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I'm pretty sure we still have a number of posters under various different forum IDs. At least, this is what I have been told on another Bond forum by one who engages in such practices here (under a different name of course). No sense in adding any more. They're bad enough first time around. Duplicity is a terrible thing but not altogether to be unexpected on Bond fora or the internet more widely. It's all a vast aid to anonymity and the mischief-making that can cone along with it.
Even for this thread we have reached a new low in logic from the God apologists.
I'm not going to say any more as I'm concerned the thread will be closed soon (which I suspect is what @Dragonpol is actually angling for here) if I go in with both barrels.
I'm hoping @DarthDimi will eviscerate this drivel with one of his eloquent posts instead.
I don't think I did say anything harsher than ridiculous but tell me what and when if l have forgotten.
As for science being immoral you would need to explain what you mean by this. I have been very clear that science is itself amoral: devoid of morals or ethics of any kind. One can use it for good or evil. It is in itself devoid of any conscience or thoughts or intentions.
As for higher standards it also applies to hypothetical beings if they're revered.
I was referring more to scientists than science in the post you quoted. Science and scientists are synonymous in my mind. That was the sense of the word I meant.
It sounds like you're in desperate need of it if you think science has morals.
By all means debate the morality of the decision to drop the atomic bombs on Japan. But to debate the morality of the process of fission that killed hundreds of thousands is idiocy of, excuse the pun, biblical proportions.
See my post immediately above for my reasoning.
Yeah I just saw. I guess we were both typing at the same time!
And who created the scientists?
If some scientists are immoral (which I wouldn't argue with as I'm sure there are numerous examples) then it's either because the process of evolution ended up making immoral men or God put in place the rules that made them immoral.
If you believe in God you always end up at the same place though - it's his game and we all have to play by his rules so anything bad, evil or immoral always ends up back at his door eventually.
Science for all its 'immorality' didn't create baby cancer, Hitler or AIDS rampantly spreading through Africa because the people are told not to wear johnnies did it?
As for some scientists being immoral yes sure.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/mar/09/church-urges-irish-catholics-to-oppose-abortion-law-reform
Now we can debate the rights and wrongs of abortion and at what point a foetus can feel pain etc till the cows come home but the bottom line remains that the Church is happy to protect the right to life of what could be described as a cluster of cells but not actual people who are alive, have hopes and dreams and families dependent on them.
The church will stand up for your rights if you don't exist yet but if your'e an African villager they will ban you from protecting yourself from HIV.
Seems a rather muddled message at best.
Thank Christ we dont live in a country where the church has sufficient influence that when they pipe up about something it is likely to sway the vote.
Oh absolutely. Their continued privileged representation in the House of Lords is shocking. But at least if the CofE came out backing a particular party or Leave or Remain say it wouldn't make a noticeable dent in the vote such is their irrelevance.
There are lots of countries out there where the church telling people which way to vote would swing an election but thankfully I don't think we're one of them.
True. I can't wait to see if that candidate to the state senate of Tennessee will win. She's an atheist and has been attacked by the GOP as godless. If she wins in such a godly place then we can say there's a huge shift in people's mentality even in the US: https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/religion/2018/03/08/can-atheist-win-public-office-tennessee-well-find-out-tuesday/387468002/
Interesting to note that she was a baptist for 40 years but came to question her beliefs and realised it was all a load of cobblers. So don't despair believers there's hope for you to that you might be saved.
A lot of prominent atheists in the US are former devout Christians. Matt Dillahunty was a fundamentalist Baptist who became atheist studying to become a priest.
I guess the more closely you scrutinise it the more ridiculous you realise religion is, as demonstrated in this thread.
Religion would much prefer it if people just believed and behaved themselves like sheep. The moment they start asking questions it's game over.
Just like a lot of the athiests posting in this thread appear to be lapsed Roman Catholics. I find that interesting in itself, given all of the iniquities and controversies surrounding the Church and the Vatican over the last 30 years or so.
I'm only surmising here but it seems to me that it was an immense aid in turning these former Christians into athiests. I can understand how that could happen in fact. I say this not as a member of that church myself, although it's easy to forget that the true Church is the people and not the leadership or the building itself. Meeting house is a better word than church in that regard.
I could go on to tell the story of my deconversion when I have time and I'd like to hear others.
It wasn't the tenets of Catholicism and the scandals around the Catholic church I turned my back on it was the existence of God.
My Catholic upbringing was very middle England, CofE. We just went to church once a week and went to Catholic schools where, although we had an hours RE a week, it wasn't shoved down our throat and we were taught physics, chemistry and biology properly.
As an altar boy for 5 years (I largely got into it to give me a way to pass the time during tedious mass) I was even unlucky enough not to get nonced up so can't claim a payout.
I think as @Ludovico says above it's just a coincidence that the people on here who have turned their back on God seem to be mostly Catholic. After all Catholicism is the biggest Christian denomination. It would be surprising, and perhaps indicative, if everyone who became an atheist was from a Mormon upbringing for example.
Yes the Catholic church and the Vatican is a disgusting organisation but that is entirely separate debate to the existence of God which transcends these man made little groups.
I think it's rather spurious to profer the argument that paedo priest scandals are fueling the rise of atheism. CofE attendances have dropped off a cliff in the last 30 years too but they have had no comparable scandals. You may want to pretend otherwise but in the UK Christianity is on the ropes as people are waking up from the past 2000 years indoctrination.
Your own area is an interesting one though. I would think living in Northern Ireland would be about as good an advert as you could get for the pernicious influence of religion. What are the rates of atheism over there? Is it on the up or is belonging to a particular religious group so entrenched in the community?
It's a real shame at that people should give up use of the most complex thing on the planent (the human brain) and simply rebrand the morality of an organised religion as their own.
Presumably, by the same rationale, he is also an apologist for paedos and happy to let half of Africa die of AIDS?
It's not even like what religion peddles is harmless. People are dying because of the drivel spewed out by the likes of the Vatican. Yet we are told we must respect it?
Why are we not told we must respect the cocaine industry which I daresay ruins less lives?
Oh I agree. You can become atheist for the wrong reasons and for irrational ones.
What played an important role in my deconversion was a decent and quite nice RE teacher who, trying to strengthen our faith, gave us a series of activities and classes that backfired big time, although it took me a while to be conscious of it.
Amazing how children can cut through all the bullshit, that apparently millions of adults cannot.
PS today's slice of bonkers:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43369392