Star Wars (1977 - present)

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  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited December 2017 Posts: 15,690
    bondsum wrote: »
    CraterGuns wrote: »
    There hasn't been a good Star Wars movie since 1980. (The year I graduated high school.)

    Except in 2005.
    No wonder the big studios can now getaway with serving up regurgitated drivel to the masses. The millennials clearly haven't got a clue what constitutes a good movie from a bad movie, so long as it looks nice, moves at a brisk clip and doesn't give them too much to think about.

    Most of the millenials were already 10 years old and/or teenagers by the time The Phantom Menace came out, so wouldn't they also be angry about recent Star Wars films rehashing the original trilogy?
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    I had two goose bump moments.

    First when the STAR WARS logo hit the screen and the Williams theme kicked in. It is similar to the gunbarrel.

    Second
    when Rey used the force to lift those boulders and save the rest of the rebels
  • edited December 2017 Posts: 3,333
    bondsum wrote: »
    CraterGuns wrote: »
    There hasn't been a good Star Wars movie since 1980. (The year I graduated high school.)

    Except in 2005.
    No wonder the big studios can now getaway with serving up regurgitated drivel to the masses. The millennials clearly haven't got a clue what constitutes a good movie from a bad movie, so long as it looks nice, moves at a brisk clip and doesn't give them too much to think about.

    Most of the millenials were already 10 years old and/or teenagers by the time The Phantom Menace came out, so wouldn't they also be angry about recent Star Wars films rehashing the original trilogy?
    I'm not sure what you mean? The Lucas's prequels didn't rehash anything that had gone before them, so how can they be angry at those movies for rehashing? I think you need to expand on your remarks as I don't quite get where you're coming from. I think some Miillenials actually are angry about the new Disney Star War movies. For the record, I'd classify The Phantom Menace as a Nineties movie, pre-millennium, but I'm not sure what that's got to do with the Disney Star Wars? Unless you think I'm referring to The Phantom Menace as one of the "originals"? Of course, you'd be mistaken... It was the retitled New Hope that was the original and that Force Awakens stole from that I'm referring to.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    That isn t what he said, is it?
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited December 2017 Posts: 15,690
    bondsum wrote: »
    bondsum wrote: »
    CraterGuns wrote: »
    There hasn't been a good Star Wars movie since 1980. (The year I graduated high school.)

    Except in 2005.
    No wonder the big studios can now getaway with serving up regurgitated drivel to the masses. The millennials clearly haven't got a clue what constitutes a good movie from a bad movie, so long as it looks nice, moves at a brisk clip and doesn't give them too much to think about.

    Most of the millenials were already 10 years old and/or teenagers by the time The Phantom Menace came out, so wouldn't they also be angry about recent Star Wars films rehashing the original trilogy?
    I'm not sure what you mean? The Lucas's prequels didn't rehash anything that had gone before them, so how can they be angry at those movies for rehashing? I think you need to expand on your remarks as I don't quite get where you're coming from. I think some Miillenials actually are angry about the new Disney Star War movies. For the record, I'd classify The Phantom Menace as a Nineties movie, pre-millennium, but I'm not sure what that's got to do with the Disney Star Wars? Unless you think I'm referring to The Phantom Menace as one of the "originals"? Of course, you'd be mistaken... It was the retitled New Hope that was the original and that Force Awakens stole from that I'm referring to.

    I never implied any of that. You mention the millennials not knowing what a good movie is compared to a bad one, and since the actual millennials generation goes from everyone born between the early 1980's to the mid 1990's (meaning the first millenials were born when the Original Trilogy was still ongoing), I was merely asking if you meant the Generation Z, which encompasses those born from the late 1990's up to the current 2010's decade.
  • edited December 2017 Posts: 4,813
    Just got back, with it fresh in my mind. Honestly I'm a bit torn. Didn't love it; didn't hate it. I feel it's a flat movie with some great parts sprinkled in. The trailers made the movie look a LOT better than it ended up being, just to me that is.
    Not too much I can explain without spoilers so.....
    When The Force Awakens came out everybody was talking about it and theorizing. Who are Rey's parents? Who is Snoke? Is Luke going to be bad? Is Rey going to be bad?The possibilities were endless and it was fun coming up with all these things as a big community. As The Last Jedi was getting closer and we saw pictures of new actors and characters, it was exciting- like 'ooooh who's that going to be?' and 'look at that light side/ dark side poster; Luke is on BOTH sides!'
    Unfortunately this is one of those instances where what we imagined was a lot cooler that what we ended up with.

    The good:

    Every scene with Luke. Especially near the end when he meets Leia, hands her the dice, and when we find out he's not actually there. Now that's some powerful Force! He pretty much force focused himself across the entire galaxy!

    R2 playing Leia's original message to Luke

    Finn fighting Phasma and Rey & Kylo teaming up- great stuff

    I laughed out loud when Chewie was eating that cooked Porg in front of the other Porgs :))

    The not so good:

    The subplot of Poe clashing with Laura Dern. Long story short, he thought she was using poor leadership but she actually wasn't. All it did was take up time; and for a movie as long as it was, we could have done without the whole bit.

    The entire casino sequence. In fact, most of Finn & Rose and all their shenanigans.

    Benicio Del Toro's character SUCKED. There's no nice way to put it.


    That's it off the top of my head- like I said I just left the theater.
    At the end of The Force Awakens I was DROOLING for the next one. Now, not so much.... and I'm already sort of forgetting this one.
    I mean, we already lost Han. Leia didn't die but we already know she's not in the next one, and now Luke is dead? I like these new young characters, but I'm not sure they can carry a movie by themselves. Han was my favorite character in TFA, Luke was my favorite character in TLJ. So now the final movie of this trilogy will be just these new guys... and there wasn't exactly a cliffhanger at the end of this one.

    Oh and I had to laugh at this one part-- that scene with those new AT-AT type vehicles on the white terrain took a lot of heat online for being visually identical to the Hoth Battle. This one extra tastes it and goes "it's salt." Like "SEE EVERYONE!! It's not snow, it's salt! Not like TESB at all!" :)) Reminded me of Batman V Superman when the guy practically broke the 4th wall telling the audience the island was uninhabited (in response to the destruction in Man of Steel)

    One last thing: in that sequence when Rey asks the mirror thing who her parents are, I would have had a heart attack on the spot if it was a Harrison Ford cameo!!!

    New ranking:
    The Empire Strikes Back
    Star Wars
    The Force Awakens
    Return of the Jedi
    Rogue One
    The Last Jedi
    Revenge of the Sith
    Attack of the Clones
    The Phantom Menace
  • edited December 2017 Posts: 3,333
    Oh, I see where you're coming from. No, I'm not referring to "millennials" born between the 1980's to mid 1990's as I feel that that is a misrepresentation of the what it truly means to be born in the new millennium. Yes, I think it's referred to as Generation Z by the fruitcake demographers, so that's what I mean. It would be late 90's onwards...
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Dahark, agree with practically everything.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited December 2017 Posts: 23,883
    Just got back. It's a good film in many ways, but also a bit disappointing to me in some ways too.

    The performances are top notch across the board (although honestly I'm not a fan of the late Carrie Fisher here - a bit flat imho). The aerial fight sequences are state of the art, as are the special effects. It's also a magnificent production.

    So what's the problem? Well, to me the film is lacking something. It doesn't gel as well/tightly as TFA does imho, and has a lot of detours and side stories that it could have done without. There is also something a bit 'manufactured assembly line' about the conflicts here and I found myself realizing that I was watching a 'Mouse House' effort (something which I didn't feel with TFA).

    Rather than bore everyone with a lengthy commentary, I'll just say that @Master_Dahark's review pretty much mirrors my own thoughts completely. I will also add the following:
    I realize this film has to make serious coin in China, a market where TFA underperformed relative to the rest of the world. Having said that, I'm a bit disappointed by the cultural pandering I've seen in the last few SW films. It comes across a bit obvious to me.

    Also, I think there are way too may scenes that are too reminiscent of the old films. Sure, they tried to shake it up with 'twists', but in my view it wasn't enough.

    The clashes between key characters work for the most part, but I felt there was a lack of gravitas and weight to them. As an example, one really felt the conflict in ESB, RoTJ and even in RoTS (despite that out of his league clown Christensen overplaying it). I just didn't feel that here even though the struggles were there and the acting was just fine. It was sort of 'so what?' or 'deja vu' to me. It could have been so much more, is what I'm saying.

    Oh, and Han Solo is sorely missed by this viewer.

    Still, as I said there's a lot to like and I think it's a decent enough effort. It just didn't elevate me to the highs I had after viewing TFA (even just the other night).

    Rankings:

    -ESB
    -TFA
    -ROTJ
    -SW
    -TLJ
    -ROTS
    -AOTC
    -PM
    -RO
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    1 Star Wars
    2 The Empire Strikes Back
    3 The Force Awakens
    4 Rogue One
    5 The Last Jedi
    6 Revenge of the Sith
    7 The Phantom Menace
    8 Attack of the Clones
    9 Return of the Jedi

  • Regarding Luke, here's what I wished happened:
    We're shown the X-Wing in the water- once the Millennium Falcon left I was hoping Luke would have lifted it out (alluding to Empire Strikes Back) and gone to that 'salty planet' IN THE FLESH. Main reason: he wouldn't have to die!!!
    The more I think about it, him never leaving that planet is just plain depressing. People are suggesting he'll be a Force Ghost in the next one but that's just not the same. I'm really not sure where they're going with Episode IX.
    Mark Hamill had said he didn't agree with where his character goes in this story; at first I brushed it off but now that I've seen it, I agree with him.

    Also, one big question from The Force Awakens that had everyone debating:
    how the FUCK, did Luke's old saber end up with Maz Kanata? They did not answer that.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    What is a force ghost
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    What is a force ghost
    It's what Ben Kenobi was in ESB/ROTJ
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    bondjames wrote: »
    What is a force ghost
    It's what Ben Kenobi was in ESB/ROTJ

    A ghost
  • Posts: 7,500
    When people hail TFA as a great film and at the same time criticises TLJ because it's "assembly line" and "too reminiscient of the old films"... I am seriously wondering what's going on. TFA was a nostalgic recycle of A New Hope. TLJ has a new and unique story.
  • edited December 2017 Posts: 2,107
    I was 14, when The Phantom Mence hit the theaters. Only a couble of years before that, was only familiar with ewoks films and cartoon series.

    Saw my first Star Wars just before the special editions.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited December 2017 Posts: 23,883
    I used the terms which seem to be causing some undue (and unnecessary) confusion. So let me clarify.
    I said conflicts seemed manufactured assembly line to me. It's in the character interplay and scenarios. The teacher vs. student conflict is one. The good jedi peer vs. bad jedi is another. The dark side calling the conflicted student is one more. These conflicts here didn't have the emotional resonance that they did for me in prior films. Perhaps because I've seen it before, or maybe because the prior encounters were so iconic and transformational. Vader's turn was so much more interesting than Ren's. Same goes for Yoda and Kenobi's difficulties training Luke and Anakin in comparison to Luke training Ray respectively. The earlier tensions reverberated more for me.
    I said some scenes were too reminiscent of the past to me. The Snoke scene in particular (despite the sudden 'twist') reminded me a lot of ROTJ's finale and the salt planet encounter was a bit too reminiscent of Hoth. There is something about the set up and flow of the film which reminded me a lot of ESB as well, although it admittedly detoured nicely towards the end.

    I don't remember 'hailing' TFA as anything. I just enjoyed the heck out of it. I enjoy TMWTGG immensely too, but don't hail that as being great either.

    Just in case I didn't state it clearly enough in my earlier post, I quite liked TLJ. I rate it middle of the pack. It's just that I'm not as impressed by it as I was TFA, which was a GE/TSWLM energy level formula recycle to me. Maybe one can only get away with one of those once a decade or so.
  • edited December 2017 Posts: 7,500
    @bondjames

    I was not refering to you specifically. Your comment was in the midst of several comments, some of them ranking TFA as a top three SW film meanwhile pointing out that TLJ was too reminiscient of the older films. The descriptions I remembered at the time happened to be yours..
  • edited December 2017 Posts: 2,107
    After my first sit through, I too was more impressed with TFA.

    I dunno, like I said before , I need to see TLJ more than once to fully appreciate it. For now , I must say the hype died faster than for TFA. TFA was easier to pick apart
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Fair enough @jobo. Thanks for clarifying. I hope I've explained why I think the way I do appropriately in my post above. I still like the film a lot actually and intend to revisit it during the holiday period. Ray, Poe and Kylo are great characters.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Poe does nothing for me. Might as well leave him out.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Poe does nothing for me. Might as well leave him out.
    I think
    they inserted him to allow Ray to develop outside of the battle station space conflicts. In the past Anakin and Luke were ace pilots who were used in complex space battles. Bifurcating the roles (although Ray is inevitably a good pilot, having jedi powers) allows for more narrative flexibility with the character Ray. He's also there to accommodate and pander to the little boys who they will rely on to buy all the games and toys. Finn and Rose are there for pandering too. Lots of toys to sell and lots of global markets to conquer. This is Disney in full effect.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Probably spot on, but I wish a more charismatic actor had played him.
  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,730
    I think it’s funny how the audience score on RT right now for TLJ is lower than all the prequels

    Still I shall enter the theatre tomorrow open minded.
  • I hate to say it friend, but I’d rank it just better than the prequels
  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,730
    I hate to say it friend, but I’d rank it just better than the prequels

    Without spoiling it for me, is it one massive direction the film goes in that makes it bad, is it a character choice, or is it just boring through out
  • This could be one of those movies that I like more after one viewing, once my sights are set a little better- because there’s definitely great direction and many memorable shots and scenes.

    But without spoiling, it’s a little of everything you mentioned.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,491
    I'm surprised to see it open roughly $40 million lower domestically than TFA - going off estimates, that is. Actuals could be higher.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    ESB didn't do as well as SW and AOTC didn't do as well as PM, so it will be par for the course if it doesn't quite hit TFA numbers.
  • Posts: 1,314
    Groo. I didn't think much to it. There's some really great bits of character work but then everything get undone time and again by bait and switch directing tricks, awful awful humour verging on prequel slapstick, narrative brick walls, deus ex machina galore....

    It breaks established 'rules' of the universe but not in a though provoking way.

    And the Mary poppins moment is just embarrassing.

    2/5
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