Analyzing the Transition of Power After The U.S. Election and Beyond Into Future Global Politics

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  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited December 2016 Posts: 12,459
    Just bumping this to this new page:
    chrisisall wrote: »
    http://www.wsj.com/articles/let-the-electoral-college-do-its-duty-1473290734
    "State courts that have considered the matter have held that elector pledges can impose, in the words of the Supreme Court of Ohio in 1948, only “a moral obligation, not a legal one.” As that court concluded, when a state attempts to “dictate to the electors the choice which they must make for president and vice president, it has invaded the field set apart to the electors by the Constitution of the United States, and such action cannot stand.”
    Interesting....

    I think the electors are under pressure from several sources. Look at what just individuals who have criticized Trump have had to put up with (Indiana credit union leader, because of Trump's Carrier 'deal', for example; him receiving phone calls saying "watch your kids" - heinous things like that.) I imagine electors are being pressured now and feel that threats afterwards will be forthcoming. Sure, it is a private vote ... but some are publicly stating they will change and not vote for Trump or even for Clinton (some are writing in a different name). It is brave of them to say so publicly in the current poisoned atmosphere we have. Who knows how they will vote in private? We can just hope they follow their own conscience (be that for Trump or Clinton).

    Denying Trump the magic number of 270 is important, but I find it unlikely to happen. But it is the best chance - and really the electors' right - to change the outcome. Then it would at least go to House to decide the presidency. Other avenues, after Dec. 19th vote from the electors will not be as easy or clear cut.
  • M16_CartM16_Cart Craig fanboy?
    Posts: 541
    i'm less afraid of trump than i am of the anti-intellectualism and prejudice that came along with his campaign. i don't think the majority of trump supporters are bigots, but he wouldn't spend so much time and spread so much vitriol to pander to a group that didn't exist.

    it's interesting because in the 80's and 90's, trump was a centrist, somewhere between a Bill Clinton Democrat and Rockefeller Republican. most don't know that he ran for president in 2000 as a moderate, and was even trying to see if he could find an opening after Reagan's two terms were up. he always had a protectionist streak, but never pandered racism until he the birther movement as an opportunity to gain the following.

    our next president is truly a blank slate interested in his own vanity. i don't know why people are angry at the government. the government is just a reflection of the people. Americans only have themselves to blame.
  • edited December 2016 Posts: 3,564
    I just posted this in the Trump Error thread. Just trying to keep the playing field level, here it is for us as well as for them...

    He's baaaaaa-ack!

    The Rude Pundit has returned, after a self-imposed time-out, and is pulling no punches. The gist of his argument is that Trump is actually going to be the LOSER-in-Chief, having lost to Hillary by nearly 3 million votes. Here's some of His Rudeness' own prose: Trump won because the Founders created a f***ed-up system to make slave states feel wanted because conservatives have always thrown a fit if you don't just accept their ignorance. And if you want to see more, just because, y'know, it's important that we all hear each other even if we don't necessarily agree, you can find him at http://rudepundit.blogspot.com/

    Meanwhile, in other news, Obama is finally getting off his behind and ordering an investigation of Russian meddling in this election because, oh I don't know, maybe they've got The Donald by the wallet and maybe it would be a bad idea to have the American Resident under the thumb of a foreign power. Just sayin'. And the recount in certain states that statisticians think maybe look a little fishy is moving forward. And the campaign to get electors to behave faithlessly to one segment of the populace but faithfully to the founding fathers' intent in creating an electoral college in the first place also moves forward.

    The Donald's drive to put the foxes in charge of the henhouse ain't a done deal yet, folks. Looks like interesting times ahead. Merry Christmas, y'all. 'Preciatecha!
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    I've read things that lead me to believe that Trump is considering believing in climate change...
    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/04/science/flooding-of-coast-caused-by-global-warming-has-already-begun.html
    OH! THIS is why! He has a luxury real estate company in Miami! =))
  • M16_CartM16_Cart Craig fanboy?
    Posts: 541
    If the electoral college were fair, the FBI weren't bribed and Russia stayed out, Democrats would've won by 2%.

    And if they actually tried to reach out to white working class voters, they would've won by 5-10%.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    And here we have in a few short paragraphs what happened to our country, and why folks like Trump & Ryan are how they are...
    http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/its-ayn-rands-america-now-republicans-have-stripped-country-its-morality?akid=14988.1353384.0TqV_Y&rd=1&src=newsletter1068596&t=4

    “To love money is to know and love the fact that money is the creation of the best power within you, and your passkey to trade your effort for the effort of the best among men.

    The creed of sacrifice is a morality for the immoral…”

  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited December 2016 Posts: 12,459
    Yes to the above post.

    And here is this, just more obviousness being pointed out.
    Tillerson reported as chosen to be Secretary of State, John Bolton as his deputy.

    Tiller would need to be confirmed. Will Congress roll over? Will Republicans still think they can control Trump? Lots of questions, sure.

    Tillerson is CEO of Exxon with strong ties to Russia. He is happy to lift sanctions to Russia. Lots of etcs to read about. Here is some info, but there is plenty of info everywhere on this.







    John Bolton to be assistant/deputy director, working daily with Tillerson.
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/john-bolton-un-ambassador-hawk-republican-secretary-of-state-donald-trump-a7419096.html




  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,554
    M16_Cart wrote: »
    If the electoral college were fair, the FBI weren't bribed and Russia stayed out, Democrats would've won by 2%.

    And if they actually tried to reach out to white working class voters, they would've won by 5-10%.

    They have been struggling to do this for decades. When Obama talked about strengthening our community colleges and helping people get the skills they need for the 21st century, guess who swooped in and CUT state funding to community colleges? The Republicans who have taken charge in state legislatures. And how did that happen? Because those same working class whites voted them in.

    I'm sorry. I have no sympathy for the toothless, brainless, hillbillies of backwoods Kentucky and Ohio. They have known for a long time that coal was done, that automation was coming, that if they wanted to survive, they needed to up their skills and training. What did they do? They voted in the bozos who'd make it more difficult to do so...again and again and again.

    It's odd that the black community is lambasted for not doing enough to pull itself out of poverty. Well same goes for those hillbillies.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited December 2016 Posts: 12,459
    A little light relief ... from one of my favorite films. :)


    Oh, here you go: ;)
    Also sage advice:
    "There's a force in the universe that makes things happen .... all you have to do is get in touch with it."
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited December 2016 Posts: 12,459
    I believe Trump essentially has not changed. And he won't change. His strongest driving goal is always for himself. Look at all he has said and done, all along. Not one comment - his comments. Not one action - his actions. Not one case of fraud - all his conning, fraud, deals, etc. - won't release taxes, will keep involved in his businesses while president (his kids involved in govt admin., too), no genuine blind trust, etc. - including of course Trump University, just a drop in the bucket.

    So he can bend this way or that way, depending upon what he thinks will be good for him. Republicans who have wanted Obama out for 8 years, and who blocked him in every way every chance they got (not putting country first, just their party), now think they can shape the administration the way they want. They are gleeful - yet starting to notice and feel some alarm with his administrative choices and his statements. They will have several rude awakenings on the upcoming bumpy, dirty, and certainly very uncivil ride. Trump's core supporters, at least a certain amount of them, don't care and cannot see negative consequences. They just wanted a big change.



    I'm going to walk my dog all over my mountain next, then watch Caddyshack. I hope everybody has a good weekend in spite of the political storm that is still threatening. It isn't going away, or getting better any time soon. Take good care of yourself.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    Caddyshack is key. A relief for what ails ya (temporarily, anyway).
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited December 2016 Posts: 12,459
    It is. ;) And such a truly American movie, isn't it?

    I miss Rodney Dangerfield. He'd be having a field day with Trump jokes, oh yes. ;)
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    It is. ;) And such a truly American movie, isn't it?
    OH certainly! Only Chase's Vacation movies come close!

  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    Here I intentionally searched for the nicest pictures of the Neowhatevers that I could.
    The faces of our owners, err, I mean rulers, uhh, I mean public servants...
    Ryan.jpg
    160318183347-donald-trump-finances-pkg-00004917-large-169.jpg
    Mike_Pence_111th.jpg

    IMO, even in their NICEST pictures you (well, not ALL of you of course) can detect a certain smugness and elitist whiff.
    Let's look at another face. I'll try like Hell to find a BAD look....
    484059572-democratic-presidential-candidate-sen-bernie-sanders.jpg.CROP.promo-xlarge2.jpg
    Angry, not at all flattering, but what's THAT? That look that is so different than the others above?
    Passion?
    .......
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited December 2016 Posts: 12,459
    Passion? Caring? About America? Standing up and saying partisanship must give way to protecting our rights and our country, etc. Stuff like that? Probably, yeah. And not such a common thing these days.

    I swear the photo of Trump smirking while having dinner with a contrite looking Romney will go down as iconic, emblematic of this election.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    _88446566_trump1.jpg
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,459
    So presidential.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    Seared by sarcasm here! :))
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
  • M16_CartM16_Cart Craig fanboy?
    Posts: 541
    trump is the average american.

    obama was a pretty neutral president, but at least the man had some dignity and class. his biggest mistake in office was inability to gain 50 pounds, drink Gordon's gin, wear a tanktop smeared in bacon grease and watch NASCAR.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    chrisisall wrote: »

    That sounds like C, all right.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    chrisisall wrote: »

    That sounds like C, all right.
    Is he not-cool?
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    C does not stand for Cool.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    C does not stand for Cool.
    Well, you know better than I.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    chrisisall wrote: »
    C does not stand for Cool.
    Well, you know better than I.

    That s cool.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited December 2016 Posts: 12,459
    Russian interference, for whatever reasons. I think more than one reason, sure.
    And Trump trying to laugh it off, of course.
    Washington Post certainly not the only one reporting on this.
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-cia-on-collision-course-over-russias-role-in-us-election/2016/12/10/ad01556c-bf01-11e6-91ee-1adddfe36cbe_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_russiaintel733pm:homepage/story&utm_term=.45048f1ca728

    U.S. intelligence officials described mounting concern and confusion about how to proceed in an administration so openly hostile to their function and role. “I don’t know what the end game is here,” a senior U.S. intelligence official said. “After Jan. 20,” the official said, referring to Inauguration Day, “we’re in uncharted territory.”

    Pillar added: “Everything Trump has indicated with regard to his character and tendencies for vindictiveness might be worse” than former president Richard Nixon, who also had a dysfunctional relationship with the intelligence community.


    And, haha!
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    Trump has intelligence, very good intelligence. The BEST, in fact!
    Straight from the KG-used-to-Be!
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,554
    The Repubs are trying to play this both ways, based on the responses I've read from Fox News and the Wall Street Journal.

    On one hand, they claim that Obama's position toward Russia was weak, leading to Russia gaining an upper hand on the U.S. However, the also seem to claim that the leak is no big deal and suggests that the Democrats are behind this and whining about the outcome again.

    You can't freak out about Putin when it comes to Obama and then shrug him off when it comes to hacking. Sorry. But Republicans pull this crap constantly.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    Yep.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited December 2016 Posts: 12,459
    Russia


    AND

    Conway saying that Trump will put his own people into the intelligence services.

    DICKERSON: I’m just trying to get a sense of the new president-elect’s views about the intelligence community… The reason I ask is that he’s had a lot of intelligence briefings [sic], and then when he was asked about this question, which is coming from the intelligence community, he said that it was a “laughing point.” In other words, the notion that the Russians were involved in the election was laughable. And so I’m just wondering how he can both respect the intelligence community and then think something they’re telling him is laughable. That seems to be a disconnect.

    CONWAY: It’s completely compatible. He absolutely respects the intelligence community. He’s made very clear he’s going to put his own people in there as well. What he has said is laughable and ridiculous is this entire notion, which people are just using as a foregone conclusion, that somehow this was meant to defeat Hillary Clinton and elevate him to the presidency.


    AND

    Rise and acceptance/normalization/glamorization of white supremists in the U.S.
    Please don't just brush this off. Think it through. Think of all that has happened during this election cycle and since Nov. 8th. What Trump has said, how he has said it, and the media coverage (TV for sure, also print media) ... especially since Nov. 8th (in my opinion)
    Examples here from L.A. Times and NYTimes. I think it is worth reading through all of this.



    CNN already in the news awhile back for pandering to white supremists.

    I was unaware of this casting call .. beyond awful. No excuse.
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/12/11/cadillac-apologizes-for-casting-call-seeking-actors-for-an-alt-right-neo-nazi-role/?utm_term=.23de19fcc7c2

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