SPECTRE Production Timeline

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Comments

  • Posts: 6,396
    By modern, do you mean lots of heavy bass and horn sounds without a melody that anyone can hum along? Yes, you're probably right there.
  • Posts: 3,169
    WillyGalore.

    Feel free to speak for yourself. But please, don't speak for "anyone."
  • Posts: 6,396
    Why, will "anyone" get upset with me?
  • Posts: 3,169
    It's just a weak argument, that's all. You can't really argue someone elses taste.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,335
    I share the same opinion with Willy so I'm fine.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,459
    Murdock wrote:
    What his music lacks to day. (Well at least with action music.) is a solid theme. Looped beats and occasional horn Blasts aren't enough. You've got to have dramatic progression. It's like he doesn't try. Action theme? Oh let me load up one of my action templates and change the notes a bit to be "New".

    I really rather agree with Murdock. And Willy.
    I don't find Zimmer to be very creative or outstanding.
    I could not play the Man of Steel. But I listened to Interstellar and it is much the same. Nothing to get excited about.
    :)>-
  • Posts: 6,396
    Zekidk wrote:
    It's just a weak argument, that's all. You can't really argue someone elses taste.

    All I said was I'd take Williams over Zimmer.

    You're the one who then had a hissy fit over it.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,614
    I suppose I don't focus on scores and soundtracks as much as I'd like, but I usually judge one by whether it stuck with me (meaning it's fantastic), or whether it stood out because of how terrible it was. Sometimes I'll go into a film focusing on the soundtrack, but it's rare. As for Zimmer, his work has never really stood out to me.
  • edited May 2014 Posts: 3,169
    Good, then anyone amounts to three so far. ;-) But even if you get a hundred or one million behind you, there will always be anyone someone who thinks otherwise.

    But I respect all opinions.
    Zekidk wrote:
    It's just a weak argument, that's all. You can't really argue someone elses taste.

    All I said was I'd take Williams over Zimmer.
    You're the one who then had a hissy fit over it.

    No, I respect your opinion, and I won't argue over taste. But I will argue than you can't speak for anyone.

    Over and out.
  • edited May 2014 Posts: 7,506
    What Zimmer has basically done throughout his whole career is to copy the techniques of the great composer Gustav Holst. Not much "modern" creativity there. Holst wrote his music early on in the 20th century...



  • Posts: 14,873
    Shouldn't this debate go somewhere else? Because Hans Zimmer is, as far as we know, nowhere near writing the soundtrack of Bond 24, or any Bond for that matter.
  • Posts: 6,396
    Zekidk wrote:
    Not very modern, though, eh?

    I missed this quote.

    What was that about a weak argument?
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited May 2014 Posts: 12,459
    Ludovico wrote:
    Shouldn't this debate go somewhere else? Because Hans Zimmer is, as far as we know, nowhere near writing the soundtrack of Bond 24, or any Bond for that matter.

    Exactly. We shall most like have Newman again. Though I would be happy with Arnold.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,335
    Zekidk wrote:
    If Newman wanted to copy Zimmer anyways, why not bring in the real thing?

    Because everybody is ripping off Zimmer these days. It's sad that the days of movie scores with epic memorable themes are about dead. I'm glad I'm learning how to write music. I'm writing the theme song to my own movie and even it has more heart in soul in it than anything Zimmer's done in the last decade.

  • Posts: 3,169
    Zekidk wrote:
    Not very modern, though, eh?

    I missed this quote.

    What was that about a weak argument?

    Huh? I love the Williams theme. I just don't think it's very modern. There are bits that sound very dated. Feel free to argue otherwise. Or just leave it. I'm not trying to prove you wrong, mate.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,614
    We've said what we want to say, let's please keep it on topic because I'm sure if this gets locked again (like it did a few days ago), it'll stay locked for a long while.
  • Posts: 3,169
    Murdock wrote:
    Zekidk wrote:
    If Newman wanted to copy Zimmer anyways, why not bring in the real thing?

    Because everybody is ripping off Zimmer these days. It's sad that the days of movie scores with epic memorable themes are about dead. I'm glad I'm learning how to write music. I'm writing the theme song to my own movie and even it has more heart in soul in it than anything Zimmer's done in the last decade.

    Then you should probably feel miserable when reading this:

    "Hans Zimmer – Net Worth: $90 Million"
    http://www.therichest.com/expensive-lifestyle/money/making-millions-5-makers-of-movie-music/4/
  • edited May 2014 Posts: 7,506
    Am I the only one who wants Newman back for Bond 24? I thought his work was overall quite outstanding. Not every part of the soundtrack is perfect, but there are far more of the "better moments" than the "worse ones". In fact I think he deserves more credit for the fact that Skyfall worked as well as it did. I think watching the actual film gives a better verdict than studying the soundtrack on its own, and Newman's music works very well with the scenes they are supposed to accompany.

    And if keeping "modern" and creative indeed is a priority, then Newman certainly is a given choice...
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    edited May 2014 Posts: 16,335
    Zekidk wrote:
    Then you should probably feel miserable when reading this:

    "Hans Zimmer – Net Worth: $90 Million"
    http://www.therichest.com/expensive-lifestyle/money/making-millions-5-makers-of-movie-music/4/

    Why should I feel miserable? I don't give a crap. Your attempt to provoke me is rather useless. If you enjoy mediocrity then you go eat it up like the rest of the sheep. ;)
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,459
    I am okay with Newman returning, but not excited. He is definitely talented but I felt Skyfall's score was lacking.

    Zekidk, please give it a rest. No one is saying Zimmer hasn't earned money, had a long career, made some memorable music (for some that means years ago). This thread should not turn into an argument about him.

  • Posts: 3,169
    Murdock.

    Eh... okay. Fine with me. Good luck with your own project which "has more heart in soul in it than anything Zimmer's done in the last decade."

    And sorry if you think I wanted to provoke a discussion. That wasn't my intention.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,335
    So is there any new news yet? I'm quit curious on the budget. we know it was cut for Skyfall. I'm wondering how much of an increase it will have for B24.
  • Posts: 7,506
    Murdock wrote:
    Zekidk wrote:
    If Newman wanted to copy Zimmer anyways, why not bring in the real thing?

    Because everybody is ripping off Zimmer these days. It's sad that the days of movie scores with epic memorable themes are about dead. I'm glad I'm learning how to write music. I'm writing the theme song to my own movie and even it has more heart in soul in it than anything Zimmer's done in the last decade.

    I agree regarding that observation. Action music has become very generic during the last couple of decades.

    Regarding Bond music especially, I think it's important that the composer either writes or contributes to the arrangement of the theme song. That's one of the areas where Newman's score was really lacking. There's only one real moment when the theme song is utilized, and that is probably my favourite part of the soundtrack. We should have gotten more of those moments! Throughout the history of Bond music, the best moments are when the theme song really gets to shine in the film. In Skyfall it seems like Newman and Adele worked completely separate.

  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,335
    @Jobo, I think Newman did pretty well on the Action cues. It was the transition music that didn't match up well. IMO.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,614
    Newman was half and half for me for SF. His 'Skyfall' tune was excellent: very creepy, ominous, and fit the mood well, it was definitely one of my favorites, but then he had some other tracks that didn't stand out at all to me.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited May 2014 Posts: 12,459
    Re budget: I have not seen any news. Reasonably, I think we can suppose that Bond 24 will have an even bigger budget simply due to Skyfall's outstanding success. Just throwing money at a director and saying "Have at it" is hardly a good idea (look at Tamahori). But Mendes seems to have a solid sense of himself, and I do not think he will just blow any additional funds. I hope there is more filming on location, for example. Oh, and if they can afford more, then definitely shoot some gorgeous scenes in Norway and/or Sweden. I'd love that!
  • Posts: 9,790
    I would want John Ottman or James Newtown Howard but that is just me
  • Posts: 3,169
    jobo wrote:
    Throughout the history of Bond music, the best moments are when the theme song really gets to shine in the film. In Skyfall it seems like Newman and Adele worked completely separate.

    The "making of" on the Blu-Ray explains why we first get to hear variations of the main theme when Bond sails towards the Macao casino: Because they (Mendes and Newman) thought it would get the "proper impact."

    They missed the mark IMO, and I agree with you entirely.

    On another note: I was watching 'Cars 2' with my son the other day, which has this Aston Martin spoofing Bond. There's usually a very significant score attached to every scene the Aston Martin is in (you can find in on youtube quicky) and when my son said "it sounds like James Bond" I thought John Barry.

    Isn't it a part of the formula, that composers should adapt to this "sound" rather than creating their own unique style, which will either sound dated by time (Bill Conti) or just out of place (Eric Serra)

    At least Arnold understood/understands this. I'm not sure Newman does.
  • Posts: 7,506
    Zekidk wrote:
    jobo wrote:
    Throughout the history of Bond music, the best moments are when the theme song really gets to shine in the film. In Skyfall it seems like Newman and Adele worked completely separate.

    The "making of" on the Blu-Ray explains why we first get to hear variations of the main theme when Bond sails towards the Macao casino: Because they (Mendes and Newman) thought it would get the "proper impact."

    That's a shame! That theme tune was one of the best in decades, and would have deserved to be an even stronger reference point for the film.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited May 2014 Posts: 12,459
    I cannot seem to get the quote function to work now ... anyway:

    Zekidk said: On another note: I was watching 'Cars 2' with my son the other day, which has this Aston Martin spoofing Bond. There's usually a very significant score attached to every scene the Aston Martin is in (you can find in on youtube quicky) and when my son said "it sounds like James Bond" I thought John Barry.
    Isn't it a part of the formula, that composers should adapt to this "sound" rather than creating their own unique style, which will either sound dated by time (Bill Conti) or just out of place (Eric Serra)
    At least Arnold understood/understands this. I'm not sure Newman does.


    Yes, that has been talked about on other threads, too. Adele and Newman definitely worked separately and Newman did not want to incorporate the Bond theme song into the film a la Barry's template. Arguments ensued. He was (surprising to me) really not involved 100% with the piece I love that does include a snippet of the theme song, the section named Komodo Dragon (Bond floats towards the casino). I forget how that was done; it is on this forum somewhere, but Newman was not a major contributor to that part. I find that whole attitude by Newman more than a little annoying. I want the composer to bring his own talents and unique style but also it is a Bond film and I want the Bondian elements there, specifically the theme song woven into the film at times (in variations) and the James Bond theme used more (not overdone, just used properly).
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