The Saint (tv series and movies)

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  • Posts: 15,802
    Making The Saint into a film does sound a bit difficult to pull off; I agree with you @mtm, that the brand name isn't strong enough. But The Saint would be great as a mini series on a streaming service. Lupin on Netflix is a good example of how The Saint could look like in a modern setting, IMO.

    Afraid I'm in agreement here, too. A Netflix series could possibly work, but I gather most audiences today may be unfamiliar with THE SAINT to go flocking to the cinema. Considering this is a reimagining of THE SAINT, I think that will make people even less familiar with the character. The Val Kilmer version was also a reimagining that pretty much had nothing to do with Leslie Charteris' creation.
    I do enjoy that film, but it's not really Simon Templar.
  • Posts: 1,566
    Lupin is TERRICIC ! OK. I see it now. The Saint as a streamer could be very cool and entertaining. Still hope it would get top treatment, and be well-funded.
  • Posts: 14,816
    Just watching the 2017 film. Gosh it's not good. It feels like a cheap TV movie from the 90s. Or one of those b movies Brosnan used to make before he became Bond. Also the casting is mediocre at best.
  • Posts: 15,802
    Ludovico wrote: »
    Just watching the 2017 film. Gosh it's not good. It feels like a cheap TV movie from the 90s. Or one of those b movies Brosnan used to make before he became Bond. Also the casting is mediocre at best.

    I never saw it, but I thought it looked mediocre at best. I don't think that guy looked much like a plausible Simon Templar. In fact Val Kilmer looked like a better Simon Templar than him, IMO.
  • Posts: 14,816
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    Just watching the 2017 film. Gosh it's not good. It feels like a cheap TV movie from the 90s. Or one of those b movies Brosnan used to make before he became Bond. Also the casting is mediocre at best.

    I never saw it, but I thought it looked mediocre at best. I don't think that guy looked much like a plausible Simon Templar. In fact Val Kilmer looked like a better Simon Templar than him, IMO.

    I think it's a better film than Kilmer's, or at least it's more... Saintly. But it's weak. At least Ian Ogilvy as the villain seems to be having fun.
  • Posts: 9,770
    Ludovico wrote: »
    Just watching the 2017 film. Gosh it's not good. It feels like a cheap TV movie from the 90s. Or one of those b movies Brosnan used to make before he became Bond. Also the casting is mediocre at best.

    Is it available to watch somewhere?
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,941
    Seems to still be on Netflix in the UK.

    If you search for it on here it should tell you where you can see it in your region:
    https://www.justwatch.com/
  • Posts: 7,653
    It is another fun Saintly mess however it does have the fun of having both Roger Moore and Ian Ogilvy playing in the tv-movie which is worth watching it for.
  • edited February 2022 Posts: 5,806
    The 2017 movie will play in France (on NRJ 12) on wednesday, february 16th, at 21.10. I'll try to watch it (try, because i have to wake up every morning at 4.30 am to get to work, and movies start later and later, depending on what's before, and the length of ad breaks).

    EDIT : I just checked, and it's available on the french iTunes.
  • Posts: 14,816
    Risico007 wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    Just watching the 2017 film. Gosh it's not good. It feels like a cheap TV movie from the 90s. Or one of those b movies Brosnan used to make before he became Bond. Also the casting is mediocre at best.

    Is it available to watch somewhere?

    Netflix.
  • Posts: 14,816
    I watched it all now and boy it wasn't great. It really felt like an early 90s TV movie meant to be a pilot for a series. Everything is very cliché, the plot twists predictable and Ogilvy and Moore have more charisma than the lead.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,941
    Yes, he is very poor, sadly. His girlfriend is actually a better lead.

    The Saint is ultimately not all that fascinating as character as a concept (he's basically a guy that fights crime; there's quite a few of them!) so you really need to make him come alive with the casting. Regé-Jean Page seems like better casting than this guy but I'm not 100% sure on him (and I doubt it'll get made anyway).
  • edited February 2022 Posts: 14,816
    The Saint is very early(ish) 20th century as a character: a gentleman thief who fights crime. Very much like Arsène Lupin, except more brutal, at least in the novels. It feels outdated in our day and age. But I could see it working, if they'd be a bit inventive. Another issue I have with the movie is that everything is already established: Templar's status as an international criminal, the relationship he has with people, etc. I don't want an origin story, but it would have been much better to have him featured earlier in his career.
  • Fire_and_Ice_ReturnsFire_and_Ice_Returns I am trying to get away from this mountan!
    Posts: 23,325
    UK viewers the Black and White series starts March 20th on Talking Pictures.
    I will recored this as I only currently own the colour series.
  • Agent_99Agent_99 enjoys a spirited ride as much as the next girl
    Posts: 3,106
    Recent charity shop haul. £1.50 for this lot!

    FMd7pfYXMAcdsxY.jpg
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 17,797
    Agent_99 wrote: »
    Recent charity shop haul. £1.50 for this lot!

    FMd7pfYXMAcdsxY.jpg

    Those are great finds at a bargain price and look like quite early Pan covers. Of those covers I think I only have Saint Overboard.
  • Agent_99Agent_99 enjoys a spirited ride as much as the next girl
    Posts: 3,106
    Those stupid charity shop stickers though! Why!?
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,941
    Maybe try a hairdryer? I’ve heard that can work.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 17,797
    Agent_99 wrote: »
    Those stupid charity shop stickers though! Why!?

    Yes, they're very annoying and more often than not they end up tearing the cover of the book. There's a lot to be said for a price pencilled on the flyleaf which is how most second hand booksellers price their books. I do know of one that puts the prices on with stickers too which isn't great.
  • Posts: 14,816
    mtm wrote: »
    Maybe try a hairdryer? I’ve heard that can work.
    There was also a solution to take off stamps from envelopes, but can't remember what it was. Might work for tags too. Any philatelists among you?

    I don't know why they use price tags for second-hand pulp novels. Surely you just need to put a price on the bookshelves and that's it.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 17,797
    Ludovico wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    Maybe try a hairdryer? I’ve heard that can work.
    There was also a solution to take off stamps from envelopes, but can't remember what it was. Might work for tags too. Any philatelists among you?

    I don't know why they use price tags for second-hand pulp novels. Surely you just need to put a price on the bookshelves and that's it.

    I did used to collect stamps when I was a child and you could steam stamps off envelopes by using steam from the kettle. Not sure if that would work with stickers on books but it's worth a try I suppose.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,941
    I think steam will damage a book; getting one of those old paperbacks wet will make it curl up. I'm not 100% sure a hairdryer won't damage it too, but at least you could slip something between the cover and the pages to make sure they're not affected. I would imagine that you wouldn't want to get any heat near the spine though.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 17,797
    mtm wrote: »
    I think steam will damage a book; getting one of those old paperbacks wet will make it curl up. I'm not 100% sure a hairdryer won't damage it too, but at least you could slip something between the cover and the pages to make sure they're not affected. I would imagine that you wouldn't want to get any heat near the spine though.

    Yes, that's what I was thinking. It's very easy to damage books as any good book collector knows. I find that it's best to grasp the nettle with stickers as if you don't remove them pretty soon after purchase they tend to be much harder to remove later on when they've been affixed to the book for a long while. Of course every sticker and the gum holding it on is different so there's no hard and fast rule on this.
  • edited April 2022 Posts: 1,001
    Those paperbacks are beautiful.
    I think this forum could do with a proper dedicated Saint thread. I have lots of books and all the DVDs of the 60's series, it'd be fun to talk about these.
    I'd start a thread myself but there's the chance a mod will close the thread because there's another old thread somewhere in the distant past. This happened to a Lazenby thread today, and the thread just died because of it. The mods say "take the discussion here", and post a link, but no-one ever does.
    People don't like being told "you shouldn't have done that". As nice as it is to have a tidy forum, it's not always the best policy to chastise people for starting topics.
  • Agent_99Agent_99 enjoys a spirited ride as much as the next girl
    Posts: 3,106
    mtm wrote: »
    Maybe try a hairdryer? I’ve heard that can work.

    Thanks - I'll give that a try!

    I don't suppose the member who started this thread, @SaintMark, is still around? They should be able to change the title to make it more general. Or maybe a mod could do that for us.
  • Posts: 14,816
    mtm wrote: »
    I think steam will damage a book; getting one of those old paperbacks wet will make it curl up. I'm not 100% sure a hairdryer won't damage it too, but at least you could slip something between the cover and the pages to make sure they're not affected. I would imagine that you wouldn't want to get any heat near the spine though.

    Could be worth its own thread. How to treat old books, preserve them, get rid of price tags, etc.
  • Posts: 5,806
    A few decades ago, a specialist in the works of Maurice Leblanc, Michel Lebrun, decided to list the ten commandments the perfect gentleman thief had t follow if he wanted to be a successor to the master of them all, Arsène Lupin. I read in a magazine the list, and the various gentlemen thieves, and how they fared (the best ones only managed to respect seven of them). However, one name was absent : Simon Templar, which surprised me, give,n how much an influence Lupin was to him. So, let's see if Templar respects these commandments (admittedly, I haven't read all his adventures, but enough to make some educated guesses).

    1) Gentleman toujours resteras, dimanche et fête mêmement. (Gentleman you shall always be, including on sundays and feast days)

    One can say that Templar respects that one.

    2) Escroc, cambrioleur seras, mais toujours sympathiquement. (Conman and burglar you will be, but always sympathetically)

    Yes, definitely.

    3) Bandits et canailles dépouilleras, mais jamais les honnêtes gens. (Crooks and scoundrels you will rob, but never honest people).

    One hit more. In all his career, Templar has robbed the Ungodly, but never honest, hardworking people.

    4) Tes forfaits signeras, d’un bristol très élégamment. (Your crimes you will sign, with a bristol, very elegantly)

    Well, the Mark of the Saint is one of the most famous calling card in the world.

    5) Veuve et orphelin défendras, au péril de ta vie souvent. (Widow and orphan you will defend, with your life frequently)

    Definitely. Templar always defended the innocent from the enterprises of the ungodly.

    6) Homicide point ne seras, sauf exceptionnellement.(Homicidal you'll never be, except rarely)

    On that point, Templar is a bit more murderous than his model. Just a bit, mind you, but still...

    7) En amour, toujours séduiras, mais souffriras conséquemment. (In love, You'll always seduce, but will suffer consequently).

    Doesn't seem like Templar suffers from love. He was, after all, faithful to Patricia Holmes in the earlier novels, and the various women he met after that didn't seem to have made him suffer iin any way.

    8) Xénophobe te montreras, ton chauvinisme l’exigeant. (Xenophobic you will show yourself to be, your jingoism demanding it).

    On that point, Templar doesn't seem to have a xenophobic bone in his body (and as for Lupin, let's remember the time at which the novels were written, some occuring during World War One).

    9) Désinvolte et gouailleur seras, jusque dans tes derniers moments. (Flippant and cheeky you will be, even in your last moments)

    Definitely, and how !

    10) En expert te maquilleras, pour mieux égarer les agents. (In expert you will disguise yourself, the better to fool the cops).

    I haven't seen Templar putting some make-up, false beards and/or moustaches, or other disguises.

    Well, seven out of ten isn't bad, I think. What do you think ?
  • Posts: 7,653
    Agent_99 wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    Maybe try a hairdryer? I’ve heard that can work.

    Thanks - I'll give that a try!

    I don't suppose the member who started this thread, @SaintMark, is still around? They should be able to change the title to make it more general. Or maybe a mod could do that for us.

    Your wish is my command,

    I am still around but the last 4 movies of the most recent 007 era and its leading man and his influence on the series were not so much my cup of tea. Hence less involvement but still hovering around.
  • Posts: 2,895
    Gerard wrote: »
    Well, seven out of ten isn't bad, I think. What do you think ?

    I think you're right. As you noted, 7 out of 10 was the highest score of any non-Lupin gentleman thieves. Suffering in love doesn't seem very common for those types of antihero. And since many of them are cosmopolitan types, xenophobia wouldn't make sense, though some patriotism would. I haven't read much of Charteris, but I wouldn't be surprised if the Saint disguised himself on at least one occasion. Even Fleming's Bond, not known for disguises, did so in DAF and YOLT.

    Incidentally, I have tracked down an interview and an article where Leslie Charteris gives his views on Bond and Fleming. I will post them soon, and in the meantime can report that the creator of the Saint did not like James Bond.
  • Agent_99Agent_99 enjoys a spirited ride as much as the next girl
    Posts: 3,106
    SaintMark wrote: »
    Your wish is my command,

    I am still around but the last 4 movies of the most recent 007 era and its leading man and his influence on the series were not so much my cup of tea. Hence less involvement but still hovering around.

    Thank you, @SaintMark! Glad you're still with us, and I hope whatever happens next in the Bondiverse is more to your taste!
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