NO TIME TO DIE (2021) - Discuss Hans Zimmer's Score

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  • BondAficionadoBondAficionado Former IMDBer
    Posts: 1,828
    I'd be really interested to know if the reason that Romer departed and Zimmer/Mazzaro were brought on board was because he refused to use cues from OHMSS out of principle.
  • I’ve listened to some of the soundtrack on its own and so far I’m not too impressed with the action tracks. For example, “Backfire” by Newman from SP (a score I’m largely disappointed with) is stronger than any action cue by Zimmer here.

    The 2 tracks that I do like are “Matera” (which is like a lovely romantic fuse of David Arnold and Eric Serra, combined with Barry’s OHMSS of course) and “Norway Chase” (especially the early part, before the choir kicks in - great suspense there).
  • SeveSeve The island of Lemoy
    Posts: 357
    RC7 wrote: »
    bondsum wrote: »
    Talking of being unnecessarily negative @RC7 what are you current thoughts on using the OHMSS Theme and WHATTITW in NTTD? I can distictly recall you saying that both these musical cues didn't belong in a Craig Bond movie because they belong exclusively to OHMSS. Has your view now changed after watching NTTD? Just curious as you were very adamant and unnecessarily negative about it a few year's ago when I made the suggestion.

    I don’t think it does belong. But here we are. It is what it is.

    Yes, the use of those pieces of music seems really odd to me, the Craig-Bond series has always been presented as an "alternative Bond timeline", unconnected to past Bonds, yet as they approach the end suddenly they introduce music connected to the death of Tracy Draco over 50 years ago. A character who was never mentioned or used in the Craig-Bond saga. Some kind of musical theme connected with Vespa Lynd would have made sense, but not Tracy.

    Many Directors resort to using a popular song as an quick and easy way to elicit emotion from the audience, in lieu of doing the hard work needed to achieve the same result via images and dialogue, or come up with an original piece of music written specifically for the movie. It's a practise which I consider to be pure laziness.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Doctor Nose
    Posts: 4,898
    I know it's been mentioned earlier in this thread, but does anyone have the ability to extract an audio file from a website so that we have a downloadable version of this unreleased cue? :)

    https://www.stevemazzaro.com/news/no-time-to-die-unreleased-music

    Here's the URL of the MP3 file, directly from the website:

    https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5e33b2332a9bf131f704a5e6/t/615f493645c11557841f3165/1633634638008/No+Time+To+Die+-+Safin+(Unreleased).mp3/original/No+Time+To+Die+-+Safin+(Unreleased).mp3
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 3,561
    Seve wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    bondsum wrote: »
    Talking of being unnecessarily negative @RC7 what are you current thoughts on using the OHMSS Theme and WHATTITW in NTTD? I can distictly recall you saying that both these musical cues didn't belong in a Craig Bond movie because they belong exclusively to OHMSS. Has your view now changed after watching NTTD? Just curious as you were very adamant and unnecessarily negative about it a few year's ago when I made the suggestion.

    I don’t think it does belong. But here we are. It is what it is.

    Yes, the use of those pieces of music seems really odd to me, the Craig-Bond series has always been presented as an "alternative Bond timeline", unconnected to past Bonds, yet as they approach the end suddenly they introduce music connected to the death of Tracy Draco over 50 years ago. A character who was never mentioned or used in the Craig-Bond saga. Some kind of musical theme connected with Vespa Lynd would have made sense, but not Tracy.

    Many Directors resort to using a popular song as an quick and easy way to elicit emotion from the audience, in lieu of doing the hard work needed to achieve the same result via images and dialogue, or come up with an original piece of music written specifically for the movie. It's a practise which I consider to be pure laziness.

    Exactly right.

    I assume fans would have happily accepted 'If There Was A Man' in one of the Brosnan films? Yeah right.

    It has nothing to do with any Bond film except TLD. And OHMSS has even less to do with Craig's era for the reasons mentioned by @Seve
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded Riding a white swan to Matera
    Posts: 12,409
    zebrafish wrote: »
    I believe this has not yet been posted in this thread?


    So beautiful; thanks. What is this part called?
  • That’s Final Ascent
  • RC7RC7
    edited October 2021 Posts: 10,512
    Seve wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    bondsum wrote: »
    Talking of being unnecessarily negative @RC7 what are you current thoughts on using the OHMSS Theme and WHATTITW in NTTD? I can distictly recall you saying that both these musical cues didn't belong in a Craig Bond movie because they belong exclusively to OHMSS. Has your view now changed after watching NTTD? Just curious as you were very adamant and unnecessarily negative about it a few year's ago when I made the suggestion.

    I don’t think it does belong. But here we are. It is what it is.

    Yes, the use of those pieces of music seems really odd to me, the Craig-Bond series has always been presented as an "alternative Bond timeline", unconnected to past Bonds, yet as they approach the end suddenly they introduce music connected to the death of Tracy Draco over 50 years ago. A character who was never mentioned or used in the Craig-Bond saga. Some kind of musical theme connected with Vespa Lynd would have made sense, but not Tracy.

    Many Directors resort to using a popular song as an quick and easy way to elicit emotion from the audience, in lieu of doing the hard work needed to achieve the same result via images and dialogue, or come up with an original piece of music written specifically for the movie. It's a practise which I consider to be pure laziness.

    I don’t really care about timelines per se, I’m just of a fan of the films having their own musical identity. However, that’s not really been a thing of late.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded Riding a white swan to Matera
    Posts: 12,409
    Thanks for letting me know it's Final Ascent. I thought maybe it was, but I do not have the soundtrack and have not studied the different tracks. I come here periodically to read what people are saying about it who are familiar with soundtracks. It's lovely. So from a total musical novice, I'm just saying that I like the music much better than Spectre's and I think some pieces, like Final Ascent, are really lovely. The music seems to fit the movie well.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited October 2021 Posts: 5,593
    RC7 wrote: »
    Seve wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    bondsum wrote: »
    Talking of being unnecessarily negative @RC7 what are you current thoughts on using the OHMSS Theme and WHATTITW in NTTD? I can distictly recall you saying that both these musical cues didn't belong in a Craig Bond movie because they belong exclusively to OHMSS. Has your view now changed after watching NTTD? Just curious as you were very adamant and unnecessarily negative about it a few year's ago when I made the suggestion.

    I don’t think it does belong. But here we are. It is what it is.

    Yes, the use of those pieces of music seems really odd to me, the Craig-Bond series has always been presented as an "alternative Bond timeline", unconnected to past Bonds, yet as they approach the end suddenly they introduce music connected to the death of Tracy Draco over 50 years ago. A character who was never mentioned or used in the Craig-Bond saga. Some kind of musical theme connected with Vespa Lynd would have made sense, but not Tracy.

    Many Directors resort to using a popular song as an quick and easy way to elicit emotion from the audience, in lieu of doing the hard work needed to achieve the same result via images and dialogue, or come up with an original piece of music written specifically for the movie. It's a practise which I consider to be pure laziness.

    I don’t really care about timelines per se, I’m just of a fan of the films having their own musical identity. However, that’s not really been a thing of late.

    Agreed. One of my particular disappointments with Spectre (though it still has it's standouts such as Los Muertos Vivos Estan (see below), Eternal City, and Secret Room (what I take as Madeleine's real theme). I was happy for NTTD's music to feel fresh, despite being a touch underwhelming and rehashing OHMSS (didn't mind that bit actually).
    Cuba Chase is still my favourite track; I live for the Bond theme in musical styles from around the world (see above)! I'll Be Right Back might be my second favourite, good climactic action Bond music that I would have thought Final Ascent should have been, and I find myself really drawn to Home as well for the emotional aspect.
  • DoctorKaufmannDoctorKaufmann Can shoot you from Stuttgart and still make it look like suicide.
    Posts: 1,160
    mattjoes wrote: »
    I know it's been mentioned earlier in this thread, but does anyone have the ability to extract an audio file from a website so that we have a downloadable version of this unreleased cue? :)

    https://www.stevemazzaro.com/news/no-time-to-die-unreleased-music

    Here's the URL of the MP3 file, directly from the website:

    https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5e33b2332a9bf131f704a5e6/t/615f493645c11557841f3165/1633634638008/No+Time+To+Die+-+Safin+(Unreleased).mp3/original/No+Time+To+Die+-+Safin+(Unreleased).mp3

    And it also is on YouTube. Has been for about three weeks.
  • I really don’t care for the Cuba Chase track. It’s all just a bunch of noise to me.

    So far Matera and Norway Chase (the early part, before the choir) are my favorites.

    What do you guys think are the best tracks?
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 5,593
    Matera is great but I can take it or leave it regarding Norway Chase.
  • SatoriousSatorious Brushing up on a little Danish
    Posts: 215
    Enjoying this soundtrack more and more each time I hear it. I really hope we get an expanded version soon as there are a few parts I also loved which aren't on the CD.

    The only part which I rather struggle with is Good To Have You Back with the OHMSS theme. It's not that it's bad - it's more it just takes me out of the film - the scene in question is not helped by the fact that Bond and M weren't exactly being civil to each other in their previous scene (so them being more chummy together seems to come out of nowhere).

    I think this score is a definite step-up from Thomas Newman's Spectre. I never really liked Newman's take on action much but he was good at the reflective mood music stuff (plenty of that in this one also). I think Zimmer and Mazzaro walked the delicate line of keeping true to the era (Newman and Arnold), whilst also putting a bit of their own spin on it. That was no mean feat!

    The standout tracks for me are Matera, Cuba Chase, Home, Poison Garden and Final Ascent. I also like elements from others - eg. the last action-packed minute of Message From An Old Friend, I really like the opening part of Norway Chase before the chanting part, and enjoy the first minute or so of The Factory (love that villainous theme which build from around 30seconds in).
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython Alpha Quadrant
    Posts: 5,520
    Good To Have You Back worked fine for me because it only kicks in right when they start talking about Blofeld
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 5,593
    Good To Have You Back worked fine for me because it only kicks in right when they start talking about Blofeld

    I like this track as well. I associate "WHATTINW" more with the love story between Bond and Tracy, rather than Tracy's death, so for me it seemed perfectly fitting to include in NTTD.
    The OHMSS theme song, even more fitting here, because that song is more linked to being On Her Majesty's Secret Service than anything to do with Tracy, and so Bond linking back up with M / MI6 seemed a perfectly fitting opportunity to use this music.
  • edited October 2021 Posts: 12,590
    This score has been a real grower for me. The first time I saw it I wasn’t that impressed. Loved some of it (everything from the grave blowing up to the titles, Johnny Marr’s new take on the Bond theme, the final ascent) but a lot of it felt quite generic to me, despite propelling things along nicely.

    But the more I listen to it, the more I like it. Comparing it to Newman’s efforts also helped me to enjoy it more, as daft as that sounds. I don’t think his scores had anywhere near the sense of intensity, which is what a composer needs to bring for Craig’s Bond imo. I loved the Mendes movies, but the scores did give them quite a stately and old fashioned feel at times (maybe Newman was working to a brief to be fair, Mendes seemed to be going for a modern day 60s vibe), that almost stripped Craig’s Bond of his virility a bit. I think Zimmer bought that virility and intensity back in spades, and if this is what he could do on such a tight turn around, then I’d love to have him back again with more time to prepare.
    Seve wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    bondsum wrote: »
    Talking of being unnecessarily negative @RC7 what are you current thoughts on using the OHMSS Theme and WHATTITW in NTTD? I can distictly recall you saying that both these musical cues didn't belong in a Craig Bond movie because they belong exclusively to OHMSS. Has your view now changed after watching NTTD? Just curious as you were very adamant and unnecessarily negative about it a few year's ago when I made the suggestion.

    I don’t think it does belong. But here we are. It is what it is.

    Yes, the use of those pieces of music seems really odd to me, the Craig-Bond series has always been presented as an "alternative Bond timeline", unconnected to past Bonds, yet as they approach the end suddenly they introduce music connected to the death of Tracy Draco over 50 years ago. A character who was never mentioned or used in the Craig-Bond saga. Some kind of musical theme connected with Vespa Lynd would have made sense, but not Tracy.

    Many Directors resort to using a popular song as an quick and easy way to elicit emotion from the audience, in lieu of doing the hard work needed to achieve the same result via images and dialogue, or come up with an original piece of music written specifically for the movie. It's a practise which I consider to be pure laziness.

    I could’ve done without it too, but I don’t think they did it out of laziness or as an emotional shortcut. I think it was there to wrongfoot fans. Evoke memories of OHMSS, get us wondering if Madeline is going to die, then that gets flipped on its head by the ending. I’m not a fan of the OHMSS nods, I think the story was strong enough to work without them, but I can see why they did it. Red herring, essentially.
  • Posts: 14
    mattjoes wrote: »
    I know it's been mentioned earlier in this thread, but does anyone have the ability to extract an audio file from a website so that we have a downloadable version of this unreleased cue? :)

    https://www.stevemazzaro.com/news/no-time-to-die-unreleased-music

    Here's the URL of the MP3 file, directly from the website:

    https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5e33b2332a9bf131f704a5e6/t/615f493645c11557841f3165/1633634638008/No+Time+To+Die+-+Safin+(Unreleased).mp3/original/No+Time+To+Die+-+Safin+(Unreleased).mp3

    Thank you very much sir!
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 3,561
    Satorious wrote: »
    Enjoying this soundtrack more and more each time I hear it. I really hope we get an expanded version soon as there are a few parts I also loved which aren't on the CD.

    The only part which I rather struggle with is Good To Have You Back with the OHMSS theme. It's not that it's bad - it's more it just takes me out of the film - the scene in question is not helped by the fact that Bond and M weren't exactly being civil to each other in their previous scene (so them being more chummy together seems to come out of nowhere).

    I think this score is a definite step-up from Thomas Newman's Spectre. I never really liked Newman's take on action much but he was good at the reflective mood music stuff (plenty of that in this one also). I think Zimmer and Mazzaro walked the delicate line of keeping true to the era (Newman and Arnold), whilst also putting a bit of their own spin on it. That was no mean feat!

    The standout tracks for me are Matera, Cuba Chase, Home, Poison Garden and Final Ascent. I also like elements from others - eg. the last action-packed minute of Message From An Old Friend, I really like the opening part of Norway Chase before the chanting part, and enjoy the first minute or so of The Factory (love that villainous theme which build from around 30seconds in).

    I have the soundtrack downloaded on my phone but I removed 'good to have you back' as I really don't think it belongs. It's a very short track anyway.

    But the soundtrack is growing on me with each listen. Final Ascent is a beautiful piece of music.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Doctor Nose
    Posts: 4,898
    zebrafish wrote: »
    I believe this has not yet been posted in this thread?


    So beautiful; thanks. What is this part called?

    As mentioned, it's Final Ascent, to be specific, the last part of that track, and as you can hear, it is only the strings. The other instruments must have been recorded separately. That was posted on Fukunaga's Instagram account.

    Steve Mazzaro also posted on Twitter this take of what can only be the gunbarrel music.



    It's worth noting that this isn't the final version of the gunbarrel. The brass at 0:10 isn't like that in the film, and the closing part at 0:13 has the typical note lengths for each phrase, but they were slightly changed for the film.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 5,593
    I was very glad to have gone into this film without having listened to the soundtrack. Final Ascent is quite spoilery, IMO, if one was to listen to it ahead of the film (but hindsight is 20/20 of course). I'm glad the OHMSS nods in Matera and elsewhere were a surprise.
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 3,561
    mattjoes wrote: »
    I know it's been mentioned earlier in this thread, but does anyone have the ability to extract an audio file from a website so that we have a downloadable version of this unreleased cue? :)

    https://www.stevemazzaro.com/news/no-time-to-die-unreleased-music

    Here's the URL of the MP3 file, directly from the website:

    https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5e33b2332a9bf131f704a5e6/t/615f493645c11557841f3165/1633634638008/No+Time+To+Die+-+Safin+(Unreleased).mp3/original/No+Time+To+Die+-+Safin+(Unreleased).mp3

    And it also is on YouTube. Has been for about three weeks.

    I'm assuming this is from the PTS scene with Madeleine and Safin at the house?
  • I really don’t care for the Cuba Chase track. It’s all just a bunch of noise to me.

    So far Matera and Norway Chase (the early part, before the choir) are my favorites.

    What do you guys think are the best tracks?

    I kind of agree. I think the track works well on its own and works best in the film when Bond leaves the bar and swings his machine gun into action. The rest of the track, along with the action going on just comes off like a noisy Tom and Jerry episode.
  • DoctorKaufmannDoctorKaufmann Can shoot you from Stuttgart and still make it look like suicide.
    Posts: 1,160
    mattjoes wrote: »
    I know it's been mentioned earlier in this thread, but does anyone have the ability to extract an audio file from a website so that we have a downloadable version of this unreleased cue? :)

    https://www.stevemazzaro.com/news/no-time-to-die-unreleased-music

    Here's the URL of the MP3 file, directly from the website:

    https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5e33b2332a9bf131f704a5e6/t/615f493645c11557841f3165/1633634638008/No+Time+To+Die+-+Safin+(Unreleased).mp3/original/No+Time+To+Die+-+Safin+(Unreleased).mp3

    And it also is on YouTube. Has been for about three weeks.

    I'm assuming this is from the PTS scene with Madeleine and Safin at the house?

    Yepp, it is!
  • edited October 2021 Posts: 537
    Jimjambond wrote: »
    I really don’t care for the Cuba Chase track. It’s all just a bunch of noise to me.

    So far Matera and Norway Chase (the early part, before the choir) are my favorites.

    What do you guys think are the best tracks?

    I kind of agree. I think the track works well on its own and works best in the film when Bond leaves the bar and swings his machine gun into action. The rest of the track, along with the action going on just comes off like a noisy Tom and Jerry episode.
    Yep the Bond theme that kicks in when Bond cocks his machine gun is great! But the rest of it is just incoherent noise, mixed with playful Latin sounds. Didn’t do anything for me.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 35,461
    I quite love Cuba Chase as a whole. It has its strengths and heights, for sure, like when the music builds as Bond goes through the railing and into the bar, stopping as they land. That's probably my favorite part.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 6,686
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    I quite love Cuba Chase as a whole. It has its strengths and heights, for sure, like when the music builds as Bond goes through the railing and into the bar, stopping as they land. That's probably my favorite part.

    Same here. Belter of a cue.
  • jabalijabali Los Angeles
    Posts: 43
    Does anyone know the track where Bond's swimming up from the sinking boat? I don't recall hearing it on the album. Would be a bummer if it stays unreleased, because I thought it was a beautiful cue
  • Posts: 310
    jabali wrote: »
    Does anyone know the track where Bond's swimming up from the sinking boat? I don't recall hearing it on the album. Would be a bummer if it stays unreleased, because I thought it was a beautiful cue

    It's unreleased right now.
  • Posts: 2,268
    I hold what appears (unless I've missed something) to be a unique take, for as excellent as "Matera," "Final Ascent," and "Home" are, I think my favourite cue from the soundtrack is "Someone Was Here." That moment about 30 seconds in where the string melody begins has lived rent free in my head since my first viewing. Additionally, while it's not explicitly the purpose of the thread, the way it is used in the film is sublime, as Bond sails back to his bungalow after fishing. Those IMAX shots were truly something else.
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