Music in SPECTRE

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  • Posts: 501
    Murdock wrote: »
    0iker0 wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    0iker0 wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Hopefully Newman will compose all the music this time instead of casually lifting snippets of Arnold's CR score.

    Casually?

    Like it wouldn't go unnoticed.
    Yet it was explicitly in our faces.

    Exactly, which is why I hope Newman composes all the music this time around. Lifting music from Previous Bond films is pretty lazy.

    What did he lift for Skyfall? Bond Theme. Yes, what more? Why do you think he's going to lift Arnold's best score?

    Why couldn't Newman be bothered to do his own arrangements? The Bond theme too good for him to rearrange as the other previous composers? And CR is far from Arnold's Best score. TND is his best score.




    It's close but it's not the same arrangements.

    And Casino Royale's score is superb. By far his best. For me, the Arnold-Bond scores go like this: CR, TWINE, QOS, TND and DAD

    The Soundtrack Version differs from the Film Version. Watch the DB5 reveal. The CR version is used then when the DB5 leaves it turns into the Soundtrack version.
    About 1:40 in the video.




    Again, compare them if you like. It's not the same arrangement it's exactly as the album version (Breadcrumbs). They're really similar, but not the same. Newman's is a bit more Monty Normanish if you like. Really similar, not a rip-off.
  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,145
    @0iker0 here is the version as heard in the film. I know. I've watched the film and I own all the soundtracks.

    Film Version of Breadcrumbs.
    http://picosong.com/VNKD/

  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    Murdock wrote: »
    0iker0 wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Hopefully Newman will compose all the music this time instead of casually lifting snippets of Arnold's CR score.

    Casually?

    Like it wouldn't go unnoticed.
    Yet it was explicitly in our faces.

    Exactly, which is why I hope Newman composes all the music this time around. Lifting music from Previous Bond films is pretty lazy.

    What did he lift for Skyfall? Bond Theme. Yes, what more? Why do you think he's going to lift Arnold's best score?

    Why couldn't Newman be bothered to do his own arrangements? He too good to rearrange it as the other previous composers? And CR is far from Arnold's Best score. TND is his best score.

    Slighlty off-topic: I don't know about you, but I can't help but find hilarious that in Breadcrumbs Newman rearranged Arnold rearrengement of The James Bond theme, which is itself John Barry's rearrangement of Monty Norman's rearrangement of his own melody "Bad Sign, Good Sign"
  • Posts: 501
    Murdock wrote: »
    @0iker0 here is the version as heard in the film. I know. I've watched the film and I own all the soundtracks.

    Film Version of Breadcrumbs.
    http://picosong.com/VNKD/

    Surprise surprise, but I've watched the film too. And another one, I've got the soundtracks too. They are really similar, but not the same. You've got the scene in the video I put, and it's slightly different to the Arnold rearrengement.

  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,145
    0iker0 wrote: »
    Surprise surprise, but I've watched the film too. And another one, I've got the soundtracks too. They are really similar, but not the same. You've got the scene in the video I put, and it's slightly different to the Arnold rearrengement.

    The link I just left is the same version as heard in the film.
  • Posts: 501
    Murdock wrote: »
    0iker0 wrote: »
    Surprise surprise, but I've watched the film too. And another one, I've got the soundtracks too. They are really similar, but not the same. You've got the scene in the video I put, and it's slightly different to the Arnold rearrengement.

    The link I just left is the same version as heard in the film.

    The video I left is an extract from the film.

  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,145
    0iker0 wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    0iker0 wrote: »
    Surprise surprise, but I've watched the film too. And another one, I've got the soundtracks too. They are really similar, but not the same. You've got the scene in the video I put, and it's slightly different to the Arnold rearrengement.

    The link I just left is the same version as heard in the film.

    The video I left is an extract from the film.

    I know, I saw it. Newman still recycled Arnold's cue. 8-|
  • Posts: 501
    Murdock wrote: »
    0iker0 wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    0iker0 wrote: »
    Surprise surprise, but I've watched the film too. And another one, I've got the soundtracks too. They are really similar, but not the same. You've got the scene in the video I put, and it's slightly different to the Arnold rearrengement.

    The link I just left is the same version as heard in the film.

    The video I left is an extract from the film.

    I know, I saw it. Newman still recycled Arnold's cue. 8-|

    It's similar, not the same. Similar, not the same. I can repeat it as many times as you need. Similar, not the same.

  • Posts: 1,552
    @0iker0 @Murdock Guys, this is going nowhere - can you agree to disagree, otherwise you'll be back and forthing all night...
  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,145
    I rest my case. :)
  • Posts: 501
    JCRendle wrote: »
    @0iker0 @Murdock Guys, this is going nowhere - can you agree to disagree, otherwise you'll be back and forthing all night...

    Not all night, Real Sociedad's match starts in 15 mins and I have to watch that. I'd continue tomorrow.

    But, yep, if you like I'll agree to disagree.

  • MalloryMallory Do mosquitoes have friends?
    Posts: 1,711
    Skyfall was made... Thriftily, to put it nicely. We know Newman's orchestra was cut a few times prior to recording... So what we have is essentially a reduced score. I would guess the resuse of the Arnold cue was because it was cheaper to licence than record a new one. I doubt Newman wouldnt come up with his own.

    Given Spectre has reportedly such a high budget one hopes some of that goes to the music department.
  • Posts: 1,552
    It would be interesting to hear a re-orchestration of the Skyfall score, as he intended it with the full orchestra.
  • MansfieldMansfield Where the hell have you been?
    Posts: 1,262
    I should preface this post by saying I agree with most of what @Getafix has posted. That is worthy of celebration.

    The part that I particularly like in his posts is how hypnotic Thomas Newman's soundtrack is for Skyfall. I'm certainly not a musical expert, but I'm an avid soundtrack listener. Most of the music I listen to comes from scores. When I listen to the soundtrack of Skyfall, I don't feel the same emotion in almost every track as I do when it's complemented by the movie itself. The only track I feel the same connection to the music as I do in the movie is for the track, "Mother," which acts as a poignant memorial to M. Otherwise, there is a distinct disconnection between the music and the corresponding pictures. Part of what makes John Barry's soundtrack so endearing and legendary is the fact that it contains all of the emotion behind the scene. When you listen to his music, you can close your eyes and feel the same way you do when you watch the movie. David Arnold was a worthy successor to John Barry in many ways, especially with his most recent contributions. But even with his early work, as soon as Tomorrow Never Dies begins, the music carries all of the bravado we desire as Bond enthusiasts. Now that he has been passed over for a second consecutive film, it's time Thomas Newman do right by the roots of the series and produce a memorable Bond soundtrack.

    The roots of the series are more important to the industry than Thomas Newman may wish to comprehend. Orchestral soundtracks were not as prevalent as they are today. More often than not, John Williams gets credit for innovating the industry with timeless soundtracks from Jaws and Star Wars. John Barry predates those works. Perhaps even more significantly, his work was created for a character such as Bond, which easily could have been viewed as taboo during the time of its entrance in theaters. His soundtracks provided a classy and sophisticated vibe to what could have otherwise been dismissed as racey. In a way, John Barry and his contemporaries are very well responsible for Thomas Newman's platform and that's why I think he should delivery a more traditional soundtrack. If I hear a new interpretation of John Barry's timeless 007 theme that has not been used since Moonraker or any similar adaptation of old classics into his work, he will be met with nothing but praise from me.
  • Mark_HazzardMark_Hazzard Classified
    Posts: 127
    Yes, this bothered me as well. Hamlisch, Karmen and Arnold have made their own arrangement/interpretation of the Bond theme. Newman more or less copied it, which struck me as 'lazy' as well. Even Arnold doens't literally copy his own arrangements for each movie (he does with Sherlock, granted since this is a tv series).

    Missed opportunity.

    @0iker0: Newman isn't mediocre. In fact: his music for Shawshank is beautiful! To me that's even more reason why I was disappointed with Skyfall. Now I don't blame Newman solely for this, this Adele's song came along late, which makes it difficult to incorporate the 'theme' into the soundtrack. But as I said previously, I didn't find Skyfall's soundtrack uplifting and contributing to the movie. I might have to do with the type of movie, hence I'm not sure whether he will deliver for Spectre. We'll have to wait and see, or listen actually, and it might turn out all fine after all.
  • dominicgreenedominicgreene The Eternal QOS Defender
    edited April 2015 Posts: 1,756
    Yes, this bothered me as well. Hamlisch, Karmen and Arnold have made their own arrangement/interpretation of the Bond theme. Newman more or less copied it, which struck me as 'lazy' as well. Even Arnold doens't literally copy his own arrangements for each movie (he does with Sherlock, granted since this is a tv series).

    Missed opportunity.

    @0iker0: Newman isn't mediocre. In fact: his music for Shawshank is beautiful! To me that's even more reason why I was disappointed with Skyfall. Now I don't blame Newman solely for this, this Adele's song came along late, which makes it difficult to incorporate the 'theme' into the soundtrack. But as I said previously, I didn't find Skyfall's soundtrack uplifting and contributing to the movie. I might have to do with the type of movie, hence I'm not sure whether he will deliver for Spectre. We'll have to wait and see, or listen actually, and it might turn out all fine after all.

    I just think Newman has the wrong "feel" for the Craig era. To me, Craig's era should come accross like "You know my name" amongst the other Bond themes, if that makes sense. His Bond themes need more of an orchestral darkness, mixed with bits of electric guitar. Something like Zimmer's INCEPTION would have been perfect

    This is an example of what Craig's Bond needs (0:55)


    Also this, with the Bond theme encorporated (little bit at 3min22)


    What a huge missed opportunity. Hopefully Nolan will direct one day.
  • SirHilaryBraySirHilaryBray Scotland
    Posts: 2,138
    I think gentlemen from the music already over the teaser trailer we will have stronger Newman soundtrack on Spectre. I did like Newmans piece for Shanghai in Skyfall.
  • Posts: 1,552
    I think gentlemen from the music already over the teaser trailer we will have stronger Newman soundtrack on Spectre. I did like Newmans piece for Shanghai in Skyfall.

    Not that I'm saying Newman's work on SPECTRE won't be strong, but I believe trailer music is rarely produced by a films main composer. Certainly with previous Bond trailers, they've used an external company.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,105
    Yep. Newman had nothing to do with the music used in the teaser trailer.
  • Yes, this botered me as well. Hamlisch, Karmen and Arnold have made their own arrangement/interpretation of the Bond theme. Newman more or less copied it, which struck me as 'lazy' as well. Even Arnold doens't literally copy his own arrangements for each movie (he does with Sherlock, granted since this is a tv series).

    Missed opportunity.

    @0iker0: Newman isn't mediocre. In fact: his music for Shawshank is beautiful! To me that's even more reason why I was disappointed with Skyfall. Now I don't blame Newman solely for this, this Adele's song came along late, which makes it difficult to incorporate the 'theme' into the soundtrack. But as I said previously, I didn't find Skyfall's soundtrack uplifting and contributing to the movie. I might have to do with the type of movie, hence I'm not sure whether he will deliver for Spectre. We'll have to wait and see, or listen actually, and it might turn out all fine after all.

    I just think Newman has the wrong "feel" for the Craig era. To me, Craig's era should come accross like "You know my name" amongst the other Bond themes, if that makes sense. His Bond themes need more of an orchestral darkness, mixed with bits of electric guitar. Something like Zimmer's INCEPTION would have been perfect

    This is an example of what Craig's Bond needs (0:55)


    Also this, with the Bond theme encorporated (little bit at 3min22)


    What a huge missed opportunity. Hopefully Nolan will direct one day.

    Reminds me a lot of the sound of the QOS soundtrack
  • @dominicgreene I completely agree. I really think that the Inception score is the prime example of what the Craig era sound should be. There were a few tracks in Skyfall where Newman had the right idea, namely Day Wasted, New Digs, and some of the Scotland action pieces.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 6,581
    Has it been 100% confirmed that Newman is doing the score?
  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,145
    talos7 wrote: »
    Has it been 100% confirmed that Newman is doing the score?
    With Mendes directing, Newman's pretty much bound to the chair.

  • MalloryMallory Do mosquitoes have friends?
    Posts: 1,711
    Murdock wrote: »
    talos7 wrote: »
    Has it been 100% confirmed that Newman is doing the score?
    With Mendes directing, Newman's pretty much bound to the chair.

    Yes, announced by Mendes himself at the December press conference.

    I really dig Newmans SF score so cant wait for Spectre.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,105
    talos7 wrote: »
    Has it been 100% confirmed that Newman is doing the score?

    Yes. Mendes mentioned it at the SP press reveal in December.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 6,581
    Thanks
  • TreefingersTreefingers Isthmus City, Republic of Isthmus
    Posts: 191
    Newman did a good job in Skyfall, but I found some of the final pieces somewhat anticlimatic.
  • MurdockMurdock Mr. 2000
    Posts: 16,145
    I found half the score to be Okay. The rest I didn't care for.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,105
    Jurassic World is a good example of the frequency of using the Jurassic Park theme music. Newman could learn a great deal from that in using the Bond theme for SP.
  • Posts: 7,652
    doubleoego wrote: »
    Jurassic World is a good example of the frequency of using the Jurassic Park theme music. Newman could learn a great deal from that in using the Bond theme for SP.

    Wasn't it coincidentally the same composer from the Incredibles and the one who created the new sound for the ST franchise?? There is an composer I would like to see working for EON.

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