Controversial opinions about Bond films

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  • Posts: 14,824
    RC7 wrote: »
    Birdleson wrote: »
    But it's there. I don't think taking it for what he said is too extreme, and I don't know where that "justify their hatred" part comes in.

    Ok, strongly worded perhaps. My opinion is that people are being unnecessarily harsh and ignoring the shades of grey to satisfy their own rhetoric. I can understand people not liking this film, bit I keep reading comments that seem reactionary, over considered.

    A lot of people have a tendency to be hyperbolic on internet forums. They don't dislike a movie they hate it and they hate it because it's the worst ever and every single element of its plot is stupid.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,691
    RC7 wrote: »
    Birdleson wrote: »
    But it's there. I don't think taking it for what he said is too extreme, and I don't know where that "justify their hatred" part comes in.

    Ok, strongly worded perhaps. My opinion is that people are being unnecessarily harsh and ignoring the shades of grey to satisfy their own rhetoric. I can understand people not liking this film, bit I keep reading comments that seem reactionary, over considered.
    Oh, let's just say this once and for all out loud:
    SPECTRE is a sub-par Bond entry because Blofeld wore no socks.
    There, I ripped out of the double-O closet and dragged it into the light... deal with it.

    B-)
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Ludovico wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    Birdleson wrote: »
    But it's there. I don't think taking it for what he said is too extreme, and I don't know where that "justify their hatred" part comes in.

    Ok, strongly worded perhaps. My opinion is that people are being unnecessarily harsh and ignoring the shades of grey to satisfy their own rhetoric. I can understand people not liking this film, bit I keep reading comments that seem reactionary, over considered.

    A lot of people have a tendency to be hyperbolic on internet forums. They don't dislike a movie they hate it and they hate it because it's the worst ever and every single element of its plot is stupid.

    Quite true. I keep having to remind myself this isn't a Mission Impossible.
  • Posts: 14,824
    chrisisall wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    Birdleson wrote: »
    But it's there. I don't think taking it for what he said is too extreme, and I don't know where that "justify their hatred" part comes in.

    Ok, strongly worded perhaps. My opinion is that people are being unnecessarily harsh and ignoring the shades of grey to satisfy their own rhetoric. I can understand people not liking this film, bit I keep reading comments that seem reactionary, over considered.
    Oh, let's just say this once and for all out loud:
    SPECTRE is a sub-par Bond entry because Blofeld wore no socks.
    There, I ripped out of the double-O closet and dragged it into the light... deal with it.

    B-)

    Yes this was SO wrong. And don't get me started on Goldfinger's Bermuda shorts and what that tart Tatiana wanted to wear in Piccadilly.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,691
    Ludovico wrote: »
    chrisisall wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    Birdleson wrote: »
    But it's there. I don't think taking it for what he said is too extreme, and I don't know where that "justify their hatred" part comes in.

    Ok, strongly worded perhaps. My opinion is that people are being unnecessarily harsh and ignoring the shades of grey to satisfy their own rhetoric. I can understand people not liking this film, bit I keep reading comments that seem reactionary, over considered.
    Oh, let's just say this once and for all out loud:
    SPECTRE is a sub-par Bond entry because Blofeld wore no socks.
    There, I ripped out of the double-O closet and dragged it into the light... deal with it.

    B-)

    Yes this was SO wrong. And don't get me started on Goldfinger's Bermuda shorts and what that tart Tatiana wanted to wear in Piccadilly.

    Potentially enjoyable films just completely ruined... [-(
  • Posts: 1,631
    Is it too late to start a blofeldwearssocks.com site? ;)
  • Posts: 14,824
    dalton wrote: »
    Is it too late to start a blofeldwearssocks.com site? ;)

    Or Blofeld sucks if he doesn't wear socks?

    Oh and in FRWL Bond is after a typewriter. That's rubbish.
  • Posts: 11,189
    Ludovico wrote: »
    dalton wrote: »
    Is it too late to start a blofeldwearssocks.com site? ;)

    Or Blofeld sucks if he doesn't wear socks?

    Oh and in FRWL Bond is after a typewriter. That's rubbish.

    The machine is described as being LIKE a typewriter :P
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Ludovico wrote: »
    dalton wrote: »
    Is it too late to start a blofeldwearssocks.com site? ;)

    Or Blofeld sucks if he doesn't wear socks?

    Oh and in FRWL Bond is after a typewriter. That's rubbish.

    Not to mention Blofeld in drag.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    So it isn t even a proper typewriter.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,691
    So it isn t even a proper typewriter.
    So it's what? A shoddy casing full of used pin ball machine parts-??

  • Posts: 14,824
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    dalton wrote: »
    Is it too late to start a blofeldwearssocks.com site? ;)

    Or Blofeld sucks if he doesn't wear socks?

    Oh and in FRWL Bond is after a typewriter. That's rubbish.

    The machine is described as being LIKE a typewriter :P

    It IS a typewriter. The Lektor is a typewriter that decodes secret codes. And Tatiana is a tart. So FRWL sucks.

  • SarkSark Guangdong, PRC
    Posts: 1,138
    It's hard to disagree with that - a "personal Bond" bridge too far from me. Let's just hope that they don't develop it much further in the next Bond film or films.

    As SPECTRE proved they could jettison entire films from history, so I don't see any problem with dropping that part of the storyline .
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Sark wrote: »
    It's hard to disagree with that - a "personal Bond" bridge too far from me. Let's just hope that they don't develop it much further in the next Bond film or films.

    As SPECTRE proved they could jettison entire films from history, so I don't see any problem with dropping that part of the storyline .

    Which films were jettisoned?
  • SarkSark Guangdong, PRC
    Posts: 1,138
    QoS. It's been pointed out numerous times that SPECTRE referenced CR and SF numerous times, but the only mention of QoS was a quick picture of Dominic Greene.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,691
    Sark wrote: »
    QoS. It's been pointed out numerous times that SPECTRE referenced CR and SF numerous times, but the only mention of QoS was a quick picture of Dominic Greene.
    But... White....
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    chrisisall wrote: »
    Sark wrote: »
    QoS. It's been pointed out numerous times that SPECTRE referenced CR and SF numerous times, but the only mention of QoS was a quick picture of Dominic Greene.
    But... White....

    and mention of 'Quantum', but let's just ignore that because it doesn't fit in with our blinkered view.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    RC7 wrote: »
    chrisisall wrote: »
    Sark wrote: »
    QoS. It's been pointed out numerous times that SPECTRE referenced CR and SF numerous times, but the only mention of QoS was a quick picture of Dominic Greene.
    But... White....

    and mention of 'Quantum', but let's just ignore that because it doesn't fit in with our blinkered view.

    Well given that in the film QOS Quatum is set up as this big mysterious organisation that White and Le Chiffre worked for I would say that the links between Quantum and SPECTRE and how they fit together are what needs explaining most of all but one mention in passing is all we get; so airbrushing out of history is about right. The quick mentions of Greene and Quantum are a sop to us fans as the general public won't remember them.

    If they could do a George Lucas and go back and change all mentions of Quantum in QOS to SPECTRE that would be the best solution.

    But seeing as they won't do that the best thing we can do is just cough and say 'SPECTRE' any time someone mentions Quantum by name in QOS (I think it's only Greene at the end).

    Actually those Q lapel badges they put on in the opera scene aren't a million miles away from the octopus logo. Just add more legs to the Q and bobs your uncle.

    Maybe Quantum took over more villains organisations adding another leg each time until they came up with the octopus?

    All it would take would be a couple of lines from Ernst in the torture scene 'after I killed my father I started Quantum blah blah but now we have rebranded ourselves and are called SPECTRE'.

    And then go on to explain what the acronym stands for FFS!! The film is called SPECTRE but it's only Madeline in the hotel and Bond in the safe house to M who ever say the word.
  • SarkSark Guangdong, PRC
    Posts: 1,138
    Also White was in Casino Royale and played a bigger role there I believe. He appeared in the PTS and very briefly at the opera scene in QoS.

    Does anyone disagree with my main point-that EON clearly decided that QoS was a red headed stepchild and minimized mentions of it?
  • SarkSark Guangdong, PRC
    edited January 2016 Posts: 1,138
    I stand corrected. I haven't watched QoS in awhile. Not as much fun as I like. I think he's a far bigger presence in CR though, appearing with Le Chiffre and the African warlord, killing Greene and apparently orchestrating the whole death of Vesper.

    Now for an opinion: Stromberg is one of the great villains of the series. He does the menacing yet suave bit excellently is a very believable megalomaniac. Maybe a more controversial bit: he's better than any villains in Craig or Pierce's era, with the possible exception of Alec.

    I was watching TSWLM last night with my gf (like many Chinese, I don't think she's really aware of a Bond pre-Craig) when I had that realization.
  • Posts: 14,824
    Boy I'd disagree with that. Stromberg is a poor man's Blofeld. I'd say he's more menacing than Carver and Graves but that's about it. And he has far less personality than Carver. I prefer TSWLM to its copy MR but find Drax the better villain.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Ludovico wrote: »
    Stromberg is a poor man's Blofeld.

    But he is more like the unseen Blofeld than any of the others, with his calm and almost detached demeanour. You could be fooled by his exterior.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited January 2016 Posts: 23,883
    I'll take Jurgens' Stromberg over any of the 'seen' film Blofeld's except Savalas's personally, where it's a draw for me. I agree that he was very Blofeld-like.
  • Posts: 14,824
    bondjames wrote: »
    I'll take Jurgens' Stromberg over any of the 'seen' film Blofeld's except Savalas's personally, where it's a draw for me. I agree that he was very Blofeld-like.

    Oh he was and if I understand they wanted to use Blofeld in early drafts. But the scifi scheme was just one step too far for me.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Yeah Bond in space isn't the problem. It's the crap comedy around Jaw's romance and his character in general in MR.
  • Posts: 11,189
    @Birdleson.Regarding Stromberg, I've always enjoyed TSWLM but the last time I saw it Stromberg felt a little underused. There's fairly long sections where he doesn't appear and, unlike Dr No, his presence isn't felt when he's offscreen.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,330
    I love Stromburg, After he kills his assistant and smiles at the two doctors and says, "Once again Gentlemen, my most profound thanks." That was a great underrated villain moment. I could see a hint of Stromburg in SP Blofeld as they both enjoyed playing with fancy computer consoles.
  • SarkSark Guangdong, PRC
    Posts: 1,138
    Murdock wrote: »
    I love Stromburg, After he kills his assistant and smiles at the two doctors and says, "Once again Gentlemen, my most profound thanks." That was a great underrated villain moment. I could see a hint of Stromburg in SP Blofeld as they both enjoyed playing with fancy computer consoles.

    Yes! thats one of the scenes I'm talking about. It's hilarious and menacing.
  • RC7 wrote: »
    But if people want to be literal to justify their hatred, nothing I can say will change that.

    I don't hate the movie at all. In fact, I really like a lot of it (although I'm not sure how great I think it is). I just really don't like this Blofeld (or the whole foster child situation, for that matter), which is what I was trying to get across. I just really didn't like anything about him, which is obviously just my own personal subjective opinion.

    Just the fact that it's in the script at all, regardless of whether or not Blofeld was being a little cheeky or "vague," bothers me. I might have overstated a bit with the "only reason" claim, but Bond being any motivation for Blofeld's path to creating SPECTRE irks me (just personal taste).

    I have other problems with the film, but that's my #1. My #2 would be the feeling that I had during every viewing, which is this sense of exhaustion/creative exhaustion. I can't really put my finger on it, I just didn't feel a lot of life in this one. Maybe I blame Mendes?

    Even Hoytema, who wouldn't have any carry-over fatigue this being his first Bond film, didn't impress me as much as I wish he had. Don't get me wrong, the cinematography ranges from good to very good (especially the bits in Blofeld's lair. That scene looks gorgeous - very intentionally 60's and I was okay with that).

    Just a lack of energy, I guess is what I'm trying to say. Again, just my personal experience with the thing. Waiting for the Blu-ray now and I'll give it another serious look.
  • Posts: 14,824
    @ThingsofXenia You can be critical about the Blofeld/Bond connection and as a creative decision it is questionable. The problem I think @RC7 and myself have about the criticism it has received is that people exaggerate its importance. It's there but Blofeld and Bond are not foster brothers, they are not blood brothers, this is not Cain and Abel.
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