NO TIME TO DIE (2021) - Discuss Hans Zimmer's Score

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  • Posts: 11,425
    I've lost count of the times I've loved a score and then found out at the end it was Zimmer. From Gladiator to 12 Years a Slave. Very diverse styles as well. He's brilliant IMO. A shame if he never scored a Bond film. I have no doubt the critics would be swiftly silenced.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 20,022
    Getafix wrote: »
    I've lost count of the times I've loved a score and then found out at the end it was Zimmer. From Gladiator to 12 Years a Slave. Very diverse styles as well. He's brilliant IMO. A shame if he never scored a Bond film. I have no doubt the critics would be swiftly silenced.

    Agreed.
  • Posts: 2,524
    Getafix wrote: »
    I've lost count of the times I've loved a score and then found out at the end it was Zimmer. From Gladiator to 12 Years a Slave. Very diverse styles as well. He's brilliant IMO. A shame if he never scored a Bond film. I have no doubt the critics would be swiftly silenced.

    When you hear Zimmer's work, it immediately grabs you, and this guy can write uplifting melodies. Days of Thunder isn't remotely like anything Barry would do, yet still sounds superb. Hearing examples like this would have got me excited, even though its nothing like Barry -



  • Posts: 11,425
    He even scored the Lion King. Unbelievably talented and prolific.
  • Posts: 5,735
    Dan Romer loves his cellos. Most of his soundtracks feature a cello at some point. Another TLD's reference? ;) Kidding of course. But the thing is, I want brass, lots of brass in the soundtrack. I want the 007 theme back. I want a full orchestral rendition of a melodic theme. I want the drums and the brass, blaring in the cinema, saying Bond is Back, with confidence. Can Romer deliver that? We'll see...or listen.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 20,022
    I used to dislike Zimmer, or rather think that he regurgitated his work incessantly. Around the time of HANNIBAL, I felt that the man had hit rock bottom. But he's been slowly rebuilding himself an impressive career since then and now, what with his Nolan collaborations and all, I'd say he's one of the finest composers we have.
  • Posts: 523
    Zekidk wrote: »
    No. Just no. The producers need to man up. This "the director chooses his own composer" has to stop! It certainly didn't lift the last two.

    This, basically. I am not interested in a Cary Joji Fukunaga film, I want a Bond film.
    For most Bond fans, James Bond films are about nostalgia. For them, a Bond film is a vehicle that transports them back into their childhood for about 2 hours. I say bollocks to that! When I watch the newest Bond film, I want to feel like moviegoers felt when they watched Dr No back in 1962.
    That’s crap! When DN came out there was no such thing as Bond films so of course it was something brand new. I go to see a Bond film expecting a Bond film and not something completely different. DN was something completely different but FRWL and everything that followed then adhered to the template set by DN. That’s what makes them Bond films.
  • Posts: 2,524
    Zekidk wrote: »
    No. Just no. The producers need to man up. This "the director chooses his own composer" has to stop! It certainly didn't lift the last two.

    This, basically. I am not interested in a Cary Joji Fukunaga film, I want a Bond film.
    For most Bond fans, James Bond films are about nostalgia. For them, a Bond film is a vehicle that transports them back into their childhood for about 2 hours. I say bollocks to that! When I watch the newest Bond film, I want to feel like moviegoers felt when they watched Dr No back in 1962.

    You do realise much of the key crew would return for subsequent Bond films right? Dr. No wasn't a one-off, and then all crew changed hands with FRWL.

  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded Riding a white swan to Matera
    edited July 2019 Posts: 12,377
    @jetsetwilly I wrote that as a Bond film. A Fukunaga Bond film. ;) So yeah, it needs to be Bondian. I'm one of the older fans on here. I just refuse to worry and hate on a new composer. I like the director and I have some faith (quite a bit, actually) in Bond 25 turning out to be very good indeed.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded Riding a white swan to Matera
    Posts: 12,377
    Getafix wrote: »
    I want a Cary Fukunaga Bond film. And I think that will be great, and still Bondian.

    I agree. But I do wonder if directors have too much power sometimes. With Bond the magic has often come from the producers assembling a great team. Basically Binder, Adam and Barry, with other regulars dropping in and out. Sometimes the director is not the best placed to make all these creative decisions.

    Anyway hopefully this works out. I think the score will be better than Newman (not hard).

    I think after Newman, EON will not hesitate to push Bondian elements in the score.
  • Posts: 2,524
    @jetsetwilly I wrote that as a Bond film. A Fukunaga Bond film. ;) So yeah, it needs to be Bondian. I'm one of the older fans on here. I just refuse to worry and hate on a new composer. I like the director and I have some faith (quite a bit, actually) in Bond 25 turning out to be very good indeed.

    I wish I had your faith. I haven't seen any of his work so I can't really judge. Had this been Nolan directing Bond 25, then there would have been very little to put me off.

    I feel Babs only really got CR right during her reign as producer after Cubby passed away. She has got a lot more wrong than she has got right during Brozza's and Craig's era, which is why I have very little faith now with the new film.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded Riding a white swan to Matera
    Posts: 12,377
    OK, you and I just differ about what to be concerned about. That's par for the course on this forum.
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    Lots of entitled whining going on.

    I'm not getting the Bond film I had in my head so I'm going to throw my toys out of the pram, Babs & MGW should sell up because they aren't deliveirng the film I imagined.

    I'm willing to give Romer a chance, I've listened to some of his work and while it doesn't scream Bond, I think we need to see what he delivers.

    Yes I was quite keen seeing Arnold finish DC's run but Newman isn't coming back so I look at that as a bonus. Romer is nowhere the Hollywood royalty TN is.

    This is a man with plenty to prove, a much newer kid on the block, unlikely to be arrogant about not using the JB theme or hopefully able to weave the main title theme into his score.

    If he's wrote some pop songs himself, maybe EON should insist whoever they pick collaborates with him or Romer is instrumental in the process of choosing the artist/group that gets the job.

    I've seen plenty to still make me think that Bond 25 is in a very safe place and no CF is not going to deliver a Netflix drama, he's going to give us an exciting, tense contemporary Bond film, well that's at least the vibe I'm getting.
  • Posts: 5,735
    Shardlake wrote: »
    Lots of entitled whining going on.

    I'm not getting the Bond film I had in my head so I'm going to throw my toys out of the pram, Babs & MGW should sell up because they aren't deliveirng the film I imagined.

    I'm willing to give Romer a chance, I've listened to some of his work and while it doesn't scream Bond, I think we need to see what he delivers.

    Yes I was quite keen seeing Arnold finish DC's run but Newman isn't coming back so I look at that as a bonus. Romer is nowhere the Hollywood royalty TN is.

    This is a man with plenty to prove, a much newer kid on the block, unlikely to be arrogant about not using the JB theme or hopefully able to weave the main title theme into his score.

    If he's wrote some pop songs himself, maybe EON should insist whoever they pick collaborates with him or Romer is instrumental in the process of choosing the artist/group that gets the job.

    I've seen plenty to still make me think that Bond 25 is in a very safe place and no CF is not going to deliver a Netflix drama, he's going to give us an exciting, tense contemporary Bond film, well that's at least the vibe I'm getting.

    +1(000)
  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    Posts: 3,126
    It's too hard tell what it will end up like and that's probably a good thing we haven't had a mysterious Bond film in a while or ever.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    Zekidk wrote: »
    Walecs wrote: »
    Newman didn't use it too much simply because he doesn't like using other people's works (hence why he didn't weave the theme song into the score).
    Not true. He used both. SF in Macao, SP in Morocco.
    He didn't. EON asked him to do so and he didn't even bother, so two different people (I can't remember their names but you'll easily find them on the Internet) did the instrumentals that we hear in the movies.
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,568
    Ok, these aren't exactly hummable but they're extremely effective, especially when paired with the film. Imagine some Bond theme woven into it.





  • Bentley007Bentley007 Manitoba, Canada
    Posts: 522
    His score for the documentary on netflix The Innocent Man is pretty different than his other work. Makes me more certain of his versatility
  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,099
    As long as the Bond theme is used and is a memorable score that isn't bad like Newman's scores then I'm fine with who gets the job. Though I would have much preferred David Arnold returning or Elliot Goldenthal.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    Posts: 5,172
    I actually hope we never have a “regular” Bond composer again. John Barry was exceptional, but I’m much more excited to see a revolving door of composers getting a crack at Bond. I honestly don’t miss David Arnold. He had his fun in the sun for five films, I want to hear new blood.
  • Posts: 3,045
    SJK91 wrote: »
    While I am not anything close to a musician myself, I find that I am quite passionate about film scores.
    (...)
    I always thought David Arnold did solid work, but as some of you have mentioned, he never created truly classic cues. Some of his action work is a good listen, but I find his much of his slower paced music (particularly the romantic cues) a bit dull.

    Dull, you say? Why do many of us love Arnold? Because of cues like these:




  • Posts: 486
    Put me in the camp disappointed that Arnold isn't coming back. Arnold understands Bond and I'd love to see him do at least one more. For me, his last two soundtracks were his best.

    That said I'm willing to give Romer a chance, but the tracks I've listened to don't exactly thrill me. I would imagine he'll add a modern, fresh element to the score. I just hope Romer can respect a bit of the structure that exists to Bond soundtracks as opposed to creating whatever he wants.
  • Posts: 11,425
    A pleasant reminder of Arnold's talent. Some if it is straight Barry pastiche/rip off but hey, I prefer that to mind numbing noodlings from Newman.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    Posts: 5,172
    And I’m not a fan of pastiche. It’s why I always regarded Martin, Hamlisch, Conti, Kamen, Serra and Newman much higher for not trying to copy Barry but play the Bond sound with their own musical identity. Even Barry himself moved away from his 60s sound, which is why part of Arnold felt like a step backwards.
  • edited July 2019 Posts: 11,425
    I get where you're coming from. But the Newman and Serra scores suck.

    My ideal would be that a genius like Barry comes along and takes us in a new musical direction that is still somehow definitively Bondian. But if that's not happening I will take Arnold's Barry-lite over aural anaesthesia from Newman any day.

    I like some of the other one off scores. Serra at least sticks in the mind (for all the wrong reasons). I can't remember anything about the Newman scores - they just make zero impact. One of the most anemic and overrated composers in Hollywood IMO.

    Also pastiche is not the worst thing a composer can do. Films composers have been 'borrowing' from classical composers forever. Nothing new in taking inspiration from wherever.
  • Posts: 2,524
    And I’m not a fan of pastiche. It’s why I always regarded Martin, Hamlisch, Conti, Kamen, Serra and Newman much higher for not trying to copy Barry but play the Bond sound with their own musical identity. Even Barry himself moved away from his 60s sound, which is why part of Arnold felt like a step backwards.

    But much of Arnold's work sounded like Barry up to 1987 when he finished Bond. There were a few retro nods to the 60's and 70's (QoS in particular), but the romantic score in CR sounded like Barry up until he died.
  • Posts: 2,524
    Getafix wrote: »
    I get where you're coming from. But the Newman and Serra scores suck.

    My ideal would be that a genius like Barry comes along and takes us in a new musical direction that is still somehow definitively Bondian. But if that's not happening I will take Arnold's Barry-lite over aural anaesthesia from Newman any day.

    I like some of the other one off scores. Serra at least sticks in the mind (for all the wrong reasons). I can't remember anything about the Newman scores - they just make zero impact. One of the most anemic and overrated composers in Hollywood IMO.

    Also pastiche is not the worst thing a composer can do. Films composers have been 'borrowing' from classical composers forever. Nothing new in taking inspiration from wherever.

    Agree 100%
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    Posts: 5,172
    Getafix wrote: »
    I get where you're coming from. But the Newman and Serra scores suck.

    Not to my ears. In fact they’re better films because of them. Had Arnold scored them they’d feel lesser to me. I want what’s good for the individual film, not the franchise.
  • Posts: 2,524
    Zekidk wrote: »
    SJK91 wrote: »
    While I am not anything close to a musician myself, I find that I am quite passionate about film scores.
    (...)
    I always thought David Arnold did solid work, but as some of you have mentioned, he never created truly classic cues. Some of his action work is a good listen, but I find his much of his slower paced music (particularly the romantic cues) a bit dull.

    Dull, you say? Why do many of us love Arnold? Because of cues like these:





    Great examples of Arnold at his peak. Sure, Arnold would go off tangent with techno stuff at times, but to me, these clips stand shoulder to shoulder with Barry's best scores, and shows he could fill Barry's big shoes.

    I am still very annoyed he hasn't been picked to come back for Craig's final outing. Babs is bending too much to the whim of any new director she recruits. Are you telling me a director would walk away from the film if they were told Arnold will be doing the score?
  • edited July 2019 Posts: 11,425
    Getafix wrote: »
    I get where you're coming from. But the Newman and Serra scores suck.

    Not to my ears. In fact they’re better films because of them. Had Arnold scored them they’d feel lesser to me. I want what’s good for the individual film, not the franchise.

    Will have to agree to disagree. I remember watching GE for the first time and sitting in a state of shock at the music. The chase with the Ferrari has to be the low point but it's all fairly awful.

    It says a lot about the Newman scores that the brief moments they are elevated above shopping mall background muzac is when they reference the title songs (neither section of which Newman deemed worthy of his own personal attention).
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