Does NO TIME TO DIE have the best ending in the franchise?

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  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    edited December 2022 Posts: 2,946
    His ashes probably did blow away on the wind, tbf. Apart from his little finger, obviously.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,028
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    I think they gave us too much death in NTTD. Killing off Felix and Blofeld in any other film would be a huge deal but in the exact same installment that you choose to kill Bond too? It's way too much.

    Why is that way too much to have those two die as well? For a finale it makes sense.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,566
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    I think they gave us too much death in NTTD. Killing off Felix and Blofeld in any other film would be a huge deal but in the exact same installment that you choose to kill Bond too? It's way too much.

    Why is that way too much to have those two die as well? For a finale it makes sense.

    Because it removes the weight of their deaths, in my opinion, like they're throwaway hits of emotion for the viewer since it's Craig's last outing.

    I nearly forgot Felix had died after my first viewing of NTTD thanks to all the other deaths and revelations.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 6,808
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    I think they gave us too much death in NTTD. Killing off Felix and Blofeld in any other film would be a huge deal but in the exact same installment that you choose to kill Bond too? It's way too much.

    Why is that way too much to have those two die as well? For a finale it makes sense.

    Because it removes the weight of their deaths, in my opinion, like they're throwaway hits of emotion for the viewer since it's Craig's last outing.

    I nearly forgot Felix had died after my first viewing of NTTD thanks to all the other deaths and revelations.

    Felix dying might be the most pointless of them all, it’s like they just wanted to wrap up every single character’s story in this single film: “Ow yeah, by the way, just saw Jeffrey in the hallway, that reminds me we must find a way to kill Felix off as well.”
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,028
    I think Felix is one of the best sacrificial lambs of this series, so it totally played for me. What made it more effective is that we got to see Bond and Felix drinking and enjoying themselves at a club, which is something I feel we’ve been too deprived of in this series.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    edited December 2022 Posts: 40,566
    @GoldenGun, as soon as Felix mentioned getting back to his family and that whole plot thread about getting Felix his cigar, I knew he was a goner.

    I will say that the repertoire and camaraderie between Bond and Felix in NTTD is what I had wanted between the two all along. Sometimes, the Craig era had too much aggression and stubbornness between allies and colleagues. That bar scene is one of my favorite bits of the film.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,028
    Should note, I was spoiled about his death before seeing the film and I did NOT like the idea of Felix dying. But the overall use of the character in NTTD got me that I no longer disliked it. That’s how good I thought it played.
  • edited December 2022 Posts: 2,101
    Personally I didn’t take issue with the ideas behind killing off the likes of Felix, Blofeld, and Bond all in one film. Would’ve been ludicrous though if they somehow killed off M, Moneypenny, and Q because that would’ve been too much.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited December 2022 Posts: 7,527
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    I think they gave us too much death in NTTD. Killing off Felix and Blofeld in any other film would be a huge deal but in the exact same installment that you choose to kill Bond too? It's way too much.

    Why is that way too much to have those two die as well? For a finale it makes sense.

    Because it removes the weight of their deaths, in my opinion, like they're throwaway hits of emotion for the viewer since it's Craig's last outing.

    I nearly forgot Felix had died after my first viewing of NTTD thanks to all the other deaths and revelations.

    Blofeld's death was more problematic than Bond's death, IMO.
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    @GoldenGun, as soon as Felix mentioned getting back to his family and that whole plot thread about getting Felix his cigar, I knew he was a goner.

    I will say that the repertoire and camaraderie between Bond and Felix in NTTD is what I had wanted between the two all along. Sometimes, the Craig era had too much aggression and stubbornness between allies and colleagues. That bar scene is one of my favorite bits of the film.

  • SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷ Lekki, Lagos, Nigeria
    edited December 2022 Posts: 1,386
    Bond vs Blofeld at the end would have really worked, even if Bond still died. How can Blofeld be revealed as "the author of all his pain" only for a new villain to be the main villain at the end? I'm really surprised Waltz didn't push for him and Craig to have the final confrontation at the film's end. Instead Waltz was underused...yet again!
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,028
    Waltz wasn’t available for more time. What we see of him was all they were able to get in his busy schedule
  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 2,534
    RewardingWeeIndochinesetiger-max-1mb.gif

    I don't think any ending tops Casino, it's perfect and caps a wonderful film. I love Skyfall's too but similar to what @Denbigh said Spectre let it down a bit

    Nice to have you back @Pierce2Daniel I do love that shot of Bond you used, he looks like a hero
  • SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷ Lekki, Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 1,386
    Waltz wasn’t available for more time. What we see of him was all they were able to get in his busy schedule

    Yeah, I seem to forget that. But in that limited time, something better and memorable should have been crafted for Waltz.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,527
    Waltz wasn’t available for more time. What we see of him was all they were able to get in his busy schedule

    Yeah, I seem to forget that. But in that limited time, something better and memorable should have been crafted for Waltz.

    100% agree with this and your post above.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,028
    I dunno if having Blofeld as the main baddie for only five minutes worth of screen time would have been a step up. I think they used him as best they could under those circumstances. It’s Safin who could have been stronger.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,527
    In those five minutes, even if they'd found a way to have him escape, that would have been better I think.
    If it's true that he was unavailable for anything more than what we got, I'd still have preferred it if Blofeld escaped and Safin remained the main villain.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,637
    I think the best ending in the entire "franchise" (which includes books, games, comics, films, ...) is still Fleming's final chapter of Casino Royale. You can't beat that.

    The best ending of the film series, however, may still be QOS for me.
  • NoWisemanNoWiseman Germany
    edited December 2022 Posts: 34
    Interesting thread.

    I've turned my back on all things Bond for quite a while. Only came back here for the one year anniversary of NTTD because i was curious, how the reception of this films has developed in the meantime.

    Personally i have to say, that it killed my interest especially in the Craig films in a big way. I watched none of it since last years premiere. Beforehand i was a great admirer of this actor and his bunch of films. I loved the substance, that they brought to it. I even could enjoy his last film, if it wouldn't end the way it does. So no, not the perfect ending for me. A far cry from the finale of CR, Bond towering above Mr. White. That gave me goosebumps.
    ... but that was absolutely the single worst decision EON have made in 60 years.

    This!

    I still cant't cope with this character-arc. In CR he hopes to find a normal life with Vesper but she dies and he becomes a hardened professional. During his career he constantly quarrels with his job and the price he has to pay. And then, what's the end of the line for him? The moment, he finds the normal life he was longing for, he has to die. It's all a journey into darkness. Depressing, miserable and tragic.

    A kind of life, that i wouldn't wish on my worst enemy. And especially not not on my beloved screen hero of +40 years. I still feel sad for this guy.

    Thats exactly the opposite, i want to take away from a Bond movie.

  • Posts: 1,015
    NoWiseman wrote: »
    Personally i have to say, that it killed my interest especially in the Craig films in a big way. I watched none of it since last years premiere. . .

    I'm the same. I really enjoyed the freshness and the contemporary feel of the Craig era, and I was even on board with SP, but they've ruined it for me by showing us how it all ends. Tragic things can happen to Bond, but Bond shouldn't be the tragedy. You can't see the ending of CR the same now, knowing a few years down the line he ends up being blown to shit the same week as discovering he's got a family.
    I know people will think I'm being over-sensitive by saying this, but for me, NTTD has sullied the whole Craig era. There was a lot of stuff I didn't like them doing in NTTD, but I'd still be on board for it all if he'd have escaped that island, (by jet-ski or balloon, or Lamma, I don't care. He just should have escaped).
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    edited December 2022 Posts: 6,008
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    I think they gave us too much death in NTTD. Killing off Felix and Blofeld in any other film would be a huge deal but in the exact same installment that you choose to kill Bond too? It's way too much.

    I liked that they killed off both Felix and Blofeld. It foreshadowed Bond's death and for the first time since at least QoS, it felt like anything could happen in a Bond film.
    The worst ending to any Bond film ever.

    Unnecessary, contrived, derivative of comic-book movies and not even well staged in a movie that featured Moore-ear comic moments from other characters.
    A mess.
    James Bond deserved better.

    Better make that two.

    I know it's the trendy thing to go after fans for questioning choices they feel are disrespectful (though I am not suggesting EON have done this), but that was absolutely the single worst decision EON have made in 60 years. And it's not just the act of killing Bond off, but the ridiculous way it was done. If he was going to die by being shot, why does he need poisoning? Any drama that might be wrung from Bond not being able to have contact with his loved ones, is made void. They might as well had Bond shot, poisoned, stabbed, dropped from a great height, flattened and then blown up. I was going to suggest his ashes be blown away on the wind, but that might be a step too far.

    My mixed feeling on SP aside, that should have been the ending to the Craig era.

    Fleming often referred to Bond imminent death, 00 agents don't make it to 40 or whatever age. It is only the earlier films--somewhere around YOLT or DAF--that made Bond seemingly invincible.

    I don't have a problem with them killing off Bond, or the nanobots justifying his sacrifice. However, Bond's death would have been a bigger, more impactful sacrifice had he (1) not already been dying from gunshot wounds, etc. and (2) if he were more actively involved in saving the island somehow. Think of May Day's sacrifice in AVTAK.

    Imagine if he were totally healthy and still found his reason to die in the end.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    Posts: 2,946
    NoWiseman wrote: »
    It's all a journey into darkness. Depressing, miserable and tragic.
    That's Brexit for you...

  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,637
    Venutius wrote: »
    NoWiseman wrote: »
    It's all a journey into darkness. Depressing, miserable and tragic.
    That's Brexit for you...

    =D>

    Bond 26:
    No Time To Bregret
    Brexit Wounds
    Farage Against The Machine
    ...

    ;-)
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    Posts: 2,946
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Brexit Wounds
    :))
  • mattjoesmattjoes matjoevakia
    Posts: 6,804
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Brexit Wounds

    "Did you call me?"

    I1ciIYp.png
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,637
    Seagal was part of a Bond production. This stays relevant somehow. ;-)

    But back on topic, I don't mind the ending of NTTD. But it's not the best of the series for me. Doesn't come close to the final scenes of QOS.
  • edited December 2022 Posts: 2,161
    I’d go with OHMSS, CR, or SF (in London only), with QOS as a dark horse.
  • Posts: 2,161
    My mixed feeling on SP aside, that should have been the ending to the Craig era.

    That’s how I feel. As much as I have derided SPECTRE over the years, I greatly prefer that ending as Bond’s swansong.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,566
    I think I'd also go with QoS in terms of best ending. It's so perfect.
  • Posts: 12,293
    In order, top 3 endings:

    1. CR
    2. QOS
    3. OHMSS

    LALD is another good candidate for underrated one thanks to a cool Samedi appearance. As mentioned before, the vast majority of these are very similar as Bond usually gets the girl and beats the baddies. But the unique ones are usually pretty good. SF in a way I feel like would be the coolest ending to the franchise if it had to have one, as it plays like a classic, full circle, infinite loop kind of thing. Only gripe is it feels a little more cheesy after the first watch x)
  • SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷ Lekki, Lagos, Nigeria
    edited December 2022 Posts: 1,386
    In no particular order, I love the following Bond endings:
    1.You didn't think I'd miss this performance, did you?
    2.This is no time to be rescued.
    3.The Name's Bond...James Bond.
    4.With pleasure, M. With pleasure.
    5.I never left.
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