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There is no really "naughty bit" in the franchise, I think. There are innuendoes and groaners and wordplays on this, no doubt, but hell...no Bond movie was rated worse than "12" over here except for occasional violence.
No Bond movie has more explicit sex or nudity than even 1970s public TV shows in Germany. So I'm not uncomfortable with that. Objectifying beautiful women? Yes, there may be a point. But apart from the fact that the actresses were doubtless aware of that, isn't showing Daniel Craig rising from the ocean in his swim shorts also a kind of objectification?
It's fine as it is.
Even in the swinging 60s Bond was down right prudish as compared with other films then and since and almost anything shown on HBO. It's difficult to get worked up about sex in the Bond films when one points out there may have been "a glimpse of nipple."
So, you're right. It can't be about nudity.
As far as objectifying women, where is the line between objectifying and not objectifying?
I don't think the sex is what some people have a problem with when it comes to Bond films/Bond girls. Maybe that's another discussion though.
The 'problem' is what I'd like to find out.
I'm not sure what the perceived 'problem' is with it, but generally the sex scenes (that they are) are often amongst the least interesting parts of the film.
There's only one Bond film which actually depicts Bond in the act itself; we always see him either pre or post-coital in the other films, but funnily enough DAD is the only time we actually see it all going on. And even more surprisingly this never seems to get mentioned anywhere.
He'd doing the deed in NSNA....
If it's not the nudity, because there really isn't any. And it's not the sex. Why, as many have speculated in various discussions, will Bond 26 need to be different? Why will the film have to reflect a new attitude or sensibility?
Although I don't think we need explicit sex scenes in the series. What we see in NSNA is enough, IMO.
Coincidence, or was that what people expected back then?
Is that with dungaree lady? I thought they were just rolling about- I’ll have to have another look.
Who has said this? What have they said? If someone has said this then you’d need to ask them specifically what they mean, I think. Are you talking about sex scenes specifically?
I think jobo probably has the right answer that it’s not about sex or ‘naughty bits’, just the portrayal of women which needs to get a bit more grown-up. NTTD was getting there, although I’m not sure Nomi wasn’t just an attempt to write a strong woman ‘so we’ll just write her as a man’. Not really the same thing. Also she’s entirely superfluous to the film, which isn’t great. Madeline is written pretty well though, I’d say.
Pretty much what was said by others above. A part is the portrayal of women.
I can understand why some would have issues with something like the barn scene from GF too. Or Bond suddenly kissing Patricia in TB. Neither are sex, however, and as I said I think there are actually very few people who have criticisms about the actual sex in Bond films.
There might be something to that. Bond is fundamentally a rather 'old fashioned' character in terms of morals. In the books one of these morals was to do with his relationship with women (no doubt in his younger days - CR specifically - he was an outright sexist with the overt 'women should be in the kitchen' mentality, but there's also that more chivalrous side to him in later stories. It's that St. George complex mixed with an attraction to damaged women that could be quite interesting played out).
Yeah, 'kissing her until she likes it' is certainly not cool and isn't coming back any time soon!
I don't think it even aged well past the 70s, haha.
Anya in the next film, whilst not exactly perfect, is a huge leap!
I never got the "thrill" of that move, either. The moment when Bond force-kisses Octopussy is particularly weird in that regard. First, the 'fight', then Moore's deadly serious face... I don't know, it's a bit too direct for my taste. Of course, the screenwriters "right that wrong" by showing that she's into it. Nevertheless, Bond doesn't win me over in that scene.
And I'm always confused by how they're suddenly standing inside the tentacles of Octopussy's elaborate bed!
There is a touch of 'she says no but means yes' about Bond and Lucia in Spectre, which sounds a little dodgy perhaps, but it's directed and played very well and there's no doubt that she's into it.
In terms of sex scenes, well, Goldeneye and Xenia kind of changed up what they would show, and it has a higher certificate as a result.
The Craig era has taken a more arthouse approach, but we also get odd things like the upskirt shot in QoS, or widow bone-jumping in Spectre.
It's not an incidental shot, it's there for a reason, but there's nothing remotely titillating or voyeuristic about that entire scene, right? It's sordid, horrible and abusive, like Medrano himself. Given that context, is it likely that that shot's there so that viewers can identify with Medrano and feel like a bit of a perve themselves by copping a look up Oona's dress? Or does it quickly tell the audience that Camille's intervention has succeeded in stopping Medrano before he's actually raped Oona's character? I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and go with the latter.
I'd even say that scene would actually be worse without the flash of knicker, because if that wasn't there the viewer might have assumed that Medrano had succeeded in going further than he actually did. The panties tell us that Camille saved Oona from Medrano. That's a good thing to know, right?
It wasn’t until I was on this board that I heard the ‘everything’s ok shot’ suggestion, which did help it sit better — but you have to wonder at it at the time.
Fatima and Bond in NSNA was up there for leaving less to the imagination. Clearly our man is having some fun while the audience sees Fatima looking wild in the door frame. As a 14 year old watching that scene left an impression.
Tim's Bond is perhaps the least shown to be frolicking but given the AIDS epidemic it is understandable.
Roger's Bond is quite the sex maniac. Tricking Solitaire into sex and taking her virginity, having Goodnight in the closet while he satisfies Anders, making out with Max Kalba's assistant within minutes of meeting her, in MR he jumps Manuela quite quickly, poor Kimberly Jones in AVTAK with the sub trip back from Hawaii. Some are offered in the spirit of entertainment, but with what is acceptable today they might make viewing problematic.
A Bond film without glamorous women looking gorgeous as well being interesting and capable is boring quite honestly