DUD vs The Phantom Menace vs Indiana Jones 4

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  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 16,351
    Oh, and I still think Indy wins. Pointless film but I can enjoy it. Although I haven't seen Star Wars so I can't fairly judge.
    Indy 4 was better than all the SW prequels combined IMO.
  • chrisisall wrote:
    Oh, and I still think Indy wins. Pointless film but I can enjoy it. Although I haven't seen Star Wars so I can't fairly judge.
    Indy 4 was better than all the SW prequels combined IMO.

    Best to worst: Phantom, DAD, Indy 4.

    How you can say that Indy 4 is better than the prequel SW episodes is beyond me. In the prequels if you get rid of Jar Jar and ignore scenes between Aniken and Padmey in E2, then they're amazing! It has such a big complex story that it tells, while the original three were simpletons by comparison. also the visual effects are so much better, as is the lightsaber fighting. SW E3 has better lightsaber fights than all the other films combined.

    By comparison, Indy 4 was a total let-down! It was way too gimmicky, what with Area 51, a rocket sled and a Indy surviving a nuke test in a fridge all in the opening bit was appalling! Exciting but then you realize how stupid it all is. And then the alien plot and Shia Labeouf make it worse, and during the movie they never once play the theme loud and blaring during the action! Seriously watch it again if you can bare to, and you'll find a surpassing lack of the Indy theme throughout the entire film.

    As for DAD, come on guys, it wasn't really that bad. The cgi wave was silly, as was the invisible car, and Moon's bionic suit, and Hally Berry didn't act very well, but don't tell me that you don't secretly love that sword fight, the car chase, Bond being tortured and escaping the hospital, the ice palace. It's a fun movie which is far more watchable than Indy 4.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 16,351
    As for DAD, come on guys, it wasn't really that bad.
    Your loss of credibility is showing.
    :))
  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,833
    Indy surviving a nuke test in a fridge all in the opening bit was appalling!

    I quote Yu-Gi-Oh! The Abridged Series creator Martin "Littlekuriboh" Billany when I say this: "Y'know, people questioned the logic of that sequence, but then George Lucas rightfully pointed out 'If my film career can survive The Phantom Menace, then Indiana Jones can survive a nuclear explosion in a fridge'."
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 16,351
    'If my film career can survive The Phantom Menace, then Indiana Jones can survive a nuclear explosion in a fridge'."

    The logic is inescapable.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    chrisisall wrote:
    Oh, and I still think Indy wins. Pointless film but I can enjoy it. Although I haven't seen Star Wars so I can't fairly judge.
    Indy 4 was better than all the SW prequels combined IMO.

    Best to worst: Phantom, DAD, Indy 4.

    How you can say that Indy 4 is better than the prequel SW episodes is beyond me. In the prequels if you get rid of Jar Jar and ignore scenes between Aniken and Padmey in E2, then they're amazing! It has such a big complex story that it tells, while the original three were simpletons by comparison. also the visual effects are so much better, as is the lightsaber fighting. SW E3 has better lightsaber fights than all the other films combined.

    By comparison, Indy 4 was a total let-down! It was way too gimmicky, what with Area 51, a rocket sled and a Indy surviving a nuke test in a fridge all in the opening bit was appalling! Exciting but then you realize how stupid it all is. And then the alien plot and Shia Labeouf make it worse, and during the movie they never once play the theme loud and blaring during the action! Seriously watch it again if you can bare to, and you'll find a surpassing lack of the Indy theme throughout the entire film.

    As for DAD, come on guys, it wasn't really that bad. The cgi wave was silly, as was the invisible car, and Moon's bionic suit, and Hally Berry didn't act very well, but don't tell me that you don't secretly love that sword fight, the car chase, Bond being tortured and escaping the hospital, the ice palace. It's a fun movie which is far more watchable than Indy 4.

    Your main gripe with Indy 4 is a lack of the theme tune? All I can say is you are lucky to have such low disappointment thresholds.

    Not even going to dignify your comments that the prequels 'are amazing'.

    It proves that DAD was bad when the only way it comes out top of any list is by throwing it in with shockers like Episode 1 and Indy 4.

    I would say DAD best, Indy 4 second (although not much in it) and Episode 1 lagging a fair way behind.
  • AliAli
    Posts: 319
    Phantom had the Duel of the Fates. That piece, alone, elevates above the others. I don't have as much hate for DAD as most around here so I'd put that second and Indy 4 at the bottom, by virtue of it never feeling like an Indy film. For the most part, it feels lighter weight than the Mummy franchise and that's not good.
  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,833
    Ali wrote:
    Phantom had the Duel of the Fates. That piece, alone, elevates above the others. I don't have as much hate for DAD as most around here so I'd put that second and Indy 4 at the bottom, by virtue of it never feeling like an Indy film. For the most part, it feels lighter weight than the Mummy franchise and that's not good.

    I used to love Duel of the Fates, but then once Battle of the Heroes was introduced in Revenge of the Sith, I now prefer that one.
  • Posts: 1,052
    Indy 4 is the best out of this poo poo! Followed by DAD and then the beyond stinker that is Phantom Menace.
  • Posts: 7,642
    I found SWI actually the most enjoyable of the prequels it did lack grown up Annakin who basicly changed Darth Vader into a whiny prick.

    DAD is enjoyable for what it is.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,090
    The only thing that makes episode 1 tolerable is the Qui Gon Jin/Obi Wan Vs Darth Maul fight with Williams' epic duel of the fates theme playing.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    doubleoego wrote:
    The only thing that makes episode 1 tolerable is the Qui Gon Jin/Obi Wan Vs Darth Maul fight with Williams' epic duel of the fates theme playing.

    If my memory serves (have only seen it once) doesn't some inexplicable force field come down for no apparent reason blocking off Obi Wan until Qui Gon is dead and then conveniently let's him out to kill Darth Maul?

    Which is really shit by the way.
  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,833
    doubleoego wrote:
    The only thing that makes episode 1 tolerable is the Qui Gon Jin/Obi Wan Vs Darth Maul fight with Williams' epic duel of the fates theme playing.

    If my memory serves (have only seen it once) doesn't some inexplicable force field come down for no apparent reason blocking off Obi Wan until Qui Gon is dead and then conveniently let's him out to kill Darth Maul?

    Which is really shit by the way.

    I think we're meant to assume that those force fields are there for protection from all the plasma conduits and whatnot.
  • Posts: 1,817
    doubleoego wrote:
    The only thing that makes episode 1 tolerable is the Qui Gon Jin/Obi Wan Vs Darth Maul fight with Williams' epic duel of the fates theme playing.

    If my memory serves (have only seen it once) doesn't some inexplicable force field come down for no apparent reason blocking off Obi Wan until Qui Gon is dead and then conveniently let's him out to kill Darth Maul?

    Which is really shit by the way.

    I think we're meant to assume that those force fields are there for protection from all the plasma conduits and whatnot.

    Five laser walls protecting... an empty room with a giant hole.

    By the way, what you people think about Darth Maul comeback in the animated series? For me it's nothing but an insult towards Obi Wan and Qui Gon by extension, as the former avenged his death.
  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,833
    0013 wrote:
    doubleoego wrote:
    The only thing that makes episode 1 tolerable is the Qui Gon Jin/Obi Wan Vs Darth Maul fight with Williams' epic duel of the fates theme playing.

    If my memory serves (have only seen it once) doesn't some inexplicable force field come down for no apparent reason blocking off Obi Wan until Qui Gon is dead and then conveniently let's him out to kill Darth Maul?

    Which is really shit by the way.

    I think we're meant to assume that those force fields are there for protection from all the plasma conduits and whatnot.

    Five laser walls protecting... an empty room with a giant hole.

    By the way, what you people think about Darth Maul comeback in the animated series? For me it's nothing but an insult towards Obi Wan and Qui Gon by extension, as the former avenged his death.

    I didn't mind it, since I liked Maul and wanted to have seen more of him, plus Sam Witwer's voice acting is awesome. I did find it a little farfetched, since he just showed up with mechanical spider limbs, but considering the arc that they brought him in with involved so much weird magic, I guess that made it a little acceptable, to an extent.
  • Posts: 11,425
    I've seen bits of the prequels and couldn't believe how bad they were. They are even worse than the Brosnan Bond movies.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    edited February 2013 Posts: 28,231
    Getafix wrote:
    I've seen bits of the prequels and couldn't believe how bad they were. They are even worse than the Brosnan Bond movies.

    So I am not missing anything by skipping them? That's likely a rhetorical question, isn't it? Yes, I think I just answered my own question.
  • Posts: 11,425
    Getafix wrote:
    I've seen bits of the prequels and couldn't believe how bad they were. They are even worse than the Brosnan Bond movies.

    So I am not missing anything by skipping them? That's likely a rhetorical question, isn't it? Yes, I think I just answered my own question.

    I'd go as far as saying they're significantly worse than DAD.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    Getafix wrote:
    Getafix wrote:
    I've seen bits of the prequels and couldn't believe how bad they were. They are even worse than the Brosnan Bond movies.

    So I am not missing anything by skipping them? That's likely a rhetorical question, isn't it? Yes, I think I just answered my own question.

    I'd go as far as saying they're significantly worse than DAD.

    Oh, I guessed that. At least I like Bond to some extent in that that I can stand it for long enough. I only like the original Star Wars films because they had characters I cared about and Yoda is just awesome, of course. He is probably the only reason I would watch the prequels. I will also hate all the CGI. I would love to know why they opted to make the prequels the films with super technology while the originals that are meant to succeed them don't have any of that. You would think that Lucas would include less tech in the prequels to compare it more to the tech appearing in the original trilogy. Granted, they were limited in the 70s with technology like CGI, but it still irks me nonetheless.
  • edited February 2013 Posts: 11,425
    Getafix wrote:
    Getafix wrote:
    I've seen bits of the prequels and couldn't believe how bad they were. They are even worse than the Brosnan Bond movies.

    So I am not missing anything by skipping them? That's likely a rhetorical question, isn't it? Yes, I think I just answered my own question.

    I'd go as far as saying they're significantly worse than DAD.

    Oh, I guessed that. At least I like Bond to some extent in that that I can stand it for long enough. I only like the original Star Wars films because they had characters I cared about and Yoda is just awesome, of course. He is probably the only reason I would watch the prequels. I will also hate all the CGI. I would love to know why they opted to make the prequels the films with super technology while the originals that are meant to succeed them don't have any of that. You would think that Lucas would include less tech in the prequels to compare it more to the tech appearing in the original trilogy. Granted, they were limited in the 70s with technology like CGI, but it still irks me nonetheless.

    And in the prequels Yoda is no longer a Jim Henson animatronic puppet but a totally fake looking CGI thing. I still personally find animatronics and a man dressed in a bear suit as Chewie more believable and likeable than all this CGI stuff. I don't know what it is about CGI but the more I see of it the less I like it. I can accept it in some contexts but I still feel it doesn't beat real sets, stunts, or even scale models. I found the hordes of orks of CGIin the Lord of the Rings battle scenes kind of dull, while Ray Harryhausen's skeleton army still looks amazing to me.

    I am disappointed with EON for not banning CGI after DAD. CR wasn't too bad, but the plane sequence in QoS and parts of SF looked pretty ropey IMO. The establishing shot of the floating casino looked like something from a Disney cartoon. I don't understand why so many film makers seem happy to use CGI, apart from that it must be cheap, of course.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    I completely agree, @Getafix. Mark Hamill recently stated (and I agree with him too) that he hopes the new trilogy can balance CGI and real life action and avoids going overboard on all the special effects. It is so much better when it is real people doing real stunts. Think if the jump in TSWLM was all special effects? It wouldn't be the lauded scene it is today if it was, showing how special it is when you have stunt men risking their lives for real and when they succeed, movie magic is made.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 16,351
    Getafix wrote:
    I don't know what it is about CGI but the more I see of it the less I like it. I can accept it in some contexts but I still feel it doesn't beat real sets, stunts, or even scale models. I found the hordes of orks of CGIin the Lord of the Rings battle scenes kind of dull, while Ray Harryhausen's skeleton army still looks amazing to me.

    L-) =D> ^:)^
    Think if the jump in TSWLM was all special effects? It wouldn't be the lauded scene it is today if it was, showing how special it is when you have stunt men risking their lives for real and when they succeed, movie magic is made.
    That kind of thing will likely never be done again.
    8-|
  • Posts: 11,425
    Wonder if we'll have enother contender soon - Indy 5!
  • Posts: 782
    I loved The Phantom Menace.Saw it five times in the theater during summer '99.

    I enjoyed Die Another Day.I am aware of its faults but it was still a fun Bond adventure.Saw it twice at the cinema when it was released in 2002.

    Was really disappointed in Indy 4 but have since warmed to it slightly.Still the worst Indy film though.

  • edited March 2014 Posts: 7,642
    The Phantom Menace is a spectacular Scifi/fantasy movie and while it failed to live up to my abnormal high SW expectations it delivered some true spectacle. I think this movie is underrated simply because the original SW was so brilliant.

    Indiana Jones 4 delivered an adventure by its already seriously aging leading man that did not left me dissapointed. Spectacle galore and still very much wicked sense of Indiana Jones humour. The theme fitted the 50's craze in cinema of Scifi monstermovies. Nice too see Harrison Ford once again whipping out a fairly decent adventure.

    Die Another Day was in hindsight supposed to be Brosnans swansong, he seems certainly most at ease in the role in his entire run. The Story did have some promise especially the conflict between the baddie & his father, which was not handled well. The spectacle was fun and well done, albeit for some truly poor CGI sequence. In the end the movie went a wee bit over the top but delivered a spectacular 007 outing that still wiped the floor with all its competitors. I guess I always expected a toned down movie not unlike FYEO to finish Brosnans era. And in my view it could easily have handled the post 9/11 era before giving the reign over to DC's CR.
  • Posts: 782
    SaintMark wrote:
    The Phantom Menace is a spectacular Scifi/fantasy movie and while it failed to live up to my abnormal high SW expectations it delivered some true spectacle. I think this movie is underrated simply because the original SW was so brilliant.

    Indiana Jones 4 delivered an adventure by its already seriously aging leading man that did not left me dissapointed. Spectacle galore and still very much wicked sense of Indiana Jones humour. The theme fitted the 50's craze in cinema of Scifi monstermovies. Nice too see Harrison Ford once again whipping out a fairly decent adventure.

    Die Another Day was in hindsight supposed to be Brosnans swansong, he seems certainly most at ease in the role in his entire run. The Story did have some promise especially the conflict between the baddie & his father, which was not handled well. The spectacle was fun and well done, albeit for some truly poor CGI sequence. In the end the movie went a wee bit over the top but delivered a spectacular 007 outing that still wiped the floor with all its competitors. I guess I always expected a toned down movie not unlike FYEO to finish Brosnans era. And in my view it could easily have handled the post 9/11 era before giving the reign over to DC's CR.

    I like this post.Good to see some people not jumping on the hate SW prequel/Indy 4/DAD bandwagon.

  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    edited March 2014 Posts: 16,057
    Die Another Day: While mediocre, it's still entertaining and fun to watch for the visuals. The Ice palace is a highlight for me as it feels like a Ken Adam design.

    Phantom Menace: It's boring but worth it for the lightsaber duels.

    Crystal Skull: I had very high hopes for this movie, I rewatched all three Indy films just days before seeing it. I was wanting it to be so awesome, I was massively let down. Massive disappointment. Mr. Plinkett said it best. "Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull is the biggest disappointment The Phantom Menace!"
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited March 2014 Posts: 16,351
    @SaintMark, you enjoy stuff too much. Where is your resentment, your concentrated vitriol at films that never live up to the cream of the crop classics?
  • Posts: 10,534
    From least bad to worst:
    3. Phantom Menace - somewhat underrated. Granted it's not one of the best Star Wars films, and the first half is pretty boring, but at least it had awesome battle scenes + Qui-Gon and Darth Maul (best prequel characters). Also good soundtrack.
    2. Die Another Day - certainly one of my least favorite Bond movies, but still has a few good merits. The first half of the film is honestly decent, including a good PTS and a solid performance by Brosnan. Thought it went a bit off the rails in the second half though, particularly the last 30 minutes.
    1. Kingdom of the Crystal Skull - easily the worst Indiana Jones film. Very disappointing too, because it had some potential; Ford obviously not as good as he was in the first 3, several stupid moments (most of which include Mutt ~X(), became boring quickly, and just lacked the magic and fun of the first 3. Not as bad as some people say, but certainly not a whole lot better.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited March 2014 Posts: 16,351
    From least bad to worst:

    3. Kingdom of the Crystal Skull - easily the worst Indiana Jones film. That said, it's full of energy & fun. Karen Allen makes the film watchable for me. Nice score.
    2. Die Another Day - certainly one of my least favorite Bond movies, but still has a few good merits. The first half of the film is honestly decent, including a good PTS and a solid performance by Brosnan. Buy the sci-fi premise, buy the flick. I bought Graves Robo-suit for a dollar!
    3. Phantom Menace - somewhat underrated. Granted it's not one of the best Star Wars films, and the first half is pretty boring, but at least it had awesome battle scenes + Qui-Gon and Darth Maul (best prequel characters). Also good soundtrack. The whole slave thing baffled me though. Why not go in and eff 'em up, you Jedis?
    Oh, so Annikin could later. More brutally. After his Mom died.
    I feel so manipulated...

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