NO TIME TO DIE (2021) - Critical Reaction and Box Office Performance

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Comments

  • baerrttbaerrtt United kingdom
    Posts: 16
    matt_u wrote: »
    If you want to witness a real bomb, look at WEST SIDE STORY.

    Yeah it even dropped a 74% yesterday in the US.

    The lowest performing Spielberg film since EMPIRE OF THE SUN from the looks of it.
    Spider-Man has a number of incredibly empowered white males. While no time to die had sensitive feminine energy and empowered black women. Yet one is gonna break records in the US and the other flopped. I think the message is clear. They want conservative entertainment.

    Uh… what?

    Indeed. That's an incredibly daft thing to say especially when NWH pretty much has the same 'sensitive ' energy and diverse presences onscreen. Spider Man is simply as iconic as Bond,more popular with younger audiences and in a well received film that acts as a literal sequel to every live action big screen SM movie of course the box office is astronomical.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,297
    Spider-Man has a number of incredibly empowered white males. While no time to die had sensitive feminine energy and empowered black women. Yet one is gonna break records in the US and the other flopped. I think the message is clear. They want conservative entertainment.

    Sense: this makes none.

    I teach sixteen to eighteen-year-olds. They've been yelling about "SPIDER-MAN!!!!" for weeks. "Spider-Man is awesome!" "Marvel is cool!" And that 50+ bloke at the end of his famous movie cycle? Yeah, sure, they know Bond, but that can wait. Their excitement involves no politics whatsoever. Besides, Zendaya's ethnicity and Peter's "emo" moments are dropping a stinky load on your "conservative entertainment" thesis, @Benjamin_Weekly69. Don't worry, it's all about one brand selling better than another right now. There is no "message".
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 7,951
    Either that or he is doing too good a job at satire for me to realize it at first glance.
  • Posts: 1,314
    Having never seen original West Side Story or being familiar with the tunes, I watched the trailer with complete indifference. It was just a series of meme type dialogue and then being told it’s the “cinema event of the year” - that seemed to be a desperate attempt to make me care. Absolutely no desire to see
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 7,837
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.
  • Posts: 631
    Matt007 wrote: »
    Having never seen original West Side Story or being familiar with the tunes, I watched the trailer with complete indifference. It was just a series of meme type dialogue and then being told it’s the “cinema event of the year” - that seemed to be a desperate attempt to make me care. Absolutely no desire to see

    Me too. I heard about the new WSS film a few months ago and I simply felt … nothing. No anticipation or dread or anything at all. Whatever.

    Whereas when I heard that Villeneuve was doing Dune I felt more anticipation for a film than I had felt in years.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 7,951
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.

    Spider-Man has ALWAYS trounced Bond at the box office, but that doesn't take away from the fact that Bond still had a stellar performance. I don't think anyone is surprised by this at all. I've said many pages ago that No Way Home was most likely to top the box office at the end.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    edited December 2021 Posts: 23,297
    Either that or he is doing too good a job at satire for me to realize it at first glance.

    Could be. Hopefully, it is. ;-)
    manover wrote: »
    This forum has become abit weird and odd..
    Why does spideys success impact upons NTTD success?
    Marvel movies have had this type of success for many years...what's the issue?

    No, not this forum. Just a few people on this forum. The fact that NTTD is doing well means, along with its good scores on various websites, that it is being well-received by the general public, which tells those who dislike the film that they most likely hold the minority view in the debate. It's easier to be able to say that "EVERYONE" [Gary Oldman voice] hates what EON did with NTTD, than to have to admit that "everyone" means those two or three people who live with you. But "EVERYONE" isn't hating NTTD, for from it, in fact, as the numbers and reviews indicate.

    So the next step is to look for other numbers that are big enough to somehow crush the optimism surrounding NTTD's BO results. A new film that scoops up a billion dollars overnight can't come soon enough. Such a film would dethrone NTTD as the big film hit of the year in the West. The rhetoric could then be "See! All it took was so-and-so and [insert infantile variation on NTTD's title] means nothing anymore." To quote one E. Carver: "Pathetic!"
  • 00Heaven00Heaven Home
    Posts: 573
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.

    Spider-Man has ALWAYS trounced Bond at the box office, but that doesn't take away from the fact that Bond still had a stellar performance. I don't think anyone is surprised by this at all. I've said many pages ago that No Way Home was most likely to top the box office at the end.

    Don't feed the troll.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    edited December 2021 Posts: 23,297
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.

    "B25" has a name.

    The Bond films cannot--can never hope to reach the same levels as Spidey. But NTTD did better than Black Widow, Shang-Chi and Eternals, three films that carry the Marvel Avengers brand, one of which features a lead character from the big Infinity saga.

    Spider-Man beating any Bond film was to be expected, in pre-Covid times as well as in Covic times. Returns can be stellar even if they aren't the highest of the year. Even Skyfall made less than The Avengers. So, bad film? We shouldn't be happy for SF now? First place or loser, something like that?
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 7,951
    Were conversations in 2012 like this with SKYFALL detractors?

    "Ha! AVENGERS made four hundred million dollars more than SKYFALL. HOW EMBARRASSING for Sam Mendes!"

    Were there any THUNDERBALL haters back in 1965?

    "The hills are alive with THE SOUND OF MUSIC, not so much for THUNDERBALL!"
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,297
    Were conversations in 2012 like this with SKYFALL detractors?

    "Ha! AVENGERS made four hundred million dollars more than SKYFALL. HOW EMBARRASSING for Sam Mendes!"

    Were there any THUNDERBALL haters back in 1965?

    "The hills are alive with THE SOUND OF MUSIC, not so much for THUNDERBALL!"

    Now that you mention it, what are we doing here? This entire film series is drowning in the shame of not finishing first all the time. James Bond fans should keep their mouths shut because they've got NOTHING to be proud of. Finishing second--how DARE they!? We should be flogged for our arrogance.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 7,951
    I think MOONRAKER is the only entry in the series to actually be the #1 film of the year.

    Maybe we should bring back the double taking pigeon.

    Spider-Menace, watch out! ;)
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,297
    So MR is the only Bond film we can be proud of? I love that!

    "Well... here's to us."
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.

    If it wasn’t for the pandemic Spidey would’ve topped Infinity War globally so yes, even NWH is being damaged by COVID.
    The point is Spider-Man’s audiences are way younger than Bond and that demographic is the one that is keeping theaters alive, without mentioning that Spidey was always going to be way bigger.
    People trying to use Spidey’s insane numbers as a way to downsize NTTD’s great run are just pathetic.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,313
    I think MOONRAKER is the only entry in the series to actually be the #1 film of the year.

    Maybe we should bring back the double taking pigeon.

    Spider-Menace, watch out! ;)

    Well deserved if you ask me. Considering it's my #2 Bond movie. No joke. :)
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 7,951
    Murdock wrote: »
    Well deserved if you ask me. Considering it's my #2 Bond movie. No joke. :)

    Well, it certainly stinks like a #2. ;)

    I kid I kid, I love that bat**** film, double taking pigeon and everything about it.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    edited December 2021 Posts: 16,313
    Murdock wrote: »
    Well deserved if you ask me. Considering it's my #2 Bond movie. No joke. :)

    Well, it certainly stinks like a #2. ;)

    I kid I kid, I love that bat**** film, double taking pigeon and everything about it.

    Same. It just gets better and better every time I watch it. :D
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited December 2021 Posts: 7,837
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.

    "B25" has a name.

    The Bond films cannot--can never hope to reach the same levels as Spidey. But NTTD did better than Black Widow, Shang-Chi and Eternals, three films that carry the Marvel Avengers brand, one of which features a lead character from the big Infinity saga.

    Spider-Man beating any Bond film was to be expected, in pre-Covid times as well as in Covic times. Returns can be stellar even if they aren't the highest of the year. Even Skyfall made less than The Avengers. So, bad film? We shouldn't be happy for SF now? First place or loser, something like that?

    I'm not saying bond has to "beat spider-man" though. The point is that no way home didn't fall off compared to the two previous entries in the Tom Holland spidey series, in fact it could well best them. Spider-man has seen an upwards trajectory, even inspite of the new omicron variant, and it kinda blows a hole in the "B25 didn't do as well because of the pandemic" theory that seems to be so popular.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,297
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.

    "B25" has a name.

    The Bond films cannot--can never hope to reach the same levels as Spidey. But NTTD did better than Black Widow, Shang-Chi and Eternals, three films that carry the Marvel Avengers brand, one of which features a lead character from the big Infinity saga.

    Spider-Man beating any Bond film was to be expected, in pre-Covid times as well as in Covic times. Returns can be stellar even if they aren't the highest of the year. Even Skyfall made less than The Avengers. So, bad film? We shouldn't be happy for SF now? First place or loser, something like that?

    I'm not saying bond has to "beat spider-man" though. The point is that no way home didn't fall off compared to the two previous entries in the Tom Holland spidey series, in fact it could well best them. Spider-man has seen an upwards trajectory, even inspite of the new omicron variant, and it kinda blows a hole in the "B25 didn't do as well because of the pandemic" theory that seems to be so popular.

    Please read @matt_u 's post. He sums it up well.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited December 2021 Posts: 7,837
    matt_u wrote: »
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.

    If it wasn’t for the pandemic Spidey would’ve topped Infinity War globally so yes, even NWH is being damaged by COVID.

    That's more of an assumption on your part than anything.

    But even if that was the case, it still proves my point. Spidey is going UP compared to previous entries, whereas bond is declining. If the pandemic really was having that kind of impact then NWHs numbers should be lower than that of FFH and Homecoming, but they aren't. The demand to see spidey in cinemas INCREASED during the pandemic compared with before. We can't say the same about Bond.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,297
    matt_u wrote: »
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.

    If it wasn’t for the pandemic Spidey would’ve topped Infinity War globally so yes, even NWH is being damaged by COVID.

    That's more of an assumption on your part than anything.

    But even if that was the case, it still proves my point. Spidey is going UP compared to previous entries, whereas bond is declining. If the pandemic really was having that kind of impact then NWHs numbers should be lower than that of FFH and Homecoming, but they aren't. The demand to see spidey in cinemas INCREASED during the pandemic compared with before. We can't say the same about Bond.

    Can't you accept that Spider-Man is the one exception in this entire story? Three Marvel films did less than a Marvel film usually does. A Spielberg film fell flat right after its start. Dune missed its target, and so on. Bond isn't the exception, NWH is.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited December 2021 Posts: 7,837
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.

    If it wasn’t for the pandemic Spidey would’ve topped Infinity War globally so yes, even NWH is being damaged by COVID.

    That's more of an assumption on your part than anything.

    But even if that was the case, it still proves my point. Spidey is going UP compared to previous entries, whereas bond is declining. If the pandemic really was having that kind of impact then NWHs numbers should be lower than that of FFH and Homecoming, but they aren't. The demand to see spidey in cinemas INCREASED during the pandemic compared with before. We can't say the same about Bond.

    Can't you accept that Spider-Man is the one exception in this entire story? Three Marvel films did less than a Marvel film usually does. A Spielberg film fell flat right after its start. Dune missed its target, and so on. Bond isn't the exception, NWH is.

    Yes exactly, you've proven my point. If Bond were the barnstorming success like has been claimed then it WOULD be the exception.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    You don’t have any point.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,297
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.

    If it wasn’t for the pandemic Spidey would’ve topped Infinity War globally so yes, even NWH is being damaged by COVID.

    That's more of an assumption on your part than anything.

    But even if that was the case, it still proves my point. Spidey is going UP compared to previous entries, whereas bond is declining. If the pandemic really was having that kind of impact then NWHs numbers should be lower than that of FFH and Homecoming, but they aren't. The demand to see spidey in cinemas INCREASED during the pandemic compared with before. We can't say the same about Bond.

    Can't you accept that Spider-Man is the one exception in this entire story? Three Marvel films did less than a Marvel film usually does. A Spielberg film fell flat right after its start. Dune missed its target, and so on. Bond isn't the exception, NWH is.

    Yes exactly, you've proven my point. If Bond were the barnstorming success like has been claimed then it WOULD be the exception.

    No one is saying that NTTD is crazy successful beyond measure, only that it has done very well all things considered. It more than passed its test without being the campus' Einstein.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    No one saw NTTD topping F9 worldwide before release. No one saw NTTD topping SP in the UK and other EU countries. No one saw NTTD being leggier than SP during a pandemic with PVOD available after just a month. Those are facts. NTTD exceeded expectations given the extreme circumstances, its older demographic and a 18 months delay.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,297
    Also, 770 million is a pretty good result for a Bond film. Ever since SF's fluke success, some people seem to think that Bond is in that billion + zone. It isn't. We should stop setting our expectations that high. The series still has legs; it has loyal fans and it always brings in good money. But it isn't Star Wars or Marvel. The golden years were left behind over four decades ago.
  • Red_SnowRed_Snow Australia
    Posts: 2,487
    matt_u wrote: »
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.

    If it wasn’t for the pandemic Spidey would’ve topped Infinity War globally so yes, even NWH is being damaged by COVID.

    That's more of an assumption on your part than anything.

    But even if that was the case, it still proves my point. Spidey is going UP compared to previous entries, whereas bond is declining. If the pandemic really was having that kind of impact then NWHs numbers should be lower than that of FFH and Homecoming, but they aren't. The demand to see spidey in cinemas INCREASED during the pandemic compared with before. We can't say the same about Bond.

    The box office figures for Spider-Man are likely going up because everyone is trying to see it now, before cinemas are closed due to new lockdowns.
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    edited December 2021 Posts: 4,547
    All the people saying B25 did stellar returns for a pandemic film, that we couldn't have hoped for better need to explain how spider-man just absolutely trounced its numbers in the first weekend lol. The narrative that no film could do pre-pandemic numbers is falling apart before our eyes, no way home is set to be at least as successful as the first two entries, if not more.

    Marvel is, for lack of a better word, a marvel. We're talking comic book fans who even dress up for conventions. Comparing Bond to Marvel (or Star Wars) is not a fair comparison.

    Star Wars trounced The Spy Who Loved Me the BO, too. It doesn't mean TSWLM flopped. Not at all.



  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    edited December 2021 Posts: 4,343
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Also, 770 million is a pretty good result for a Bond film. Ever since SF's fluke success, some people seem to think that Bond is in that billion + zone. It isn't. We should stop setting our expectations that high. The series still has legs; it has loyal fans and it always brings in good money. But it isn't Star Wars or Marvel. The golden years were left behind over four decades ago.

    NTTD would’ve hit at least $925M if the pandemic never occurred. In the US it was projected to fall in between SP and SF (so $250M according to Forbes January estimates) and in China alone it would’ve grossed something like $40M more.
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