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Bond Movie A vs. Bond Movie B (Diamonds Are Forever vs. The World Is Not Enough)

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  • JBFan626JBFan626
    Posts: 1,497
    Getafix wrote:
    Grinderman wrote:
    Getafix wrote:
    ...Indeed, he doesn't just pull off the bad jokes and comedy, he makes it integral to the overall enjoyment of the film. It's a testament to his utter class as Bond.

    See, here's where The Great Divide begins between the major factions of JB fans. What you call "bad jokes" and "comedy", others (myself included) call glibness, flippancy and just plain bad writting.

    A matter of taste, I suppose. But one thing's for sure: the cliche 'over-the-topness' and coyness of Moore's films sure made Mike Myers a ton of money.

    I think there are those who see it as a Great Divide and others who see it as all part of the glorious mash-up that is Bond tradition. The seeds of the Moore brand of comedy were laid during Connery's tenure. OP has a lot more going for it than a few dodgy sight gags. If you want bad writing then check out the Brosnan outings.

    So true. Let's not forget about "the dragon" in Dr. No, Connery with the "duck hat" in GF, the jetpack in Thunderball, Bond "going Japanese." Comedy has always been there. It's just that Moore's genius was in making the humor complimentary to the film and to the enjoyment of it. Roger Moore made the comedy go hand in hand with the character.
  • 00Beast00Beast
    Posts: 4,762
    JBFan626 wrote:
    Getafix wrote:
    Grinderman wrote:
    Getafix wrote:
    ...Indeed, he doesn't just pull off the bad jokes and comedy, he makes it integral to the overall enjoyment of the film. It's a testament to his utter class as Bond.

    See, here's where The Great Divide begins between the major factions of JB fans. What you call "bad jokes" and "comedy", others (myself included) call glibness, flippancy and just plain bad writting.

    A matter of taste, I suppose. But one thing's for sure: the cliche 'over-the-topness' and coyness of Moore's films sure made Mike Myers a ton of money.

    I think there are those who see it as a Great Divide and others who see it as all part of the glorious mash-up that is Bond tradition. The seeds of the Moore brand of comedy were laid during Connery's tenure. OP has a lot more going for it than a few dodgy sight gags. If you want bad writing then check out the Brosnan outings.

    So true. Let's not forget about "the dragon" in Dr. No, Connery with the "duck hat" in GF, the jetpack in Thunderball, Bond "going Japanese." Comedy has always been there. It's just that Moore's genius was in making the humor complimentary to the film and to the enjoyment of it. Roger Moore made the comedy go hand in hand with the character.

    Exactly. Those that you mentioned from the Connery era are some of which you might need a laugh track in order to understand if it is supposed to be funny or not. Otherwise, you might think that it could be played seriously, whereas in the Moore era, we know exactly when to laugh, and it is genuinely funny.
  • GrindermanGrinderman
    Posts: 165
    00Beast wrote:
    JBFan626 wrote:
    Getafix wrote:
    Grinderman wrote:
    Getafix wrote:
    ...Indeed, he doesn't just pull off the bad jokes and comedy, he makes it integral to the overall enjoyment of the film. It's a testament to his utter class as Bond.

    See, here's where The Great Divide begins between the major factions of JB fans. What you call "bad jokes" and "comedy", others (myself included) call glibness, flippancy and just plain bad writting.

    A matter of taste, I suppose. But one thing's for sure: the cliche 'over-the-topness' and coyness of Moore's films sure made Mike Myers a ton of money.

    I think there are those who see it as a Great Divide and others who see it as all part of the glorious mash-up that is Bond tradition. The seeds of the Moore brand of comedy were laid during Connery's tenure. OP has a lot more going for it than a few dodgy sight gags. If you want bad writing then check out the Brosnan outings.

    So true. Let's not forget about "the dragon" in Dr. No, Connery with the "duck hat" in GF, the jetpack in Thunderball, Bond "going Japanese." Comedy has always been there. It's just that Moore's genius was in making the humor complimentary to the film and to the enjoyment of it. Roger Moore made the comedy go hand in hand with the character.

    Exactly. Those that you mentioned from the Connery era are some of which you might need a laugh track in order to understand if it is supposed to be funny or not. Otherwise, you might think that it could be played seriously, whereas in the Moore era, we know exactly when to laugh, and it is genuinely funny.

    I don't know. The slide whistle sounds effect and the Tarzan yell is "genuinely funny"? In my book, they're just plain stupid. Worse than stupid, they take you right out of the movie.

    My problem with the Moore-era comedy really comes down the fact that the comedy wasn’t very good – more groan inducing than laugh inducing – and that the franchise became far too reliant on the (so-called) comedy aspect.

    And if Connery's duck hat was the seed that lead to Moore's over-reliance on comedy, then Moore's constant shtick directly lead to lines such as "Ornithologist? That's a mouthful." And for that I’ll never be able to forgive. :)
  • 00Beast00Beast
    Posts: 4,762
    @Grinderman: Well no, the slide whistle and the Tarzan yell were not funny, not by any means. I wasn't referring to those, I just meant Roger's humor in general.
  • SirHenryLeeChaChingSirHenryLeeChaChing
    edited July 2012 Posts: 3,494
    The Connery films had a great sense of humor prior to DAF turning up more to Moore-like levels, it's just different from the Moore era and not as heavily relied on. It's a much drier sense of wit that's delivered more offhandedly and purposely not as overt as Sir Roger's brand, and not difficult to understand. Let's just say it's geared more to adults than teenagers and younger children, and may require a little bit more thought.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,894
    With Dr No, it's the film that is creaky. With OP, it's the star that's creaky.

    DN.
  • 0iker00iker0
    Posts: 501
    I love both of them, but Octopussy is, IMO not the best movie in the franchise, but the most entertaining of the whole series. Good PTS, good story development, not the best villains, but the best humor - seriousness interaction in the series. For example it's fun to see that the most serious and dramatic scene in the movie happens with bond in a clown suite.
    Dr. No. is good, if it wasn't there wouldn't be any series, but as it was the first it has some mistakes that would be solved in future productions. However it is in my top 5.
    5. Dr. No
    4. Octopussy
  • 00Beast00Beast
    Posts: 4,762
    @0iker0: Wow, this match was neck and neck for you I see!
  • JrW_008JrW_008 The North
    Posts: 112
    @00Beast presuming you have a list, what are your top 5 Bond films?
  • 00Beast00Beast
    Posts: 4,762
    JrW_008 wrote:
    @00Beast presuming you have a list, what are your top 5 Bond films?

    1. GoldenEye
    2. License to Kill
    3. A View to a Kill
    4. Tomorrow Never Dies
    5. From Russia with Love

    The top 5, my friend!
  • JrW_008JrW_008 The North
    Posts: 112
    A fellow fan of AVTAK I see! It's sort of a guilty pleasure of mine, it has been criticized alot yet there is something about it that has a nice feel to it, if that makes any sense. It is currently my number 7.
  • 00Beast00Beast
    Posts: 4,762
    JrW_008 wrote:
    A fellow fan of AVTAK I see! It's sort of a guilty pleasure of mine, it has been criticized alot yet there is something about it that has a nice feel to it, if that makes any sense. It is currently my number 7.

    Excellent! I've waited for more fans of AVTAK around here! Hahaha, I seem to be in the corner by myself usually when it comes to Roger's last outing! I don't see why it receives such harsh criticism. I think the plot is terrific and very interesting, Roger is in top performance, Christopher Walken plays Max Zorin perfectly, the soundtrack is quite intense, and the last 30-40 minutes is all top notch action suspense! Also, AVTAK is rather dark for a Bond movie, and I'm always a fan of the darker Bond movies, like GE and LTK in my top three.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,559
    Are we still discussing DN and OP?
  • DB5DB5
    Posts: 408
    I think when people start to go off topic it's time to call the round and move on to the next one. What's the score at this point by the way?
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 5,634
    I tried to add up, and got lost amid all the confusion and going off topic

    Doctor No, is way out in front, as you would expect - it is going to be a clear winner
  • JrW_008JrW_008 The North
    Posts: 112
    Apologies, got a little carried away finding someone else likes AVTAK.
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 5,634
    Yeh, that would put me into a state of shock too... ; - )
  • 00Beast00Beast
    Posts: 4,762
    DN- 24 votes
    OP- 14 votes

    Wow, yikes, a ten vote landslide by the 1962 Bond movie on this round!

    I'm opening up the floor for suggestions- anyone got some ideas?
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    GE v.s. CR maybe? A good camp of fans for each on here.
  • DB5DB5
    Posts: 408
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote:
    GE v.s. CR maybe? A good camp of fans for each on here.

    I'll second that one O'Brady. Assuming it hasn't been done already, Brosnan's first vs. Craig's first would make for a good competition. And as you said, each film has a loyal contingent of fans on this site.

  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,559
    Is someone actually keeping track of all the past entries? :) There ought to be a few hundreds of these possible, mathematically speaking.
  • DB5DB5
    Posts: 408
    Well now that I think about it, on second thought a better match up might be CR and TLD. Since TLD already beat GE, maybe Craig's first against Dalton's first; again assuming it hasn't already been done.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,489
    Anyone feeling up to going through all 109 pages and docking the competitions and winners?
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    edited July 2012 Posts: 13,350
    Creasy47 wrote:
    Anyone feeling up to going through all 109 pages and docking the competitions and winners?

    I do.

    I'll update this post soon. By the end of the day at the latest, I hope.

    FRWL beats TB
    DAF beats AVTAK
    TSWLM vs FYEO - TIE
    TMWTGG beats TND
    CR beats GF
    YOLT beats MR
    OP beats QOS
    LTK beats DN
    DAF beats TMWTGG
    OHMSS beats TLD
    LALD beats TWINE
    GF beats TSWLM
    OP beats GE
    QOS beat AVTAK
    TND beats TWINE
    TLD beats FYEO
    OHMSS beats FYEO
    TB beats OP
    MR beats TWINE
    DN beats GF
    TSWLM beats LALD
    LTK beats AVTAK
    GE beats TLD
    FYEO beats MR
    LTK beats QOS
    YOLT beats TND
    TLD beats TB
    GE beats FYEO
    DN beats MR
    LALD beats TMWTGG
    YOLT beats DAF
    AVTAK beats DAD
    OHMSS beats CR
    TSWLM beats MR
    GF beats GE
    TSWLM beats LTK
    OHMSS beats DN
    OP beats FYEO
    GE beats LALD
    FRWL beats OHMSS
    TB beats LTK
    MR beats AVTAK
    DAF beats DAD
    GF beats FYEO
    TLD beats TWINE
    YOLT beats QOS
    CR beats DN
    FRWL beats LTK
    GE beats TSWLM
    TLD beats GF
    LALD beats MR
    OHMSS beats GE
    TWINE beats AVTAK
    QOS beats MR
    TB beats GF
    TLD beats YOLT
    TMWTGG beats AVTAK
    FYEO beats LALD
    QOS beats TND
    DN beats OP
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,489
    @Samuel001, sounds good, we all appreciate it. Maybe then @00Beast can look through and have a better idea of what we've done.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,350
    Do you want the scores as well as the match ups?
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,489
    I'm not sure what he would like. You can go with both, unless it proves to be too much work, then I'm sure a 'A VS. B, WINNER IS _' type layout would work.
  • DB5DB5
    Posts: 408
    I'd suggest giving the results with the chronology of the films. So you'd start with all the DN competitns first DN vs GF, winner is DN; DN vs OP, winner is DN, etc., then all the FRWL competitions, all the way until QoS. Unless that would be too much work.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,350
    OK, done! Copy that list to the first page. That way, we can keep track of what's been done before. We are currently on match-up 60, as it happens.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,489
    Nice work. If you aren't on when @00Beast returns, I'll be sure to let him know if he doesn't see your post. Upon a quick glance, it appears FRWL has yet to be beaten.
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