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The Next American President Thread (2016)

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  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Germanlady wrote: »
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    @jetsetwilly, I think it's all down to which shows you watch, as impartiality varies greatly in some spots.

    For CNN you can't go wrong with Don Lemon or Anderson Cooper, and for Fox Megyn Kelly and Bill O'Reilly have really improved as impartial commentators in my eyes over time. Fox is largely a joke of a network, especially their Fox & Friends news blocks, but there's some good commentators on there if you're looking for them that call it as they see it both ways, left or right.

    Sometimes I turn on Hannity just to have a laugh at his expense, as you need the cartoon character commentators too to balance things out.

    Brady, a big channel like CNN will ALWAYS only report, what is allowed and system true. Its a Make Belief channel like all the others. No mainstream media channel is free to report as they wish. Anderson and Co report, what is written for them on a piece of paper. Nothing else. You can wipe your cute little arse with that AND with their news. Well - mostly.

    Thanks for your opinion, @Germanlady, I really needed to hear another. As I stated, there's an obvious bias in a lot of news, but the alternative is watching none of it, and that's not very sensible either. It's quite easy to watch something and tell when you're being led on, and as an American one of the few rights I have is to interpret what I see and hear as either true or false. Do they have that in Germany, or did Merkel take that away too? :|
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    jobo wrote: »
    Can someone please explain to me how a country that has been plagued and destroyed with absurdly conservative and reactionary right wing politics for several decades, would benefit from an even more extreme right wing populist? How can that possibly be "the shock to the system" that is needed? :-??

    with that I meant shock to the system of the aristocratic political establishment who sees the voter as a necessary nuisance to uphold the illusion of democracy, that goes for left and right, Reps and Dems.
    I mean that. Such a shock is needed.
    Just wish people would prove more reasonable, Bernie is the greatest opportunity missed.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    BondJasonBond006 wrote: »
    jobo wrote: »
    Can someone please explain to me how a country that has been plagued and destroyed with absurdly conservative and reactionary right wing politics for several decades, would benefit from an even more extreme right wing populist? How can that possibly be "the shock to the system" that is needed? :-??

    with that I meant shock to the system of the aristocratic political establishment who sees the voter as a necessary nuisance to uphold the illusion of democracy, that goes for left and right, Reps and Dems.
    I mean that. Such a shock is needed.
    Just wish people would prove more reasonable, Bernie is the greatest opportunity missed.

    Bernie was also fairly non-partisan in a partisan heavy system. He wanted to make everybody's wallets light, and didn't have the necessary support of the DNC on top of it, while Hillary did. It's amazing he got as far as he did, honestly, because of his independent spirit. But now people are vilifying him because he's supporting the Dems and helping Hillary get the high seat.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited November 2016 Posts: 12,459
    This is beautiful. Nevada ~




    oh and this one :)

  • GermanladyGermanlady
    Posts: 6,601
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    Germanlady wrote: »
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    @jetsetwilly, I think it's all down to which shows you watch, as impartiality varies greatly in some spots.

    For CNN you can't go wrong with Don Lemon or Anderson Cooper, and for Fox Megyn Kelly and Bill O'Reilly have really improved as impartial commentators in my eyes over time. Fox is largely a joke of a network, especially their Fox & Friends news blocks, but there's some good commentators on there if you're looking for them that call it as they see it both ways, left or right.

    Sometimes I turn on Hannity just to have a laugh at his expense, as you need the cartoon character commentators too to balance things out.

    Brady, a big channel like CNN will ALWAYS only report, what is allowed and system true. Its a Make Belief channel like all the others. No mainstream media channel is free to report as they wish. Anderson and Co report, what is written for them on a piece of paper. Nothing else. You can wipe your cute little arse with that AND with their news. Well - mostly.

    Thanks for your opinion, @Germanlady, I really needed to hear another. As I stated, there's an obvious bias in a lot of news, but the alternative is watching none of it, and that's not very sensible either. It's quite easy to watch something and tell when you're being led on, and as an American one of the few rights I have is to interpret what I see and hear as either true or false. Do they have that in Germany, or did Merkel take that away too? :|

    As so often, you Go the easy Route. There is a third Option. I can only repeat myself over and over. The net is Full of vids like above, that you guys probably dont watch to not burst your bubble. People in the know, WHO are Not afraid any longer to speak their truth. Once you have a clearer picture of how it all Connects, its rather easy to Tell truth from bs. Whatever source you are watching.
  • jetsetwillyjetsetwilly
    Posts: 3,279
    Germanlady wrote: »
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    Germanlady wrote: »
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    @jetsetwilly, I think it's all down to which shows you watch, as impartiality varies greatly in some spots.

    For CNN you can't go wrong with Don Lemon or Anderson Cooper, and for Fox Megyn Kelly and Bill O'Reilly have really improved as impartial commentators in my eyes over time. Fox is largely a joke of a network, especially their Fox & Friends news blocks, but there's some good commentators on there if you're looking for them that call it as they see it both ways, left or right.

    Sometimes I turn on Hannity just to have a laugh at his expense, as you need the cartoon character commentators too to balance things out.

    Brady, a big channel like CNN will ALWAYS only report, what is allowed and system true. Its a Make Belief channel like all the others. No mainstream media channel is free to report as they wish. Anderson and Co report, what is written for them on a piece of paper. Nothing else. You can wipe your cute little arse with that AND with their news. Well - mostly.

    Thanks for your opinion, @Germanlady, I really needed to hear another. As I stated, there's an obvious bias in a lot of news, but the alternative is watching none of it, and that's not very sensible either. It's quite easy to watch something and tell when you're being led on, and as an American one of the few rights I have is to interpret what I see and hear as either true or false. Do they have that in Germany, or did Merkel take that away too? :|

    As so often, you Go the easy Route. There is a third Option. I can only repeat myself over and over. The net is Full of vids like above, that you guys probably dont watch to not burst your bubble. People in the know, WHO are Not afraid any longer to speak their truth. Once you have a clearer picture of how it all Connects, its rather easy to Tell truth from bs. Whatever source you are watching.

    Yes I agree. God bless the internet and Social Media. It throws another perspective onto the election, rather than the spoon-fed biased crap that CNN and Fox are currently heavily embroiled in.

    If you watch CNN, its a done deal - Clinton has won, and if you watch Fox, its a done deal - Trump has won.

  • GermanladyGermanlady
    Posts: 6,601
    Its Not, that I believe everything just because its Reported by an Indie Source. I compare, what I know with what is Said and If it makes Sense.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    Germanlady wrote: »
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    Germanlady wrote: »
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    @jetsetwilly, I think it's all down to which shows you watch, as impartiality varies greatly in some spots.

    For CNN you can't go wrong with Don Lemon or Anderson Cooper, and for Fox Megyn Kelly and Bill O'Reilly have really improved as impartial commentators in my eyes over time. Fox is largely a joke of a network, especially their Fox & Friends news blocks, but there's some good commentators on there if you're looking for them that call it as they see it both ways, left or right.

    Sometimes I turn on Hannity just to have a laugh at his expense, as you need the cartoon character commentators too to balance things out.

    Brady, a big channel like CNN will ALWAYS only report, what is allowed and system true. Its a Make Belief channel like all the others. No mainstream media channel is free to report as they wish. Anderson and Co report, what is written for them on a piece of paper. Nothing else. You can wipe your cute little arse with that AND with their news. Well - mostly.

    Thanks for your opinion, @Germanlady, I really needed to hear another. As I stated, there's an obvious bias in a lot of news, but the alternative is watching none of it, and that's not very sensible either. It's quite easy to watch something and tell when you're being led on, and as an American one of the few rights I have is to interpret what I see and hear as either true or false. Do they have that in Germany, or did Merkel take that away too? :|

    As so often, you Go the easy Route. There is a third Option. I can only repeat myself over and over. The net is Full of vids like above, that you guys probably dont watch to not burst your bubble. People in the know, WHO are Not afraid any longer to speak their truth. Once you have a clearer picture of how it all Connects, its rather easy to Tell truth from bs. Whatever source you are watching.

    Yes I agree. God bless the internet and Social Media. It throws another perspective onto the election, rather than the spoon-fed biased crap that CNN and Fox are currently heavily embroiled in.

    If you watch CNN, its a done deal - Clinton has won, and if you watch Fox, its a done deal - Trump has won.
    I agree with both of you. The US media is for the most part a disgrace. Throw MSNBC into that mix as well. Let's not forget some of the newspapers that are often quoted here (same reporters over and over).
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Germanlady wrote: »
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    Germanlady wrote: »
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    @jetsetwilly, I think it's all down to which shows you watch, as impartiality varies greatly in some spots.

    For CNN you can't go wrong with Don Lemon or Anderson Cooper, and for Fox Megyn Kelly and Bill O'Reilly have really improved as impartial commentators in my eyes over time. Fox is largely a joke of a network, especially their Fox & Friends news blocks, but there's some good commentators on there if you're looking for them that call it as they see it both ways, left or right.

    Sometimes I turn on Hannity just to have a laugh at his expense, as you need the cartoon character commentators too to balance things out.

    Brady, a big channel like CNN will ALWAYS only report, what is allowed and system true. Its a Make Belief channel like all the others. No mainstream media channel is free to report as they wish. Anderson and Co report, what is written for them on a piece of paper. Nothing else. You can wipe your cute little arse with that AND with their news. Well - mostly.

    Thanks for your opinion, @Germanlady, I really needed to hear another. As I stated, there's an obvious bias in a lot of news, but the alternative is watching none of it, and that's not very sensible either. It's quite easy to watch something and tell when you're being led on, and as an American one of the few rights I have is to interpret what I see and hear as either true or false. Do they have that in Germany, or did Merkel take that away too? :|

    As so often, you Go the easy Route. There is a third Option. I can only repeat myself over and over. The net is Full of vids like above, that you guys probably dont watch to not burst your bubble. People in the know, WHO are Not afraid any longer to speak their truth. Once you have a clearer picture of how it all Connects, its rather easy to Tell truth from bs. Whatever source you are watching.

    Yes, like that evil weather machine video. Most spooky.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    edited November 2016 Posts: 9,020
    It's difficult nowadays to get the big picture.
    I stick to some selected news media to get as much information possible without overloading myself with it.

    I read newspapers from all political spectrums. I even read the Swiss right-wing (neoliberal) newspaper WELTWOCHE just to get their perspective and I can see when it goes into propaganda and when not.
    I read DER SPIEGEL (German newspaper) and the online version which gives a pretty good inside what people really think in the comments section.
    I read TIME as well for instance.

    Twitter and FB is too full of silly short messages and propaganda. I just skip it completely.

    As for Fox news, sometimes I watch it, just for fun. It's satirical reality to the max and quite entertaining.

    BBC News is also quite a good source to get informed.

    There's more but most of it you folks wouldn't know anyway except @Germanlady I guess.

    Overall I think EVERYTHING gets blown out of proportion here.
    Neither Hillary nor Trump will bring us Armageddon.

    And quite frankly, even if I know American's couldn't give a damn about it, Europe is far more in danger of going downhill and fast.

    Look at Turkey!! Look at Hungary and Poland...
    Now that's what should get you folks worried and not if a lying clown or a notorious lier is getting to the White House. You can always correct your errors after four years.

    We can't (in Europe). We are living in a factual economic dictatorship ruled by a woman (Merkel) who couldn't care less about really everything. She is just there doing nothing, since years, and the little she did was putting her middle class damaging Austerity Politics on everybody and open the borders of Germany to welcome a million refugees without even caring for people's concerns.
    WE CAN DO THIS it's her (in)famous motto that now is eerily similar to Obama's YES WE CAN.

    Sorry if I used sarcasm in past posts, I won't again, it's obvious only leads to misunderstandings.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    What's clear is that any information we read, no matter who is comes from needs to be vetted, because it's impossible to be sure about most anything these days simply because so much is out there and overexaggeration and sensationalism are big business. You just have to use your head and when something doesn't feel right, don't pursue it, and if you hear something that seems true, check it around with other sources to spot bias.

    It also helps not to be a sanctimonious jackass who thinks they are huffing the secret truths of the universe from a plastic bag that nobody else has access to.

    But sometimes we ask for too much.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,459
    Buenas noches :)
    And read the links above from me. Just so nice to have positives.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Thought I'd share this:



    With where we're at right now, it's not hard to imagine people being tricked into thinking this was true.
  • BeatlesSansEarmuffsBeatlesSansEarmuffs
    Posts: 3,564
    I love this: while Trump urges crowds at his rallies to physically attack his detractors, Hillary's #1 surrogate defends Trump supporters. This is why we can't have a Trump presidency: it's a matter of civility. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/obama-defends-trump-supporter-video_us_581cebe0e4b0d9ce6fbc0910

    Oh, and even Faux News is admitting they reported falsely regarding Hillary & the FBI: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/fox-news-clinton-indictment-mistake_us_581cc361e4b0d9ce6fbb9753
    But hey, at least the polls are closer now, so it's all good, right?
    4EverBonded wrote: »
    Buenas noches :)
    And read the links above from me. Just so nice to have positives.
    This one's for you, @4EverBonded. Pleasant dreams!
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    edited November 2016 Posts: 4,554
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »

    How exactly is HRC dangerous? From the standpoint of what she can control, within the Oval Office, she poses no threat and we will likely see more of what we've seen the past 8 years.

    CNN is a real news organization. Unfortunately, like most news, they give in to some sensationalism. Fox, on the other hand, is pure propaganda.

    I think she is dangerous in the fact that she has been caught out lying, covering her tracks, being misleading - and now being under another investigation by the FBI. The whiff of corruption is all around her. The daily stories that are leaking are not good in any way, and I'm guessing there are bigger things to be revealed by the FBI. The bleaching of emails, and her smug remarks of `What? Wiping it with some kind of cloth?'

    A person behaving that way is not fit for office. These are definitely not positive traits, whichever way you try and spin it in her favour, and she is definitely no Obama either.

    As for CNN, why are they not reporting any of the daily Wikileaks, or the FBI investigation? They are not mentioning it in any of their bulletins now. That to me is looking just as biased as Fox.

    In other words, she's like every other politician. Nothing new there. And seriously: the daily stories coming out of the FBI are being disputed!!!!


    On the other hand, Trump hasn't released his tax returns, doesn't pay federal income tax, has repeatedly lied about his own positions despite there being tape that 100% contradicts him, has used foreign materials for his own businesses while railing about jobs being moved overseas, and has praised Putin. Yeah, Donald sure is trustworthy. 8-|

    CNN was smart NOT to report on the FBI leaks, many of which turned have turned out to be wrong.

    Big OOOOOOPS here: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2016/11/04/fox-news-apologizes-clinton-report/93300254/

    The issue is that the conservatives in this country, for a long time now, have trafficked in misinformation and conspiracy theories that there's no turning back.

    Just a simple example: Trump jumped on the whole BIRTHER issue, which was a joke, and then backtracked and said he was just "exposing" the truth. And his followers just shrugged it off. No amount of evidence can sway conservatives. From the age of the earth to a birth certificate.

  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    edited November 2016 Posts: 4,554
    Germanlady wrote: »
    Interesting view, no?


    No.

    It's more BS propaganda.

    I am old enough to remember the crap coming out 24 years ago about Bill Clinton and how he was going to turn the U.S into a "Communist Country." There was a documentary called The Clinton Chronicles that made its way around local TV stations.

    Nothing new. The Right traffics in conspiracy theories and propaganda. Just like Obama was trained in a terrorist school, was secretly Muslim, was not born in the U.S. Blah blah blah blah blah.




  • GermanladyGermanlady
    Posts: 6,601
    Aha, oh well. @Brady - chem trails and Harp are facts . Of course, you wont find truth in Wikipedia.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    edited November 2016 Posts: 5,985
    @TripAces, sadly, too many people can't discern fact from fiction anymore. It is, at least partly, Murdoch's fault.
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    Germanlady wrote: »
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    Germanlady wrote: »
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    @jetsetwilly, I think it's all down to which shows you watch, as impartiality varies greatly in some spots.

    For CNN you can't go wrong with Don Lemon or Anderson Cooper, and for Fox Megyn Kelly and Bill O'Reilly have really improved as impartial commentators in my eyes over time. Fox is largely a joke of a network, especially their Fox & Friends news blocks, but there's some good commentators on there if you're looking for them that call it as they see it both ways, left or right.

    Sometimes I turn on Hannity just to have a laugh at his expense, as you need the cartoon character commentators too to balance things out.

    Brady, a big channel like CNN will ALWAYS only report, what is allowed and system true. Its a Make Belief channel like all the others. No mainstream media channel is free to report as they wish. Anderson and Co report, what is written for them on a piece of paper. Nothing else. You can wipe your cute little arse with that AND with their news. Well - mostly.

    Thanks for your opinion, @Germanlady, I really needed to hear another. As I stated, there's an obvious bias in a lot of news, but the alternative is watching none of it, and that's not very sensible either. It's quite easy to watch something and tell when you're being led on, and as an American one of the few rights I have is to interpret what I see and hear as either true or false. Do they have that in Germany, or did Merkel take that away too? :|

    As so often, you Go the easy Route. There is a third Option. I can only repeat myself over and over. The net is Full of vids like above, that you guys probably dont watch to not burst your bubble. People in the know, WHO are Not afraid any longer to speak their truth. Once you have a clearer picture of how it all Connects, its rather easy to Tell truth from bs. Whatever source you are watching.

    Yes I agree. God bless the internet and Social Media. It throws another perspective onto the election, rather than the spoon-fed biased crap that CNN and Fox are currently heavily embroiled in.

    If you watch CNN, its a done deal - Clinton has won, and if you watch Fox, its a done deal - Trump has won.

    Social media is often wrong.

    https://www.buzzfeed.com/craigsilverman/how-macedonia-became-a-global-hub-for-pro-trump-misinfo?utm_term=.kjABLKMaB#.sb6YPN6zY
  • BeatlesSansEarmuffsBeatlesSansEarmuffs
    edited November 2016 Posts: 3,564
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    What's clear is that any information we read, no matter who is comes from needs to be vetted, because it's impossible to be sure about most anything these days simply because so much is out there and overexaggeration and sensationalism are big business. You just have to use your head and when something doesn't feel right, don't pursue it, and if you hear something that seems true, check it around with other sources to spot bias.

    It also helps not to be a sanctimonious jackass who thinks they are huffing the secret truths of the universe from a plastic bag that nobody else has access to.

    But sometimes we ask for too much.

    0Brady, you're writing too much stuff in your excellent film analyses over at the Community Bondathan thread. Nobody's got the time to read it all. For you, a really pretty-sounding latin-influenced 12 minute version of "Sad-Eyed Lady of the Lowlands." ;)

  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    edited November 2016 Posts: 4,554
    http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-1106-lopez-democracy-20161104-story.html

    yep.

    And who's to blame for this?

    It's the same side that created Timothy McVeigh. The same side that courts white supremacists and the KKK. The same side that holds hands with the NRA. The same side that claims the President isn't even an American. The same side that wants to limit a woman's right to discuss her own healthcare with own doctor. The same side that celebrates armed resistance and takeover of federal lands while having a sh*tfit over a Black Lives Matter movement. The same side that claims women can't get pregnant when being raped. The same side that wants creationist viewpoints taught in science classes. The same side that poisons drinking water and then shrugs it off. The same side that closes bridges as "political payback." The same side that outs CIA agents who are married to critics of their bogus agenda. The same side that lies about and manipulates intelligence to justify wars that cost us trillions of dollars and thousands of lives. The side that complains about "illegals" entering the country and not paying taxes while, at the same time, supporting a Presidential candidate who doesn't pay taxes.
  • BeatlesSansEarmuffsBeatlesSansEarmuffs
    edited November 2016 Posts: 3,564
    @Trip Aces: exactly right. For you, Peter Paul & Mary singing an early Dylan composition, "When the Ship Comes In" It's less than 2 1/2 minutes and the lyrics are shown on screen, so everybody should have the time to watch this one.

    "And the ship's wise men will remind you once again
    That the whole wide world is watching."
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited November 2016 Posts: 23,883
    What's with all this Dylan stuff? Can't we get some variety? What about some JLO or Jay Z. They're doing the rounds these days from what I've heard.

    Like I told you, next time out, it's Kanye. He's laying the groundwork already now through his rapper minions.

    For the next three days, this one is what's required:


    After the election, we need this:
  • jetsetwillyjetsetwilly
    edited November 2016 Posts: 3,279
    TripAces wrote: »
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »

    How exactly is HRC dangerous? From the standpoint of what she can control, within the Oval Office, she poses no threat and we will likely see more of what we've seen the past 8 years.

    CNN is a real news organization. Unfortunately, like most news, they give in to some sensationalism. Fox, on the other hand, is pure propaganda.

    I think she is dangerous in the fact that she has been caught out lying, covering her tracks, being misleading - and now being under another investigation by the FBI. The whiff of corruption is all around her. The daily stories that are leaking are not good in any way, and I'm guessing there are bigger things to be revealed by the FBI. The bleaching of emails, and her smug remarks of `What? Wiping it with some kind of cloth?'

    A person behaving that way is not fit for office. These are definitely not positive traits, whichever way you try and spin it in her favour, and she is definitely no Obama either.

    As for CNN, why are they not reporting any of the daily Wikileaks, or the FBI investigation? They are not mentioning it in any of their bulletins now. That to me is looking just as biased as Fox.

    In other words, she's like every other politician. Nothing new there. And seriously: the daily stories coming out of the FBI are being disputed!!!!


    On the other hand, Trump hasn't released his tax returns, doesn't pay federal income tax, has repeatedly lied about his own positions despite there being tape that 100% contradicts him, has used foreign materials for his own businesses while railing about jobs being moved overseas, and has praised Putin. Yeah, Donald sure is trustworthy. 8-|

    CNN was smart NOT to report on the FBI leaks, many of which turned have turned out to be wrong.

    Big OOOOOOPS here: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2016/11/04/fox-news-apologizes-clinton-report/93300254/

    The issue is that the conservatives in this country, for a long time now, have trafficked in misinformation and conspiracy theories that there's no turning back.

    Just a simple example: Trump jumped on the whole BIRTHER issue, which was a joke, and then backtracked and said he was just "exposing" the truth. And his followers just shrugged it off. No amount of evidence can sway conservatives. From the age of the earth to a birth certificate.

    I'm not disputing Trump either. They are equally untrustworthy. It's just that some people are willing to look at Trump's faults, but are blind to Clinton's troubles.
  • jetsetwillyjetsetwilly
    Posts: 3,279
    echo wrote: »
    @TripAces, sadly, too many people can't discern fact from fiction anymore. It is, at least partly, Murdoch's fault.
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    Germanlady wrote: »
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    Germanlady wrote: »
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    @jetsetwilly, I think it's all down to which shows you watch, as impartiality varies greatly in some spots.

    For CNN you can't go wrong with Don Lemon or Anderson Cooper, and for Fox Megyn Kelly and Bill O'Reilly have really improved as impartial commentators in my eyes over time. Fox is largely a joke of a network, especially their Fox & Friends news blocks, but there's some good commentators on there if you're looking for them that call it as they see it both ways, left or right.

    Sometimes I turn on Hannity just to have a laugh at his expense, as you need the cartoon character commentators too to balance things out.

    Brady, a big channel like CNN will ALWAYS only report, what is allowed and system true. Its a Make Belief channel like all the others. No mainstream media channel is free to report as they wish. Anderson and Co report, what is written for them on a piece of paper. Nothing else. You can wipe your cute little arse with that AND with their news. Well - mostly.

    Thanks for your opinion, @Germanlady, I really needed to hear another. As I stated, there's an obvious bias in a lot of news, but the alternative is watching none of it, and that's not very sensible either. It's quite easy to watch something and tell when you're being led on, and as an American one of the few rights I have is to interpret what I see and hear as either true or false. Do they have that in Germany, or did Merkel take that away too? :|

    As so often, you Go the easy Route. There is a third Option. I can only repeat myself over and over. The net is Full of vids like above, that you guys probably dont watch to not burst your bubble. People in the know, WHO are Not afraid any longer to speak their truth. Once you have a clearer picture of how it all Connects, its rather easy to Tell truth from bs. Whatever source you are watching.

    Yes I agree. God bless the internet and Social Media. It throws another perspective onto the election, rather than the spoon-fed biased crap that CNN and Fox are currently heavily embroiled in.

    If you watch CNN, its a done deal - Clinton has won, and if you watch Fox, its a done deal - Trump has won.

    Social media is often wrong.

    https://www.buzzfeed.com/craigsilverman/how-macedonia-became-a-global-hub-for-pro-trump-misinfo?utm_term=.kjABLKMaB#.sb6YPN6zY

    Bottom line, I wouldn't really trust the media anymore with these elections full stop. The people will speak come election day, and that result will be all you'll need to know then.

    No doubt there will be some backlash from the media, whoever wins.

  • BeatlesSansEarmuffsBeatlesSansEarmuffs
    edited November 2016 Posts: 3,564
    bondjames wrote: »
    What's with all this Dylan stuff? Can't we get some variety?

    All the Dylan stuff is because Dylan just recently won the Nobel Prize for literature. Yes, really. As soon as Jay Z wins the Nobel Prize for anything I'll start posting some of his stuff. And in point of fact, a few days ago, I posted a Steve Goodman song ("The Dying Cubs Fan's Last Request") to congratulate the Cubbies for winning the World Series. Finally, I've been posting Joan Baez versions, Peter Paul & Mary versions, etc., so that a little variety could still be had. Lotta people have covered Dylan! In just a few days, we'll all be singing this one...and just to lure @Birdleson back onto this thread, I'm going with the Grateful Dead's version of "It's All Over Now, Baby Blue" (There are a lot of performances of this song by the Dead online, including one with Joan Baez & one with Dylan himself. This one's from San Francisco in 1983, maybe @birdleson himself was in the audience at the time. Heck, maybe I was too!)

    You must leave now
    Take what you need you think will last
    But whatever you wish to keep
    You better grab it fast
    Yonder stands your orphan with his gun
    Crying like a fire in the sun
    Look out, the saints are coming through
    And it's all over now, baby blue

    The highway is for gamblers
    Better use your sense
    Take what you have gathered
    From coincidence
    The empty handed painter from your streets
    Is drawing crazy patterns on your sheets
    This sky, too, is folding under you
    And it's all over now, baby blue

    All your seasick sailors
    They are rowing home
    Your empty handed army
    Is all going home
    Your lover, who just walked out the door
    Has taken all his blankets from the floor
    The carpet too, is moving under you
    And it's all over now, baby blue

    Leave your stepping stones behind
    Now, something that calls for you
    Forget the dead you've left
    They will not follow you
    The vagabond who's rapping at your door
    Is standing in the clothes that you once wore
    Strike another match, go start anew
    And it's all over now, baby blue
  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    edited November 2016 Posts: 11,119
    Four years ago in a very similar topic, leading to the elections between Romney and Obama......atmosphere was much better. I recall talking about issues back then.

    Regarding educated and non-educated people. This has nothing to do with 'arrogance'. It's just a demographic fact that on average -and I'm not saying ALL people- who vote for a right-wing populist party.....are simply less educated. Denying that or walk over such a demographic fact is in itself a sign of arrogance.

    Same thing with that 'basket of deplorables'. Not all Trump supporters are 'deplorables'. In fact, I like to highlight president Obama's speech today in North-Carolina. We should have respect for many of the Trump supporters. And it's bullocks to say that all Trump supporters are racists. Nonsense! @BondJames for instance is a fine, decent man. Butttt, if you ask me on what party a racist would vote for? Then it most likely won't be for the Democratic Party....or Clinton.
  • jetsetwillyjetsetwilly
    Posts: 3,279
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    Four years ago in the very similar topic, leading to the elections between Romney and Obama......atmosphere was much better. I recall talking about issues back then.
    This has to be the dirtiest, nastiest election campaign I've ever seen. Both candidates are despicable, but what amazes me more is the amount of people who slag off Trump, and yet in the same breath think Clinton is great.

  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    edited November 2016 Posts: 11,119
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    Four years ago in the very similar topic, leading to the elections between Romney and Obama......atmosphere was much better. I recall talking about issues back then.
    This has to be the dirtiest, nastiest election campaign I've ever seen. Both candidates are despicable, but what amazes me more is the amount of people who slag off Trump, and yet in the same breath think Clinton is great.

    Uhm, I am a Clinton supporter.

    I personally think the biggest problem is language. While Donald Trump thinks it's OK to be 'less politically correct', and use whatever language to offend people, Hillary mostly stays cleaner in the field of 'verbal language'. While calling people 'deplorables' is wrong, she at least firmly apoligized for it. In the meanwhile there's no apoligy in Trump's vocabulary.

    Trump succeeded in one thing: Making discussing impossible. Because he wants that. He wants more political incorrectness. I don't. I want political correctness. At least in debates. I don't want to hear language like 'nasty woman', 'miss piggy' and other faul language. It's as simple as that.

    At work we had this discussion. It has become impossible to have a nuanced debate about the issues with right-wing populists....or supporters of them (well, I must say @BondJames to me should be an example for many Trump supporters, as with him at least I had some discussions about issues). So that's why the last four weeks I stayed away from this topic.
  • jetsetwillyjetsetwilly
    edited November 2016 Posts: 3,279
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    Four years ago in the very similar topic, leading to the elections between Romney and Obama......atmosphere was much better. I recall talking about issues back then.
    This has to be the dirtiest, nastiest election campaign I've ever seen. Both candidates are despicable, but what amazes me more is the amount of people who slag off Trump, and yet in the same breath think Clinton is great.

    Uhm, I am a Clinton supporter.
    And do you think she is great?

    Do you think she is 100% trustworthy (forgetting Trump and all that is wrong with him for a second)....?
  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    edited November 2016 Posts: 11,119
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    jetsetwilly wrote: »
    Gustav_Graves wrote: »
    Four years ago in the very similar topic, leading to the elections between Romney and Obama......atmosphere was much better. I recall talking about issues back then.
    This has to be the dirtiest, nastiest election campaign I've ever seen. Both candidates are despicable, but what amazes me more is the amount of people who slag off Trump, and yet in the same breath think Clinton is great.

    Uhm, I am a Clinton supporter.
    And do you think she is great?

    Do you think she is 100% trustworthy (forgetting Trump and all that is wrong with him for a second)....?

    I admire Hillary yes. One should read the very critical biography written by Carl Bernstein, 'A Woman In Power'. And at the same time obviously reading Gwenda Blair's biography about Trump (here's a nice piece http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/04/donald-trump-2016-campaign-biography-psychology-history-barrett-hurt-dantiono-blair-obrien-213835 ). Once you see both Trump and Clinton in the light of their personal lifes from being little kids until their presidential candidacy's this year, you start to understand them better.

    Clinton trustworthy? Off course not. But at least I understand in what kind of troubled family she grew up and how she became the woman she is now. Her offensive, agressive dad, constantly bullying her mother and her two brothers. And she always had to 'get up and don't look back, because life isn't fair'. Hillary had a more difficult youth than Trump had. Trump was born as a rich kid. That gives an entire different perspective on people around you.

    Whereas Clinton fought for kids with severe disabilities, or brought racial inequality under attention when she was president of a student board, Trump merely took over his father's kingdom.

    Having read both extensively about the lives of Clinton and Trump, I can most definately say that I admire Hillary Clinton much more. She's not a charmer, but she has a proven record at helping people with problems. I prefer women who had to work enormously hard to become rich, instead of men like Trump who had a more or less guaranteed life as a billionaire when he was born.
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