No Time To Die - Safin's Plot (Spoilers!)

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  • DCisaredDCisared Liverpool
    Posts: 1,316
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    DCisared wrote: »
    Contraband wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Lynch was on a rocky shore interesting do we have a picture was she still wearing her commando getup?

    @007Blofeld Here you go. Pics taken near the small italian town of Maratea, Italy. Picture with the rib boat has both Swann and Lynch in it. They also shot the rib boat on much deeper water.

    O80koM8.jpg
    rZY16AM.jpg
    iMi1VdF.jpg

    Just noticed that the girl having a giggle with Lashana, is holding Bond’s Naval Npeal.

    Hmm I wonder where this takes place? Is that guy on the raft Bond or an extra and is maddy have on a coat?

    Kind of looks like Dan’s head but then we know bond is wearing a white Henley under the Npeal so I don’t think it his him?
  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    edited February 2020 Posts: 3,126
    DCisared wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    DCisared wrote: »
    Contraband wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Lynch was on a rocky shore interesting do we have a picture was she still wearing her commando getup?

    @007Blofeld Here you go. Pics taken near the small italian town of Maratea, Italy. Picture with the rib boat has both Swann and Lynch in it. They also shot the rib boat on much deeper water.

    O80koM8.jpg
    rZY16AM.jpg
    iMi1VdF.jpg

    Just noticed that the girl having a giggle with Lashana, is holding Bond’s Naval Npeal.

    Hmm I wonder where this takes place? Is that guy on the raft Bond or an extra and is maddy have on a coat?

    Kind of looks like Dan’s head but then we know bond is wearing a white Henley under the Npeal so I don’t think it his him?

    Looks like a camera person. Interesting why it's just her and Madeleine. Maybe she kidnaps Madeline?
  • Maybe Bond's been captured or is being tortured, and Nomi is evacuating Madeleine from Safin's lair?
  • danielcc wrote: »
    With all the information given, no matter how much I think about it, I always come up wit what is essentially the transhumanism from Dan Brown's Inferno novel.
    - Genetic warfare
    - Safin thinks he found the solution for one of the biggest problems
    - "men who play god"
    - the Spectre party where apparently only some people are affected by an attack

    What if Safin has stolen plans for genetic viruses - or something that can be used as such.

    In fact, he and Blofeld/Spectre could be opponents here.
    Spectre wants it a weapon to be sold to evil parties, while Safin wants it to extinguish parts of manking to "save the rest"


    I think this makes very much sense as a Bond plot, fits to what we know, and is not too close to reality such as topics like global warming

    In the new trailer Safing tells Bond "I have made you redundant".
    Given that Craig's Bond has been on various occasions been described as someone who is needed to pull the trigger, I still go with my guess for the villain's plot from above.
    Seems Safin has created something that allows him to kill certain people - thus making someone like Bond redundant

  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 6,496
    Yes I know it’s the DM, although I’ve read this speculation on numerous outlets, but the threat of biological/genetic warfare is very real and very timely; a plot to eradicate large numbers of people could be very real.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8009669/Did-coronavirus-originate-Chinese-government-laboratory.html
  • Posts: 13,742
    talos7 wrote: »
    Yes I know it’s the DM, although I’ve read this speculation on numerous outlets, but the threat of biological/genetic warfare is very real and very timely; a plot to eradicate large numbers of people could be very real.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8009669/Did-coronavirus-originate-Chinese-government-laboratory.html

    I've always wanted and expected biological warfare to show up again in the films. It would be very topical if it did for NTTD.
  • talos7 wrote: »
    Yes I know it’s the DM, although I’ve read this speculation on numerous outlets, but the threat of biological/genetic warfare is very real and very timely; a plot to eradicate large numbers of people could be very real.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8009669/Did-coronavirus-originate-Chinese-government-laboratory.html

    Seemingly this is the idea the film is going in….some kind of genetically created virus that will affect a certain type of person.

    Which I think will make more sense in light of Safin’s “I have made you redundant” line. Maybe Safin has found a way to create the perfect solider genetically? All a bit too ‘science fiction’ for me.

    However, I think the actual mechanics of Safin’s plot will be secondary to Bond’s emotional story and his dynamic with Safin. Basically the film is ‘about’ Bond, and Safin’s plot is just background noise, ‘destroy the world’ nonsense to give the drama stakes.

    I’m curious how Blofeld factors into this….he clearly has some kind of relationship with Safin. Especially after the Russian trailer revealed the ‘my enemy is now your enemy’ line.

    I think there is a chance that Blofeld factors into this film more than we think….maybe Safin kills him? We know that Safin is in the UK at some point to give Madeleine the Noh mask.

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    Could he go to the prison to kill Blofeld? I personally would love to see Safin kill him. It cement Safin as the ‘ultimate evil’ if he killed Blofeld. Plus CJ said in the Empire interview that Safin wants to be King of the Underworld. The only way to become the King is the kill the King.

    Christoph-Waltz-as-Blofeld-in-No-Time-To-Die-James-Bond.jpg
  • DrinmanDrinman New York
    Posts: 40
    What is Safin wants Madeline to kill Blofeld?
  • RollTide007RollTide007 Orange Beach, Alabama
    Posts: 1
    Regarding Madeline's "secret", does anyone else feel most of the theories floating around the web (ie undercover SPECTRE agent, she's the young girl fleeing Safin, etc.) all seem, simply put, a little too lazy and obvious? I don't buy any of them as that translates into lazy writing and despite the Blofeld/Bond sibling angle, I feel the current slate of writers are bit more clever than that. I feel they're going to toss us a curveball or two. Plus the trailers are always cut together to deceive and mislead.

    I'm just spitballing here, but instead of her being some secret SPECTRE agent, what if she had a relationship with Safin? What if the wee girl he stalked across the snow in Norway wasn't Madeline, but instead their daughter? Or, if not by Safin but in a similar scenario, what if Madeline had a daughter he murdered out of punishment due to some other ties? Of course, it's silly to think a mother would keep a dead child from her lover, unless she feels guilty or responsible and could have prevented it. Either way, if Safin is as ruthless as they claim, and given Cary's tendency to show no mercy for children, I wouldn't be surprised.

    Of course, I'm not endorsing that theory (so I won't argue or debate it), just throwing out something different because I have a hard time believing that young girl was Madeline. I think - as with most films - our theories are usually incorrect and we're delivered something we never came close to anticipating. I'm trying to think outside the box.
  • Regarding Madeline's "secret", does anyone else feel most of the theories floating around the web (ie undercover SPECTRE agent, she's the young girl fleeing Safin, etc.) all seem, simply put, a little too lazy and obvious? I don't buy any of them as that translates into lazy writing and despite the Blofeld/Bond sibling angle, I feel the current slate of writers are bit more clever than that. I feel they're going to toss us a curveball or two. Plus the trailers are always cut together to deceive and mislead.

    I'm just spitballing here, but instead of her being some secret SPECTRE agent, what if she had a relationship with Safin? What if the wee girl he stalked across the snow in Norway wasn't Madeline, but instead their daughter? Or, if not by Safin but in a similar scenario, what if Madeline had a daughter he murdered out of punishment due to some other ties? Of course, it's silly to think a mother would keep a dead child from her lover, unless she feels guilty or responsible and could have prevented it. Either way, if Safin is as ruthless as they claim, and given Cary's tendency to show no mercy for children, I wouldn't be surprised.

    Of course, I'm not endorsing that theory (so I won't argue or debate it), just throwing out something different because I have a hard time believing that young girl was Madeline. I think - as with most films - our theories are usually incorrect and we're delivered something we never came close to anticipating. I'm trying to think outside the box.

    I too am at a loss as to what Madeleine's secret is and why it will be the "death of Bond" to discover....

    Here are some ideas:
    • Maybe Madeleine is Vesper's sister?
    • Maybe Madeleine is Safin's sister?
    • Maybe Madeleine had a child with Safin?
    • Maybe Madeleine knows that Safin is Vesper's brother?
    • Maybe Madeleine and Safin are married?
    • Maybe Madeleine and Safin have a child?

    Remember these set photos? I can't find the actual photo, but wasn't a small blonde child photographed on set? Can anyone find the photo???? I think Safin and Madeleine had a baby. Maybe he raped Madeleine and she kept the child........that would be a very villainous thing to do.

    08.jpg
  • Posts: 3,162
    A fantastic theory from the other forum, what if White isn't actually Madeleine's father...Safin kills her real parents and then hands Madeleine over to Spectre/White, who raises her as her own.
  • edited February 2020 Posts: 4,358
    antovolk wrote: »
    A fantastic theory from the other forum, what if White isn't actually Madeleine's father...Safin kills her real parents and then hands Madeleine over to Spectre/White, who raises her as her own.

    Cool theory, but it would be more of a shock to Madeleine to discover.....remember if and when Bond finds out Madeline's secret it'll be earth-shattering for him.

    If she was hiding what you suggest from Bond, it's not that major.

    Madeleine having secret child would he huge, especially if the father of that kid is on the scene.
  • Posts: 3,162
    antovolk wrote: »
    A fantastic theory from the other forum, what if White isn't actually Madeleine's father...Safin kills her real parents and then hands Madeleine over to Spectre/White, who raises her as her own.

    Cool theory, but it would be more of a shock to Madeleine to discover.....remember if and when Bond finds out Madeline's secret it'll be earth-shattering for him.

    If she was hiding what you suggest from Bond, it's not that major.

    Madeleine having secret child would he huge, especially if the father of that kid is on the scene.

    Per Purvis & Wade, the whole idea behind Madeleine being White's daughter is that being the daughter of an assassin, she can understand and connect with Bond in a way others can't, and that's (though I guess we'll know more whether they'll actually take that route in the PTS/Matera scenes) presumably a huge part of why Bond falls for her. So realising that oh, she's just like everyone else, would be a bit of a shock.

    Secret child - I don't really buy...I think it's pretty clear as day whom we see in the Norway opening scenes is a young Madeleine (and that's something that was seemingly confirmed by the stuntwoman in that sequence too).

    Also, who's to say the whole 'Madeleine's secret will be the death of you' from Blofeld is a touch of Marvel-esque trailer misdirection and Blofeld doesn't actually say that in the film?
  • antovolk wrote: »
    antovolk wrote: »
    A fantastic theory from the other forum, what if White isn't actually Madeleine's father...Safin kills her real parents and then hands Madeleine over to Spectre/White, who raises her as her own.

    Cool theory, but it would be more of a shock to Madeleine to discover.....remember if and when Bond finds out Madeline's secret it'll be earth-shattering for him.

    If she was hiding what you suggest from Bond, it's not that major.

    Madeleine having secret child would he huge, especially if the father of that kid is on the scene.

    Per Purvis & Wade, the whole idea behind Madeleine being White's daughter is that being the daughter of an assassin, she can understand and connect with Bond in a way others can't, and that's (though I guess we'll know more whether they'll actually take that route in the PTS/Matera scenes) presumably a huge part of why Bond falls for her. So realising that oh, she's just like everyone else, would be a bit of a shock.

    Secret child - I don't really buy...I think it's pretty clear as day whom we see in the Norway opening scenes is a young Madeleine (and that's something that was seemingly confirmed by the stuntwoman in that sequence too).

    Also, who's to say the whole 'Madeleine's secret will be the death of you' from Blofeld is a touch of Marvel-esque trailer misdirection and Blofeld doesn't actually say that in the film?

    Hmmmm......what you're saying still doesn't hold up.

    Remember, Safin is hunting the young Madeleine. Therefore, we can assume that Safin is Madeleine's secret.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    edited February 2020 Posts: 6,496
    Or does she hold something that Safin needs, something in her blood perhaps. The damage to his mask shows that his face is degenerating. Does she hold the key to his "playing God".

    He obviously wants her alive.
  • duke_togoduke_togo france
    edited February 2020 Posts: 138
    Regarding Madeline's "secret", does anyone else feel most of the theories floating around the web (ie undercover SPECTRE agent, she's the young girl fleeing Safin, etc.) all seem, simply put, a little too lazy and obvious? I don't buy any of them as that translates into lazy writing and despite the Blofeld/Bond sibling angle, I feel the current slate of writers are bit more clever than that. I feel they're going to toss us a curveball or two. Plus the trailers are always cut together to deceive and mislead.

    I'm just spitballing here, but instead of her being some secret SPECTRE agent, what if she had a relationship with Safin? What if the wee girl he stalked across the snow in Norway wasn't Madeline, but instead their daughter? Or, if not by Safin but in a similar scenario, what if Madeline had a daughter he murdered out of punishment due to some other ties? Of course, it's silly to think a mother would keep a dead child from her lover, unless she feels guilty or responsible and could have prevented it. Either way, if Safin is as ruthless as they claim, and given Cary's tendency to show no mercy for children, I wouldn't be surprised.

    Of course, I'm not endorsing that theory (so I won't argue or debate it), just throwing out something different because I have a hard time believing that young girl was Madeline. I think - as with most films - our theories are usually incorrect and we're delivered something we never came close to anticipating. I'm trying to think outside the box.

    I too am at a loss as to what Madeleine's secret is and why it will be the "death of Bond" to discover....

    Here are some ideas:
    • Maybe Madeleine is Vesper's sister?
    • Maybe Madeleine is Safin's sister?
    • Maybe Madeleine had a child with Safin?
    • Maybe Madeleine knows that Safin is Vesper's brother?
    • Maybe Madeleine and Safin are married?
    • Maybe Madeleine and Safin have a child?

    Remember these set photos? I can't find the actual photo, but wasn't a small blonde child photographed on set? Can anyone find the photo???? I think Safin and Madeleine had a baby. Maybe he raped Madeleine and she kept the child........that would be a very villainous thing to do.

    08.jpg

    Maybe Vesper was adopted by White and Safin is his real brother who wants her sister back. Or/and the french algerian boyfriend stuff in CR and QoS was a lure and it was Safin who was held by Spectre.
  • silva13silva13 Australia
    Posts: 198
    Maybe Madeline wasn't just hiding from her father In Spectre. Maybe she was also hiding from Safin.
  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    Posts: 3,497
    Tuck91 wrote: »
    I hope he’s not dr no. This will be two films in a row they rebooted a villian.

    The world will end soon after the release of NTTD because of this.

    But... I hope he's an original villain too. Just because they screwed up Blofeld.
  • ResurrectionResurrection Kolkata, India
    Posts: 2,541
    What if saffin inject some kind of virus to bond in the end, the plot seems to indicate biological/bacterial warfare.
  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    Posts: 3,497
    What if saffin inject some kind of virus to bond in the end, the plot seems to indicate biological/bacterial warfare.

    Yeah that might happen... :-?
  • silva13 wrote: »
    Maybe Madeline wasn't just hiding from her father In Spectre. Maybe she was also hiding from Safin.

    It’s this.

    After all, we know Madeleine is very qualified and, despite this, she is hiding out in Austria. The answer Spectre gives is that she is laying low because of her father. But it doesn’t make sense, after all she has lived her whole life knowing her father was a Spectre operative. Why hide now?

    She has probably been in Austria for a few months prior to meeting Bond. Perhaps something happened….

    I think the simplest explanation is sometimes the best: Madeleine and Safin worked together. She’s a Doctor, so perhaps had a role in helping create the virus he is trying to spread. She later escaped from him. The reason why the ‘secret’ is so explosive for Bond is that the real ‘villain’ who engineered the virus was Madeleine. Even though she was under duress.

    In many ways, this is preferable to some kind of ‘brother’ or ‘baby’ twist, which feels more appropriate for Eastenders.
  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    Posts: 3,497
    silva13 wrote: »
    Maybe Madeline wasn't just hiding from her father In Spectre. Maybe she was also hiding from Safin.

    It’s this.

    After all, we know Madeleine is very qualified and, despite this, she is hiding out in Austria. The answer Spectre gives is that she is laying low because of her father. But it doesn’t make sense, after all she has lived her whole life knowing her father was a Spectre operative. Why hide now?

    She has probably been in Austria for a few months prior to meeting Bond. Perhaps something happened….

    I think the simplest explanation is sometimes the best: Madeleine and Safin worked together. She’s a Doctor, so perhaps had a role in helping create the virus he is trying to spread. She later escaped from him. The reason why the ‘secret’ is so explosive for Bond is that the real ‘villain’ who engineered the virus was Madeleine. Even though she was under duress.

    In many ways, this is preferable to some kind of ‘brother’ or ‘baby’ twist, which feels more appropriate for Eastenders.

    I hope they are not related at all...
  • silva13silva13 Australia
    Posts: 198
    silva13 wrote: »
    Maybe Madeline wasn't just hiding from her father In Spectre. Maybe she was also hiding from Safin.

    It’s this.

    After all, we know Madeleine is very qualified and, despite this, she is hiding out in Austria. The answer Spectre gives is that she is laying low because of her father. But it doesn’t make sense, after all she has lived her whole life knowing her father was a Spectre operative. Why hide now?

    She has probably been in Austria for a few months prior to meeting Bond. Perhaps something happened….

    I think the simplest explanation is sometimes the best: Madeleine and Safin worked together. She’s a Doctor, so perhaps had a role in helping create the virus he is trying to spread. She later escaped from him. The reason why the ‘secret’ is so explosive for Bond is that the real ‘villain’ who engineered the virus was Madeleine. Even though she was under duress.

    In many ways, this is preferable to some kind of ‘brother’ or ‘baby’ twist, which feels more appropriate for Eastenders.

    Love it!
  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    Posts: 3,497
    silva13 wrote: »
    silva13 wrote: »
    Maybe Madeline wasn't just hiding from her father In Spectre. Maybe she was also hiding from Safin.

    It’s this.

    After all, we know Madeleine is very qualified and, despite this, she is hiding out in Austria. The answer Spectre gives is that she is laying low because of her father. But it doesn’t make sense, after all she has lived her whole life knowing her father was a Spectre operative. Why hide now?

    She has probably been in Austria for a few months prior to meeting Bond. Perhaps something happened….

    I think the simplest explanation is sometimes the best: Madeleine and Safin worked together. She’s a Doctor, so perhaps had a role in helping create the virus he is trying to spread. She later escaped from him. The reason why the ‘secret’ is so explosive for Bond is that the real ‘villain’ who engineered the virus was Madeleine. Even though she was under duress.

    In many ways, this is preferable to some kind of ‘brother’ or ‘baby’ twist, which feels more appropriate for Eastenders.

    Love it!

    What, Eastenders?

    :)>-
  • silva13silva13 Australia
    Posts: 198
    @JamesCraig I've never seen it. Is that wrong of me? Haha
  • edited February 2020 Posts: 4,358
    I had heard from someone reputable that Malek isn't playing Dr No......but for some reason, I really really want Rami to be playing Dr No.

    I know Eon did just reboot an iconic villain with mixed results. But I'm kinda into the Dr No twist. Mainly as it isn't as obviously sign-posted as the Blofeld reveal.

    Who else wants Rami to be Dr No? There is a resemblance...even the lighting and set all look to be designed deliberately to evoke the Crab Key lair.

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    ERB2Lv9XYAAF4g0?format=jpg&name=medium
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,219
    Everything about Safin resemble Dr No. Basically everything.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited February 2020 Posts: 4,974
    No, I'm alright. He doesn't need to be. I personally think all these connections people are making to be on the money, but I don't think the character is Dr. No.

    I honestly believe Safin has just been bred out of the villains from the novels. They seems to be taking bits from the literary Dr. No and Shatterhand...

    ...like how Silva was inspired by the Scaramanga from the novel
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 6,496
    I'm not for or against, but I always felt that the Craig era would end with at least a mention of Dr. No.
  • DrinmanDrinman New York
    Posts: 40
    I'd love for the film to end with Craig sitting at a baccarat table in a London Club mirroring the beginning of Dr.No. Obviously it wouldn't be in the same timeline and be pseudo fourth wall breaking but I can't help but get giddy thinking about it.
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