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Anyway lets pick through some of the bones.
Come on errr dude, I thought you were a man of science? How many threads are there out there and how many dont bump? Perhaps its really common and you have a long list you can quote which will cut me off at the knees? But the only two I know of both have Nikki van der Zyl in the title. Just a computer glitch? You are happy with that as a logical working hypothesis are you? Ok I shouldnt ridicule somebody's beliefs I suppose.
As for you all taking money from EON, I dont think anyone has ever actually suggested that have they? For a start we all know from the pitiful SP DVD release that EON are far too tight to do something as extravagant as spend some money. I feel with Nikkigate you are like the security guy at the Russian consulate in Istanbul in that this is classified far above your level. I genuinely believe your personal bemusement at why this happened Darth - but that doesnt change the facts, which are there for all to see and draw any inferences they so desire.
Dear me. Is this really a post becoming of a mod? Not sure whether to laugh at this, flag it, send you a rabies injection in the post or maybe all three.
I will just note for the record that if said elimination games were so popular with 'a great many members' why did you feel the need to pin them to the top of the list via an announcement because not enough people (for your liking) were posting in them and they were slipping down the list? Perhaps less time spent frothing at the mouth and more trying to hold together a coherent argument might be the way forward?
Indeed. When something so insignificant can provoke lunatic overreactions such as Benny's above then how can a chap not be having any fun?
But enough of this jovial banter. After over 3 years of controversy lets have a quick history of Nikkigate recap for newcomers and those of us who may have forgotten; after all now its been 'announced' so there is clearly nothing to hide here.
The facts are these it seems to me:
1. In 2012 Nikki was banned from appearing at a GF day event.
2. There was a happening between Nikki and Sir Roger Moore whereby he retracted a foreword he had penned for her autobiography.
3. There was a thread about these incidents in which they were discussed.
http://www.mi6community.com/index.php?p=/discussion/3978/the-secret-bond-girl-unknown-artist-dubbed-the-voices-of-007-s-best-known-beauties-but-know-she-s/p1
4. Said thread mysteriously stopped bumping.
5. @thewizardofice created a new thread posing the question 'do we think there was foul play in the first thread not bumping?' which was swiftly closed.
6. The discussion moved to this second thread: http://www.mi6community.com/index.php?p=/discussion/105/nikki-van-der-zyl-voice-dubber-extraordinaire/p1
7. This thread then mysteriously stopped bumping.
8. When queried as to why this might be the mods either ignored the question or offered some vague and unconvincing explanation about glitches in computer code.
9. For 3 years @thewizardofice kept picking at this scab whenever he could because he is a petty and annoying prick.
10. A thread called the 'Great Bond Film Elimination Game' was created.
11. Because it did not seem to be generating enough interest @Benny 'announced' it which meant it was always at the top of the list.
12. Because he has no interest in this thread and is a petty and annoying prick @thewizardofice asked if it could be 'deannounced' and left to fend for itself like every other thread and also enquired why this Nikki thread could not also be 'announced' to boost its popularity too.
13. @darthdimi 'announced' this Nikki thread to show there is no conspiracy and free and frank discussion of Nikki is perfectly acceptable on the forums.
So what do we think chaps and chapesses? Lets take advantage of this new era of glasnost that we have been granted and open up the whole thing for discussion.
Why might Rog have pulled his foreword at the 11th hour? Why is Nikki so hated in the world of Bond alumni? Do we think there really were underhand tactics employed on these boards to try and suppress Nikki discussion or do we believe the grassy knoll oops I mean the computer glitch theory? If we do think the Nikki threads were tampered with why do we think that might be? Why do people react so defensively when the subject of Nikki is brought up?
(But please - and I'm deadly serious here - for the sake of the forums, make sure any theories you postulate are not libellous in any way as we would not want to cause any party to consider legal action against the site.)
Even after all that, it's hard to know what came first; Nikki's ungracious attitude, or the Goldfinger day snub. I suspect that the latter enhanced (but did not create) the former.
As to the reason why the threads were not bumped, I suspect it's just an embarrassing story for EON (nothing more) and this was a ridiculous attempt to sweep it under the carpet.
I hope that's a fair and plausible summary.
Feel free to elaborate on any rules I have broken. I have not received a warning from any of the mods (including you old son) which I would expect for contravening forum rules.
Every word simply dripping with respect - I see now how being a mod means you have to rise above such petty spats so you have my respect for doing that.
So if I create a thread dedicated to Mrs Bell or about say the snooper gadget from AVTAK that no one has any interest in I just need to get two other members to back it and it will get 'announced' so everyone can see it?
Don't worry I'm only taking the piss Benny - dont have a benny (an old one for people who were UK school children in the 80s there!). I'm not about to start creating loads of crappy threads just to annoy you.
Anyway enjoyable as all this has been can we get things back on topic? It would be ironic if now it miraculously bumps again it gets closed down a week later.
Has anyone even read Nikki's book? Are there any fireworks in there or is it dull tedium of sitting in a tiny studio with headphones on day after day and occasionally glimpsing Sean Connery or Shirley Eaton in a corridor?
What's impressive is that so much milk has already been spilled over these threads yet since their revival yesterday, not much stimulating talk has graced them. So people, what are you waiting for? Here they are, your precious Nikki threads. Talk! Discuss. Make it good. Don't tell me I wasted those 30 seconds of google search plus hitting F5 twice... That would be a shame now wouldn't it, I mean, after several years of throwing nonsensical accusations in my face while I clearly have other things going on on this forum.
That wasn't very clear what I wrote. Roger's explanation is that:
1. Nikki's son wrote him a letter saying that there was stuff in the book he didn't think should be (the family's dirty laundry).
2. Nikki had kicked up a fuss over Eunice Grayson's book and wanted passages inserted which gave her credit as her voice. Roger didn't like this.
I have yet to decide who is Trump and who is Hillary :))
The entertainment value of this thread is priceless.
And who the frack is Nikki van der Zyl?? :))
It's nice to think that the mods here are keeping the truth form the masses, but it's all out there if you are interested.
Indeed @Scaramanga12 it's more mod posts telling us there's nothing to see here than it is thread now.
I don't really understand why it seems to be that the mods constantly feel the need to keep posting how it's nothing to do with them and there's no conspiracy.
Ok guys we get it. It was just a computer glitch, albeit one that was so easily fixable in could be done in 30 seconds but took 3 years for someone to do manage to get round to doing.
It's fine that none of you are interested in Nikki and that the whole thing is boring to you (though for all that you all seem to spend a lot of time in this thread!). The thread now bumps which is all we asked for from the start and I'm sure you have lots of other mod duties you could be getting on with so why not just leave all us conspiracy nutters to our silly theories?
@DarthDimi I would have thought that you would understand that the moment you sign up to be a mod you cross the line from being one of us to one of the establishment? I have absolutely no doubts that you do it for the right reasons just as I have no doubts that most football referees are decent blokes who do it for a love of the game. And despite my gratitude to a referee for putting himself in the firing line, without which the game could not take place, it won't stop me from calling him a blind wanker if he so much as gets a throw in wrong for my team.
The same goes for anyone who puts themselves up for public service so you really shouldn't be so sensitive about it and I don't think anyone has ever accused you personally (at least I don't think I have) of being complicit only in the sense you are part of the overall regime.
I thank all of the mods for the work they put in to keep us clear of trolls and closing down bullshit threads because it is an utterly thankless task. But then didn't you realise that when you signed up to do it?
Anyway at least now there is a glimmer of light at the end of the tunnel for all of us because I'm pretty sure in 48 hours this thread will die the natural death it would have done in the first place because not that many people (including me) are that interested in Nikki.
Of course Nikkigate will enter the lexicon around here as a byword for state sponsored censorship but that can't be really be helped at this point.
Wouldn't it have been much more easier and convenient if these Nikki threads had "accidentally" been deleted long ago by the evil mods?
But you are so! wrong!
To be honest it's hard to respect anyone who finds it good grace to be negative about those who voluntarily help the commuinty along. There's nothing funny or cool about these comments, and I sure hope karma will come around and slap you in the face for all those people you insulted because they did something for the benefit of others that wasn't exactly up your street. Your reasoning is that of a rapist. Blaming someone else for your own misconduct.
So go out there and be a referee (and an honest one) or shut your mouth forever to anyone who's doing anything, voluntarily or not, for the greater good.
What is it about this thread that causes people to go mental?
I was just pointing out that people who do public service have to expect that it won't be appreciated. If you apply to be a referee or a traffic warden I presume the first day of training is 'the public will hate you'. If you go into the job not expecting that then you are pretty naive.
I'm not saying it's right I'm just saying that's the way it is. I shout at referees yes but the referee is a pantomime villain character and it goes with the territory. If someone shouting at you makes you go and sit crying in the shower with your clothes on then you're in the wrong job. Every single day the public moan and slag us off at work and 90% of the time I agree with them (I despise the cycle lanes for example) but it's Boris who makes the calls and so as the face of his policies we get the flak. C'est la vie.
There's not a single referee I haven't gone and shook hands with after a match and thanked becaus it's people like that who keep the game going.
As regards the mods here I have prodded them relentlessly over Nikkigate because it all seemed extremely dodgy and they are the face of the governing regime so it's them who have to face the scrutiny. Similarly with the recent instructions not to post any EON copyrighted pics or vids. Let's not forget that although there are a lot of people who put in a load of hard work to make this site run smoothly the fans contribute just as much to make this the biggest Bond site in the world so when something seems amiss we owe it to ourselves to ask questions about it.
But at the end of the day none of this really matters so I'm not going to lose my shit over it. Myself and Darth remain on good terms as pushing the atheist agenda is far more important and fun than bickering over non-entity Nikki van Der Zyl.
I guess we can't all be as calm and reasonable as you CommanderRoss. I need to take a leaf out of your book as comparing people to rapists is usually a fine way to garner respect.
I concur!
Have you ever considered not taking it 'as it is' but actually taking responsibility for your own actions? Nah... probably not.
I take it you're now sitting crying in the shower with your clothes on then? I never compared you to a rapist, I compared your reasoning with that of a rapist. If you can't tell the difference, It's time to go. (that, just as my opening in the earlier post, is of course a Bond reference. I put it in italics just to make sure, you seem to misinterpret some of my words here).
Odd, by the way, that you're slacking our good mods here, claim that's fair game, and start whining about getting flak yourself. Heard of the saying 'what goes around comes around'? Or am I utterly mistaken, and are you only allowed to attack public figures, not the ones who attack them?
What have I 'admitted' to exactly? Slagging off referees? Yes absolutely. Anyone who doesn't do that isn't a proper football fan. It's part of the pantomime of the game but it's confined to the 90 minutes and afterwards forgotten. It would be water off a ducks back to any ref worth his salt so I really don't see what you're getting so excited about as you try to paint me as some sort of ASBO collecting droog.
I take full responsiblity for my actions but (and I know this will be a disappointment to you) my actions only extend to shouting when the ref makes a bad decision. If I followed him home and put a petrol bomb through his letterbox then I'd agree with you I do need locking up.
Thanks for the distinction Chomsky but not sure the difference is as big as you think it is in terms of one being an insult and the other not.
Not that I could give the slightest toss. Feel free to claim my mother fellates dead badgers if you want I'm really not going to start flagging you to the mods. That's what mystifies me about people taking everything so personally. Who gives a shit about some guy ranting on the Internet? Then again who gives a shit about some old woman ranting in a book? But here we are!
Capital idea Sir! Perhaps I shall put myself forwards for public service? I'll start with PM and then work my way up. I can just picture myself sitting round the summit table with Donald Trump and Vlad deciding who needs a good carpet bombing.
Doubt it. By all accounts she's a right cow. And lest you forget it's her that started all this!
And if that doesn't bring the conspiracy theorists out of the closet nothing will.
Haha. I was almost just about to suggest that. There's precious little Nikki debate and that's because no one is really that interested in her.
This is what would have happened naturally all those years ago anyway if things hadn't got silly.
Although closure is a bit draconian NicNac - there are plenty of threads that get more off topic than this has which don't get closed down.
I presume if you closed it there would be no objections if I started a new Nikkigate thread (as the other one got closed, also ironically, because that never once veered off topic) and it would miraculously bump with no problems now that we know how to fix the computer glitch?
I'll start...if Nikki was married to me would she be NikkiNakki?
Or you could take her name and be Nic Nac van Der Zyl which, to quote the great Jinx herself (something I can say with all certainty I've never done before), is 'a bit of mouthful'.
Just to clarify would discussing Nikkigate rather than Nikki herself be classed as veering off topic?
You're inclination that I'm actually getting excited about you is wishfull thinking however. If you complain (and you do) about my choice of words, them beeing too harsh, consider your own first. My tone is a response to yours, not the other way around.
Even on the internet it works better to just be kind to people, instead of saying 'Who gives a shit about some guy ranting on the Internet?'. You know, it's called communication and thefunny thing about it is, it's very important for human beeings. Even if it's thru more impersonal means.
Anyway, just to add a little of Nikki into the drama, same goes for her. If she'd been a bit more considerate to those around her, she'd probably have a bestseller, with Roger's introduction too. But alas, she was far too busy hiding her own shortcomings. Sad, isn't it?
I don't follow the correlation of why being a connaisseur (sic) on beeing (sic) a ref would automatically make me want to be one? I know and understand the laws of the game and sometimes I disagree with the ref. But I derive much more enjoyment playing than standing there implementing said laws so a career as a ref is something I have no interest in. And here's some news for you - yes a lot about being a football fan is childish and stupid but it is (or rather was) one of the few releases left for the working man at the end of a week providing for his family so who are you to criticise how he goes about it as long as he's not hurting anyone? I'd sooner have a stadium of people being childish than people like you sitting po faced not saying anything and tucking into their prawn sandwiches. If you can hand on heart say that youve never shouted at the officials at a dodgy penalty or offside then you are no football fan just a consumer of a product.
As regards the mods I've only ever criticised them as being part of the ruling regime which is something they signed up to do. I thank them and appreciate their work when dealing with trolls and spam but I disagree and consider it fair to hold them to account when I see something I dont agree with, and in my view (only my view - I can understand that some people are happy with the computer glitch explanation) questions needed to be asked over the whole Nikkigate affair. I'm sorry you can't differentiate between this and spitting vitriol in someones face and glassing them with a pintpot which seems to be what you are inferring I am on the verge of doing to referees, traffic wardens, politicians, mods etc etc. I should have a restraining order out on me to protect all public figures.
Who am I being unkind to there? The guy I was referring to is me.
Anyway I'm rather tired of this debate (I'm sure you are too) and given @NicNac's comment above I dont really want to let this dull argument risk derailing the thread to the point of closure (you sure you arent working for the mods @CommanderRoss trying to divert this thread into being locked??).
Back on topic!!
Well none of us really know what went on with Nikki. Is it just that she feels disgruntled because she didn't get a credit? Is it that she had a big barney with Shirley Eaton? Or is it something deeper? Personally I'd be inclined to veer towards the latter but whatever she doesn't acquit herself at all well with more conspiracy theories than me about why she is being denied her place in Bond history!!! Any chance that someone could plough through her book (really can't be bothered myself) and see if there are any juicy nuggets?
PS -
'Increadable'?, 'Connaisseur'?, Wishfull?', 'Beeing'? (could claim it as a typo if you didnt do it twice in as many paragraphs).
To avoid misinterpretation you might want to proof read your post next time:
Anyway, it all seems to be – I done a quick Google of dear old Nikki, and perused this thread – a pissed off old lady, with a grudge against EON. A rather Sean Connery-eque form of not getting the recognition that she (feels?) deserves.
Still, if I were EON and asked to take sides between Shirley Eaton, the famed “Golden Girl” no less, and poor Nikki, I know which side I'd come down on.
Regardless, here's to Nikki voice dubber extraordinaire!
Very well said.
Nikki's contribution is far more important than Shirley's IMO.
Jill could've been played by any blonde in a bikini. Shirley just got lucky to be in the iconic film in the iconic role. Could just have easily been Margaret Nolan who lets not forget played the golden girl in the title sequence and on the poster.
I can see how Nikki might well get the hump with Shirley lording it over her at various events.
But yes she is definitely an underappreciated icon in the Bond world