The Music of No Time To Die - Original Score By Dan Romer

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  • Posts: 511
    I highly disagree with people on this. Serra's score was great, Arnold was great, and Newman was one to forget.

    And that's OK! I'm in the (seemingly niche) camp of being as hadcore a David Arnold fan as they come, and yet I really, really loved Tom Newman's work on the last two films as well.

    Serra's GE score didn't appeal to me at all when I was younger, but as I've aged I've learned to appreciate it in many more ways. Still not my favorite, but I think it's actually quite innovative and more unique/classically Bond than it gets credit for. I mean, if you love John Barry, I find it hard to believe you can totally hate the fella who wrote "We Share the Same Passions."
  • Posts: 511
    I do wonder if Romer will collaborate with the artist for the title song... When’s the last time that happened?

    "You Know My Name" from "Casino Royale".

    Arnold worked "Another Way to Die" into the QOS score a lot, as well. He was really quite the team player on that film.
  • edited July 2 Posts: 2,569
    @tqb

    Yes, Romer is a synth-and-beep guy, but let's not be entirely unfair: judging from his IG, he plays several instruments, so a musician he most certainly is. Less synth-and-beep experiments and more strings, horns and brass - traditional Bond music - and he could probably pull it off. Let's have faith now and complain later ;-)

    As long as his score don't sound dated in 10-20 years, like others who wanted to do their own contemporary experiments (Hamlish, Serra, Conti) it will suffice.
  • The_Bleeding_HeartThe_Bleeding_Heart Oakland, CA
    Posts: 18
    I do wonder if Romer will collaborate with the artist for the title song... When’s the last time that happened?

    "You Know My Name" from "Casino Royale".

    Ahh, of course! Thanks for the reminder, it’d been awhile. Now I need to go listen to YNMN all over again, such an awesome Bond theme.
  • edited July 2 Posts: 1,291
    AgentM72 wrote: »
    tqb wrote: »
    Copied from a Facebook post but I think they make a good point:

    The main issue is that those guys are not musicians at all, they are mere sound manipulators with their synthesizers , strange noises and beeps... Forget the melodic line, the orchestra, the good mix of old and new. Why don't they cast real musicians?

    I don't agree with this at all, and I think it's a little insulting.

    Film composing is a wondrous creative landscape that allows for an unlimited range of melodies, sounds and flavours to enrich the film the music is supporting. It's not about writing great music to stand on its own, although that's always a nice bonus. It's about creating an engrossing cinematic experience that feels right and feels honest and emphasizes the emotions for the audience that the experience has been specifically designed to produce.

    Melody is part of that. Sound is part of that. Ambience is part of that. It's all the same toolbox, and as stories and narratives and characters' inner lives become increasingly complex (and real) in the way they're depicted on screen, so should the music that supports them.

    Just because the first trumpet part or the principle violin aren't carrying an instantly recognizable leitmotif for 120 straight minutes doesn't mean that an ambient score—synthesized or otherwise—can't get the job done in a compelling way.

    There is no absolute right answer. It's all about the experience.

    And I say this as a 'classic' Bond music fan in the sense that David Arnold could return, deliver an absolute pastiche near-copy of the Goldfinger score, and I'd love it to death. But as much as I'd love to always stay firmly in that John Barry sandbox, the series can't—and won't—survive if it simply played it that safe all the time.

    I sympathize with the hesitation, believe me. I thought very differently about this not all that long ago. But at this point, I'm all for rolling the dice with a new voice and a new sound that respects and builds on the old.

    Why wouldn't the series survive if it gave us another Bond film with Arnold doing his nods to John Barry? That is the most ridiculous thing I've read today.

    And as for modern day music composers, that Facebook comment was spot on. Moody atmos tracks are easy, ten-a-penny. Any student musician could knock up moody ambience on their electronic keyboards. Composing strong melodies is a fine art that only a handful of legendary musicians could really achieve - the likes of Morricone, Williams, Goldsmith, and of course, our very own John Barry. Arnold was becoming closer with each new Bond film to reaching those heights, but now he has been robbed of the chance.

    Instead, we have to look forward to another second rate `composer' with his keyboard tricks to give us electro moody vibes. Every example of Romer's that I've listened to on YouTube in the past hour is pretty depressing. I haven't heard one example to prove this guy has it in him to write a strong, melodic score that Barry could do in his sleep - and for that matter - so could Arnold.
  • 00Ralf00Ralf Germany
    Posts: 138
    Well, at this early stage I can only hope that:

    a) he uses more Bond theme than Newman, and not only the first few notes of it, but also the orchestral explosion of Bondiness. Newman nearly got that during the Mexico City helicopter scene when Bond re-gains control over the chopper - I was getting ready to celebrate, when it abruptly ended. Also, laying it only over the end credits is not enough, imho.

    b) he weaves in the main theme into the score (but I guess that depends on how they coordinate the main theme with the scoring of the rest of the film, time-wise)

    c) he takes a more of an 'orchestral' and 'melodic' approach, and less of a 'moody', 'generically repetitive' and unmemorable one (I'm not a music expert, hence I'm using these terms in a layman's fashion. Memorability is my no. 1 criterion, I guess. Basically, I'd like to be able to hum the tracks walking down the street.)

    Some time ago I heard a rumour that they don't use the Bond Theme that often anymore, because they're obliged to pay exorbitant royalties. Is that true? Or is it purely the composer's choice not to do it?
  • DoctorKaufmannDoctorKaufmann Germany
    Posts: 812
    I'll try to stay open-minded about Romer and give him a chance. Certainly a outside the box decision. But after I have listened to the examples on YouTube, why not? I was sceptic about Serra, and about Newman, as the scores I knew, were also quite heavy on synth. I would have liked to get Arnold back, or to get Daniel Pemberton, but I am willing to be surprised.
  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld Minnesota USA
    Posts: 2,282
    00Ralf wrote: »
    Well, at this early stage I can only hope that:

    a) he uses more Bond theme than Newman, and not only the first few notes of it, but also the orchestral explosion of Bondiness. Newman nearly got that during the Mexico City helicopter scene when Bond re-gains control over the chopper - I was getting ready to celebrate, when it abruptly ended. Also, laying it only over the end credits is not enough, imho.

    b) he weaves in the main theme into the score (but I guess that depends on how they coordinate the main theme with the scoring of the rest of the film, time-wise)

    c) he takes a more of an 'orchestral' and 'melodic' approach, and less of a 'moody', 'generically repetitive' and unmemorable one (I'm not a music expert, hence I'm using these terms in a layman's fashion. Memorability is my no. 1 criterion, I guess. Basically, I'd like to be able to hum the tracks walking down the street.)

    Some time ago I heard a rumour that they don't use the Bond Theme that often anymore, because they're obliged to pay exorbitant royalties. Is that true? Or is it purely the composer's choice not to do it?

    His scores definitely sound moody
  • edited July 2 Posts: 1,291
    00Ralf wrote: »
    Well, at this early stage I can only hope that:

    a) he uses more Bond theme than Newman, and not only the first few notes of it, but also the orchestral explosion of Bondiness. Newman nearly got that during the Mexico City helicopter scene when Bond re-gains control over the chopper - I was getting ready to celebrate, when it abruptly ended. Also, laying it only over the end credits is not enough, imho.

    b) he weaves in the main theme into the score (but I guess that depends on how they coordinate the main theme with the scoring of the rest of the film, time-wise)

    c) he takes a more of an 'orchestral' and 'melodic' approach, and less of a 'moody', 'generically repetitive' and unmemorable one (I'm not a music expert, hence I'm using these terms in a layman's fashion. Memorability is my no. 1 criterion, I guess. Basically, I'd like to be able to hum the tracks walking down the street.)

    Some time ago I heard a rumour that they don't use the Bond Theme that often anymore, because they're obliged to pay exorbitant royalties. Is that true? Or is it purely the composer's choice not to do it?

    You are hoping what I and many others are hoping for too. Whether Romer has the chops to pull it off remains to be seen.

    The only thing that would give me confidence at this stage is if this guys went on an interview and came out with things like `Barry was one of my idols in the music film world. He will be my inspiration when composing the score, evoking his sound while also trying to modernise it too. I'm even looking at reworking the `007' theme, which was last heard in Moonraker, etc. etc....'

    If I heard these types of comments coming from Romer, then I would be fully on board too. As it is, I am remaining very sceptical. Other than the Jamaica location and the use of the Aston Martin from TLD, there isn't much I'm excited about with Bond 25 currently.

    The news of this `composer' just made my trepidation even worse...
  • edited July 2 Posts: 511
    .
  • Posts: 511

    Why wouldn't the series survive if it gave us another Bond film with Arnold doing his nods to John Barry? That is the most ridiculous thing I've read today.

    That's specifically not what I said, and fundamentally not what I meant.

    I'd have loved that approach for Bond 25. As stated. You and I, it seems, share a passion for Arnold's work and he's clearly our preferred choice.

    But the same way Arnold was an evolution, we need to be open to other evolutions. And the music ultimately needs to fit the film. That's the most important thing. And I trust in CJF and Romer to know that, and get it right.





  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded Dancing at midnight under the BeBop Moon
    Posts: 11,482
    I don't mind moody music, as that is appropriate for some scenes. What matters to me is that it really fits, uplifts the film.
    And yes, I want the Bond theme in there sometimes. But I'm open minded about this choice and I want this film to not be too much like older films, including the music - but still retaining the Bondian feeling. Which can be done, I feel sure.
  • Posts: 511
    00Ralf wrote: »
    Well, at this early stage I can only hope that:

    a) he uses more Bond theme than Newman, and not only the first few notes of it, but also the orchestral explosion of Bondiness. Newman nearly got that during the Mexico City helicopter scene when Bond re-gains control over the chopper - I was getting ready to celebrate, when it abruptly ended. Also, laying it only over the end credits is not enough, imho.

    b) he weaves in the main theme into the score (but I guess that depends on how they coordinate the main theme with the scoring of the rest of the film, time-wise)

    c) he takes a more of an 'orchestral' and 'melodic' approach, and less of a 'moody', 'generically repetitive' and unmemorable one (I'm not a music expert, hence I'm using these terms in a layman's fashion. Memorability is my no. 1 criterion, I guess. Basically, I'd like to be able to hum the tracks walking down the street.)

    Some time ago I heard a rumour that they don't use the Bond Theme that often anymore, because they're obliged to pay exorbitant royalties. Is that true? Or is it purely the composer's choice not to do it?

    You are hoping what I and many others are hoping for too. Whether Romer has the chops to pull it off remains to be seen.

    The only thing that would give me confidence at this stage is if this guys went on an interview and came out with things like `Barry was one of my idols in the music film world. He will be my inspiration when composing the score, evoking his sound while also trying to modernise it too. I'm even looking at reworking the `007' theme, which was last heard in Moonraker, etc. etc....'

    If I heard these types of comments coming from Romer, then I would be fully on board too. As it is, I am remaining very sceptical. Other than the Jamaica location and the use of the Aston Martin from TLD, there isn't much I'm excited about with Bond 25 currently.

    The news of this `composer' just made my trepidation even worse...

    In fairness, Newman's SPECTRE interviews were those exact platitudes as well.
  • edited July 2 Posts: 1,291
    AgentM72 wrote: »

    Why wouldn't the series survive if it gave us another Bond film with Arnold doing his nods to John Barry? That is the most ridiculous thing I've read today.

    That's specifically not what I said, and fundamentally not what I meant.

    I'd have loved that approach for Bond 25. As stated. You and I, it seems, share a passion for Arnold's work and he's clearly our preferred choice.

    But the same way Arnold was an evolution, we need to be open to other evolutions. And the music ultimately needs to fit the film. That's the most important thing. And I trust in CJF and Romer to know that, and get it right.

    Ok fair enough, I misunderstood your post.

    At least you have more faith than I do. From what I have learned of CJF and Romer's work, we are in modernised Netflix TV Box set moody territory - a million miles away from majestically sweeping, uplifting beautiful scenes like this -





  • edited July 2 Posts: 2,569
    I haven't heard one example to prove this guy has it in him to write a strong, melodic score that Barry could do in his sleep - and for that matter - so could Arnold.

    The days when people are hired into the franchise because of their merits are over. (Arnold did some fantastic scores and won awards before he was considered, same with Hamlish, Conti, Serra).

    Now all they have to do is to be a friend, or earlier collaborator, of the director, because modern directors don't know how to work with composers they have never met, or something?

    Imagine if Ryan Johnson brought Nathan Jonson onboard as composer to replace John Williams for SW: Last Jedi, just because they've worked together on 'Looper' - it would be ludicrous.
  • edited July 2 Posts: 1,291
    Zekidk wrote: »
    I haven't heard one example to prove this guy has it in him to write a strong, melodic score that Barry could do in his sleep - and for that matter - so could Arnold.

    The days when people are hired into the franchise because of their merits are over. (Arnold did some fantastic scores and won awards before he was considered, same with Hamlish, Conti, Serra).

    Now all they have to do is to be a friend, or earlier collaborator, of the director, because modern directors don't know how to work with composers they have never met, or something?

    Imagine if Ryan Johnson brought Nathan Jonson onboard as composer to replace John Williams for SW: Last Jedi, just because they've worked together on 'Looper' - it would be ludicrous.

    Exactly!
    Spot on, mate!
  • Posts: 3,613
    AgentM72 wrote: »
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    AgentM72 wrote: »
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    Maybe this will be a cross between Eric Serra and Michel Legrand?

    I don't think it will sound anything like that.

    It's hard to guess at this point, but I'd look to Pemberton's work on UNCLE as a possible comparison. Very much the spy sound, without leaning directly on some of the more blatant stereotypes and cliches.

    I'm kind of half kidding. I'm listening to some of Romer's work on Youtube, and it isn't grabbing me. Reminds me a bit of John Tesh or somebody.
    I do hope he's not too intimidated to use the Bond theme once in awhile.

    If I were in his seat, I'd go the opposite way. Really lean into it and reinvent/re-orchestrate the way it's used. Make it, truly, Bond's theme in the film and give it new life by appreciating its elements in new ways.

    I come back to Lorne Balfe's Fallout score a lot, on this topic. That score is so driven by the presence of the Mission: Impossible theme—but it's picked apart and rebuilt and used in all sorts of newly inventive ways. On paper you'd practically be able to criticize him for turning to it too much, but in practice it works so damn well. Big sound, little sound, fast-paced, haunting—he uses it for every mode and every mood.

    Would love to see Romer bring the Bond theme to the forefront with a similar treatment in B25.

    I would have liked Balfe to get it. He is much hated on soundtrack forums, but I loved his Fallout score. He does add a lot of dynamism to ambient. Lovely rework of MI theme in The Exchange, sort of Schifrin meets euphoria.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded Dancing at midnight under the BeBop Moon
    Posts: 11,482
    @jetsetwilly ummm, Cary has worked with him on 3 of his films. Good films, judging by what I've read. So a wee bit more than "hiring a friend". ;)
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 3,513
    vzok wrote: »
    AgentM72 wrote: »
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    AgentM72 wrote: »
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    Maybe this will be a cross between Eric Serra and Michel Legrand?

    I don't think it will sound anything like that.

    It's hard to guess at this point, but I'd look to Pemberton's work on UNCLE as a possible comparison. Very much the spy sound, without leaning directly on some of the more blatant stereotypes and cliches.

    I'm kind of half kidding. I'm listening to some of Romer's work on Youtube, and it isn't grabbing me. Reminds me a bit of John Tesh or somebody.
    I do hope he's not too intimidated to use the Bond theme once in awhile.

    If I were in his seat, I'd go the opposite way. Really lean into it and reinvent/re-orchestrate the way it's used. Make it, truly, Bond's theme in the film and give it new life by appreciating its elements in new ways.

    I come back to Lorne Balfe's Fallout score a lot, on this topic. That score is so driven by the presence of the Mission: Impossible theme—but it's picked apart and rebuilt and used in all sorts of newly inventive ways. On paper you'd practically be able to criticize him for turning to it too much, but in practice it works so damn well. Big sound, little sound, fast-paced, haunting—he uses it for every mode and every mood.

    Would love to see Romer bring the Bond theme to the forefront with a similar treatment in B25.

    I would have liked Balfe to get it. He is much hated on soundtrack forums, but I loved his Fallout score. He does add a lot of dynamism to ambient. Lovely rework of MI theme in The Exchange, sort of Schifrin meets euphoria.

    That score is a grower. Initially didn't like it, but now I play it regularly. It's great fun. "Stairs And Rooftops" is superb.
  • edited July 2 Posts: 1,291
    @jetsetwilly ummm, Cary has worked with him on 3 of his films. Good films, judging by what I've read. So a wee bit more than "hiring a friend". ;)

    Where did I say `hiring a friend'....??

    And he may have done `good films'. The pair of them may have collaborated on `good films'. Newman and Mendes did `good films'.

    Still doesn't mean their collaboration style will be ideally suited for Bond. Moody scores don't usually suit Bond, unless the composer has it in him to do uplifting pieces too as a contrast.

    Right now there is not one single shred of evidence to prove this guy has it in him to do an uplifting Barry piece. I sincerely hope I'm proved wrong.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 2,477
    00Ralf wrote: »
    Some time ago I heard a rumour that they don't use the Bond Theme that often anymore, because they're obliged to pay exorbitant royalties. Is that true? Or is it purely the composer's choice not to do it?
    I highly doubt it's the reason. The Bond theme is used often in the new scores, it's just that it's really subtle. Arnold only used the vamp in CR because he want Bond to earn it. Newman didn't use it too much simply because he doesn't like using other people's works (hence why he didn't weave the theme song into the score).

    That said, I just remembered that Mendes said "WOTW" was recorded in January, that is two months after filming started. I know with all the troubles they had recently it might be too early for that, but I wonder if they might be recording it around September-October or so.
  • Posts: 348
    Not happy with this at all. Arnold should have been brought back. He is the only one who gets John Barry, and brings enough of those sounds into a Bond film which has been severely lacking in Craig's past 2 outings.

    From the examples I've heard, it sounds like Bond 25 will be another moody Newman type job, which I'm sick to death of. I was really hoping Arnold would have returned. It was the one thing I was holding out for (that, and some unused Fleming scenes).

    So I'm already disappointed now by Bond 25 from the choice of composer. Here's hoping we at least get a few lifted Fleming scenes (although again, wishful thinking.)

    I really think the producers need to sell the franchise on to people who know what they are doing with Bond. I think Babs and Wilson's time is up.

    Cubby knew he needed to stick with Barry whenever possible, and he also knew he had to still rely on Fleming, even during the 80's when the novel titles dried up. Short stories and scenes were still heavily relied upon. Other than CR, we haven't seen any Fleming scenes adapted since LTK in 1989. Instead, we've had to suffer poor attempts at `Fleming re-imagined' by P&W.

    Agreed. I'm largely prepared to take a break from the franchise until new blood is brought in. Purvis and Wade were tired more than a decade ago, and it's clear MGW's hand is no longer on the tiller. Babs may have his name, but she doesn't have a tenth of the talent of her father.
  • Posts: 1,291
    MooreFun wrote: »
    Not happy with this at all. Arnold should have been brought back. He is the only one who gets John Barry, and brings enough of those sounds into a Bond film which has been severely lacking in Craig's past 2 outings.

    From the examples I've heard, it sounds like Bond 25 will be another moody Newman type job, which I'm sick to death of. I was really hoping Arnold would have returned. It was the one thing I was holding out for (that, and some unused Fleming scenes).

    So I'm already disappointed now by Bond 25 from the choice of composer. Here's hoping we at least get a few lifted Fleming scenes (although again, wishful thinking.)

    I really think the producers need to sell the franchise on to people who know what they are doing with Bond. I think Babs and Wilson's time is up.

    Cubby knew he needed to stick with Barry whenever possible, and he also knew he had to still rely on Fleming, even during the 80's when the novel titles dried up. Short stories and scenes were still heavily relied upon. Other than CR, we haven't seen any Fleming scenes adapted since LTK in 1989. Instead, we've had to suffer poor attempts at `Fleming re-imagined' by P&W.

    Agreed. I'm largely prepared to take a break from the franchise until new blood is brought in. Purvis and Wade were tired more than a decade ago, and it's clear MGW's hand is no longer on the tiller. Babs may have his name, but she doesn't have a tenth of the talent of her father.

    Spot on!
    Give that man a beer!
  • Posts: 11,492
    Will have to listen to some of his work? Don't really know much about him.
  • Posts: 1,291
    RogueAgent wrote: »
    Will have to listen to some of his work? Don't really know much about him.

    You'll be close to slashing your wrists after hearing some of the electro moody garbage he has churned up.
  • Posts: 11,492
    RogueAgent wrote: »
    Will have to listen to some of his work? Don't really know much about him.

    You'll be close to slashing your wrists after hearing some of the electro moody garbage he has churned up.

    :)) Sounds exciting then!!! =))
  • Posts: 2,569
    Walecs wrote: »
    Newman didn't use it too much simply because he doesn't like using other people's works (hence why he didn't weave the theme song into the score).
    Not true. He used both. SF in Macao, SP in Morocco.
  • edited July 2 Posts: 10,757
    He's a singer song writer as well. Maybe he will perform the theme tune.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dan_Romer

    But seriously apparently he produced a hit song for Christina Aguillera so maybe he could write the title song or at least collaborate.

    That producer and collaborative role is what also Arnold brought.

    Say Something is actually a pretty good song as well.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded Dancing at midnight under the BeBop Moon
    Posts: 11,482
    Ah yes, it was @Zekidk 's comment, but you concurred.
    Should have mentioned it directly to him.

    I am fine with Romer being on board. As I've said, I think it's good (and expected) that Cary would choose someone he's worked with before. I look forward to different music in this Bond film, yet still retaining enough Bondian flare. I'm not concerned.
  • Posts: 9,352
    RogueAgent wrote: »
    Will have to listen to some of his work? Don't really know much about him.

    You'll be close to slashing your wrists after hearing some of the electro moody garbage he has churned up.

    I tried listening to some of his stuff earlier today. Reminded me of Kenny G or John Tesh. Maybe I'm thinking of Yanni? Either way nothing remotely resembling a Bond sound, IMO.
    Although we really can't judge until the film comes out, I suspect Eon wants a different sound this time, and not particularly a Bond sound.
    I think we may end up with something more comparable to Michel LeGrand's NSNA, with the obligatory, (now over used Craig era) Bond theme saved for the end credits.
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