Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (30th June 2023)

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  • Posts: 669
    mtm wrote: »
    I think probably all of those except for the first one. It's James Mangold, I think he's too good to be doing anything heartless.

    I completely agree. Even if it doesn't turn out "good," I find it hard to believe that most fans will think of it as a cynical cash grab. Worst case scenario, it will be a well-intentioned, lovingly made failure. But with Mangold at the helm, I genuinely think it will be a well-intentioned, lovingly made success.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 4,904
    Please please for the love of God lets not have a "strong female character" castrate Jones and one up him for the whole movie. I hope it's more inline with what I saw in NTTD a real fleshed out female character.

    The other hope they keep the movie fun and light-hearted like the previous adventures. Somehow my faith is shaken but I will be glad to be proven wrong.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,050
    thedove wrote: »
    Please please for the love of God lets not have a "strong female character" castrate Jones and one up him for the whole movie. I hope it's more inline with what I saw in NTTD a real fleshed out female character.

    The other hope they keep the movie fun and light-hearted like the previous adventures. Somehow my faith is shaken but I will be glad to be proven wrong.

    You might be worried as Phoebe Waller-Bridge was involved in both projects. But it could honestly go either way at this point.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    edited June 2022 Posts: 8,000
    I think it would be fun to see Indy be taken down a peg by a woman. Maybe even be accused of child rape, just to show how woke the film is.
  • If I never hear the word woke again it will be too soon.
  • Posts: 1,545
    I think it would be fun to see Indy be taken down a peg by a woman. Maybe even be accused of child rape, just to show how woke the film is.

    You mean, how realistic ?
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited June 2022 Posts: 14,861
    I fear Makeshift's point is being missed slightly.

    Anyway: exactly one year to go until we see this film!
  • Posts: 1,545
    mtm wrote: »
    I fear Makeshift's point is being missed slightly.

    Anyway: exactly one year to go until we see this film!

    One year to go ? Really. Or, did we all already see it, but forgot what we saw because we all traveled in the time travel machine but, being under the spell of someone or other, forgot it all ? Oh...time travel stories do get complicated.
  • Posts: 313

    There's this IG pages which has some interesting content and recently a new bts image surfaced.
    One of the comments states that ''it's a cryptex which contains infos about where to find Die Glocke, a machine that can alter time. Wyatt (Toby Jones) stile that from Shroeder (Mads) a nazi scientist. Nazis want to change the past by travelling back in time and writing a new end for WWII and win. And then the time travel happens
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489

    There's this IG pages which has some interesting content and recently a new bts image surfaced.
    One of the comments states that ''it's a cryptex which contains infos about where to find Die Glocke, a machine that can alter time. Wyatt (Toby Jones) stile that from Shroeder (Mads) a nazi scientist. Nazis want to change the past by travelling back in time and writing a new end for WWII and win. And then the time travel happens

    Looks like they succeeded.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    edited July 2022 Posts: 7,889
    Interesting…
    (The conspiracy theory )
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Die_Glocke_(conspiracy_theory)

    Die Glocke (conspiracy theory)
    Article Talk
    Language
    Watch
    Edit
    Die Glocke (German: [diː ˈɡlɔkə], "The Bell") was a purported top-secret Nazi scientific technological device, secret weapon, or Wunderwaffe. First described by Polish journalist and author Igor Witkowski in Prawda o Wunderwaffe (2000), it was later popularized by military journalist and author Nick Cook, who associated it with Nazi occultism, antigravity, and free energy suppression research. Mainstream reviewers have criticized claims about Die Glocke as being pseudoscientific, recycled rumors, and a hoax. Die Glocke and other alleged Nazi "miracle weapons" have been dramatized in video games, television shows, and novels.


    Artist's impression of Die Glocke.
    History
    Edit


    Polish author Igor Witkowski.
    In his 2001 book The Hunt for Zero Point, author Nick Cook identified claims about Die Glocke as having originated in the 2000 Polish book Prawda o Wunderwaffe (The Truth About The Wonder Weapon) by Igor Witkowski. Cook described Witkowski's claims of a device called "The Bell" engineered by Nazi scientists that was "a glowing, rotating contraption" rumored to have "some kind of antigravitational effect", be a "time machine", or part of an "SS antigravity program" for a flying saucer.[1]

    According to Cook, Die Glocke was bell-shaped, about 12 feet (3.7 m) high and 9 feet (2.7 m) in diameter, and incorporated "two high-speed, counter-rotating cylinders filled with a purplish, liquid metallic-looking substance that was supposed to be highly radioactive, code-named 'Xerum 525.'" Cook recounts claims that "scientists and technicians who worked on the bell and who did not die of its effects were wiped out by the SS at the close of the war, and the device was removed to an unknown location".[2] Cook proposed that SS official Hans Kammler later secretly traded this technology to the U.S. military in exchange for his freedom.[1] Fringe theorists have suggested that a concrete ring called "The Henge" near the Wenceslaus mine built in 1943 or 1944 and vaguely resembling Stonehenge was "used as a launch pad for the Bell". According to writer Jason Colavito, the structure is merely the remains of an ordinary industrial cooling tower.[3]

    Cook's publication introduced the topic in English without critically discussing the subject.[4] More recently, historian Eric Kurlander has discussed the topic in his 2017 book on Nazi esotericism Hitler's Monsters: A Supernatural History of the Third Reich. According to reviewer Julian Strube, Kurlander "cites from the reservoir of post-war conspiracy theories" and "heavily relies on sensationalist accounts...mixing up contemporary sources with post-war sensationalist literature, half-truths, and fictitious accounts".[5]

    According to Salon reviewer Kurt Kleiner, "It's a story that strains credulity. But unless we're after cheap laughs, our hope when we pick up a book like this is that the author will, against the odds, build a careful, reasonable and convincing case. Cook isn't that author". Kleiner criticized Cook's work as "ferreting out minor inconsistencies and odd, ambiguous details which he tries to puff up into proof", characterized the process of evaluating Cook's claims as "untangling science from pseudo-science", and concluded that "what is instructive about the book is the insight we get into how conspiracy theories seduce otherwise reasonable people".[1]

    Skeptical author Robert Sheaffer criticized Cook's book as "a classic example of how to spin an exciting yarn based on almost nothing. He visits places where it is rumored that secret UFO and antigravity research is going on...and writes about what he feels and imagines, although he discovers nothing more tangible than unsubstantiated rumors". Sheaffer notes that claims about Die Glocke are circulated by UFOlogists and conspiracy-oriented authors such as Jim Marrs, Joseph P. Farrell, and antigravity proponent John Dering.[2]

    Jason Colavito wrote that Witkowski's claims were "recycled" from 1960s rumors of Nazi occult science first published in Morning of the Magicians, and describes Die Glocke as "a device few outside of fringe culture think actually existed. In short, it looks to be a hoax, or at least a wild exaggeration".[3] Author Brian Dunning states that Morning of the Magicians helped promote belief in Die Glocke and Nazi occultism, and its absence in the historical record make it "increasingly unlikely that anything like it actually existed". According to Dunning, "all we have in the way of evidence is a third-hand anecdotal account of something that's desperately implausible, backed up by neither evidence nor even a corroborating account".[6]

    Author and historian Robert F. Dorr characterizes Die Glocke as among "the most imaginative of the conspiracy theories" that arose in post-World War II years, and typical of the fantasies of magical German weapons often popularized in pulp magazines such as The Police Gazette.[7]

    Some theories circulating on Internet conspiracy sites claim that Die Glocke is located in a Nazi gold train that is buried in a tunnel beneath a mountain in Poland.[8] Duncan Roads, editor of Nexus magazine, has pointed out that the "Nazis on the Moon trope" is linked to wild speculations about Nazi anti-gravitational technology, such as Witkowski's Die Glocke.[9]

    Journalist Patrick J. Kiger wrote that German propaganda of fictional Wunderwaffen combined with the secrecy surrounding actual advanced technology such as the V-2 rocket captured at war's end by the U.S. military helped spawn "sensational book-length exposes, web sites, and legions of enthusiasts who revel in rumors of science fiction-like weapons supposedly invented by Hitler’s scientists". According to Kiger, Die Glocke is a popular example of such legends and speculation, citing former aerospace scientist David Myhra's contention that if antigravity devices actually existed, the Germans, desperate to stop the Allies' advance, would have used them.[10]


  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    edited July 2022 Posts: 7,889
    Delete
  • Posts: 313
    talos7 wrote: »
    Interesting…
    (The conspiracy theory )
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Die_Glocke_(conspiracy_theory)

    Die Glocke (conspiracy theory)
    Article Talk
    Language
    Watch
    Edit
    Die Glocke (German: [diː ˈɡlɔkə], "The Bell") was a purported top-secret Nazi scientific technological device, secret weapon, or Wunderwaffe. First described by Polish journalist and author Igor Witkowski in Prawda o Wunderwaffe (2000), it was later popularized by military journalist and author Nick Cook, who associated it with Nazi occultism, antigravity, and free energy suppression research. Mainstream reviewers have criticized claims about Die Glocke as being pseudoscientific, recycled rumors, and a hoax. Die Glocke and other alleged Nazi "miracle weapons" have been dramatized in video games, television shows, and novels.


    Artist's impression of Die Glocke.
    History
    Edit


    Polish author Igor Witkowski.
    In his 2001 book The Hunt for Zero Point, author Nick Cook identified claims about Die Glocke as having originated in the 2000 Polish book Prawda o Wunderwaffe (The Truth About The Wonder Weapon) by Igor Witkowski. Cook described Witkowski's claims of a device called "The Bell" engineered by Nazi scientists that was "a glowing, rotating contraption" rumored to have "some kind of antigravitational effect", be a "time machine", or part of an "SS antigravity program" for a flying saucer.[1]

    According to Cook, Die Glocke was bell-shaped, about 12 feet (3.7 m) high and 9 feet (2.7 m) in diameter, and incorporated "two high-speed, counter-rotating cylinders filled with a purplish, liquid metallic-looking substance that was supposed to be highly radioactive, code-named 'Xerum 525.'" Cook recounts claims that "scientists and technicians who worked on the bell and who did not die of its effects were wiped out by the SS at the close of the war, and the device was removed to an unknown location".[2] Cook proposed that SS official Hans Kammler later secretly traded this technology to the U.S. military in exchange for his freedom.[1] Fringe theorists have suggested that a concrete ring called "The Henge" near the Wenceslaus mine built in 1943 or 1944 and vaguely resembling Stonehenge was "used as a launch pad for the Bell". According to writer Jason Colavito, the structure is merely the remains of an ordinary industrial cooling tower.[3]

    Cook's publication introduced the topic in English without critically discussing the subject.[4] More recently, historian Eric Kurlander has discussed the topic in his 2017 book on Nazi esotericism Hitler's Monsters: A Supernatural History of the Third Reich. According to reviewer Julian Strube, Kurlander "cites from the reservoir of post-war conspiracy theories" and "heavily relies on sensationalist accounts...mixing up contemporary sources with post-war sensationalist literature, half-truths, and fictitious accounts".[5]

    According to Salon reviewer Kurt Kleiner, "It's a story that strains credulity. But unless we're after cheap laughs, our hope when we pick up a book like this is that the author will, against the odds, build a careful, reasonable and convincing case. Cook isn't that author". Kleiner criticized Cook's work as "ferreting out minor inconsistencies and odd, ambiguous details which he tries to puff up into proof", characterized the process of evaluating Cook's claims as "untangling science from pseudo-science", and concluded that "what is instructive about the book is the insight we get into how conspiracy theories seduce otherwise reasonable people".[1]

    Skeptical author Robert Sheaffer criticized Cook's book as "a classic example of how to spin an exciting yarn based on almost nothing. He visits places where it is rumored that secret UFO and antigravity research is going on...and writes about what he feels and imagines, although he discovers nothing more tangible than unsubstantiated rumors". Sheaffer notes that claims about Die Glocke are circulated by UFOlogists and conspiracy-oriented authors such as Jim Marrs, Joseph P. Farrell, and antigravity proponent John Dering.[2]

    Jason Colavito wrote that Witkowski's claims were "recycled" from 1960s rumors of Nazi occult science first published in Morning of the Magicians, and describes Die Glocke as "a device few outside of fringe culture think actually existed. In short, it looks to be a hoax, or at least a wild exaggeration".[3] Author Brian Dunning states that Morning of the Magicians helped promote belief in Die Glocke and Nazi occultism, and its absence in the historical record make it "increasingly unlikely that anything like it actually existed". According to Dunning, "all we have in the way of evidence is a third-hand anecdotal account of something that's desperately implausible, backed up by neither evidence nor even a corroborating account".[6]

    Author and historian Robert F. Dorr characterizes Die Glocke as among "the most imaginative of the conspiracy theories" that arose in post-World War II years, and typical of the fantasies of magical German weapons often popularized in pulp magazines such as The Police Gazette.[7]

    Some theories circulating on Internet conspiracy sites claim that Die Glocke is located in a Nazi gold train that is buried in a tunnel beneath a mountain in Poland.[8] Duncan Roads, editor of Nexus magazine, has pointed out that the "Nazis on the Moon trope" is linked to wild speculations about Nazi anti-gravitational technology, such as Witkowski's Die Glocke.[9]

    Journalist Patrick J. Kiger wrote that German propaganda of fictional Wunderwaffen combined with the secrecy surrounding actual advanced technology such as the V-2 rocket captured at war's end by the U.S. military helped spawn "sensational book-length exposes, web sites, and legions of enthusiasts who revel in rumors of science fiction-like weapons supposedly invented by Hitler’s scientists". According to Kiger, Die Glocke is a popular example of such legends and speculation, citing former aerospace scientist David Myhra's contention that if antigravity devices actually existed, the Germans, desperate to stop the Allies' advance, would have used them.[10]



    Very interesting. Knew something about that but not that much!
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 7,889
    If this is the McGuffin, it’s ideal for an Indiana Jones story.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,861
    It’s been rumoured since the start of filming, I’m not sure why an ancient code dial thing would lead to a modern machine though. Doesn’t quite make sense.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 7,889
    mtm wrote: »
    It’s been rumoured since the start of filming, I’m not sure why an ancient code dial thing would lead to a modern machine though. Doesn’t quite make sense.

    Well it’s not dissimilar to the Nazis trying to harness the power of the Ark of the Covenant and apply it to their nefarious goals.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,861
    The leak says they’re looking for something they’ve actually built though, it’s a bit weird.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 7,889
    Right, but was it built, in part, by using an ancient artifact? That would tie in everything.
  • Posts: 669
    As much as I think this device could be an ideal MacGuffin, one that opens up a wealth of story possibilities, I do wonder how the general public will react to it. I can just picture a lot of people saying, "First aliens, and now time travel! Boy, has this series jumped the shark! (Or nuked the fridge.)"
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 7,889
    Last yesterday Entertainment Tonight did a retroactive on the career of Harrison Ford; behind the scenes footage from Indy 5 was included. Only nine days away from 80, Harrison looks absolutely remarkable and extremely fit.
  • Posts: 15,785
    talos7 wrote: »
    Last yesterday Entertainment Tonight did a retroactive on the career of Harrison Ford; behind the scenes footage from Indy 5 was included. Only nine days away from 80, Harrison looks absolutely remarkable and extremely fit.

    I think Ford looks better now than he did in CRYSTAL SKULL.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 7,889
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    talos7 wrote: »
    Last yesterday Entertainment Tonight did a retroactive on the career of Harrison Ford; behind the scenes footage from Indy 5 was included. Only nine days away from 80, Harrison looks absolutely remarkable and extremely fit.

    I think Ford looks better now than he did in CRYSTAL SKULL.

    And he look natural, not surgical
  • edited July 2022 Posts: 313
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    talos7 wrote: »
    Last yesterday Entertainment Tonight did a retroactive on the career of Harrison Ford; behind the scenes footage from Indy 5 was included. Only nine days away from 80, Harrison looks absolutely remarkable and extremely fit.


    Do you have a link to that?
  • Posts: 1,545
    Nazis again ?
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 7,889
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    talos7 wrote: »
    Last yesterday Entertainment Tonight did a retroactive on the career of Harrison Ford; behind the scenes footage from Indy 5 was included. Only nine days away from 80, Harrison looks absolutely remarkable and extremely fit.


    Do you have a link to that?

    https://www.etonline.com/media/videos/celebrating-harrison-ford-the-actors-iconic-career-and-movie-milestones-186663
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 8,254
    talos7 wrote: »
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    talos7 wrote: »
    Last yesterday Entertainment Tonight did a retroactive on the career of Harrison Ford; behind the scenes footage from Indy 5 was included. Only nine days away from 80, Harrison looks absolutely remarkable and extremely fit.

    I think Ford looks better now than he did in CRYSTAL SKULL.

    And he look natural, not surgical

    Agreed @talos7 ... He has been active his entire life with weights, flying planes and tennis... An example of making movement, mobility and fitness as much a part of your life as eating (though I do suspect the doctor may assist with simple testosterone shots-- which is something I have no issues with)
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,861
    One thing I've always been curious with Ford is that he seems to have started losing his hair as far back as the 1980s with quite a thin hairline (which he's never worried about hiding to be fair) but then.. it just never fell out any further. A neat trick if you can do it! :)
  • I’m not sure if we have a general Indiana Jones thread for this, but I recently caught up with the Jean-Paul Belmondo double feature That Man from Rio and Up to His Ears, which both involve an everyman played by Belmondo who’s comedically swept up in a globe-trotting adventure. They definitely riffed on elements from the early 60s Bond films (the latter includes Ursula Andress on an island beach in very Honey Ryder-esque attire), but what struck me most about both of them were how many scenes felt reminiscent of scenes from the Indiana Jones trilogy. Far too many to be coincidence. These were definitely films Spielberg watched and closely homaged/lifted from for all three of his 80s Indiana Jones films, from the biplane escape in the opening of Raiders to the bridge sequence in Temple of Doom to the boat stunts in Last Crusade. What also struck me was the insanity of Belmondo quite apparently doing all his own stunts, throwing himself down hills and through tables and climbing about on ridiculously high structures. Things were definitely different in the 60s.
  • edited July 2022 Posts: 6,682
    I’m not sure if we have a general Indiana Jones thread for this, but I recently caught up with the Jean-Paul Belmondo double feature That Man from Rio and Up to His Ears, which both involve an everyman played by Belmondo who’s comedically swept up in a globe-trotting adventure. They definitely riffed on elements from the early 60s Bond films (the latter includes Ursula Andress on an island beach in very Honey Ryder-esque attire), but what struck me most about both of them were how many scenes felt reminiscent of scenes from the Indiana Jones trilogy. Far too many to be coincidence. These were definitely films Spielberg watched and closely homaged/lifted from for all three of his 80s Indiana Jones films, from the biplane escape in the opening of Raiders to the bridge sequence in Temple of Doom to the boat stunts in Last Crusade. What also struck me was the insanity of Belmondo quite apparently doing all his own stunts, throwing himself down hills and through tables and climbing about on ridiculously high structures. Things were definitely different in the 60s.

    I recall Man from Rio was mentioned before on this site as inspiring Indiana Jones to some extent. Spielberg has always had an interest in French films, so it's plausible.

    I haven't seen Man from Rio, but in his eighties cop/spy flicks, Belmondo is hanging from helicopters, lying on top of cars and speedboats, or driving them at high speed, his face on full display. It's nuts, and I love it.
  • mattjoes wrote: »
    I’m not sure if we have a general Indiana Jones thread for this, but I recently caught up with the Jean-Paul Belmondo double feature That Man from Rio and Up to His Ears, which both involve an everyman played by Belmondo who’s comedically swept up in a globe-trotting adventure. They definitely riffed on elements from the early 60s Bond films (the latter includes Ursula Andress on an island beach in very Honey Ryder-esque attire), but what struck me most about both of them were how many scenes felt reminiscent of scenes from the Indiana Jones trilogy. Far too many to be coincidence. These were definitely films Spielberg watched and closely homaged/lifted from for all three of his 80s Indiana Jones films, from the biplane escape in the opening of Raiders to the bridge sequence in Temple of Doom to the boat stunts in Last Crusade. What also struck me was the insanity of Belmondo quite apparently doing all his own stunts, throwing himself down hills and through tables and climbing about on ridiculously high structures. Things were definitely different in the 60s.

    I recall Man from Rio was mentioned before on this site as inspiring Indiana Jones to some extent. Spielberg has always had an interest in French films, so it's plausible.

    I haven't seen Man from Rio, but in his eighties cop/spy flicks, Belmondo is hanging from helicopters, lying on top of cars and speedboats, or driving them at high speed, his face on full display. It's nuts, and I love it.

    Yeah, he was crazy. I know they had stuntmen back then, so maybe he just loved doing that stuff. Maybe he was Tom Cruise before there was Tom Cruise.
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