Has Each Bond Actor Done a "Classic" Bond film?

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  • @socaljon3, if you've been around since Dr. No, then I'd suggest you head on down to the Originals thread, where you can talk with other fine members of this fine forum who have been around since the Connery days. You can even review all the films yourself, I'm sure they'd appreciate your take.

    I pretty much agree with your take on the classics, by the way. I'd include OHMSS in there, but other than that, you're good!
  • edited November 2013 Posts: 1,919
    I really hate to say this to the Dalton fans but Dalton did not make any classic Bond films. While the 007 super fans may think he did he did not. If you ask a casual movie fan name some classic Bond films. U will never hear them say TLD, and LTK. If you ask the casual fans name the actors who played James Bond you will hear them say Sean, Roger, Pierce, and Daniel. U will not hear them say Dalton or Lazenby. Sorry but its the truth. We on this site may love Dalton but the public didn't.
  • Posts: 2,369
    fjdinardo wrote:
    I really hate to say this to the Dalton fans but Dalton did not make any classic Bond films. While the 007 super fans may think he did he did not. If you ask a casual movie fan name some classic Bond films. U will never hear them say TLD, and LTK. If you ask the casual fans name the actors who played James Bond you will hear them say Sean, Roger, Pierce, and Daniel. U will not hear them say Dalton or Lazenby. Sorry but its the truth. We on this site may love Dalton but the public didn't.

    GP's opinion is not the point of this thread. TLD has all the elements of a classic Bond film AND is heavily rooted in Fleming. Therefore, TLD is a classic Bond film.
  • edited November 2013 Posts: 1,919
    fjdinardo wrote:
    I really hate to say this to the Dalton fans but Dalton did not make any classic Bond films. While the 007 super fans may think he did he did not. If you ask a casual movie fan name some classic Bond films. U will never hear them say TLD, and LTK. If you ask the casual fans name the actors who played James Bond you will hear them say Sean, Roger, Pierce, and Daniel. U will not hear them say Dalton or Lazenby. Sorry but its the truth. We on this site may love Dalton but the public didn't.

    GP's opinion is not the point of this thread. TLD has all the elements of a classic Bond film AND is heavily rooted in Fleming. Therefore, TLD is a classic Bond film.

    yes to the Bond super fans its a classic, but to the public it wasnt. In order for your Bond film to be a classic the public as to love it and be invested into it as well. And thats what Daltons movies failed at doing
  • X3MSonicXX3MSonicX https://www.behance.net/gallery/86760163/Fa-Posteres-de-007-No-Time-To-Die
    Posts: 2,635
    Connery - All of them - except for DAF and NSNA.
    Lazemby - His only film is a classic.
    Moore - TMWTGG, TSWLM, MR.
    Dalton - TLD.
    Brosnan - Goldeneye, TWINE.
    Craig - CR, Skyfall.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    fjdinardo wrote:
    fjdinardo wrote:
    I really hate to say this to the Dalton fans but Dalton did not make any classic Bond films. While the 007 super fans may think he did he did not. If you ask a casual movie fan name some classic Bond films. U will never hear them say TLD, and LTK. If you ask the casual fans name the actors who played James Bond you will hear them say Sean, Roger, Pierce, and Daniel. U will not hear them say Dalton or Lazenby. Sorry but its the truth. We on this site may love Dalton but the public didn't.

    GP's opinion is not the point of this thread. TLD has all the elements of a classic Bond film AND is heavily rooted in Fleming. Therefore, TLD is a classic Bond film.

    yes to the Bond super fans its a classic, but to the public it wasnt. In order for you Bond film to be a classic the public as to love it and be invested into it as well. And thats what Daltons movies failed at doing

    It's a fair point. I think if you asked the cinema-going public to name a 'Classic' Bond, I think TLD would be well down the pecking order, if at all. I think you're looking at an amalgamation of Connery and Moore entries.
  • Posts: 1,052
    RC7 wrote:
    fjdinardo wrote:
    fjdinardo wrote:
    I really hate to say this to the Dalton fans but Dalton did not make any classic Bond films. While the 007 super fans may think he did he did not. If you ask a casual movie fan name some classic Bond films. U will never hear them say TLD, and LTK. If you ask the casual fans name the actors who played James Bond you will hear them say Sean, Roger, Pierce, and Daniel. U will not hear them say Dalton or Lazenby. Sorry but its the truth. We on this site may love Dalton but the public didn't.

    GP's opinion is not the point of this thread. TLD has all the elements of a classic Bond film AND is heavily rooted in Fleming. Therefore, TLD is a classic Bond film.

    yes to the Bond super fans its a classic, but to the public it wasnt. In order for you Bond film to be a classic the public as to love it and be invested into it as well. And thats what Daltons movies failed at doing

    It's a fair point. I think if you asked the cinema-going public to name a 'Classic' Bond, I think TLD would be well down the pecking order, if at all. I think you're looking at an amalgamation of Connery and Moore entries.

    If you are going with the theory of what the public thinks is a classic / films they remember it would probably be:

    GF, YOLT
    LALD, TSWLM
    GE
    CR,SF

    I would say these are probably the most recognised? That leaves 16 films that are just a blur that rolls into one.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,332
    Don't forget From Russia With Love. Those are the only films that are remembered you're right, though I wonder if GoldenEye is as clear to many as it might have once been. In recent years has it's status faded somewhat?
  • I think all of the first five Connery movies are well-remembered and that GoldenEye is still remembered, since the general public still likes Brosnan, and that was definitely his best film, not to mention the one that brought the series back from the 6-year hiatus. The video game adaptation is definitely a part of its renown, at least among the younger generation.

    About Craig, it might be a little too early to call Casino Royale and Skyfall classics, but they are definitely well on their way. If nothing else, they'll be more fondly remembered than Quantum of Solace.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,332
    GoldenEye would mean more to younger generations, yes, mosty due to the game and that makes me wonder, what do those people think of, say, The Spy Who Loved Me? At the moment I think one could only say the Connery films transend all ages.
  • Speaking as someone born in 1994, I think of GoldenEye and The Spy Who Loved Me as sort of trans-generational equivalents. Younger people remember GoldenEye more, though they may be familiar with the Union Jack parachute and Oddjob and Nobody Does It Better, and the elder generation remembers The Spy Who Loved Me more, though they know of the bungee jump and Trevelyan and Xenia.

    You're definitely right that the first five more than stand the test of time. Truly wonderful movies.
  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,146
    SC- From Russia With Love
    GL- OHMSS
    RM-The Spy Who Loved Me
    TD- Licence To Kill
    PB- GoldenEye
    DC- Casino Royale
  • edited November 2013 Posts: 1,497
    I consider all Bond films 1962-1989 classic, as they were produced by Cubby Broccoli, involved a direct lineage of directors since the beginning: Young-Hunt-Glen, featured Richard Maibaum scripts (mostly), featured Maurice Binder's title sequences (mostly), and still relied on Fleming source material directly even if in small doses for some films - the proverbial bottom of the barrel had not been scraped. (CR is the only film post Cubby Broccoli to borrow directly and explicitly as far as I know). There is a common in house Bond family that seems present throughout this era, that continues in spirit today with EON, but that original old guard seems forever encased in gold from 1962-1989.

    GE has many classic elements, and is even moving in the classic list, but still feels like the first reboot to me: new M, new Bond, new director who wasn't involved in past films, new Bond, Cubby all but retired. The Craig films are still part of the current zeitgeist that they haven't achieved classic status yet for me.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,281
    JBFan626 wrote:
    GE has many classic elements, and is even moving in the classic list, but still feels like the first reboot to me
    In my mind, LTK was the last in the lineage of "classic" Bonds even though it (and TLD) can be seen as having a younger Bond- a reboot of sorts. But it still has links to previous material whereas GE seems to start fresh (with the exception of a missing Leiter, presumably due to his trauma in LTK). Was Brosnan's Bond ever married? I don't see it. His was a new Bond for a new era, just as Craig's is for his IMO.
  • chrisisall wrote:
    JBFan626 wrote:
    GE has many classic elements, and is even moving in the classic list, but still feels like the first reboot to me
    In my mind, LTK was the last in the lineage of "classic" Bonds even though it (and TLD) can be seen as having a younger Bond- a reboot of sorts. But it still has links to previous material whereas GE seems to start fresh (with the exception of a missing Leiter, presumably due to his trauma in LTK). Was Brosnan's Bond ever married? I don't see it. His was a new Bond for a new era, just as Craig's is for his IMO.

    Janus makes reference to the women he failed to protect, and there's a subtext of Tracy's death in The World Is Not Enough. It's one of the films many shortcomings that it didn't do more with this novel concept.
  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    Posts: 7,274
    chrisisall wrote:
    Was Brosnan's Bond ever married? I don't see it. His was a new Bond for a new era, just as Craig's is for his IMO.
    I always got the feeling that GE was about the same old Bond trying to adjust to living in a new era.
  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,146
    To me GoldenEye was the last classic Bond because It had that dark but stylish look to it, and Cubby was still alive at the time so He must have made some choices for the film. Tomorrow Never Dies feels like a reboot.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,281
    pachazo wrote:
    I always got the feeling that GE was about the same old Bond trying to adjust to living in a new era.
    Yes, it's definitely in the script, and you CAN see it as a continuation from LTK, surely. I'm only talking about the 'feel' of the Bond movies after LTK- just my own reaction.
  • Posts: 1,548
    Connery and Craig have the highest percentage of "classic Bond" films in their canon. 2 (Lazenby doesn't count in my dojo cos he wasn't a proper actor as much as I love OHMSS) 2 out of 3 classics to date aint bad for Dan and QOS is filed under the drawer marked "underrated" imho.
  • Posts: 1,497
    Murdock wrote:
    To me GoldenEye was the last classic Bond because It had that dark but stylish look to it, and Cubby was still alive at the time so He must have made some choices for the film. Tomorrow Never Dies feels like a reboot.

    GE is the first Bond film with the producing credit of Barbara Broccoli, and Cubby is not listed. The behind the scenes also make it clear, that Cubby was in ill health and had a very limited advisory role at that point. LTK was the last film he had full involvement in and is listed as Producer (he had to be flown out even due to health issues). I suppose you could say GE is linked to the old films with the Cold War angle, but the whole point is that this is a post Cold War story: Bond in a new era. Also, by 'look', the cinematography and direction is all new (Meheux and Campbell), so if anything, this is a new interpretation of the old films. I guess I have a hard time seeing TND as a reboot, when so much of a change in production and crew began with GE: Bruce Feirstein had writing credits for both GE and TND as another example. TND also takes some elements from Bond17 such as the Chinese setting, so you could say that is also linked to the old era as well.

    But I agree though in a way: GE strikes a nice balance of classic elements, while bringing Bond into the modern era, without compromising the traits that make the character. There is a Bond "feel" that is familiar.
  • RC7RC7
    edited November 2013 Posts: 10,512
    LeChiffre wrote:
    2 out of 3 classics to date aint bad for Dan and QOS is filed under the drawer marked "underrated" imho.

    However you, I, or anyone else may feel about CR and SF, I do think bestowing 'classic' status on them is jumping the gun. They will always be lauded as great films, but in such a canon as Bond I think you have to give the best part of 10-20 years before you can retrospectively and objectively define one as a classic. The only films that are deemed 'classic' within a year or so of release are the ones that truly capture the zeitgeist. I would say CR didn't do this, despite it's success, and while SF performed well at the box-office, it's not held in the same regard as something like TDK, which has pretty much embedded itself as a modern classic, whether people agree with it or not.

  • edited November 2013 Posts: 1,497
    RC7 wrote:
    LeChiffre wrote:
    2 out of 3 classics to date aint bad for Dan and QOS is filed under the drawer marked "underrated" imho.

    However you, I, or anyone else may feel about CR and SF, I do think bestowing 'classic' status on them is jumping the gun. They will always be lauded as great films, but in such a canon as Bond I think you have to give the best part of 10-20 years before you can retrospectively and objectively define one as a classic. The only films that are deemed 'classic' within a year or so of release are the ones that truly capture the zeitgeist. I would say CR didn't do this, despite it's success, and while SF performed well at the box-office, it's not held in the same regard as something like TDK, which has pretty much embedded itself as a modern classic, whether people agree with it or not.

    Watch out, they'll be coming for your head! ;)
  • RC7 wrote:
    LeChiffre wrote:
    2 out of 3 classics to date aint bad for Dan and QOS is filed under the drawer marked "underrated" imho.

    However you, I, or anyone else may feel about CR and SF, I do think bestowing 'classic' status on them is jumping the gun. They will always be lauded as great films, but in such a canon as Bond I think you have to give the best part of 10-20 years before you can retrospectively and objectively define one as a classic. The only films that are deemed 'classic' within a year or so of release are the ones that truly capture the zeitgeist. I would say CR didn't do this, despite it's success, and while SF performed well at the box-office, it's not held in the same regard as something like TDK, which has pretty much embedded itself as a modern classic, whether people agree with it or not.

    They're classic Bond films, and that's what counts. The Dark Knight is an unqualified classic because it was "of the time". The Bond series hasn't been the zeitgeist since the first five Connery movies, and maybe, maybe The Spy Who Loved Me.

    The Bond series is sort of like a long-lived band, AC/DC, Metallica, Sabbath, Springsteen, the Rolling Stones, Dylan, whoever. They had their chance to shape the world of music, and they ran with it. Now they can just produce damn good albums that focus on what they do best, even if it can't live up to the glories of the early years.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 37,079
    @Soundofthesinners, while I feel that the work Craig is putting into the role is giving us films that really stand up there with the best of Connery's - the good ol' days - I agree, and really like your comparison between the Bond series and some of those legendary bands/artists: even though they may never reach the status they did during their glory years, they can still focus on what the fans love and create some great entertainment.
  • You have a good point about Craig. It's tough for me to sort out exactly where the Craig era falls, largely since it's not over. It's certainly on pace to be the best since Connery (they'd really have to screw up Bond 24 and 25 to derail that), and while nothing can equal the first 5 in terms of influence (include On Her Majesty's Secret Service for overall quality), they could stand in the same pantheon.

    Like I said, though, time will tell. We're lucky that we'll get to watch the Bond series develop from here.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 37,079
    @Soundofthesinners, same, and while I'm not looking forward to Craig's tenure coming to a close, I am excited to put all of his films into perspective and seeing which is my favorite, though I'm not sure if anything else can beat CR.
  • I don't foresee anything beating Casino Royale for a long time, Craig or not. It took On Her Majesty's Secret Service 37 years to be topped by Casino Royale (I'm 19, I'm just doing that retroactively). I expect a similar gap between Casino Royale and the next film of its caliber. I'm not saying the movies won't be good, of course not, but it will take a lot to beat the (kind of) reboot and the last full adaptation of Ian Fleming.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 37,079
    I don't foresee anything beating Casino Royale for a long time, Craig or not. It took On Her Majesty's Secret Service 37 years to be topped by Casino Royale (I'm 19, I'm just doing that retroactively). I expect a similar gap between Casino Royale and the next film of its caliber. I'm not saying the movies won't be good, of course not, but it will take a lot to beat the (kind of) reboot and the last full adaptation of Ian Fleming.

    And with GE (typically) being the favorite of the Brosnan era for most fans and CR being one of the best in the series for most fans, I think they need to bring back Campbell - if he isn't too old - for the opening of the next Bond actor's film.
  • Creasy47 wrote:
    I don't foresee anything beating Casino Royale for a long time, Craig or not. It took On Her Majesty's Secret Service 37 years to be topped by Casino Royale (I'm 19, I'm just doing that retroactively). I expect a similar gap between Casino Royale and the next film of its caliber. I'm not saying the movies won't be good, of course not, but it will take a lot to beat the (kind of) reboot and the last full adaptation of Ian Fleming.

    And with GE (typically) being the favorite of the Brosnan era for most fans and CR being one of the best in the series for most fans, I think they need to bring back Campbell - if he isn't too old - for the opening of the next Bond actor's film.

    If you figure it will be in about 2020, he'll be 77. That's certainly old, but I'd really hope he could do it. Being the first director since Glen (unless Mendes does Bond 25) to get a hat trick would be special. He's more than earned it, given how amazing GoldenEye and Casino Royale were.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,332
    Martin Campbell is already the series' oldest director so I can't see him beating his own record, not that he wants to make another Bond anyway.
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