No Time to Die production thread

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  • edited December 2019 Posts: 3,051
    peter wrote: »
    he did mention Fukunaga wanting Safin to feel like he could come from anywhere and the accent evoking (paraphrasing here) 'a voice that could have been heard centuries ago'... evocative of Safin wanting to prolong his life/slow aging?
    ...where we not only have a chase, but the story continues with Bond's distrust in Madeleine). This is what makes action memorable: when there are real stakes for the character(s)-- and in the AM chase we see the stakes are two-fold: one is for survival, the other is the survival of their relationship... (which looks like it might end at the train station, only to be picked up again, in some form, later in the film)

    If Fukunaga is serious about "the action to feel dangerous" both Madeleine and Bond should be focusing 100% about getting out of Dodge and escaping their pursuers. After all, it if wasn't for the bulletproof glass in the DB5, they would both be dead.

    But no... Like with Mendes, another non action director, there just has to be something else going on at the same time during a setpiece, typically a conversation between the characters or crosscutting to an entire different place in the world.

    So in the middle of a car chase, Bond and Madeleine seemingly decide to have a discussion. They couldn't wait till they made it to safe distance - the train station, like any sane person, fearing for his or her life, would do.
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,579
    Zekidk wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    he did mention Fukunaga wanting Safin to feel like he could come from anywhere and the accent evoking (paraphrasing here) 'a voice that could have been heard centuries ago'... evocative of Safin wanting to prolong his life/slow aging?
    ...where we not only have a chase, but the story continues with Bond's distrust in Madeleine). This is what makes action memorable: when there are real stakes for the character(s)-- and in the AM chase we see the stakes are two-fold: one is for survival, the other is the survival of their relationship... (which looks like it might end at the train station, only to be picked up again, in some form, later in the film)

    If Fukunaga is serious about "the action to feel dangerous" both Madeleine and Bond should be focusing 100% about getting out of Dodge and escaping their pursuers. After all, it if wasn't for the bulletproof glass in the DB5, they would both be dead.

    But no... Like with Mendes, another non action director, there just has to be something else going on at the same time during a setpiece, typically a conversation between the characters or crosscutting to an entire different place in the world.

    So in the middle of a car chase, Bond and Madeleine seemingly decide to have a discussion. They couldn't wait till they made it to safe distance - the train station, like any sane person, fearing for his or her life, would do.
    Didn't realize you got to see an early screening.
  • Posts: 3,051
    @jake24

    I am only using facts that we know about. With all the different cameras and angles and cameravehicles used, I am almost certain that this will be better shot and likely better paced than SP, however.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    He watched the trailer, though.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 6,236
    Zekidk wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    he did mention Fukunaga wanting Safin to feel like he could come from anywhere and the accent evoking (paraphrasing here) 'a voice that could have been heard centuries ago'... evocative of Safin wanting to prolong his life/slow aging?
    ...where we not only have a chase, but the story continues with Bond's distrust in Madeleine). This is what makes action memorable: when there are real stakes for the character(s)-- and in the AM chase we see the stakes are two-fold: one is for survival, the other is the survival of their relationship... (which looks like it might end at the train station, only to be picked up again, in some form, later in the film)

    If Fukunaga is serious about "the action to feel dangerous" both Madeleine and Bond should be focusing 100% about getting out of Dodge and escaping their pursuers. After all, it if wasn't for the bulletproof glass in the DB5, they would both be dead.

    But no... Like with Mendes, another non action director, there just has to be something else going on at the same time during a setpiece, typically a conversation between the characters or crosscutting to an entire different place in the world.

    So in the middle of a car chase, Bond and Madeleine seemingly decide to have a discussion. They couldn't wait till they made it to safe distance - the train station, like any sane person, fearing for his or her life, would do.

    I honestly don’t think they’re monologuing. She asks a question. He replies. The rest of what we’ve seen doesn’t show them having any “conversation” at all. Although what we have heard adds to the tension of the scenes (between them and who these hit men may be).

    At least to me.

  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,579
    Zekidk wrote: »
    @jake24

    I am only using facts that we know about. With all the different cameras and angles and cameravehicles used, I am almost certain that this will be better shot and likely better paced than SP, however.
    I see no point in making assumptions based on a few seconds of footage. We have no clue how that conversation will unfold. I suggest waiting for the movie before stressing for no reason.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    edited December 2019 Posts: 4,219
    Zekidk wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    he did mention Fukunaga wanting Safin to feel like he could come from anywhere and the accent evoking (paraphrasing here) 'a voice that could have been heard centuries ago'... evocative of Safin wanting to prolong his life/slow aging?
    ...where we not only have a chase, but the story continues with Bond's distrust in Madeleine). This is what makes action memorable: when there are real stakes for the character(s)-- and in the AM chase we see the stakes are two-fold: one is for survival, the other is the survival of their relationship... (which looks like it might end at the train station, only to be picked up again, in some form, later in the film)

    But no... Like with Mendes, another non action director, there just has to be something else going on at the same time during a setpiece, typically a conversation between the characters or crosscutting to an entire different place in the world.

    The notion you are implying, that “action directors” never have this kind of approach, is simply not true. Anyway I see your point, but it’s way too early to complain and/or worry.
    Zekidk wrote: »
    @jake24

    I am only using facts that we know about. With all the different cameras and angles and cameravehicles used, I am almost certain that this will be better shot and likely better paced than SP, however.

    The only fact here is that scenes with Bond and Swann together in the DB5 will be just a small portion of the big set piece. Prior to this Bond is fighting and running all alone, so I highly doubt he will get caught in any conversation.
  • Posts: 3,051
    peter wrote: »
    She asks a question. He replies. The rest of what we’ve seen doesn’t show them having any “conversation” at all. Although what we have heard adds to the tension of the scenes (between them and who these hit men may be).
    Yes, you are probably right. It could be a very short conversation. But if I personally want to "feel" danger, it would be of images of Bond and Madeleine scared to death while escaping. I have always found arguing with your ally while trying to escape to save your life, kind of stupid.
  • edited December 2019 Posts: 5,735
    Zekidk wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    She asks a question. He replies. The rest of what we’ve seen doesn’t show them having any “conversation” at all. Although what we have heard adds to the tension of the scenes (between them and who these hit men may be).
    Yes, you are probably right. It could be a very short conversation. But if I personally want to "feel" danger, it would be of images of Bond and Madeleine scared to death while escaping. I have always found arguing with your ally while trying to escape to save your life, kind of stupid.

    You're probably not married.

    Anyway, it's probably just a line or two to establish that Bond and Madeleine are in the car, so we unconsciously take their presence as driver and passenger for granted during the chase.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 6,236
    Univex wrote: »
    Zekidk wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    She asks a question. He replies. The rest of what we’ve seen doesn’t show them having any “conversation” at all. Although what we have heard adds to the tension of the scenes (between them and who these hit men may be).
    Yes, you are probably right. It could be a very short conversation. But if I personally want to "feel" danger, it would be of images of Bond and Madeleine scared to death while escaping. I have always found arguing with your ally while trying to escape to save your life, kind of stupid.

    You're probably not married.

    Well done, @Univex , lol!!
  • edited December 2019 Posts: 5,735
    peter wrote: »
    Univex wrote: »
    Zekidk wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    She asks a question. He replies. The rest of what we’ve seen doesn’t show them having any “conversation” at all. Although what we have heard adds to the tension of the scenes (between them and who these hit men may be).
    Yes, you are probably right. It could be a very short conversation. But if I personally want to "feel" danger, it would be of images of Bond and Madeleine scared to death while escaping. I have always found arguing with your ally while trying to escape to save your life, kind of stupid.

    You're probably not married.

    Well done, @Univex , lol!!

    Right? I've said it countless times, if it happens that me and my wife are under attack, I'll have to render her unconscious and then take her on my back, Forest Gump style.
  • MinionMinion Don't Hassle the Bond
    Posts: 1,165
    @Zekidk, you might save these hot takes until you've actually seen the darn thing.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 6,236
    my wife tends to render me unconscious by pulling a surprise Draco punch to my jaw.
  • Posts: 3,051
    @Minion

    You are right. We shouldn't speculate. Let's keep this 561-pages thread limited to news and facts only.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 4,105
    Zekidk wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    he did mention Fukunaga wanting Safin to feel like he could come from anywhere and the accent evoking (paraphrasing here) 'a voice that could have been heard centuries ago'... evocative of Safin wanting to prolong his life/slow aging?
    ...where we not only have a chase, but the story continues with Bond's distrust in Madeleine). This is what makes action memorable: when there are real stakes for the character(s)-- and in the AM chase we see the stakes are two-fold: one is for survival, the other is the survival of their relationship... (which looks like it might end at the train station, only to be picked up again, in some form, later in the film)

    If Fukunaga is serious about "the action to feel dangerous" both Madeleine and Bond should be focusing 100% about getting out of Dodge and escaping their pursuers. After all, it if wasn't for the bulletproof glass in the DB5, they would both be dead.

    But no... Like with Mendes, another non action director, there just has to be something else going on at the same time during a setpiece, typically a conversation between the characters or crosscutting to an entire different place in the world.

    So in the middle of a car chase, Bond and Madeleine seemingly decide to have a discussion. They couldn't wait till they made it to safe distance - the train station, like any sane person, fearing for his or her life, would do.

    Yeah, I get ur point....but it depends on the conversation. Remember Bond & Anya, Bond & Wai Lin, Bond & Kara, Bond & Tracy. They all had conversations during the action scenes & it still worked. SP was the one that got it wrong. That conversation between Bond & Moneypenny during the car chase made it less gritty, unlike the one in QoS. The conversation in NTTD sounds & looks tense, so it definitely won't be like SP's.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    edited December 2019 Posts: 4,219
    Zekidk wrote: »
    You are right. We shouldn't speculate. Let's keep this 561-pages thread limited to news and facts only.

    The two of them being together just for the last part of the chase is basically a fact.
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    Zekidk wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    he did mention Fukunaga wanting Safin to feel like he could come from anywhere and the accent evoking (paraphrasing here) 'a voice that could have been heard centuries ago'... evocative of Safin wanting to prolong his life/slow aging?
    ...where we not only have a chase, but the story continues with Bond's distrust in Madeleine). This is what makes action memorable: when there are real stakes for the character(s)-- and in the AM chase we see the stakes are two-fold: one is for survival, the other is the survival of their relationship... (which looks like it might end at the train station, only to be picked up again, in some form, later in the film)

    If Fukunaga is serious about "the action to feel dangerous" both Madeleine and Bond should be focusing 100% about getting out of Dodge and escaping their pursuers. After all, it if wasn't for the bulletproof glass in the DB5, they would both be dead.

    But no... Like with Mendes, another non action director, there just has to be something else going on at the same time during a setpiece, typically a conversation between the characters or crosscutting to an entire different place in the world.

    So in the middle of a car chase, Bond and Madeleine seemingly decide to have a discussion. They couldn't wait till they made it to safe distance - the train station, like any sane person, fearing for his or her life, would do.

    Yeah, I get ur point....but it depends on the conversation. Remember Bond & Anya, Bond & Wai Lin, Bond & Kara, Bond & Tracy. They all had conversations during the action scenes & it still worked. SP was the one that got it wrong. That conversation between Bond & Moneypenny during the car chase made it less gritty, unlike the one in QoS. The conversation in NTTD sounds & looks tense, so it definitely won't be like SP's.

    Yes. Even tho the Rome chase wasn’t supposed to feel gritty. More like a lighthearted speed race in a metaphysical urban setting.
  • MinionMinion Don't Hassle the Bond
    edited December 2019 Posts: 1,165
    Zekidk wrote: »
    @Minion

    You are right. We shouldn't speculate. Let's keep this 561-pages thread limited to news and facts only.

    @Zekidk, generally, yes - this isn't the speculation thread, it's the Production News thread, so I'm glad we're in agreement there - but the lesson here is to work on how to better express your feels.

    "Based on the footage they've shown, I have some concerns that the action sequences may break the tension by cutting back and forth between bits of dialogue."

    See? Much better, and less reactionary and inflammatory.
  • DrinmanDrinman New York
    edited December 2019 Posts: 40
    The conversation between Bond and Madeline doesn't really bother me too much for three reasons:

    1- Bond is a veteran agent, one of the most elite spies in the world. He's been in more deadly situations in a week than most people will go through in their entire lives. The fact that he is able to communicate clearly and have a conversation during a deadly chase just shows how he is able to operate under extreme pressure.

    2- Also, the discussions of betrayal with Madeline probably spring from the fact that Bond is trying to make sense of the situation and get some kind of clue as to who may be chasing him. Is it Spectre? Another intelligence agency? MI6 trying to get rid of him since he might be a liability?

    3- It also injects the scene with some very interesting emotional content, which Spectre had none of. Bonds convo with Moneypenny during Rome chase was strictly a fact-finding, information calls whereas Bond and Madeline is a different beast altogether. is this woman really in love with him? Did she turn on him? Even if she did betray him he still feels obligated to protect her due to his attachment to her no? Lots of confusing and contradictory thoughts running through his head while being shot at and pursued. It definitely heightens the danger even more in my opinion.

  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    edited December 2019 Posts: 4,443
    Zekidk wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    he did mention Fukunaga wanting Safin to feel like he could come from anywhere and the accent evoking (paraphrasing here) 'a voice that could have been heard centuries ago'... evocative of Safin wanting to prolong his life/slow aging?
    ...where we not only have a chase, but the story continues with Bond's distrust in Madeleine). This is what makes action memorable: when there are real stakes for the character(s)-- and in the AM chase we see the stakes are two-fold: one is for survival, the other is the survival of their relationship... (which looks like it might end at the train station, only to be picked up again, in some form, later in the film)

    If Fukunaga is serious about "the action to feel dangerous" both Madeleine and Bond should be focusing 100% about getting out of Dodge and escaping their pursuers. After all, it if wasn't for the bulletproof glass in the DB5, they would both be dead.

    But no... Like with Mendes, another non action director, there just has to be something else going on at the same time during a setpiece, typically a conversation between the characters or crosscutting to an entire different place in the world.

    So in the middle of a car chase, Bond and Madeleine seemingly decide to have a discussion. They couldn't wait till they made it to safe distance - the train station, like any sane person, fearing for his or her life, would do.

    It seems to me that many "dangerous" action sequences also contain discussion. Star Wars (New Hope) did it quite a bit. In fact, there were often jokes being spoken in the midst of all of it.

    And the "Sam Mendes = not an action director" criticism is geting old and stale. I am not sure what you were watching during the PTS of both SF and SP. Besides, it seems that 1917 has put that crap to bed.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Zekidk wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    he did mention Fukunaga wanting Safin to feel like he could come from anywhere and the accent evoking (paraphrasing here) 'a voice that could have been heard centuries ago'... evocative of Safin wanting to prolong his life/slow aging?
    ...where we not only have a chase, but the story continues with Bond's distrust in Madeleine). This is what makes action memorable: when there are real stakes for the character(s)-- and in the AM chase we see the stakes are two-fold: one is for survival, the other is the survival of their relationship... (which looks like it might end at the train station, only to be picked up again, in some form, later in the film)

    If Fukunaga is serious about "the action to feel dangerous" both Madeleine and Bond should be focusing 100% about getting out of Dodge and escaping their pursuers. After all, it if wasn't for the bulletproof glass in the DB5, they would both be dead.

    But no... Like with Mendes, another non action director, there just has to be something else going on at the same time during a setpiece, typically a conversation between the characters or crosscutting to an entire different place in the world.

    So in the middle of a car chase, Bond and Madeleine seemingly decide to have a discussion. They couldn't wait till they made it to safe distance - the train station, like any sane person, fearing for his or her life, would do.

    Or perhaps the scenario prior, in the graveyard, is her ‘fault’ in some way - or at least that’s the way Bond perceives it - and he justifiably wants to give it to her with both barrels. Honestly, I think you’re being deliberately obtuse. As are others, who want their misgivings to drive the conversation here. Funnily enough most of us, like football fans, want to back our team regardless.
  • edited December 2019 Posts: 3,051
    RC7 wrote: »
    Funnily enough most of us, like football fans, want to back our team regardless.

    You are right. This forum is no place for sceptics, like any football stadium isn't a place for people criticizing the decisions made by the coach! Then they are not "proper" fans I guess the saying goes.
    Minion wrote: »
    the lesson here is to work on how to better express your feels.
    I'm not here to be taught any lesson. I'm here to express my expectations and to chime in on any speculation I find interesting. Like most others. You don't like how I express myself... feel free to ignore everything I am writing or flag my posts if you feel I am out of order.
    TripAces wrote: »
    I am not sure what you were watching during the PTS of both SF and SP.
    Best parts of both movies, although I believe the crosscutting to the MI6 HQ in SF took some tension out of the setpiece, alas my point.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    TripAces wrote: »
    And the "Sam Mendes = not an action director" criticism is geting old and stale. I am not sure what you were watching during the PTS of both SF and SP.

    IMO they're both very overrated.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Zekidk wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    Funnily enough most of us, like football fans, want to back our team regardless.

    You are right. This forum is no place for sceptics, like any football stadium isn't a place for people criticizing the decisions made by the coach! Then they are not "proper" fans I guess the saying goes.

    No, but most fans critique the performance post-game. Unless they just love wallowing in their own self pity.
  • edited December 2019 Posts: 3,051
    @RC7
    Self-pity you say?

    Due to extremely high expectations I left the theatre either a bit or a lot dissapointed after the last three Bond movies. Although it's hard for me to ignore the many things it does have going for it, maybe I am just trying to convince myself that this one is a dud, so I can be pleasantly surprised instead ;-) Sorry, if it was too much for some that I stirred the soup. We all have our own wishes for NTTD, and we all - I hope - want to leave the theatre smiling in April.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Each moment I draw closer to the Divine.
    Posts: 43,902
    Zekidk wrote: »
    @RC7
    Self-pity you say?

    Due to extremely high expectations I left the theatre either a bit or a lot dissapointed after the last three Bond movies. Although it's hard for me to ignore the many things it does have going for it, maybe I am just trying to convince myself that this one is a dud, so I can be pleasantly surprised instead ;-) Sorry, if it was too much for some that I stirred the soup. We all have our own wishes for NTTD, and we all - I hope - want to leave the theatre smiling in April.

    Not everyone. I can promise you some will resemble this man.
    78a708b3f04cc43a2b0f02b51efef907.png?w=656
    Worst. Bond movie. Ever.
    Rest assured, I am on my way to the internet to express my disgust!


    (Saved as draft ahead of the premiere.)
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Zekidk wrote: »
    @RC7
    Self-pity you say?

    Due to extremely high expectations I left the theatre either a bit or a lot dissapointed after the last three Bond movies. Although it's hard for me to ignore the many things it does have going for it, maybe I am just trying to convince myself that this one is a dud, so I can be pleasantly surprised instead ;-) Sorry, if it was too much for some that I stirred the soup. We all have our own wishes for NTTD, and we all - I hope - want to leave the theatre smiling in April.

    I would wholeheartedly love you to walk out delighted, as I would anyone here. It’s what’s we all want - I agree.
  • Posts: 15,989
    RC7 wrote: »
    Zekidk wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    Funnily enough most of us, like football fans, want to back our team regardless.

    You are right. This forum is no place for sceptics, like any football stadium isn't a place for people criticizing the decisions made by the coach! Then they are not "proper" fans I guess the saying goes.

    No, but most fans critique the performance post-game. Unless they just love wallowing in their own self pity.

    You're obviously not an Arsenal supporter :))
  • RC7RC7
    edited December 2019 Posts: 10,512
    RC7 wrote: »
    Zekidk wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    Funnily enough most of us, like football fans, want to back our team regardless.

    You are right. This forum is no place for sceptics, like any football stadium isn't a place for people criticizing the decisions made by the coach! Then they are not "proper" fans I guess the saying goes.

    No, but most fans critique the performance post-game. Unless they just love wallowing in their own self pity.

    You're obviously not an Arsenal supporter :))

    Ha ha! Honestly, I’d thought of adding that caveat but didn’t want to prod the Hornet’s nest!
  • Posts: 15,989
    RC7 wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    Zekidk wrote: »
    RC7 wrote: »
    Funnily enough most of us, like football fans, want to back our team regardless.

    You are right. This forum is no place for sceptics, like any football stadium isn't a place for people criticizing the decisions made by the coach! Then they are not "proper" fans I guess the saying goes.

    No, but most fans critique the performance post-game. Unless they just love wallowing in their own self pity.

    You're obviously not an Arsenal supporter :))

    Ha ha! Honestly, I’d thought of adding that caveat but didn’t want to prod the Hornet’s nest!

    Haha, I don't think you'd prod the Hornet’s nest as far as Arsenal fans goes with that caveat. The self pity and complaining is almost a thing of amusement at this point. ;-)
  • edited December 2019 Posts: 3,051
    I am on my way to the internet to express my disgust!
    Here's a good one from last week:

    http://www.platformmagazine.co.uk/culture-and-entertainment/opening-old-wounds-disabled-bond-villains-stuck-in-the-past/

    "Opening old wounds: Disabled Bond villains stuck in the past?
    this latest trailer shows that Bond may well be stuck in a past while the rest of the industry wishes to move on (...) surely a villain without some sort of disability should be a blindingly obvious move for the franchise to make. Maybe the next villain can just sport a dodgy haircut"


    ...or be.... normal? A regular PC guy (or woman)? No smoking, drinking, swearing, scars, walking sticks, eyepatches, sitting in a wheelchair and all that stuff, while he (or she) is underway with his (or her) master plan to kill thousands or even millions.
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