No Time To Die: Production Diary

18978989009029032507

Comments

  • dominicgreenedominicgreene The Eternal QOS Defender
    Posts: 1,756
    This just in, breaking news...

    ... Craig is still thinking about it.
  • QuantumOrganizationQuantumOrganization We have people everywhere
    Posts: 1,187
    Birdleson wrote: »
    I'd rather not have an "S" title just to have it.

    Let's go for all Q titles for the next couple:

    Quiver of Arrows
    Quaint Apartment
    Quan the Anarchist
    Quayle, Dan Quayle
    Queen and Country
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 12,914
    You seem to be targeting a very specific audience, @QuantumOrganization. But I'm down with Q-titles.
  • QuantumOrganizationQuantumOrganization We have people everywhere
    Posts: 1,187
    You seem to be targeting a very specific audience, @QuantumOrganization. But I'm down with Q-titles.
    See, "S" is taking up all the title room. It's time "Q" takes back its rightful glory.

  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 12,914
    You see I'm biased. But I guess 7-letters is the ideal.
  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,730
    Yeah, there's the opportunity to really mix it up this time. Nice.
    SERVICE.

    Ah thats a great title. Far better than shatterhand and if its a remake of OHMSS then its a fun name to go along with that
  • Posts: 15,785
    I'd rather B25 not be a remake of OHMSS.
  • Posts: 12,242
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    I'd rather B25 not be a remake of OHMSS.

    Same. Only 26 maybe and even then it's a stretch.
  • 001001
    edited August 2017 Posts: 1,575
    boldfinger wrote: »
    001 wrote: »
    Should bond get rid of his ppk in the next films like Brozza did ?
    And Craig in CR ;-).

    But Craig already got rid of his PPK a few times. I recall he also used the P99
    http://www.imfdb.org/images/thumb/c/cc/Cr-w99a.jpg/601px-Cr-w99a.jpg

    You're right. Thumbs Up :)

    images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT8V2wF4qU-WZ7i8QkxCgI35HLRJGk-5143ozmIhYEG_omX6Dx1
  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,730
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    I'd rather B25 not be a remake of OHMSS.

    Well its not like P and W have the ability to make original stories without the help of an original Fleming novel
  • Posts: 3,333
    It doesn't surprise me that B25 will take some of its influence from OHMSS, especially as it's now considered to be one of the very best Bond movies made. But do I really want to see another OHMSS watered-down clone? Absolutely not. Unfortunately, Madeleine Swann is no Contessa Teresa Draco, and Léa Seydoux is no Diana Rigg. Surely if Eon had plans to go down this route from get-go then Broccoli and Mendes should have cast an actress a lot more closer to Craig's age and with a bit of pizzazz about her. Léa Seydoux just isn't in the same league as Rigg or her character. This was just one aspect of SPECTRE that I just didn't buy into: Bond falling in love with Mr White's young and incredibly bland daughter. Did I care when Blofeld kidnapped her at the climax of the movie with the intention of blowing her to pieces - no, I didn't - and neither will I care if she's killed in B25. Problem was that Léa Seydoux just didn't win me over the same way as Diana Rigg's did when she sold her Tracy role to me. And you know what really infuriated me about all the hype around the Swann character being an "independent woman" in the PR rounds? Remember, “She’s his equal,” Seydoux told Yahoo Movies, “because she doesn’t need him. She saves him.” Yadda yadda yadda. (Haven't we heard this every time there's a new Bond movie?) Funny, as I also don't recall Swann having saved Bond at all, but I do remember Tracy Draco saving Bond in OHMSS in a breathtaking action-packed less hamfisted way as SPECTRE purports to have done. Honestly, between the protracted waiting time between the last Bond film to the latest one, I'm beginning to not give a damn about Bond anymore.
  • edited August 2017 Posts: 11,425
    Sacrilege! Dangerous heresy!

    You must hold firm to the one true faith.

    Just think how long those Christians have been waiting for the Second Coming, and they're still going relatively strong after 2000 years.

    Just hold onto the fact that we're much more likely to see another Bond movie within our lifetimes than we are to see the return of Jesus Christ. Surely there's some solace to be taken from this (almost) certainty.

    Quality will prevail. Eventually. When they get rid of Purvis and Wade.
  • edited August 2017 Posts: 12,242
    bondsum wrote: »
    It doesn't surprise me that B25 will take some of its influence from OHMSS, especially as it's now considered to be one of the very best Bond movies made. But do I really want to see another OHMSS watered-down clone? Absolutely not. Unfortunately, Madeleine Swann is no Contessa Teresa Draco, and Léa Seydoux is no Diana Rigg. Surely if Eon had plans to go down this route from get-go then Broccoli and Mendes should have cast an actress a lot more closer to Craig's age and with a bit of pizzazz about her. Léa Seydoux just isn't in the same league as Rigg or her character. This was just one aspect of SPECTRE that I just didn't buy into: Bond falling in love with Mr White's young and incredibly bland daughter. Did I care when Blofeld kidnapped her at the climax of the movie with the intention of blowing her to pieces - no, I didn't - and neither will I care if she's killed in B25. Problem was that Léa Seydoux just didn't win me over the same way as Diana Rigg's did when she sold her Tracy role to me. And you know what really infuriated me about all the hype around the Swann character being an "independent woman" in the PR rounds? Remember, “She’s his equal,” Seydoux told Yahoo Movies, “because she doesn’t need him. She saves him.” Yadda yadda yadda. (Haven't we heard this every time there's a new Bond movie?) Funny, as I also don't recall Swann having saved Bond at all, but I do remember Tracy Draco saving Bond in OHMSS in a breathtaking action-packed less hamfisted way as SPECTRE purports to have done. Honestly, between the protracted waiting time between the last Bond film to the latest one, I'm beginning to not give a damn about Bond anymore.

    I understand the concerns and share them; I'm hopeful they won't go full-OHMSS for Bond 25. If they listened to the fans at all, they'd realize SP isn't as well-liked because of it trying to be too personal or emotional. Though I have really enjoyed the Craig era - SP included, I think most of us are ready for something less along the lines of "this time it's personal" and something more traditional. While SP is the most traditional Bond film of Craig's era, it still does use unnecessary plot points for emotional value, like the foster brother thing or recalling Vesper.

    As for Swann saving Bond, I think she was referring to when she uses the explosive watch as Bond is being tortured. "Doesn't need him" goes too far obviously since Bond saves her big time near the end of the movie. Anyway, I just really hope the next Bond film is less emotionally-oriented.
  • RoadphillRoadphill United Kingdom
    Posts: 984
    Why in gods name would they remake OHMSS?

    That film is damn near perfect and there is no way they can better it.

    Im sick to high heaven of all the callbacks they have done to previous Bond films that have crept in to the last 3 entries.
  • Posts: 11,119
    bondsum wrote: »
    It doesn't surprise me that B25 will take some of its influence from OHMSS, especially as it's now considered to be one of the very best Bond movies made. But do I really want to see another OHMSS watered-down clone? Absolutely not. Unfortunately, Madeleine Swann is no Contessa Teresa Draco, and Léa Seydoux is no Diana Rigg. Surely if Eon had plans to go down this route from get-go then Broccoli and Mendes should have cast an actress a lot more closer to Craig's age and with a bit of pizzazz about her. Léa Seydoux just isn't in the same league as Rigg or her character. This was just one aspect of SPECTRE that I just didn't buy into: Bond falling in love with Mr White's young and incredibly bland daughter. Did I care when Blofeld kidnapped her at the climax of the movie with the intention of blowing her to pieces - no, I didn't - and neither will I care if she's killed in B25. Problem was that Léa Seydoux just didn't win me over the same way as Diana Rigg's did when she sold her Tracy role to me. And you know what really infuriated me about all the hype around the Swann character being an "independent woman" in the PR rounds? Remember, “She’s his equal,” Seydoux told Yahoo Movies, “because she doesn’t need him. She saves him.” Yadda yadda yadda. (Haven't we heard this every time there's a new Bond movie?) Funny, as I also don't recall Swann having saved Bond at all, but I do remember Tracy Draco saving Bond in OHMSS in a breathtaking action-packed less hamfisted way as SPECTRE purports to have done. Honestly, between the protracted waiting time between the last Bond film to the latest one, I'm beginning to not give a damn about Bond anymore.

    I agree. I mean let's face it, two of Craig's best films have similar kind of deeper drama. The loss of Vesper Lynd in CR, which really could be seen as Craig's OHMSS. And the loss of 'mother' 'M' in SF. Both films are, together with OHMSS, the most dramatic Bond outings.

    What Craig needs now is a 'fun' film, with trendsetting action. Hence I really felt....adament to write something by myself. I just urgen the official Bond writers to find the 'fun' again! Be creative, get inspired, look at us Bond fans in here!!!
  • Posts: 3,333
    Ah yes, Swan's strong independent woman saved Bond with his own explosive watch. Thanks for reminding me @FoxRox. But as you quite rightly pointed out, it was Bond that had to save her sorry independent ass from getting blown up at the very end. The French actress also had this to say about her multilayered character: “I think she is distinct from all the others. She’s not really a Bond girl – she’s a real character,” said one of the most bland actresses to ever grace a recent Bond movie in living memory. She's got a nerve, I'll give her that much, and she's clearly never watched a Bond picture otherwise she'd never made such an asinine remark. Just how can anyone warm to an actress that hasn't even bothered to do her homework? Beats me, but I'm sure there'll be some here on the forums that think she's everything that she says she is and defend her.

    On a serious note, I really wished that Broccoli and co had the cojones to move on without Craig, especially as he's not too concerned about reprising his role unless he's given an incredibly long sabbatical to recharge his creative juices. It kind of reminds me of the late Roger Moore years when Cubby was too scared to replace Moore for fear of poor BO results. But at least with RM he didn't dictate to Eon when the next movie should be made, he quickly signed on and got the ball moving swiftly. The same cannot be said of the current star.
  • edited August 2017 Posts: 3,333
    bondsum wrote: »
    It doesn't surprise me that B25 will take some of its influence from OHMSS, especially as it's now considered to be one of the very best Bond movies made. But do I really want to see another OHMSS watered-down clone? Absolutely not. Unfortunately, Madeleine Swann is no Contessa Teresa Draco, and Léa Seydoux is no Diana Rigg. Surely if Eon had plans to go down this route from get-go then Broccoli and Mendes should have cast an actress a lot more closer to Craig's age and with a bit of pizzazz about her. Léa Seydoux just isn't in the same league as Rigg or her character. This was just one aspect of SPECTRE that I just didn't buy into: Bond falling in love with Mr White's young and incredibly bland daughter. Did I care when Blofeld kidnapped her at the climax of the movie with the intention of blowing her to pieces - no, I didn't - and neither will I care if she's killed in B25. Problem was that Léa Seydoux just didn't win me over the same way as Diana Rigg's did when she sold her Tracy role to me. And you know what really infuriated me about all the hype around the Swann character being an "independent woman" in the PR rounds? Remember, “She’s his equal,” Seydoux told Yahoo Movies, “because she doesn’t need him. She saves him.” Yadda yadda yadda. (Haven't we heard this every time there's a new Bond movie?) Funny, as I also don't recall Swann having saved Bond at all, but I do remember Tracy Draco saving Bond in OHMSS in a breathtaking action-packed less hamfisted way as SPECTRE purports to have done. Honestly, between the protracted waiting time between the last Bond film to the latest one, I'm beginning to not give a damn about Bond anymore.

    I agree. I mean let's face it, two of Craig's best films have similar kind of deeper drama. The loss of Vesper Lynd in CR, which really could be seen as Craig's OHMSS. And the loss of 'mother' 'M' in SF. Both films are, together with OHMSS, the most dramatic Bond outings.

    What Craig needs now is a 'fun' film, with trendsetting action. Hence I really felt....adament to write something by myself. I just urgen the official Bond writers to find the 'fun' again! Be creative, get inspired, look at us Bond fans in here!!!
    You make a very valid point @Gustav_Graves. Both CR and SF do carry a lot of the same dramatic senses of loss that OHMSS does. Most notably SF with the death of M as a substitute Tracy. Which makes me somewhat apprehensive of not wanting to see the same trope repeated again with the lackluster Madeleine Swann. I think Eon have painted themselves into a corner with this continuous timeline thing and it'll be difficult to just simply drop Swann, like she'd never existed, and start with a fresh story and a new heroine.
  • edited August 2017 Posts: 11,119
    bondsum wrote: »
    bondsum wrote: »
    It doesn't surprise me that B25 will take some of its influence from OHMSS, especially as it's now considered to be one of the very best Bond movies made. But do I really want to see another OHMSS watered-down clone? Absolutely not. Unfortunately, Madeleine Swann is no Contessa Teresa Draco, and Léa Seydoux is no Diana Rigg. Surely if Eon had plans to go down this route from get-go then Broccoli and Mendes should have cast an actress a lot more closer to Craig's age and with a bit of pizzazz about her. Léa Seydoux just isn't in the same league as Rigg or her character. This was just one aspect of SPECTRE that I just didn't buy into: Bond falling in love with Mr White's young and incredibly bland daughter. Did I care when Blofeld kidnapped her at the climax of the movie with the intention of blowing her to pieces - no, I didn't - and neither will I care if she's killed in B25. Problem was that Léa Seydoux just didn't win me over the same way as Diana Rigg's did when she sold her Tracy role to me. And you know what really infuriated me about all the hype around the Swann character being an "independent woman" in the PR rounds? Remember, “She’s his equal,” Seydoux told Yahoo Movies, “because she doesn’t need him. She saves him.” Yadda yadda yadda. (Haven't we heard this every time there's a new Bond movie?) Funny, as I also don't recall Swann having saved Bond at all, but I do remember Tracy Draco saving Bond in OHMSS in a breathtaking action-packed less hamfisted way as SPECTRE purports to have done. Honestly, between the protracted waiting time between the last Bond film to the latest one, I'm beginning to not give a damn about Bond anymore.

    I agree. I mean let's face it, two of Craig's best films have similar kind of deeper drama. The loss of Vesper Lynd in CR, which really could be seen as Craig's OHMSS. And the loss of 'mother' 'M' in SF. Both films are, together with OHMSS, the most dramatic Bond outings.

    What Craig needs now is a 'fun' film, with trendsetting action. Hence I really felt....adament to write something by myself. I just urgen the official Bond writers to find the 'fun' again! Be creative, get inspired, look at us Bond fans in here!!!
    You make a very valid point @Gustav_Graves. Both CR and SF do carry a lot of the same dramatic senses of loss that OHMSS does. Most notably SF with the death of M as a substitute Tracy. Which makes me somewhat apprehensive of not wanting to see the same trope repeated again with the lackluster Madeleine Swann. I think Eon have painted themselves into a corner with this continuous timeline thing and it'll be difficult to just simply drop Swann, like she'd never existed, and start with a fresh story and a new heroine.

    I think the continuous timeline-thing isn't the big issue here. Certainly not for Bond #25. The thing is, they simply have to nail it this time from a writer's perspective. That's how I see it. Neal Purvis and Robert Wade need to stop moaning saying that "the whole world is now full of Blofeld's and Silva's now, so....ehhh....we don't know what to do". That's, to me as a Bond fan, a real pain in the ass!! They need to get a proverbial kick under the butt from Babs and Michael, old-school style!

    So having said that, I kep saying all the time that there's plentiful inspiration you can draw from the original Fleming novels or even the continuation novels. What about a quick, fast, yet believable love relationship break-up during the first 30 mins of the new film?? I honestly believe that both Daniel Craig and Lea Seydoux can pull that off. They simply have to read what Tiffany Case did at the start of the novel "From Russia With Love". Or what Pussy Galore did at the start of "Trigger Mortis".

    I think it would be challenging and both great to make the viewers believe that Bond simply isn't the right man (not yet) to get into a full-blown love relationship! And with it I want to see Craig's Bond to act a bit like a real prick to Madeleine, so you actually think "Sjee man, you're fucking rude!!". By doing so you could also create an atmosphere like "Damn, glad Bond dumped her finally!".

    Something like that has NEVER been done before in a Bond film. And by maintaining this kind of continuity, you could actually re-focus very fast on Bond's mission during the remainder of the 120 mins of the film; you could re-focus on the standalone quality of the story! Tada! It's simple. Neal Purvis & Robert Wade simply need to become as inspired as we Bond fans are!!
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited August 2017 Posts: 9,117
    bondsum wrote: »
    bondsum wrote: »
    It doesn't surprise me that B25 will take some of its influence from OHMSS, especially as it's now considered to be one of the very best Bond movies made. But do I really want to see another OHMSS watered-down clone? Absolutely not. Unfortunately, Madeleine Swann is no Contessa Teresa Draco, and Léa Seydoux is no Diana Rigg. Surely if Eon had plans to go down this route from get-go then Broccoli and Mendes should have cast an actress a lot more closer to Craig's age and with a bit of pizzazz about her. Léa Seydoux just isn't in the same league as Rigg or her character. This was just one aspect of SPECTRE that I just didn't buy into: Bond falling in love with Mr White's young and incredibly bland daughter. Did I care when Blofeld kidnapped her at the climax of the movie with the intention of blowing her to pieces - no, I didn't - and neither will I care if she's killed in B25. Problem was that Léa Seydoux just didn't win me over the same way as Diana Rigg's did when she sold her Tracy role to me. And you know what really infuriated me about all the hype around the Swann character being an "independent woman" in the PR rounds? Remember, “She’s his equal,” Seydoux told Yahoo Movies, “because she doesn’t need him. She saves him.” Yadda yadda yadda. (Haven't we heard this every time there's a new Bond movie?) Funny, as I also don't recall Swann having saved Bond at all, but I do remember Tracy Draco saving Bond in OHMSS in a breathtaking action-packed less hamfisted way as SPECTRE purports to have done. Honestly, between the protracted waiting time between the last Bond film to the latest one, I'm beginning to not give a damn about Bond anymore.

    I agree. I mean let's face it, two of Craig's best films have similar kind of deeper drama. The loss of Vesper Lynd in CR, which really could be seen as Craig's OHMSS. And the loss of 'mother' 'M' in SF. Both films are, together with OHMSS, the most dramatic Bond outings.

    What Craig needs now is a 'fun' film, with trendsetting action. Hence I really felt....adament to write something by myself. I just urgen the official Bond writers to find the 'fun' again! Be creative, get inspired, look at us Bond fans in here!!!
    You make a very valid point @Gustav_Graves. Both CR and SF do carry a lot of the same dramatic senses of loss that OHMSS does. Most notably SF with the death of M as a substitute Tracy. Which makes me somewhat apprehensive of not wanting to see the same trope repeated again with the lackluster Madeleine Swann. I think Eon have painted themselves into a corner with this continuous timeline thing and it'll be difficult to just simply drop Swann, like she'd never existed, and start with a fresh story and a new heroine.

    I think the continuous timeline-thing isn't the big issue here. Certainly not for Bond #25. The thing is, they simply have to nail it this time from a writer's perspective. That's how I see it. Neal Purvis and Robert Wade need to stop moaning saying that "the whole world is now full of Blofeld's and Silva's now, so....ehhh....we don't know what to do". That's, to me as a Bond fan, a real pain in the ass!! They need to get a proverbial kick under the butt from Babs and Michael, old-school style!

    So having said that, I kep saying all the time that there's plentiful inspiration you can draw from the original Fleming novels or even the continuation novels. What about a quick, fast, yet believable love relationship break-up during the first 30 mins of the new film?? I honestly believe that both Daniel Craig and Lea Seydoux can pull that off. They simply have to read what Tiffany Case did at the start of the novel "From Russia With Love". Or what Pussy Galore did at the start of "Trigger Mortis".

    I think it would be challenging and both great to make the viewers believe that Bond simply isn't the right man (not yet) to get into a full-blown love relationship! And with it I want to see Craig's Bond to act a bit like a real prick to Madeleine, so you actually think "Sjee man, you're fucking rude!!". By doing so you could also create an atmosphere like "Damn, glad Bond dumped her finally!".

    Something like that has NEVER been done before in a Bond film. And by maintaining this kind of continuity, you could actually re-focus very fast on Bond's mission during the remainder of the 120 mins of the film; you could re-focus on the standalone quality of the story! Tada! It's simple. Neal Purvis & Robert Wade simply need to become as inspired as we Bond fans are!!

    I don't go to a Bond film to watch this soap opera shite.

    If we're going get rid of the Madeline elephant in the room then by all means have one line with MP that it didn't work but I don't want to have to sit through this mundane break up.

    Apart from anything else it serves to do nothing narratively for the story if we spend the first 30 mins watching this rubbish play our before Bond gets on with the mission.
  • Posts: 11,119
    bondsum wrote: »
    bondsum wrote: »
    It doesn't surprise me that B25 will take some of its influence from OHMSS, especially as it's now considered to be one of the very best Bond movies made. But do I really want to see another OHMSS watered-down clone? Absolutely not. Unfortunately, Madeleine Swann is no Contessa Teresa Draco, and Léa Seydoux is no Diana Rigg. Surely if Eon had plans to go down this route from get-go then Broccoli and Mendes should have cast an actress a lot more closer to Craig's age and with a bit of pizzazz about her. Léa Seydoux just isn't in the same league as Rigg or her character. This was just one aspect of SPECTRE that I just didn't buy into: Bond falling in love with Mr White's young and incredibly bland daughter. Did I care when Blofeld kidnapped her at the climax of the movie with the intention of blowing her to pieces - no, I didn't - and neither will I care if she's killed in B25. Problem was that Léa Seydoux just didn't win me over the same way as Diana Rigg's did when she sold her Tracy role to me. And you know what really infuriated me about all the hype around the Swann character being an "independent woman" in the PR rounds? Remember, “She’s his equal,” Seydoux told Yahoo Movies, “because she doesn’t need him. She saves him.” Yadda yadda yadda. (Haven't we heard this every time there's a new Bond movie?) Funny, as I also don't recall Swann having saved Bond at all, but I do remember Tracy Draco saving Bond in OHMSS in a breathtaking action-packed less hamfisted way as SPECTRE purports to have done. Honestly, between the protracted waiting time between the last Bond film to the latest one, I'm beginning to not give a damn about Bond anymore.

    I agree. I mean let's face it, two of Craig's best films have similar kind of deeper drama. The loss of Vesper Lynd in CR, which really could be seen as Craig's OHMSS. And the loss of 'mother' 'M' in SF. Both films are, together with OHMSS, the most dramatic Bond outings.

    What Craig needs now is a 'fun' film, with trendsetting action. Hence I really felt....adament to write something by myself. I just urgen the official Bond writers to find the 'fun' again! Be creative, get inspired, look at us Bond fans in here!!!
    You make a very valid point @Gustav_Graves. Both CR and SF do carry a lot of the same dramatic senses of loss that OHMSS does. Most notably SF with the death of M as a substitute Tracy. Which makes me somewhat apprehensive of not wanting to see the same trope repeated again with the lackluster Madeleine Swann. I think Eon have painted themselves into a corner with this continuous timeline thing and it'll be difficult to just simply drop Swann, like she'd never existed, and start with a fresh story and a new heroine.

    I think the continuous timeline-thing isn't the big issue here. Certainly not for Bond #25. The thing is, they simply have to nail it this time from a writer's perspective. That's how I see it. Neal Purvis and Robert Wade need to stop moaning saying that "the whole world is now full of Blofeld's and Silva's now, so....ehhh....we don't know what to do". That's, to me as a Bond fan, a real pain in the ass!! They need to get a proverbial kick under the butt from Babs and Michael, old-school style!

    So having said that, I kep saying all the time that there's plentiful inspiration you can draw from the original Fleming novels or even the continuation novels. What about a quick, fast, yet believable love relationship break-up during the first 30 mins of the new film?? I honestly believe that both Daniel Craig and Lea Seydoux can pull that off. They simply have to read what Tiffany Case did at the start of the novel "From Russia With Love". Or what Pussy Galore did at the start of "Trigger Mortis".

    I think it would be challenging and both great to make the viewers believe that Bond simply isn't the right man (not yet) to get into a full-blown love relationship! And with it I want to see Craig's Bond to act a bit like a real prick to Madeleine, so you actually think "Sjee man, you're fucking rude!!". By doing so you could also create an atmosphere like "Damn, glad Bond dumped her finally!".

    Something like that has NEVER been done before in a Bond film. And by maintaining this kind of continuity, you could actually re-focus very fast on Bond's mission during the remainder of the 120 mins of the film; you could re-focus on the standalone quality of the story! Tada! It's simple. Neal Purvis & Robert Wade simply need to become as inspired as we Bond fans are!!

    I don't go to a Bond film to watch this soap opera shite.

    If we're going get rid of the Madeline elephant in the room then by all means have one line with MP that it didn't work but I don't want to have to sit through this mundane break up.

    Apart from anything else it serves to do nothing narratively for the story if we spend the first 30 mins watching this rubbish play our before Bond gets on with the mission.

    Then in hindsight you also think many of Ian Fleming's stories are 'soap opera shite' as well. Since I got that inspiration from the novels. Thank you for burning down a nice idea. It could work, and I honestly believe that.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited August 2017 Posts: 7,969
    If the real story doesn't start until 30 minutes in, how long will the film be? Hopefully when they soft reboot they bring the run time back to under 2hrs again. Part of good writing is concision and perspecuity.
  • edited August 2017 Posts: 11,119
    If the real story doesn't start until 30 minutes in, how long will the film be? Hopefully when they soft reboot they bring the run time back to under 2hrs again. Part of good writing is concision and perspecuity.

    I mean, come on. This could be a scene of perhaps 10 mins, if done correctly and accurately. All I said is that this part needs to take place at the start of the film, preferably during the first 30 mins. But the scene in itself could be less than 10 mins.

    Runtime for me is such a quantity issue. If writing is done perfectly a film could be 120 mins for me until even 150 mins. As long as the movie 'flows'. The relatively long "Casino Royale" flows perfectly, so did "OHMSS". But the shorter "Doctor No" and "From Russia With Love" also had a great 'flow'.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    bondsum wrote: »
    bondsum wrote: »
    It doesn't surprise me that B25 will take some of its influence from OHMSS, especially as it's now considered to be one of the very best Bond movies made. But do I really want to see another OHMSS watered-down clone? Absolutely not. Unfortunately, Madeleine Swann is no Contessa Teresa Draco, and Léa Seydoux is no Diana Rigg. Surely if Eon had plans to go down this route from get-go then Broccoli and Mendes should have cast an actress a lot more closer to Craig's age and with a bit of pizzazz about her. Léa Seydoux just isn't in the same league as Rigg or her character. This was just one aspect of SPECTRE that I just didn't buy into: Bond falling in love with Mr White's young and incredibly bland daughter. Did I care when Blofeld kidnapped her at the climax of the movie with the intention of blowing her to pieces - no, I didn't - and neither will I care if she's killed in B25. Problem was that Léa Seydoux just didn't win me over the same way as Diana Rigg's did when she sold her Tracy role to me. And you know what really infuriated me about all the hype around the Swann character being an "independent woman" in the PR rounds? Remember, “She’s his equal,” Seydoux told Yahoo Movies, “because she doesn’t need him. She saves him.” Yadda yadda yadda. (Haven't we heard this every time there's a new Bond movie?) Funny, as I also don't recall Swann having saved Bond at all, but I do remember Tracy Draco saving Bond in OHMSS in a breathtaking action-packed less hamfisted way as SPECTRE purports to have done. Honestly, between the protracted waiting time between the last Bond film to the latest one, I'm beginning to not give a damn about Bond anymore.

    I agree. I mean let's face it, two of Craig's best films have similar kind of deeper drama. The loss of Vesper Lynd in CR, which really could be seen as Craig's OHMSS. And the loss of 'mother' 'M' in SF. Both films are, together with OHMSS, the most dramatic Bond outings.

    What Craig needs now is a 'fun' film, with trendsetting action. Hence I really felt....adament to write something by myself. I just urgen the official Bond writers to find the 'fun' again! Be creative, get inspired, look at us Bond fans in here!!!
    You make a very valid point @Gustav_Graves. Both CR and SF do carry a lot of the same dramatic senses of loss that OHMSS does. Most notably SF with the death of M as a substitute Tracy. Which makes me somewhat apprehensive of not wanting to see the same trope repeated again with the lackluster Madeleine Swann. I think Eon have painted themselves into a corner with this continuous timeline thing and it'll be difficult to just simply drop Swann, like she'd never existed, and start with a fresh story and a new heroine.

    I think the continuous timeline-thing isn't the big issue here. Certainly not for Bond #25. The thing is, they simply have to nail it this time from a writer's perspective. That's how I see it. Neal Purvis and Robert Wade need to stop moaning saying that "the whole world is now full of Blofeld's and Silva's now, so....ehhh....we don't know what to do". That's, to me as a Bond fan, a real pain in the ass!! They need to get a proverbial kick under the butt from Babs and Michael, old-school style!

    So having said that, I kep saying all the time that there's plentiful inspiration you can draw from the original Fleming novels or even the continuation novels. What about a quick, fast, yet believable love relationship break-up during the first 30 mins of the new film?? I honestly believe that both Daniel Craig and Lea Seydoux can pull that off. They simply have to read what Tiffany Case did at the start of the novel "From Russia With Love". Or what Pussy Galore did at the start of "Trigger Mortis".

    I think it would be challenging and both great to make the viewers believe that Bond simply isn't the right man (not yet) to get into a full-blown love relationship! And with it I want to see Craig's Bond to act a bit like a real prick to Madeleine, so you actually think "Sjee man, you're fucking rude!!". By doing so you could also create an atmosphere like "Damn, glad Bond dumped her finally!".

    Something like that has NEVER been done before in a Bond film. And by maintaining this kind of continuity, you could actually re-focus very fast on Bond's mission during the remainder of the 120 mins of the film; you could re-focus on the standalone quality of the story! Tada! It's simple. Neal Purvis & Robert Wade simply need to become as inspired as we Bond fans are!!

    I don't go to a Bond film to watch this soap opera shite.

    If we're going get rid of the Madeline elephant in the room then by all means have one line with MP that it didn't work but I don't want to have to sit through this mundane break up.

    Apart from anything else it serves to do nothing narratively for the story if we spend the first 30 mins watching this rubbish play our before Bond gets on with the mission.

    Then in hindsight you also think many of Ian Fleming's stories are 'soap opera shite' as well. Since I got that inspiration from the novels. Thank you for burning down a nice idea. It could work, and I honestly believe that.

    Well I just looked it up and in a 337 page book Fleming covers it in half a page when Bond is having breakfast in his flat and another half page of chat with M - a total of one whole page. That's less than a third of 1% of the 'running time' of the book which in a 120 min film would come in somewhere around the 20 second mark which is exactly the way to deal with it. We really do not need Lea Seydoux brought back for half an hour of slanging matches with Bond like something out of Eastenders that doesnt serve the plot in any way.
  • RoadphillRoadphill United Kingdom
    Posts: 984
    I have to agree with @TheWizardOfIce

    That type of scenario has no place in a Bond film, unfortunately.

    @Gustav_Graves it is always nice to hear someone try to come up with an idea though. Don't be deterred on sharing if you come up with more.

    Just because this one probably doesn't work, there may be one you have that does.

  • BondAficionadoBondAficionado Former IMDBer
    Posts: 1,884

    Although I don't think signing Dan up for 2 more films is that far fetched.
    This has been all but officially confirmed to me, but take it as you will.

    As Bond would say; "Drop the act." You just copy words from members of ajb007 and pretend like it's some exclusive news. I wouldn't care if these assumptions did come true, but the harsh reality is that they haven't, and you frequently update your 'news' to fit the current model.
  • SeanCraigSeanCraig Germany
    Posts: 732
    I would just call the movie "007".
  • RoadphillRoadphill United Kingdom
    Posts: 984
    The idea that @Gustav_Graves shared has inspired me somewhat.

    Is this thread the place to share personal ideas for Bond 25, or even to share some ideas for improving earlier Bond films?

    Perhaps a mod could comment? I don't wish to annoy anyone by going off topic.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    SeanCraig wrote: »
    I would just call the movie "007".

    Thank Christ you don't work for EON then. (I hope. If you do and are just floating this idea to see what the fan community thinks - it's bollocks).
  • Posts: 11,119
    bondsum wrote: »
    bondsum wrote: »
    It doesn't surprise me that B25 will take some of its influence from OHMSS, especially as it's now considered to be one of the very best Bond movies made. But do I really want to see another OHMSS watered-down clone? Absolutely not. Unfortunately, Madeleine Swann is no Contessa Teresa Draco, and Léa Seydoux is no Diana Rigg. Surely if Eon had plans to go down this route from get-go then Broccoli and Mendes should have cast an actress a lot more closer to Craig's age and with a bit of pizzazz about her. Léa Seydoux just isn't in the same league as Rigg or her character. This was just one aspect of SPECTRE that I just didn't buy into: Bond falling in love with Mr White's young and incredibly bland daughter. Did I care when Blofeld kidnapped her at the climax of the movie with the intention of blowing her to pieces - no, I didn't - and neither will I care if she's killed in B25. Problem was that Léa Seydoux just didn't win me over the same way as Diana Rigg's did when she sold her Tracy role to me. And you know what really infuriated me about all the hype around the Swann character being an "independent woman" in the PR rounds? Remember, “She’s his equal,” Seydoux told Yahoo Movies, “because she doesn’t need him. She saves him.” Yadda yadda yadda. (Haven't we heard this every time there's a new Bond movie?) Funny, as I also don't recall Swann having saved Bond at all, but I do remember Tracy Draco saving Bond in OHMSS in a breathtaking action-packed less hamfisted way as SPECTRE purports to have done. Honestly, between the protracted waiting time between the last Bond film to the latest one, I'm beginning to not give a damn about Bond anymore.

    I agree. I mean let's face it, two of Craig's best films have similar kind of deeper drama. The loss of Vesper Lynd in CR, which really could be seen as Craig's OHMSS. And the loss of 'mother' 'M' in SF. Both films are, together with OHMSS, the most dramatic Bond outings.

    What Craig needs now is a 'fun' film, with trendsetting action. Hence I really felt....adament to write something by myself. I just urgen the official Bond writers to find the 'fun' again! Be creative, get inspired, look at us Bond fans in here!!!
    You make a very valid point @Gustav_Graves. Both CR and SF do carry a lot of the same dramatic senses of loss that OHMSS does. Most notably SF with the death of M as a substitute Tracy. Which makes me somewhat apprehensive of not wanting to see the same trope repeated again with the lackluster Madeleine Swann. I think Eon have painted themselves into a corner with this continuous timeline thing and it'll be difficult to just simply drop Swann, like she'd never existed, and start with a fresh story and a new heroine.

    I think the continuous timeline-thing isn't the big issue here. Certainly not for Bond #25. The thing is, they simply have to nail it this time from a writer's perspective. That's how I see it. Neal Purvis and Robert Wade need to stop moaning saying that "the whole world is now full of Blofeld's and Silva's now, so....ehhh....we don't know what to do". That's, to me as a Bond fan, a real pain in the ass!! They need to get a proverbial kick under the butt from Babs and Michael, old-school style!

    So having said that, I kep saying all the time that there's plentiful inspiration you can draw from the original Fleming novels or even the continuation novels. What about a quick, fast, yet believable love relationship break-up during the first 30 mins of the new film?? I honestly believe that both Daniel Craig and Lea Seydoux can pull that off. They simply have to read what Tiffany Case did at the start of the novel "From Russia With Love". Or what Pussy Galore did at the start of "Trigger Mortis".

    I think it would be challenging and both great to make the viewers believe that Bond simply isn't the right man (not yet) to get into a full-blown love relationship! And with it I want to see Craig's Bond to act a bit like a real prick to Madeleine, so you actually think "Sjee man, you're fucking rude!!". By doing so you could also create an atmosphere like "Damn, glad Bond dumped her finally!".

    Something like that has NEVER been done before in a Bond film. And by maintaining this kind of continuity, you could actually re-focus very fast on Bond's mission during the remainder of the 120 mins of the film; you could re-focus on the standalone quality of the story! Tada! It's simple. Neal Purvis & Robert Wade simply need to become as inspired as we Bond fans are!!

    I don't go to a Bond film to watch this soap opera shite.

    If we're going get rid of the Madeline elephant in the room then by all means have one line with MP that it didn't work but I don't want to have to sit through this mundane break up.

    Apart from anything else it serves to do nothing narratively for the story if we spend the first 30 mins watching this rubbish play our before Bond gets on with the mission.

    Then in hindsight you also think many of Ian Fleming's stories are 'soap opera shite' as well. Since I got that inspiration from the novels. Thank you for burning down a nice idea. It could work, and I honestly believe that.

    Well I just looked it up and in a 337 page book Fleming covers it in half a page when Bond is having breakfast in his flat and another half page of chat with M - a total of one whole page. That's less than a third of 1% of the 'running time' of the book which in a 120 min film would come in somewhere around the 20 second mark which is exactly the way to deal with it. We really do not need Lea Seydoux brought back for half an hour of slanging matches with Bond like something out of Eastenders that doesnt serve the plot in any way.

    Somewhere during the first 30 mins of the film you could spend less than 10 mins on such a scene. Perhaps 6 mins. That's what I said, Sadly you make it sound like I want to create a 30 min episode of Eastenders. Which is wrong. In "Trigger Mortis" it's nicely done by the way.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 8,251
    IF DC stays on board, I'd like to see how they're going to show us what he's been up to in between films.

    After all, he left the Service. So where is he, and how does he get back into "the game"?

    I think Fleming's Bond would have busted up with Maddy long ago. And because he's stubborn and had doubts about his job in the past, he's probably living out his pension by drinking, seducing married women, and gambling his days away.

    But he'd be bored and a little unfocused.

    Meanwhile, some of his senses would be dull. And he doesn't realize that he's been tracked down from someone in his past.

    I mentioned this a couple months back, but it's Camille who's tracked him down. She needs his help. Whatever that may be, it shakes Bond out of his doldrums, and this meeting between them's the catalyst to the bigger story.

    So, no mention of Maddy. It'd be a way of bringing in an exceptional Bond girl. And, IF they're doing a two-part send-off for Craig (I can't see it happening, but I've been wrong many times before), with links to YOLT and OHMSS (still don't see it), I could see Bond falling in love with Camille, and I could see her death having an impact (since she and Craig were good together on screen, and as an actress, I find her stronger than Lea).

    Only my two cents, have at it.
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