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James Bond on Blu-ray/4K

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  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    Posts: 6,724
    The AVTAK gunbarrel still looks off center in the 4K version. I don't know if that's how its's meant to look. I'm going to take a look at my SE out of curiosity.
  • TorgeirtrapTorgeirtrap
    Posts: 17,280
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    Very generous of you, thanks @Torgeirtrap ! Later down the line screencaps of the main titles would be helpful, depending on which films.

    Send me a PM when you need them, and I'll send you the screencaps you want. If I have time to do it, I can also edit out the black bars. :-)
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    edited September 2019 Posts: 6,724
    AVTAK gunbarrel:

    SE DVD:

    l3C1kl3.png

    UE DVD (from @MakeshiftPython):

    a-view10.jpg

    4K iTunes (from @MakeshiftPython):

    avtak111.png

    The 4K print appears to be slightly cropped to the right.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    edited September 2019 Posts: 8,025
    mattjoes wrote: »
    The AVTAK gunbarrel still looks off center in the 4K version. I don't know if that's how its's meant to look. I'm going to take a look at my SE out of curiosity.

    Yeah, you're not wrong. The 4K looks like it's slightly stretched to towards the right side of the screen when you go back and forth. Here's the SE, UE, and 4K for comparison.





    2000 SE DVD
    01AVTAKSEDVD.png

    2006 UE DVD
    01AVTAKUEDVD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    01AVTAK4K.png



    EDIT: Beat me to it mattjones!
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,025
    And to take it a bit further, here's the helicopter shot seconds after the iris opens up.


    2000 SE DVD
    02AVTAKSEDVD.png

    2006 UE DVD
    02AVTAKUEDVD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    02AVTAK4K.png
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    Posts: 6,724
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    EDIT: Beat me to it mattjones!

    No worries, @MakeshiftPython.

    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    And to take it a bit further, here's the helicopter shot seconds after the iris opens up.


    2000 SE DVD
    02AVTAKSEDVD.png

    2006 UE DVD
    02AVTAKUEDVD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    02AVTAK4K.png

    Yes, some image information is lost on the right. Shame that we still haven't reached an ideal AVTAK print in terms of the frame.
  • TorgeirtrapTorgeirtrap
    edited September 2019 Posts: 17,280
    Wonder what reason they had for placing the image off center?
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    edited September 2019 Posts: 8,025
    It's funny how with each step of improvement one format makes there's also one step back. UE has better color definition of the white glaciers, but heavily crops all sides. 4K reduces the heavy cropping of the UE, but only restores 50% of the right side.


    Also as mentioned way earlier in the thread, the cropping of the UE stretches all the way to the end of the PTS as seen here. It looks like the 4K restores the whole image after the first helicopter shot.


    2000 SE DVD
    03AVTAKSEDVD.png

    2006 UE DVD
    03AVTAKUEDVD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    03AVTAK4K.png
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,025
    Torgeirtrap wrote: »
    Wonder what reason they had for placing the image off center?

    Probably just another error they overlooked. It always seems to happen to Bond one way or another. But as mentioned, it looks like the off center framing only happens for the gun barrel and helicopter shot.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    Posts: 6,724
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    Torgeirtrap wrote: »
    Wonder what reason they had for placing the image off center?

    Probably just another error they overlooked. It always seems to happen to Bond one way or another. But as mentioned, it looks like the off center framing only happens for the gun barrel and helicopter shot.

    Yes, look at the seats behind Roger Moore. The 4K version appears to show more of them than the SE DVD.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,025
    mattjoes wrote: »
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    Torgeirtrap wrote: »
    Wonder what reason they had for placing the image off center?

    Probably just another error they overlooked. It always seems to happen to Bond one way or another. But as mentioned, it looks like the off center framing only happens for the gun barrel and helicopter shot.

    Yes, look at the seats behind Roger Moore. The 4K version appears to show more of them than the SE DVD.

    Ahhh, but there's less info on the left side of the 4K than there is of the SE's.

    Oh well, nitpicking at this point. What's important is that the 4K restored the tremor effect at Stacey's house that Lowry accidentally messed with in their remaster of the UE DVD and blu-ray.
  • BonSimonLeBon_1BonSimonLeBon_1
    Posts: 2,436
    I believe the framing of AVTAK and GE suffered hugely in the UE DVDs. Like massively zoomed in, certainly was case with GE. GoldenEye's framing though has never been 100% accurate when compared to 35mm prints. The Tomorrow Never Dies Blu Ray must have some cropping too as it is presented in 2.35:1 rather than the full 2.40:1 ratio.
  • ToTheRightToTheRight
    Posts: 15,818
    I really wish I hadn't gotten rid of my SE DVDs now.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    Posts: 6,724
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    mattjoes wrote: »
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    Torgeirtrap wrote: »
    Wonder what reason they had for placing the image off center?

    Probably just another error they overlooked. It always seems to happen to Bond one way or another. But as mentioned, it looks like the off center framing only happens for the gun barrel and helicopter shot.

    Yes, look at the seats behind Roger Moore. The 4K version appears to show more of them than the SE DVD.

    Ahhh, but there's less info on the left side of the 4K than there is of the SE's.

    Oh well, nitpicking at this point. What's important is that the 4K restored the tremor effect at Stacey's house that Lowry accidentally messed with in their remaster of the UE DVD and blu-ray.

    Oh, yes, you're right. I didn't look at that side.

    Agree about the tremor.

    All these comparisons show us how difficult it is to get an ideal copy of a film, and at times, to determine just what is that ideal.
  • BonSimonLeBon_1BonSimonLeBon_1
    Posts: 2,436
    mattjoes wrote: »
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    mattjoes wrote: »
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    Torgeirtrap wrote: »
    Wonder what reason they had for placing the image off center?

    Probably just another error they overlooked. It always seems to happen to Bond one way or another. But as mentioned, it looks like the off center framing only happens for the gun barrel and helicopter shot.

    Yes, look at the seats behind Roger Moore. The 4K version appears to show more of them than the SE DVD.

    Ahhh, but there's less info on the left side of the 4K than there is of the SE's.

    Oh well, nitpicking at this point. What's important is that the 4K restored the tremor effect at Stacey's house that Lowry accidentally messed with in their remaster of the UE DVD and blu-ray.

    Oh, yes, you're right. I didn't look at that side.

    Agree about the tremor.

    All these comparisons show us how difficult it is to get an ideal copy of a film, and at times, to determine just what is that ideal.

    TMWTGG's gunbarrel comes to mind too, with its use of blue dots originally in the gunbarrel that became white on home video.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,025
    Now onto DAF. Seems the LD transfer had a green tint all across the board like making Bond's white shirt not pure white, which I'm going to assume was an error as well as the cropping and the image appearing to stretch vertically. SE appears more natural but , while the blu-ray AGAIN has that magenta tint as all other blu-rays have shown. Curiously, the 4K seems to slightly have more info on the sides than the blu-ray, essentially making it the most "open" of the transfers.


    1990 MGM LD
    00DAFLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    00DAFDVDSE.png

    2012 FOX BD
    00DAFBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    00DAF4K.png



    1990 MGM LD
    01DAFLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    01DAFDVDSE.png

    2012 FOX BD
    01DAFBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    01DAF4K.png



    1990 MGM LD
    02DAFLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    02DAFDVDSE.png

    2012 FOX BD
    02DAFBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    02DAF4K.png



    1990 MGM LD
    03DAFLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    03DAFDVDSE.png

    2012 FOX BD
    03DAFBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    03DAF4K.png



    1990 MGM LD
    04DAFLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    04DAFDVDSE.png

    2012 FOX BD
    04DAFBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    04DAF4K.png



    1990 MGM LD
    05DAFLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    05DAFDVSE.png

    2012 FOX BD
    05DAFBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    05DAF4K.png



    1990 MGM LD
    06DAFLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    06DAFDVDSE.png

    2012 FOX BD
    06DAFBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    06DAF4K.png



    1990 MGM LD
    07DAFLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    07DAFDVDSE.png

    2012 FOX BD
    07DAFBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    07DAF4K.png



    1990 MGM LD
    08DAFLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    08DAFDVDSE.png

    2012 FOX BD
    08DAFBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    08DAF4K.png



    1990 MGM LD
    09DAFLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    09DAFDVDSE.png

    2012 FOX BD
    09DAFBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    09DAF4K.png



    1990 MGM LD
    10DAFLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    10DAFDVDSE.png

    2012 FOX BD
    10DAFBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    10DAF4K.png



  • w2bondw2bond is indeed a very rare breed
    Posts: 2,252
    Thanks so much for these screencaps. Very interesting especially the colour differences
  • ToTheRightToTheRight
    edited November 2019 Posts: 15,818
    Been awhile since I saw this on the big screen. However at the time I was pretty obsessed with the colors of the Bond films and constantly re-calibrating my set to look like the cinematic versions. I think the LD gunbarrel looks closest to the film, while the red of the Mustang looks truest to the SE DVD. The other are bit too magenta for the film.
    Certain colors stood out in the film. The surgical gown Bond removes int the PTS was definitely on the blue side of the spectrum. Some VHS copies made the gown look more turquoise green.
    One thing I distinctly remember about the film print was the scene at Kirk Douglas' house where Plenty is drowned. The sky was a vibrant blue, extremely bright and the contrasts were deep. The Blu ray captures that, Bond the tint of the flesh tones was closer to the LD. Bond looked tanned, not magenta ish.
    The gas station scene was really bright and the Mustang red popped. I think the Blu-ray captures that feel accurately.
    I remember the MGM/UA Connery Classics VHS version making the mud in the PTS look a bit green. Aside from that I always felt that tape had fairly accurate colors. I think the LD may have been sourced from that print.
  • ShakenNotStirredShakenNotStirred
    Posts: 1,395
    Excellent screen caps once again!
  • SeanCraigSeanCraig Germany
    Posts: 732
    Thanks for all those screen caps and comparisons - highly appreciated! Overall I think the 4K versions look better especially on the color side ...
  • NS_writingsNS_writings Buenos Aires
    Posts: 544
    GoldenEye in 4K is flawless, except for this...

  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,025
    Most curious! I wonder how that could have happened. Weren't film negatives still being cut even in 1995?
  • ShakenNotStirredShakenNotStirred
    Posts: 1,395
    Technical specs released for the Craig 4K set release : https://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=25694
  • NS_writingsNS_writings Buenos Aires
    Posts: 544
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    Most curious! I wonder how that could have happened. Weren't film negatives still being cut even in 1995?

    My hunch is that someone forgot to check it and let the algorithm do the job, and the algorithm interpreted the fade out to white was a mistake and corrected it. More or less like in the FYEO scenes when Bond kills Locque.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,025
    I recall Marc Forster said he recorded a commentary track for what was supposed to be a collectors edition blu-ray of QOS before MGM went bankrupt. It’s a shame that’s been sitting in some storage collecting dust.
  • TorgeirtrapTorgeirtrap
    Posts: 17,280
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    Torgeirtrap wrote: »
    Wonder what reason they had for placing the image off center?

    Probably just another error they overlooked. It always seems to happen to Bond one way or another. But as mentioned, it looks like the off center framing only happens for the gun barrel and helicopter shot.

    You're probably right about that. A bit annoying though!
    ___________
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    06DAF4K.png
    09DAF4K.png

    I love DAF!
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,025
    As Moore would have put it, "such lovely lines".
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,473
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    I recall Marc Forster said he recorded a commentary track for what was supposed to be a collectors edition blu-ray of QOS before MGM went bankrupt. It’s a shame that’s been sitting in some storage collecting dust.

    I'd pay a good amount of money for that, or even a Collector's Edition of QoS.
  • ToTheRightToTheRight
    Posts: 15,818
    NS_writings wrote: »
    GoldenEye in 4K is flawless, except for this...


    Horrible mistake.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,025
    Onto Moore's LIVE AND LET DIE. The LaserDisc transfer seems to have a cooler color palette, while also being cropped on one side. One thing apparent about the SE DVD was that it was vertically stretched to a 1:78 aspect ratio, whereas later formats had it correctly at 1:85. The improvement from blu-ray to 4K is once again the loss of that magenta push. Curiously when you look at the gun barrel there are details on the BD that are lost in 4K, but then there are details in the 4K that are lost in the BD. But at least without the magenta the white of the gun barrel looks more accurate to previous editions, even if the blood seems a bit darker. Anyway, here ya go.



    1993 MGM LD
    08GBLD.png


    1999 SE DVD
    08GBDVD.png


    2008 FOX BD
    08GBBD.jpg


    2017 iTunes 4K
    08GB4K.png



    1993 MGM LD
    01LALDLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    01LALDDVD.png

    2008 FOX BD
    01LALDBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    01LALD4K.png




    1993 MGM LD
    02LALDLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    02LALDDVD.png

    2008 FOX BD
    02LALDBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    02LALD4K.png




    1993 MGM LD
    03LALDLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    03LALDDVD.png

    2008 FOX BD
    03LALDBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    03LALD4K.png




    1993 MGM LD
    04LALDLD.png

    1999 SE DVD
    04LALDDVD.png

    2008 FOX BD
    04LALDBD.jpg

    2017 iTunes 4K
    04LALD4K.png



    Next for TMWTGG, I may skip LD caps for that because I'm having a hard time looking for a widescreen copy.
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