NO TIME TO DIE (2021) - Discuss Hans Zimmer's Score

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  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython Alpha Quadrant
    Posts: 5,520
    Arnold could never secure an Oscar nomination during his five film stint, so I don’t think EON will ever go back to him.
  • Posts: 2,268
    jake24 wrote: »
    Oh, maybe it's not there after all. At least one of the action sequences does have that melody in it, though. That might be the bit from "Message from an Old Friend" (which I think is leading INTO the donut sequence?) and I'm just getting it mixed up. I could have sworn that melody appears at other moments in the film.
    I think the melody in question is the one that appears throughout the chase, first at the start when the DB5 manoeuvres away from the SPECTRE vehicles in the square, then after Bond deploys the mines after approaching the sheep. The theme reprises at various parts including when Bond and Valdo take off in the plane as well as Swann’s reintroduction into the story.

    This might have been what I was thinking of.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Doctor Nose
    Posts: 4,898
    jake24 wrote: »
    Oh, maybe it's not there after all. At least one of the action sequences does have that melody in it, though. That might be the bit from "Message from an Old Friend" (which I think is leading INTO the donut sequence?) and I'm just getting it mixed up. I could have sworn that melody appears at other moments in the film.
    I think the melody in question is the one that appears throughout the chase, first at the start when the DB5 manoeuvres away from the SPECTRE vehicles in the square, then after Bond deploys the mines after approaching the sheep. The theme reprises at various parts including when Bond and Valdo take off in the plane as well as Swann’s reintroduction into the story.

    This might have been what I was thinking of.

    I look forward to listening to those parts when I buy the film.
  • GadgetMan wrote: »
    I love David Arnold and would like to see him return for Bond 26. But if Zimmer can come up with a score this good in such a short space of time, I begin to fear that Arnold might not return again. Another reason is, once Romer left I really thought Arnold was going to get the gig, and I'm sure he thought so as well.

    I really can't see Arnold returning. Once Dan Romer left, the opportunity was there to invite Arnold back. Instead they went for Zimmer. Arnold has had his run. Zimmer must be a near certainty for Bond 26.

  • Posts: 355
    Zimmer also supervised the music for The Rhythm Section (which also happened to have a continuous action shot). It looks like it will be there for a while, which would make sense.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 3,916
    Arnold could never secure an Oscar nomination during his five film stint, so I don’t think EON will ever go back to him.

    Yeah, that's another worry.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    edited November 2021 Posts: 3,916
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    I love David Arnold and would like to see him return for Bond 26. But if Zimmer can come up with a score this good in such a short space of time, I begin to fear that Arnold might not return again. Another reason is, once Romer left I really thought Arnold was going to get the gig, and I'm sure he thought so as well.

    I really can't see Arnold returning. Once Dan Romer left, the opportunity was there to invite Arnold back. Instead they went for Zimmer. Arnold has had his run. Zimmer must be a near certainty for Bond 26.

    True, I would be very surprised if Zimmer, Marr & Mazzaro are not already on standby for Bond 26. And I think EON should go back to rock music for Bond 26's title song. We've now had three ballads in a row...the problem isn't that the songs are bad, but the last two all want to be Adele's SF.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 5,593
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    Arnold could never secure an Oscar nomination during his five film stint, so I don’t think EON will ever go back to him.

    Yeah, that's another worry.

    It's too bad they "go in for that sort of thing", Oscar winners and whatnot. I can see why, but it's kind of a shame if it's true they wouldn't go back to someone because they were never nominated by the Academy.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 3,916
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    Arnold could never secure an Oscar nomination during his five film stint, so I don’t think EON will ever go back to him.

    Yeah, that's another worry.

    It's too bad they "go in for that sort of thing", Oscar winners and whatnot. I can see why, but it's kind of a shame if it's true they wouldn't go back to someone because they were never nominated by the Academy.

    Yeah. I think after how SF took the world by storm, with Adele winning an Oscar and Newman nominated for best score, EON now have an insatiable taste for more Oscar wins...it's also evident with the Adele-type of title songs we've had ever since.
  • My favorite part of the Bond theme is (pardon me if I'm using this word wrong) the refrain - the part two thirds in that kicks into high gear. I've been saying for years that it's a shame composers don't use it more, and along comes Zimmer who not only uses it but uses it as the primary action motif of the film. I was so excited and happy that I didn't know whether to cheer or cry.
  • edited November 2021 Posts: 537
    Arnold could never secure an Oscar nomination during his five film stint, so I don’t think EON will ever go back to him.
    And his failure to secure an Oscar nom has absolutely nothing to do with his lack of talent. It has everything to do with name recognition and clout. Zimmer and Newman have it. Arnold doesn’t. Also nowadays (since SF) the Bond films have become more Oscar-friendly than in the past. So Arnold really had no chance.

    I mean when you look at Barry - the man certainly had clout and Oscar wins under his belt. But he was never nominated for a Bond film. Which is beyond bizarre. But Marvin Hamlisch was for TSWLM. Of course it certainly helped that he was the flavor of the month during that time in the 70s.

    As you can see none of this reflects in any way on actual quality. The Oscars don’t make sense.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,051
    Arnold could never secure an Oscar nomination during his five film stint, so I don’t think EON will ever go back to him.
    And his failure to secure an Oscar nom has absolutely nothing to do with his lack of talent. It has everything to do with name recognition and clout. Zimmer and Newman have it. Arnold doesn’t. Also nowadays (since SF) the Bond films have become more Oscar-friendly than in the past. So Arnold really had no chance.

    I mean when you look at Barry - the man certainly had clout and Oscar wins under his belt. But he was never nominated for a Bond film. Which is beyond bizarre. But Marvin Hamlisch was for TSWLM. Of course it certainly helped that he was the flavor of the month during that time in the 70s.

    As you can see none of this reflects in any way on actual quality. The Oscars don’t make sense.

    Correct on every count, sir!
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited November 2021 Posts: 5,593
    100%. The Academy is a joke, they like what they like (which tends to be films about them/Hollywood, or films with "American" in the title), and that's that.
  • The 'ending' piece 'Final Ascent' is so poignant, and I think will live long in memory as Bond's epitaph music.It may also go down as a close runner up for me at least, to WHATTITW. As being one of the most evocative of the entire Bond series.
  • Gettler wrote: »
    jabali wrote: »
    Does anyone know the track where Bond's swimming up from the sinking boat? I don't recall hearing it on the album. Would be a bummer if it stays unreleased, because I thought it was a beautiful cue

    It's unreleased right now.

    Wow! It's so short.
    Nice.But short.
  • GadgetMan wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    Arnold could never secure an Oscar nomination during his five film stint, so I don’t think EON will ever go back to him.

    Yeah, that's another worry.

    It's too bad they "go in for that sort of thing", Oscar winners and whatnot. I can see why, but it's kind of a shame if it's true they wouldn't go back to someone because they were never nominated by the Academy.

    Yeah. I think after how SF took the world by storm, with Adele winning an Oscar and Newman nominated for best score, EON now have an insatiable taste for more Oscar wins...it's also evident with the Adele-type of title songs we've had ever since.

    Which I think is ridiculous. The focus should be on creative excellence and not being a pretentious glory hunter. Everything about CR wipes the floor with the majority of all Bond films, especially the 4 films that came after it and aside from Haggis' involvement EoN weren't exactly on a mission for hinting Oscar horcruxes. EoN need to focus on the art and quality and less on the "prestige". They got Oscar winners Waltz and Malek and quite frankly both were lacklustre at best.
  • Posts: 355
    They need the films to be financed, and Oscar winners is reassuring to the Studios Heads.

    They don't care (the Studios) about the final product, just about how they can market it. Hans Zimmer is reassuring to them due to his track record.
  • AceHoleAceHole Belgium, via Britain
    Posts: 1,725
    My favorite part of the Bond theme is (pardon me if I'm using this word wrong) the refrain - the part two thirds in that kicks into high gear. I've been saying for years that it's a shame composers don't use it more, and along comes Zimmer who not only uses it but uses it as the primary action motif of the film. I was so excited and happy that I didn't know whether to cheer or cry.

    Do you mean the horn section action motif that starts at 00:10 sec into 'Square Escape' ?
    I've always wondered why on earth Newman didn't use this at all, even Arnold only used that motif for about 5sec. in all of his scores.

  • Stamper wrote: »
    They need the films to be financed, and Oscar winners is reassuring to the Studios Heads.

    They don't care (the Studios) about the final product, just about how they can market it. Hans Zimmer is reassuring to them due to his track record.

    It's a Bond film. A series that's been running for 60 years that for better or worse sells itself. You only have to look at how NTTD is performing internationally. Zimmer, Waltz and Malek certainly aren't major draws to the film. Although nice to have, they don't need Oscar calibre talent to draw in sponsors. If that really were the case, then the likes of Purvis and Wade would have been ousted when Brosnan left.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Doctor Nose
    edited November 2021 Posts: 4,898
    AceHole wrote: »
    My favorite part of the Bond theme is (pardon me if I'm using this word wrong) the refrain - the part two thirds in that kicks into high gear. I've been saying for years that it's a shame composers don't use it more, and along comes Zimmer who not only uses it but uses it as the primary action motif of the film. I was so excited and happy that I didn't know whether to cheer or cry.

    Do you mean the horn section action motif that starts at 00:10 sec into 'Square Escape' ?
    I've always wondered why on earth Newman didn't use this at all, even Arnold only used that motif for about 5sec. in all of his scores.

    Just going by memory, that part of the Bond theme has rarely been used in the films, apart from those times when the original recording was played in FRWL, YOLT and OHMSS. It's really great that they made it such a relevant part of this score after so many years.

    Another thing I like in this score is how the flamboyant brass passages in tracks like Message from an Old Friend and Cuba Chase are doubled by electric guitar, which off the top of my head I can't recall ever happening before. The instruments blend together very well, and of course, both the brass and the guitar are signature elements of the Bond scores. Even Arnold, who was very deferential to the traditional Bond sound, kept them separate.

    Also, I've already expressed my appreciation for the final part of Someone Was Here, but now I find myself paying attention to the rhythmic staccato strings in the background. They're great; they have a fierceness to them.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython Alpha Quadrant
    Posts: 5,520
    Jimjambond wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    Arnold could never secure an Oscar nomination during his five film stint, so I don’t think EON will ever go back to him.

    Yeah, that's another worry.

    It's too bad they "go in for that sort of thing", Oscar winners and whatnot. I can see why, but it's kind of a shame if it's true they wouldn't go back to someone because they were never nominated by the Academy.

    Yeah. I think after how SF took the world by storm, with Adele winning an Oscar and Newman nominated for best score, EON now have an insatiable taste for more Oscar wins...it's also evident with the Adele-type of title songs we've had ever since.

    aside from Haggis' involvement EoN weren't exactly on a mission for hinting Oscar horcruxes.

    Are you kidding? EON was campaigning hard for CR during awards season that they actually managed to get Daniel Craig nominated for a BAFTA.

    The only awards organization they failed to get any noms from was the American Academy. That didn’t come along until they got Sam Mendes’s clout. But then again, SF is in every measurable sense a better film than CR.
  • SatoriousSatorious Brushing up on a little Danish
    Posts: 215
    A subjective end statement at best - there are lots of things CR did better than SF. To be honest I find Skyfall a little overhyped (sure it looks pretty and has a fun villain - but it's also somewhat pretentious - rich in subtext - weak on actual plot logic).
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited November 2021 Posts: 5,593
    I can't help but find SF a touch boring when I think about it... but similarly I find that issue with CR at points (Miami and Venice, mostly).
    The problem with Miami, for me, is twofold - 1, Bond looks terrible the whole time, and 2, we're basically watching the same thing twice from a narrative perspective: watch Bond foil Le Chiffre's plot to sabotage Skyfleet stock in Madagascar, and again in Miami.
    But honestly, if the Miami stuff looked better / was more fun, I wouldn't have minded it.
    NTTD may be the first Craig film where I actively look forward to each scene before it comes. But of course, that may change after the honeymoon phase. It just moves.
  • macdrummer wrote: »
    The 'ending' piece 'Final Ascent' is so poignant, and I think will live long in memory as Bond's epitaph music.It may also go down as a close runner up for me at least, to WHATTITW. As being one of the most evocative of the entire Bond series.
    As Q used to say “You must be joking!”

    “Final Ascent” is what I would call a “standard epic Zimmer piece that’s supposed to pull on your heart strings” that could have been used in any of the epic films he’s scored - from PEARL HARBOR to INTERSTELLAR. There’s absolutely nothing Bondian about it. That’s why to compare it to anything from OHMSS is a joke. Everything in the latter is just pure Bond, and WHATTITW is probably the most romantic and iconic piece of music that we ever got in a Bond film!

    “Final Ascent” could have been from any Zimmer-scored epic.

  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 5,593
    I actually agree with @ringfire211 here. It's a nice piece of music and does it's job well, but it's very "stock" feeling to me; could be used in any film/franchise, and doesn't really have a unique identity of it's own. I much prefer "I'll Be Right Back" as the climactic music of NTTD (despite, of course, obviously serving a different purpose than Final Ascent).
  • Jimjambond wrote: »
    Stamper wrote: »
    They need the films to be financed, and Oscar winners is reassuring to the Studios Heads.

    They don't care (the Studios) about the final product, just about how they can market it. Hans Zimmer is reassuring to them due to his track record.

    It's a Bond film. A series that's been running for 60 years that for better or worse sells itself. You only have to look at how NTTD is performing internationally. Zimmer, Waltz and Malek certainly aren't major draws to the film. Although nice to have, they don't need Oscar calibre talent to draw in sponsors. If that really were the case, then the likes of Purvis and Wade would have been ousted when Brosnan left.
    Absolutely!!! It wasn’t until Walken in ‘85 that a Bond film got an Oscar winner to play the villain. He’s my favorite by the way. But that’s a different story. It’s Walken! But look at the actors they got prior to him. Not exactly headline grabbing names. Wiseman, Frobe, Celi, Gray, Jurgens, Lonsdale, Glover, Jourdan, etc. Even Christopher Lee who was a “name” was mostly relegated to horror projects, not Oscar caliber material for sure. Savalas was also pre-KOJAK. Kotto too was just making a name for himself. Even the Craig films kicked off with Mikkelsen and Amalric. I mean who really knew them before they were cast? I didn’t.

    So the Bond series certainly never needed big names for its cast. The Bond brand sold itself. In fact it’s the obscure “foreign” actors that have often left the biggest mark. Same with the Bond girls.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython Alpha Quadrant
    Posts: 5,520
    macdrummer wrote: »
    The 'ending' piece 'Final Ascent' is so poignant, and I think will live long in memory as Bond's epitaph music.It may also go down as a close runner up for me at least, to WHATTITW. As being one of the most evocative of the entire Bond series.
    As Q used to say “You must be joking!”

    “Final Ascent” is what I would call a “standard epic Zimmer piece that’s supposed to pull on your heart strings” that could have been used in any of the epic films he’s scored - from PEARL HARBOR to INTERSTELLAR. There’s absolutely nothing Bondian about it. That’s why to compare it to anything from OHMSS is a joke. Everything in the latter is just pure Bond, and WHATTITW is probably the most romantic and iconic piece of music that we ever got in a Bond film!

    “Final Ascent” could have been from any Zimmer-scored epic.

    On the other hand, you could make the claim that WHATTITW sounds like any other John Barry romantic melody from a non-Bond film. And you know what? That’s perfectly fine. Because in the end it’s about whether the music works for the film or not, and “Final Ascent” absolutely PLAYS for that moment of Craig’s demise.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited November 2021 Posts: 5,593
    macdrummer wrote: »
    The 'ending' piece 'Final Ascent' is so poignant, and I think will live long in memory as Bond's epitaph music.It may also go down as a close runner up for me at least, to WHATTITW. As being one of the most evocative of the entire Bond series.
    As Q used to say “You must be joking!”

    “Final Ascent” is what I would call a “standard epic Zimmer piece that’s supposed to pull on your heart strings” that could have been used in any of the epic films he’s scored - from PEARL HARBOR to INTERSTELLAR. There’s absolutely nothing Bondian about it. That’s why to compare it to anything from OHMSS is a joke. Everything in the latter is just pure Bond, and WHATTITW is probably the most romantic and iconic piece of music that we ever got in a Bond film!

    “Final Ascent” could have been from any Zimmer-scored epic.

    On the other hand, you could make the claim that WHATTITW sounds like any other John Barry romantic melody from a non-Bond film. And you know what? That’s perfectly fine. Because in the end it’s about whether the music works for the film or not, and “Final Ascent” absolutely PLAYS for that moment of Craig’s demise.

    True, but IMO, at least WHATTITW has a bit more of it's own unique identity, which enables it to be associated with Bond more. FA lacks this unique identity, which means, IMO, it would just slide off any long-term association with Bond it might have otherwise had.
  • macdrummer wrote: »
    The 'ending' piece 'Final Ascent' is so poignant, and I think will live long in memory as Bond's epitaph music.It may also go down as a close runner up for me at least, to WHATTITW. As being one of the most evocative of the entire Bond series.
    As Q used to say “You must be joking!”

    “Final Ascent” is what I would call a “standard epic Zimmer piece that’s supposed to pull on your heart strings” that could have been used in any of the epic films he’s scored - from PEARL HARBOR to INTERSTELLAR. There’s absolutely nothing Bondian about it. That’s why to compare it to anything from OHMSS is a joke. Everything in the latter is just pure Bond, and WHATTITW is probably the most romantic and iconic piece of music that we ever got in a Bond film!

    “Final Ascent” could have been from any Zimmer-scored epic.

    On the other hand, you could make the claim that WHATTITW sounds like any other John Barry romantic melody from a non-Bond film.
    I disagree that it does. I can’t see it playing during OUT OF AFRICA or DANCES WITH WOLVES or BORN FREE or any of his other films. It just belongs in OHMSS and nothing else. It’s 100% Bond and Tracy’s love theme.

    “Final Ascent” to me is basically hero sacrifice music. Could be any series. In fact any series other than Bond because Bond doesn’t sacrifice himself. Bond always returns.

  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited November 2021 Posts: 5,593
    macdrummer wrote: »
    The 'ending' piece 'Final Ascent' is so poignant, and I think will live long in memory as Bond's epitaph music.It may also go down as a close runner up for me at least, to WHATTITW. As being one of the most evocative of the entire Bond series.
    As Q used to say “You must be joking!”

    “Final Ascent” is what I would call a “standard epic Zimmer piece that’s supposed to pull on your heart strings” that could have been used in any of the epic films he’s scored - from PEARL HARBOR to INTERSTELLAR. There’s absolutely nothing Bondian about it. That’s why to compare it to anything from OHMSS is a joke. Everything in the latter is just pure Bond, and WHATTITW is probably the most romantic and iconic piece of music that we ever got in a Bond film!

    “Final Ascent” could have been from any Zimmer-scored epic.

    On the other hand, you could make the claim that WHATTITW sounds like any other John Barry romantic melody from a non-Bond film.
    I disagree that it does. I can’t see it playing during OUT OF AFRICA or DANCES WITH WOLVES or BORN FREE or any of his other films. It just belongs in OHMSS and nothing else. It’s 100% Bond and Tracy’s love theme.

    “Final Ascent” to me is basically hero sacrifice music. Could be any series. In fact any series other than Bond because Bond doesn’t sacrifice himself. Bond always returns.

    Exactly.

    It could have, before it was in OHMSS, but because All The Time has it's own unique identity, and now that it's associated with Bond, it will remain associated with Bond.

    Hopefully my above comments aren't invisible in this thread.
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