so "vile" in the eyes of the critics, that they wrote angry reviews condemning the indecent boldness of these films. Eventually, American horror hit back hard, and now the British output stayed behind. It was suddenly deemed too softcore to please an audience hungry for independent B flicks like Night Of The Living Dead.

    The Funny thing is that I've always been fond of British horror films. They are usually low-budget, but several of them are really unforgettable. Think 28 Days Later: A British horror film, made on a shoestring budget, but absolutely relentless in its satire and horror.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,882
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Agreed! It had me itching to seek out the installment I somehow missed so I could enjoy that ending in full but glad I realized it was an original decision instead. It's a really great one.

    It is interesting to see all the chances and new opportunities they take as the series progresses, instead of falling back on the same premise over and over again (which they seemed to do when they weren't sure if Lee was returning or not).

    There was a growing amount of bad blood between Lee and Hammer by this point. Lee wanted a Dracula film closer to the book (he got his wish, though not with Hammer). As for Hammer, when Lee told them he was done with their Dracula films, Hammer tried to emotionally blackmail him into returning (if Lee wasn't Dracula, the film wouldn't get made, and all those people won't be paid). For those reasons, Lee hated the last few Dracula films he did for Hammer. He also criticized the dialogue, going so far as to refuse to say the worst lines.

    That's awful to hear. I know one of the earlier installments also had a bit of controversy due to Lee claiming he refused to speak the horrible lines he was given whereas the screenwriter claimed he didn't want Dracula speaking (despite him speaking early on in the series). I wonder who was telling the truth.

    I might be mistaken, but I think there's an interview with Lee, online, where he talks about about the dialogue that he refused to speak. I might be misremembering, but I am sure I have seen such an interview.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,371
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Agreed! It had me itching to seek out the installment I somehow missed so I could enjoy that ending in full but glad I realized it was an original decision instead. It's a really great one.

    It is interesting to see all the chances and new opportunities they take as the series progresses, instead of falling back on the same premise over and over again (which they seemed to do when they weren't sure if Lee was returning or not).

    There was a growing amount of bad blood between Lee and Hammer by this point. Lee wanted a Dracula film closer to the book (he got his wish, though not with Hammer). As for Hammer, when Lee told them he was done with their Dracula films, Hammer tried to emotionally blackmail him into returning (if Lee wasn't Dracula, the film wouldn't get made, and all those people won't be paid). For those reasons, Lee hated the last few Dracula films he did for Hammer. He also criticized the dialogue, going so far as to refuse to say the worst lines.

    That's awful to hear. I know one of the earlier installments also had a bit of controversy due to Lee claiming he refused to speak the horrible lines he was given whereas the screenwriter claimed he didn't want Dracula speaking (despite him speaking early on in the series). I wonder who was telling the truth.

    I might be mistaken, but I think there's an interview with Lee, online, where he talks about about the dialogue that he refused to speak. I might be misremembering, but I am sure I have seen such an interview.

    I'd love to see it. I just saw some snippets of it on the Wiki page after I watched the film and couldn't help but side with Lee. Dracula spoke before in the series and I don't see why he'd make up a story like that if there was simply no dialogue written down. I guess the screenwriter was embarrassed by that call-out and tried to save face with a lie.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,882
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Agreed! It had me itching to seek out the installment I somehow missed so I could enjoy that ending in full but glad I realized it was an original decision instead. It's a really great one.

    It is interesting to see all the chances and new opportunities they take as the series progresses, instead of falling back on the same premise over and over again (which they seemed to do when they weren't sure if Lee was returning or not).

    There was a growing amount of bad blood between Lee and Hammer by this point. Lee wanted a Dracula film closer to the book (he got his wish, though not with Hammer). As for Hammer, when Lee told them he was done with their Dracula films, Hammer tried to emotionally blackmail him into returning (if Lee wasn't Dracula, the film wouldn't get made, and all those people won't be paid). For those reasons, Lee hated the last few Dracula films he did for Hammer. He also criticized the dialogue, going so far as to refuse to say the worst lines.

    That's awful to hear. I know one of the earlier installments also had a bit of controversy due to Lee claiming he refused to speak the horrible lines he was given whereas the screenwriter claimed he didn't want Dracula speaking (despite him speaking early on in the series). I wonder who was telling the truth.

    I might be mistaken, but I think there's an interview with Lee, online, where he talks about about the dialogue that he refused to speak. I might be misremembering, but I am sure I have seen such an interview.

    I'd love to see it. I just saw some snippets of it on the Wiki page after I watched the film and couldn't help but side with Lee. Dracula spoke before in the series and I don't see why he'd make up a story like that if there was simply no dialogue written down. I guess the screenwriter was embarrassed by that call-out and tried to save face with a lie.

    It's one of him in his later years.


    Found it:

  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,371
    Thanks so much, @MajorDSmythe, that's really cool to see.

    And while I didn't absolutely love it, I still really, really enjoyed Dracula A.D. 1972 for what it was and I'm thoroughly loving The Satanic Rites of Dracula but I'm only halfway through. I admire their risky attempts to try something new and it still retains a dark atmosphere and all the occult madness that comes with it.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,448
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Thanks so much, @MajorDSmythe, that's really cool to see.

    And while I didn't absolutely love it, I still really, really enjoyed Dracula A.D. 1972 for what it was and I'm thoroughly loving The Satanic Rites of Dracula but I'm only halfway through. I admire their risky attempts to try something new and it still retains a dark atmosphere and all the occult madness that comes with it.

    I love its experimental nature but I resent its somewhat dull police research story. That's why this one lands in the middle of my Dracula ranking. I guess I'm going with

    1) Prince
    2) Taste
    3) Dracula

    4) A.D. 1972
    5) Satanic Rites
    6) Brides

    7) Risen
    8) Scars
    9) Golden Vampires

    Jess Franco's Count Dracula with Lee was made outside of Hammer and shows a different Dracula, but I find it to be a sort of spiritual sequel/sidequel to the Hammer series. If I had to include it, I'd almost put it in the second place. It's dark and cold, but arguably much closer to Stoker. Not that a good Dracula film has to be, mind.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Thanks so much, @MajorDSmythe, that's really cool to see.

    And while I didn't absolutely love it, I still really, really enjoyed Dracula A.D. 1972 for what it was and I'm thoroughly loving The Satanic Rites of Dracula but I'm only halfway through. I admire their risky attempts to try something new and it still retains a dark atmosphere and all the occult madness that comes with it.

    I love its experimental nature but I resent its somewhat dull police research story. That's why this one lands in the middle of my Dracula ranking. I guess I'm going with

    1) Prince
    2) Taste
    3) Dracula

    4) A.D. 1972
    5) Satanic Rites
    6) Brides

    7) Risen
    8) Scars
    9) Golden Vampires

    Jess Franco's Count Dracula with Lee was made outside of Hammer and shows a different Dracula, but I find it to be a sort of spiritual sequel/sidequel to the Hammer series. If I had to include it, I'd almost put it in the second place. It's dark and cold, but arguably much closer to Stoker. Not that a good Dracula film has to be, mind.

    I liked that one better than the Hammer films.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,371
    I'll have to add that one to the list then once I finish this and have seen the Golden Vampires one. This one moves far away from the original releases but occult snipers? A tucked away army of nude female vampires? I'm digging it.
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