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  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    This is one match we still haven t had on my ranking tournament thread. My preference flipped during my Bondathon earlier. I am going to give it to QOS. It slipped into my top five now, while SF slipped right outside my top ten.
  • Junglist_1985Junglist_1985 Los Angeles
    Posts: 1,006
    This is one match we still haven t had on my ranking tournament thread. My preference flipped during my Bondathon earlier. I am going to give it to QOS. It slipped into my top five now, while SF slipped right outside my top ten.

    Same! I think it’s fair to say that, in general, as time passes Skyfall keeps falling down the rankings while QOS keeps rising. Skyfall’s flaws just become so apparent with more views and QOS’s flaws have become quite forgivable.
  • The_Bleeding_HeartThe_Bleeding_Heart Oakland, CA
    edited July 2019 Posts: 34
    For me, Skyfall has almost lost its rewatchability factor, whereas with QoS I can watch almost anytime. Maybe it’s because the latter film doesn’t spend an inordinate amount of time being ponderous or plodding in its pacing (not to mention the egregious amount of plot holes), unlike Skyfall.
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    Well I've just booked tickets for SF in Concert at Bridgewater Hall in Manchester and can't wait, while I don't think it's perfect, it sits at no. 5 in my rankings and is my 2nd favourite DC film.

    Shame they missed QOS but no real surprise considering the way that film is regarded outside the fanbase.

    Although the fact they didn't consider a ltd re-release of OHMSS for it's 50th is even worse in my book.

    Now if they could do OHMSS in concert that would be like a dream come true, the fact they've done SW, ESB, ET & Jurassic Park, surely someone can take on conducting Barry's Bond masterpiece in sinc with the film?

    Anyway I digress.

    QOS of my well raise in the fanbase rankings but it's fair to say SF will sustain it's position with the general public.

    This film is like GF, SWLM & GE, it's going to be continued to be loved by the general public for years to come.

    That being said I think on here the SF detractors just shout louder than it's fans which give it the impression of it's stock dropping. Possibly SF isn't as derieded here as it's dissenters would have us believe.

    I still love the film as I did on original release and can't wait to soak it up on the big screen with a live orchestra at the end of the year
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    SF is aeons ahead of QoS.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,000
    I used to be very generous to QOS, ranking it as high as #8, but these days it sits around the teens. Whereas SF has sat comfortably at #3 behind GF and FRWL since 2012. QOS is just so slight and rushed. And that damned editing, which makes the film feel less like Bond and more like a generic actioner that would have suited a nonentity like Gerard Butler. SF in contrast moves me. I feel far more invested during the climax whereas QOS feels unearned, especially with Greene being among the weakest of the villains.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,453
    For me, Skyfall has almost lost its rewatchability factor, whereas with QoS I can watch almost anytime. Maybe it’s because the latter film doesn’t spend an inordinate amount of time being ponderous or plodding in its pacing (not to mention the egregious amount of plot holes), unlike Skyfall.

    I must admit that I'm in the same boat as @The_Bleeding_Heart. QOS has a surprising rewatchability, perhaps because the fast pace and epileptic editing made me miss so much the first ten times, the film just keeps giving. ;-)

    In truth, though, QOS presents a lot of images I love and a James Bond who is confident and almost undefeatable. The whole "you might be too old for this game" thing from SF angers me a bit; it came much too soon in Craig's career as Bond and now we're stuck with a 007 who has already suffered a midlife crisis of sorts.

    Overall, while QOS felt like a botched project the first time I watched the film, it has grown on me--tremendously. SF has more or less stayed the same. I'm not saying that makes QOS the better film for me, but it is the more rewatchable IMO, and not just because of the shorter feature length.
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    edited July 2019 Posts: 4,043
    QOS niggles me far more than SF.

    I just think with the editing so frenetic, the boat sequence improved, no sink hole CGI nonsense and a bit more space to breathe with some more scenes like the ones between Bond and Mathis. The film would have been much better, I don't agree that the length is right, I think this would have been better sitting at the 1.50 - 2hr mark personally but that is me.

    That being said it sits inside my top 10 and I much rather watch it than LTK, the film I find it has the most in common, it sticks to it's guns and maintains it's tone, unlike Dalton's 2nd film.

    SF is more the plot holes but hell I'm having such fun watching it and it totally engages me that I can forgive it. SF for me despite some small issues is a blast and I don't get the it's too long comments one bit.

    Mendes for me made a cracking film but it should have been a one shot deal with him.
  • Posts: 12,243
    I love them both, but I think I prefer SF a little still. Became an instant personal favorite and has been so ever since its release. QOS used to be middle-lower, but it’s on the verge of my Top 10 now which is great placing for my list. SP is the only Craig film I’m not fond of. Hopefully B25 will keep it that way.
  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    Posts: 1,003
    Quantum Of Solace is probably my most watched Bond film...

    Total guilty pleasure. I love it. Such a unique style, its something different for sure.


    Great action film, girls, I actually like the music (Greene’s party music), the opera scene was really well put together. The car chase is one of the greatest car chases of all time.

    Seeing the car chase in theaters, you felt like you were sitting in the passenger seat.
  • RemingtonRemington I'll do anything for a woman with a knife.
    Posts: 1,532
    Quantum Of Solace is probably my most watched Bond film...

    Total guilty pleasure. I love it. Such a unique style, its something different for sure.


    Great action film, girls, I actually like the music (Greene’s party music), the opera scene was really well put together. The car chase is one of the greatest car chases of all time.

    Seeing the car chase in theaters, you felt like you were sitting in the passenger seat.

    👏👏👏👏
  • Daniel316Daniel316 United States
    Posts: 210
    I think QOS is miles better than Skyfall. it is a far more enjoyable film with a better performance from Craig, a decent villain, good score by David Arnold, Good action scenes, it actually has a bond girl, does not break continuity with the DB5 insert, and overall it is face paced. meanwhile Skyfall is far to slow and boring, gives physics the middle finger in the beginning (minus 2 points for that alone), the villain is a terrible mash up of the Joker and Alec Trevelyan, has horrible earbleeding music by Thomas Newman that ruins every scene, has a terrible Version of Q and Moneypenny, M dies for no reason other than shock, and the film just feels so bland and generic. Quantum is a lot better than Skyfall.
  • Posts: 6,729
    Daniel316 wrote: »
    I think QOS is miles better than Skyfall. it is a far more enjoyable film with a better performance from Craig, a decent villain, good score by David Arnold, Good action scenes, it actually has a bond girl, does not break continuity with the DB5 insert, and overall it is face paced. meanwhile Skyfall is far to slow and boring, gives physics the middle finger in the beginning (minus 2 points for that alone), the villain is a terrible mash up of the Joker and Alec Trevelyan, has horrible earbleeding music by Thomas Newman that ruins every scene, has a terrible Version of Q and Moneypenny, M dies for no reason other than shock, and the film just feels so bland and generic. Quantum is a lot better than Skyfall.

    Not subtle...but I would have to agree.
    Regarding Q and Moneypenny, I thought they were much better in SP.
    Moneypenny came across as trying too hard and Q as not trying hard enough!
    The action is pretty poor throughout apart from parts of the pts, and the scene where Bond turns the tables on his captors. It has grown on me a little, but it will never better QOS in my estimation, which just gets better and better with every viewing. Dare I say it is seriously challenging CR as Craig's best Bond!
  • Posts: 11,425
    bonspy wrote: »
    I realize that this thread began years ago, I have recently been re-examining QUANTUM OF SOLACE and while searching the site for posts regarding that film I ran across this from MI6_Cart and was compelled to address what was typed.

    MI6_Cart, although I appreciate your viewpoint on QUANTUM OF SOLACE, I am not completely certain that I agree with your comments on SKYFALL.
    I think that QOS is a very mis-maligned film. As MI6_Cart points out, the film appears to
    have a lot happening that is more of an undercurrent, rather than the obvious veneer, which is clearly visible on first viewing. If one watches the film with an eye toward the sub-plot occurrences, then things take shape that alters your perception of the overall movie.
    With Bond being the voice of reason for Camille in her quest for vengeance from Medrano, Bond's character displays some of the growth that M suggested a "blunt instrument" would find difficult in Casino Royale. At last, the "blunt instrument" gathers some of the perspective that he will need when he eventually confronts Vesper's former lover. With Yusef Kabirain in his pocket and the female Canadian operative dismissed with a warning, Bond can do as he pleases and get some payback for Vesper. Instead he merely turned the POS over to the proper authorities. After a brief discussion with M, Bond drops Vesper's necklace in the snow, his revenge is complete and he ascribes no value to the Algerian Love Knot any longer and simply walks away. Though he tried to hide his feelings for Vesper throughout the movie, whenever he is confronted with her memory his emotions are pretty transparent, especially for the individuals he works with. Intelligence community staffers are trained observers and have a good deal of training to discern motivations in others. There is little chance of Bond being able to fool any of them as he deals with Vesper's death, her betrayal and the people behind that betrayal, e.g., Kabirain. Bond's hope of disguising his emotions about Vesper are simply wasted time. When he confronts Kabirain, Bond does "the right thing" in the end. I'm not sure I would have been able to let the guy off the hook that easily.
    Something that MI6_Cart pointed out: "...Camille as a non-sexualized Bond girl..." Absolutely true, I thought it demonstrated growth in Bond and kept a professional attitude between him and Camille.
    The only serious problem I have with QUANTUM OF SOLACE is the MTV video-like editing. It's just fast at times and kind of jerky, for my tastes.

    In spite of having some issues with SKYFALL, it is still a very good movie. Though the more I watch it, with critical eyes, the more I am convinced it is not quite the "amazing" movie I initially thought it was.
    Some background on me: Among other careers, I'm an internet engineer and spent a decade doing it for a living beginning before there was a World Wide Web. Anyway, I know about computer networks and network security. My question is why, oh why, would an allegedly smart cookie and techno genius like Q plug an enemy's computer into MI6's secure network without precautions? When Q pulls that idiotic move, all hell breaks loose, just as Silva had hoped. It is beyond stupid and there is only one reason it would happen: to ramp up the plot.
    One of the other plot issues I have is that Bond takes M to Skyfall. What? Why would he do that? Again, there is only one reason that I can think of and that is to increase the tension in the plot, that's it. It is certainly not the course of action that someone well versed in personal protection would take. He hasn't been there for years, he doesn't know for certain what type of weaponry will be available to him there and if he has trouble that is beyond his ability to handle he has no back up plan at all. Who, in their right mind, would head to Skyfall for a "last stand" against Silva? I wouldn't and I'd be willing to wager that anyone reading this who has any tactical training, like Bond should have, would do it either. It is just a really bad idea. He had no idea that Kincaid was still residing there! That certainly shows that he knows zero about the current state of affairs at Skyfall.
    These two major problems bring to my mind the real culprit; lazy story telling, plain and simple.
    How much were Logan, Purvis and Wade paid for this script?
    The correct answer is: TOO BLOODY MUCH!
    Oh and Michael Wilson is said to have developed the story idea during the filming of QUANTUM OF SOLACE, so he needs to shoulder some responsibility too.

    I enjoyed reading your comments MI6_Cart. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

    Best to all-

    kia

    M16_Cart wrote: »
    Jazz007 wrote: »
    I fail to see the Batman influence (but I definitely see the Bond influence in Nolan's Batman).

    Thanks for your comments. I noticed Skyfall has a super-hero feeling to it. Raoul Silva is based off of the Joker, and the fact he lets himself get captured and escapes prison reinforces that more. And Craig is sort of a troubled superhero. He survives what would have killed anyone and climbs back from the ashes. He's Gotham's (or London's) dark knight, and he is both needed and underappreciated at the moment. Although there is no Two-Face, the themes of vindication in public office (that presides over the city) with M mirror that of Harvey Dent.

    If Craig's Bond was an action hero in QoS, he's an anti-hero superhero in Skyfall.

    Agree with your comments on SF. It's a clumsy film.
  • Posts: 11,425
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    For me, Skyfall has almost lost its rewatchability factor, whereas with QoS I can watch almost anytime. Maybe it’s because the latter film doesn’t spend an inordinate amount of time being ponderous or plodding in its pacing (not to mention the egregious amount of plot holes), unlike Skyfall.

    I must admit that I'm in the same boat as @The_Bleeding_Heart. QOS has a surprising rewatchability, perhaps because the fast pace and epileptic editing made me miss so much the first ten times, the film just keeps giving. ;-)

    In truth, though, QOS presents a lot of images I love and a James Bond who is confident and almost undefeatable. The whole "you might be too old for this game" thing from SF angers me a bit; it came much too soon in Craig's career as Bond and now we're stuck with a 007 who has already suffered a midlife crisis of sorts.

    Overall, while QOS felt like a botched project the first time I watched the film, it has grown on me--tremendously. SF has more or less stayed the same. I'm not saying that makes QOS the better film for me, but it is the more rewatchable IMO, and not just because of the shorter feature length.

    Always nice to hear QOS has gained credibility with people. I must be one of the few who really enjoyed it first time round. Forster is a talented director and although flawed, QOS is for me probably the best of the Craig era. Definitely the film that has the most rewatch value.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou. I can still hear my old hound dog barkin'.
    Posts: 8,657
    I can only say from the discussions on IMDb when QOS came out that I was one of very few defenders, finding it at least average or mediocre while numerous others failed to see any redeeming value. And yet I hated (and still hate) the editing. The one thing I appreciate about it is its curious effect on re-watchability: For the very reason that the editing is such a mess that you miss so many details the first time around, you always discover something new on a rewatch.

    QOS could have been a decent Bond film. I'm not complaining about the plot, as many do, just because it seems to be "only" about a country's water supply. But the finished product could have been so much better. The car chase in the beginning as well as the chase in Siena are a complete waste, IMO. I wish they'd do a re-cut, really. And make it 20 minutes longer.

    In comparison, I still think SKYFALL is truly the best Bond movie since FRWL (with GF and CR also sharing my personal top tier, but still). It's the Bond film I enjoyed most at a cinema (Odeon Leicester Square on public day one, by the way, and later in Hamburg), and the only one where there were actually ovations by the crowd in certain scenes (like the appearance of the old DB5, and to hell with continuity). I left the cinema in a really enthustiastic state, and had the feeling that so did many others.

    Or in short: QOS 7/10 (benevolently), SF 9/10.
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