Spectre Gunbarrel ***Spoilers***

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  • QoS is a traditional gunbarrel in a non- traditional place.
  • gt007gt007 Station G
    Posts: 1,181
    3) it's at the end of the movie.
    As I said, the actual, physical gunbarrel is no different to every other gunbarrel (with the exception of CASINO ROYALE). Being out of sequence does not make it "non-traditional".
    As I said before, tradition has it that the gunbarrel sequence opens the film. In QOS it doesn't, therefore it's not traditional. Can we move on now please?
  • Posts: 1,894
    As I said before, tradition has it that the gunbarrel sequence opens the film. In QOS it doesn't, therefore it's not traditional.
    And I compeltely disagree. Tradition is over-rated. Tradition is what gave us DIE ANOTHER DAY, because DIE ANOTHER DAY was structured along the same lines that Bond films had been built on for years. Just because something is traditional, it doesn't automatically make it better, and I think people who decry the gunbarrel being at the end of the film instead of the front because it is "not traditional" are missing the point entirely.
    Can we move on now please?
    No. This is a thread about the SKYFALL gunbarrel. In the absence of any information about its inclusion in the film, what else is there to discuss?
  • As I said before, tradition has it that the gunbarrel sequence opens the film. In QOS it doesn't, therefore it's not traditional.
    And I compeltely disagree. Tradition is over-rated. Tradition is what gave us DIE ANOTHER DAY, because DIE ANOTHER DAY was structured along the same lines that Bond films had been built on for years. Just because something is traditional, it doesn't automatically make it better, and I think people who decry the gunbarrel being at the end of the film instead of the front because it is "not traditional" are missing the point entirely.
    Can we move on now please?
    No. This is a thread about the SKYFALL gunbarrel. In the absence of any information about its inclusion in the film, what else is there to discuss?
    tradition is important to me for a bond film because i came to see a bond film. Which means i want the gunbarrel at the start, i want fast cars, girls, fighting, gadgets, girls and action. I do NOT want bourne 2.0 or some random action flick, i came to see a bond movie.

    the way i see it, casino royale breaking tradition is fair enough, its a reboot, gets people reintrested, i can live with that. quantum of solace, mehhh pushin the limit now, but its CRs sequel so I'll let it slide.

    But skyfall has no excuse. The reboot is more or less over (apart from afew characters needing introducing), so i want a proper bond film. It doesnt have to go crazy like DAD but, as licence to kill proved, you can have a good, realistic bond film while remaining a bond film.

    The thing is shadow, all these traditions make a bond film a bond film. Its what made the films so famous. Take them away and you haven't really got a bond film.
  • gt007gt007 Station G
    edited November 2011 Posts: 1,181
    As I said before, tradition has it that the gunbarrel sequence opens the film. In QOS it doesn't, therefore it's not traditional.
    And I compeltely disagree.
    Dictionary.com defines "tradition" as "a long-established or inherited way of thinking or acting". By that definition, a gunbarrel sequence opening a Bond film is a tradition. QOS obviously broke with that tradition. So you're completely disagreeing with a fact.
    Can we move on now please?
    No. This is a thread about the SKYFALL gunbarrel.
    That's exactly my point. This is a thread about the Skyfall gunbarrel, and yet you keep talking about the one in QOS.
  • Posts: 1,894
    The thing is shadow, all these traditions make a bond film a bond film. Its what made the films so famous. Take them away and you haven't really got a bond film.
    No, they're not. James Bond is what makes a James Bond film a James Bond film. To cite my earlier example, would FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE be any less of a film if the producers decided to remove the gunbarrel? After all, Bond does not introduce himself as "Bond ... James Bond" in the film, and under your logic, this is one of your much-vaunted traditions. Does the overall quality of FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE suffer because Bond does not introduce himself that way?

    No, it does not.
    That's exactly my point. This is a thread about the Skyfall gunbarrel, and yet you keep talking about the one in QOS.
    Because we're discussing whether SKYFALL's gunbarrel will be more in line with the QUANTUM OF SOLACE gunbarrel, or one of the pre-Craig gunbarrels.
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 12,299
    Let's mix things up, and put the gunbarrel sequence at the end of the title song. Just hear me out. The sequence has the usual silhouette girls holding guns, dancing etc. Just before the song's about to end, the camera revolves clockwise around one of the girls (and slows to view behind her). In the same motion, she aims to the right of the screen as the camera zooms into the gun, and then through the back of the gun. Cue classic gunbarrel sequence. Song lyrics finish as the iris (bottom corner) opens up to the beginning of the main body of the film. Director credit rolls.
  • Posts: 1,817
    @shadow Your overconfidence is your weakness!
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited November 2011 Posts: 15,534
    FRWL would be much less of a Bond film if it didn't start with a gunbarrel sequence.

    Think of all the young people of the past 40 years, who, for their first viewing of a Bond film, were mesmerized by the 20 seconds of the gunbarrel... a sequence that stuck in their minds for weeks. Yes, the gunbarrel is an integral part of the Bond films. Ask that to all the kids who have just discovered the Bond films.

    So saying the gunbarrel at the start of the films is not an integral part of Bond films is just rewriting the history books of the franchise.

    Just ask to anyone on this site, if they were blown away by the gunbarrel sequence at the start of their first ever viewing of a Bond film... 99% of them would answer yes.

  • FRWL would be much less of a Bond film if it didn't start with a gunbarrel sequence.

    Think of all the young people of the past 40 years, who, for their first viewing of a Bond film, were mesmerized by the 20 seconds of the gunbarrel... a sequence that stuck in their minds for weeks. Yes, the gunbarrel is an integral part of the Bond films. Ask that to all the kids who have just discovered the Bond films.

    So saying the gunbarrel at the start of the films is not an integral part of Bond films is just rewriting the history books of the franchise.

    Just ask to anyone on this site, if they were blown away by the gunbarrel sequence at the start of their first ever viewing of a Bond film... 99% of them would answer yes.

    I wasn't blown away by the gunbarrel at the start of the first Bond film I watched; I found it interesting and confusing. I was young (11 or 12) and what's interesting is how guys my age at school referred to it as "the eye" or the "camera" sequence for quite some time. It was probably a couple of years (!) before we found out it's supposed to be a gunbarrel. Mind you, this was loooong before the internet and instant access to even minute trivia about a film you just watched...

    I can see both sides of the argument playing out above. I agree that the QoS gunbarrel is a indeed a traditional gunbarrel; it's just in a non-traditional place in the run of the film. However, because the gunbarrel is the first part of the film proper (after studio logo) I can understand why people think it's a far more important tradition than "Bond, James Bond" or a martini ordered "shaken, not stirred" (which is redundant when ordering a vodka martini anyway!).

    After CR I thought it would be interesting if they continued to use the gunbarrel sequence from that film for the rest of Craig's films. Slightly modified - have the white dots trace from left to right, but then pan over to find Craig in the centre of the screen, but white out the background so he isn't in a washroom. But after seeing the QoS gunbarrel I kind of like the return to the traditional style.

  • It was so long ago I can't even remember my initial thoughts on my first viewing of a 007 GunBarrel opening, to state the obvious this was back in the day when it was played straight, you'd have Connery or whoever appear, blam, blood comes down, job done, movie begins, and all at the very start of the picture, not at the end, not after the pre credits sequence or what we saw in some recent episodes :L , the main issue being it's what I always grew up with or instantly recognize as in having GB right at the very front of any Bond picture, anywhere else is simply out of place or inappropriate

    I can remember my frustrations on first viewing Royale back in 2006 and seeing what they had done to the franchise after 45 years of keeping it in order or how it should be, although DAD led slighlty astray with this, but at least it was at the start of the film where it should always be

    (feel like having a lie down now)

    @-)
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e il momento che verrà
    Posts: 5,922
    Hopefully, the GB will be at the beginning. Time to bring tradition back.
  • edited November 2011 Posts: 12,700
    i actually do think FRWL would've been less of a film without traditions like the gunbarrel, moneypenny, etc. Without these things you have an action film starring james bond, not a bond film. Why do you think goldfinger is so popular??? because it set the template for many bond films to come. In many ways goldfinger was the original bond film. And FRWL isn't one of my personal favourites anyway, never say never again is my fave connery outing (despite the fact it didn't have a gunbarrel, but that can't be helped), followed by goldfinger.
  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    Posts: 1,003
    Classic gunbarreal from DR. NO should return with the DR. NO music or a remixed one...
  • tqbtqb
    Posts: 1,020
    what is up with everyone and tradition? just curious.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,332
    what is up with everyone and tradition? just curious.
    Many feel there has been little or no tradition with the last two films so they want it back full force in Skyfall.
  • tqbtqb
    Posts: 1,020
    Got to play devils advocate here, perhaps Its time for things to change. If you eat the same food everyday for 50 years. won't they get boring?
  • Posts: 562
    My absolute favourite Gun Barrel Intro is OHMSS. For SF, I would like to see something similar. I love how the initial white dots pause for the producer credit as they did in DN, but the music has a much smoother, classier tone; which, in my opinion, helps build suspense for the coming film much better than the loud horns and explosive Bond theme.

  • edited November 2011 Posts: 5,745
    I think it'd be cool if the circle(s) pulsed. Like its one circle that starts from the left and pulses, then fades as it continues right, then pulses again, fades as it moves and pulses again, and then expands to Craig walking from right. And I agree with Agent005, a lighter beat, not like the end of CR. (However that fit perfectly, made me want to stand up and cheer)
  • Posts: 4,619
    I just realised that we might get a Gunbarrel sequence shot by Roger Deakins!
  • tqbtqb
    Posts: 1,020
    I just realised that we might get a Gunbarrel sequence shot by Roger Deakins!
    that is an awesome thought
  • I just realised that we might get a Gunbarrel sequence shot by Roger Deakins!
    As opposed to Daniel Kleinman? Does Kleinman only do the actual design or does he film the walking part too?

  • tqbtqb
    Posts: 1,020
    I think Kleinman did both the walk and the design.
    And thats a good point. I don't think Deakins would do the design.. unless they actually shot down a barrel of a gun again. It'd be cool if they could mix a reallive barrel with cgi
  • edited November 2011 Posts: 4,619
    I think Kleinman did both the walk and the design.
    And thats a good point. I don't think Deakins would do the design.. unless they actually shot down a barrel of a gun again. It'd be cool if they could mix a reallive barrel with cgi
    Of course Deakins won't do the design. What I meant is that maybe he'll shoot the walking part.


    As opposed to Daniel Kleinman? Does Kleinman only do the actual design or does he film the walking part too?

    As opposed to the previous cinematographers. Or have the cinematographers never worked on the gunbarrel sequence?
  • Posts: 5,745
    Maybe have it closer up/zoomed in. Instead of showing Bond walking full form, show waste up.

    I don't know. If everybody wants it to stay the same, why make a thread about it if you don't want it to change?
  • @PanchitoPistoles

    I think Kleinman films the walking because he is the main titles designer. Binder held the same position and he filmed the walking part and designed the gunbarrel. One can assume Kleinman films the walking too.

    That being said, I don't know for sure.
  • tqbtqb
    Posts: 1,020
    It's probably Kleinman since it's a visual effect shot.
  • After the wonderful use of the gunbarrel in both Casino Royale and Quantum of Solace, I wish the one of Skyfall will celebrate the fiftieth birthday of the saga. That's why I hope a gunbarrel a la Dr No : mention to Barbara Broccoli and Michael G. Wilson, plus a position a la Sean Connery, and last but not least no PTS.

    I'd really really love to see the title sequence following the gunbarrel, with an instrumental music, but not the James Bond theme. An instrumental a la From Russia with love. What do you think of the idea ?
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 12,299
    Or have the Bond theme fade into the title song like in DN.
  • Posts: 2,107
    If Quantum of Solace gunbarrel would've been at the beginning of the movie, I would consider it traditional. The only thing that doesn't make it traditional is it's placement at the end of the movie. Like shadow said, Craig just left his own mark. Every actor has done it before him...
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