Where does Bond go after Craig?

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Comments

  • Posts: 1,517
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    I'm only disappointed reading her comments because we wait so long for these films lately, and it feels like they're a chore for the creatives involved. Comments like that just come across as disrespectful, especially given how much attention they gave to her involvement and her talent

    That's typical Hollywood and a press that likes rave on about the latest thing. I love her work on Fleabag, but I have no idea what her contributions were to NTTD.
  • timdalton007timdalton007 North Alabama
    Posts: 154
    Reading some of the responses to her comments gives me some deja vu to Doctor Who fandom’s responses to when episode writers and even Jodie Whittaker admitted to not being massive fans of it before coming to be involved with it. And especially the opinion expressed akin to “If you’re not an expert on the franchise, you shouldn’t be making it.”

    That’s something that seems to ignore the realities of how the business works, for starters. But also perhaps speaks to the fact that things like Bond, Sherlock Holmes, and Doctor Who are long-running cultural icons that everyone thinks they know and telling a story with them is simple. The fact seems to be that it’s anything but simple.
  • edited March 2023 Posts: 6,677
    They should get an already proven writer, proficient in every genre and format, and with massive insight on the novels and films, and a fan,…
    …hey, here I am :D
    PM me, EON. I’ll do it for free ;)

    BTW, I’m just being rather immodest because this is anonymous.
  • I do believe Eon is holding things closer to the vest. Whether that means there’s a script, a director locked in, or an actor they’ve already had discussions with, who knows?

    Wasn’t Sam Mendes unofficially attached to SKYFALL for nearly a year before he was officially announced?

    I am guessing they have a deal with Nolan that he will be officially announced around the release of Oppenheimer to boost its box office.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,526
    Univex wrote: »
    They should get an already proven writer, proficient in every genre and format, and with massive insight on the novels and films, and a fan,…
    …hey, here I am :D
    PM me, EON. I’ll do it for free ;)

    BTW, I’m just being rather immodest because this is anonymous.

    Don't be modest, you're the greatest writer I've (n)ever heard of! ;)
  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 2,513
    Reading some of the responses to her comments gives me some deja vu to Doctor Who fandom’s responses to when episode writers and even Jodie Whittaker admitted to not being massive fans of it before coming to be involved with it. And especially the opinion expressed akin to “If you’re not an expert on the franchise, you shouldn’t be making it.”

    That’s something that seems to ignore the realities of how the business works, for starters. But also perhaps speaks to the fact that things like Bond, Sherlock Holmes, and Doctor Who are long-running cultural icons that everyone thinks they know and telling a story with them is simple. The fact seems to be that it’s anything but simple.

    That's true mate.
    I wouldn't say a writer needs to be a fan of the series, sometimes an objective opinion is needed, but I would say it would help to do their "homework" on Daniel's era at least. As NTTD wasn't a new story, it was wrapping up his arc and tying up loose ends
  • Posts: 6,677
    Univex wrote: »
    They should get an already proven writer, proficient in every genre and format, and with massive insight on the novels and films, and a fan,…
    …hey, here I am :D
    PM me, EON. I’ll do it for free ;)

    BTW, I’m just being rather immodest because this is anonymous.

    Don't be modest, you're the greatest writer I've (n)ever heard of! ;)

    Indeed...I most certainly am ;)
  • ImpertinentGoonImpertinentGoon Everybody needs a hobby.
    Posts: 1,351
    That's the thing with these massive, long-running things like Bond and Dr Who and Star Trek. How do you balance keeping the thing the thing while also not just doing the same thing over and over and over again. I don't have any numbers, so this might be anecdotal, but I think it's commonly accepted that most of the first let's say 10 films have the formula and the elements we connect with Bond, but not every single one has every single trope. Whereas many of the newer ones seem like the first production meeting is something like:
    We obviously have to have 3 action sequences one of which a car chase, at least 3 locations plus London, villain, henchman, 2 Bond women, M, Q, Moneypenny, Tanner, the PPK, an Aston (preferably both an old one and a current model), a watch, "shaken not stirred", at least one sex scene, a character twist and a black tie sequence. So what are your ideas, Mr. Screenwriter?
    I honestly think the features that make CR and SF stand out is that the first is very stripped down away from many of these elements, while SF cites so many of these tropes while acknowledging them as such and being mindful of that. Just look at the way they used the DB5. CR gives us the origin, but it's not the souped up version we know. It's just a nice oldtimer. SF (somehow) returns the original car, but then uses it because it is old and then blows it up. That's (one of) the disappointing thing about SP and NTTD: They just have these symbols in the film and no subtext to it. "The V8 is cool. Let's have one shot with it..."
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 8,501
    Subtext is an underlying idea that's not deliberately stated.

    I thought there was plenty of subtext for the V-8: Fifteen years ago a young James Bond won an Aston Martin DB5 in a gambling match. He fell in love with this car and , over the years, bought one or two other models, keeping them in storage. The V-8 was one of them.

    Re: PWB:

    She is one of the most talented writers working at the moment.

    Her comments seem more self deprecating and maybe even reverential to Daniel Craig, than anything else...

    She actually had a difficult job to do on NTTD: outside of character work (which she excels at), she was also brought on board to work on the depiction and exposition of the Heracles Project. Exposition is deadly, and when it's "on the nose", it's absolutely brutal to listen to in a film.

    PWB took a sci-fi concept and made it palatable for worldwide audiences. That is a difficult job, tremendously difficult to simplify it, not make it sound "scripty", and assured that most audiences understood what the concept was.

  • Posts: 1,517
    peter wrote: »
    Subtext is an underlying idea that's not deliberately stated.

    I thought there was plenty of subtext for the V-8: Fifteen years ago a young James Bond won an Aston Martin DB5 in a gambling match. He fell in love with this car and , over the years, bought one or two other models, keeping them in storage. The V-8 was one of them.

    Re: PWB:

    She is one of the most talented writers working at the moment.

    Her comments seem more self deprecating and maybe even reverential to Daniel Craig, than anything else...

    She actually had a difficult job to do on NTTD: outside of character work (which she excels at), she was also brought on board to work on the depiction and exposition of the Heracles Project. Exposition is deadly, and when it's "on the nose", it's absolutely brutal to listen to in a film.

    PWB took a sci-fi concept and made it palatable for worldwide audiences. That is a difficult job, tremendously difficult to simplify it, not make it sound "scripty", and assured that most audiences understood what the concept was.

    Do you have a source for PWB's work? I too like her; however, I am curious about her contributions to NTTD.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 8,501
    I’m sure there must be reports out there, but—

    A quick google search gave me this, @CrabKey :

    https://www.indiewire.com/2021/09/phoebe-waller-bridge-shaped-no-time-to-die-plot-1234667662/amp/

    I’m in the industry and had access to information that she was on the job and it was far more than anyone was giving credit to.

    However, her role went beyond just being a script doctor (that was more Scott Burns’s role and probably why he didn’t get a credit (my understanding is he came in and punched up the action sequences (I’m sure there are reports on this as well)).

    I’m on a project at the moment, adapting BA Paris’s novel, The Therapist. It’s been challenging and rewarding, but I can understand a little of what PWB walked into when she took on writing duties for NTTD.

    Knowing how much she actually did do on the script, and reading her comments, she was clearly being her usual self deprecating self. And she obviously thinks highly of Craig. But in the end, she was being modest and deflected attention from herself.
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,554
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Phoebe Waller-Bridge admits James Bond producers rejected her early ideas for No Time To Die screenplay because they were 'too camp'

    'I should naturally have done a lot of Bond research... I didn't do a huge amount of research for it,'
    'I'm not very good at homework. That says a lot. Sometimes it is frustrating when you say, "I think this is genius," and they are like, "Next time."'

    'It is fun playing in someone else's sandpit for a while as you learn stuff,' she added. 'I certainly learned what my Bond film would be like.
    'I learned how mine might have been slightly too camp. A bit misogynistic really. Daniel [Craig] knows that character better than anyone"


    Firstly, I know we as fans care too much about the series, but these sort of quotes frustrate me. How do you get to write for a prestigious series like Bond and not care enough to do your homework.

    Honestly you could tell watching the scenes PWB had a hand in writing (M scene, Blofeld, Cuba scenes, in particular) because the interactions were so jarring between characters, they felt like entirely different characters.

    So going forwards I hope EON employ writers who care enough to do their homework, not just use these iconic characters to tell the stories they choose.

    I disagree with that statement.....

    Based on what?
  • Posts: 1,517
    peter wrote: »
    I’m sure there must be reports out there, but—

    A quick google search gave me this, @CrabKey :

    https://www.indiewire.com/2021/09/phoebe-waller-bridge-shaped-no-time-to-die-plot-1234667662/amp/

    I’m in the industry and had access to information that she was on the job and it was far more than anyone was giving credit to.

    However, her role went beyond just being a script doctor (that was more Scott Burns’s role and probably why he didn’t get a credit (my understanding is he came in and punched up the action sequences (I’m sure there are reports on this as well)).

    I’m on a project at the moment, adapting BA Paris’s novel, The Therapist. It’s been challenging and rewarding, but I can understand a little of what PWB walked into when she took on writing duties for NTTD.

    Knowing how much she actually did do on the script, and reading her comments, she was clearly being her usual self deprecating self. And she obviously thinks highly of Craig. But in the end, she was being modest and deflected attention from herself.

    I have no doubt she was being modest and self-deprecating. I only ask because there is so much speculation on this site. I appreciate your response.
  • LucknFateLucknFate 007 In New York
    Posts: 1,430
    peter wrote: »
    I’m sure there must be reports out there, but—

    A quick google search gave me this, @CrabKey :

    https://www.indiewire.com/2021/09/phoebe-waller-bridge-shaped-no-time-to-die-plot-1234667662/amp/

    I’m in the industry and had access to information that she was on the job and it was far more than anyone was giving credit to.

    However, her role went beyond just being a script doctor (that was more Scott Burns’s role and probably why he didn’t get a credit (my understanding is he came in and punched up the action sequences (I’m sure there are reports on this as well)).

    I’m on a project at the moment, adapting BA Paris’s novel, The Therapist. It’s been challenging and rewarding, but I can understand a little of what PWB walked into when she took on writing duties for NTTD.

    Knowing how much she actually did do on the script, and reading her comments, she was clearly being her usual self deprecating self. And she obviously thinks highly of Craig. But in the end, she was being modest and deflected attention from herself.

    Thanks for the insight and good luck on your adaptation.
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    edited March 2023 Posts: 3,390
    TripAces wrote: »
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Phoebe Waller-Bridge admits James Bond producers rejected her early ideas for No Time To Die screenplay because they were 'too camp'

    'I should naturally have done a lot of Bond research... I didn't do a huge amount of research for it,'
    'I'm not very good at homework. That says a lot. Sometimes it is frustrating when you say, "I think this is genius," and they are like, "Next time."'

    'It is fun playing in someone else's sandpit for a while as you learn stuff,' she added. 'I certainly learned what my Bond film would be like.
    'I learned how mine might have been slightly too camp. A bit misogynistic really. Daniel [Craig] knows that character better than anyone"


    Firstly, I know we as fans care too much about the series, but these sort of quotes frustrate me. How do you get to write for a prestigious series like Bond and not care enough to do your homework.

    Honestly you could tell watching the scenes PWB had a hand in writing (M scene, Blofeld, Cuba scenes, in particular) because the interactions were so jarring between characters, they felt like entirely different characters.

    So going forwards I hope EON employ writers who care enough to do their homework, not just use these iconic characters to tell the stories they choose.

    I disagree with that statement.....

    Based on what?

    Just my opinion, but I don't think it that way, I mean is Craig really knows the character better than anyone? Sounds to me like an exaggeration.

    For me personally, I just don't believe that Craig knows the character better than anyone, he did played the character well, but knows the character better than anyone?

    As much as I liked Craig as an actor, but this opinion is a bit too far.
  • JustJamesJustJames London
    Posts: 203
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Phoebe Waller-Bridge admits James Bond producers rejected her early ideas for No Time To Die screenplay because they were 'too camp'

    'I should naturally have done a lot of Bond research... I didn't do a huge amount of research for it,'
    'I'm not very good at homework. That says a lot. Sometimes it is frustrating when you say, "I think this is genius," and they are like, "Next time."'

    'It is fun playing in someone else's sandpit for a while as you learn stuff,' she added. 'I certainly learned what my Bond film would be like.
    'I learned how mine might have been slightly too camp. A bit misogynistic really. Daniel [Craig] knows that character better than anyone"


    Firstly, I know we as fans care too much about the series, but these sort of quotes frustrate me. How do you get to write for a prestigious series like Bond and not care enough to do your homework.

    Honestly you could tell watching the scenes PWB had a hand in writing (M scene, Blofeld, Cuba scenes, in particular) because the interactions were so jarring between characters, they felt like entirely different characters.

    So going forwards I hope EON employ writers who care enough to do their homework, not just use these iconic characters to tell the stories they choose.

    I disagree with that statement.....

    Based on what?

    Just my opinion, but I don't think it that way, I mean is Craig really knows the character better than anyone?

    For me personally, I just don't believe that Craig knows the character better than anyone.

    He’s been playing his version for many many years, and has a producing role. Every line and moment *that version* of the character has had, he, by nature of his job has been there for. Since the Craig era is very much a self-contained thing, I think it is very likely he does know it better than anyone, especially since he has had various elements of creative control certainly from QoS onwards. (Writers strike meant him and the director had to make up a fair bit for a start…) There *are* some actors who claim an element of false-knowledge over their characters, or get them changed to suit them as people (step forwards Patrick Stewart) but usually they weren’t so involved in the behind the scenes stuff as Craig was with his interpretation of Bond.

    It’s funny, because Craig got what Brosnan had been asking for for a while. And even what Connery would have liked, and got, in NSNA. Moore and Dalton *less* interested in that, but even they had some element of control and voiced their opinions.

    The statement isn’t that Craig knows ‘James Bond’ the character that has existed in various forms, literary, cinematic, comic strip, etc etc all different since 53, better than anyone — but he does know ‘James Bond’ the character that existed from 2005 on screen (and the couple of video games he was involved in) better than anyone. Not least because he was given a greater control over the role than was usual, by a series of events and co-incidences. He didn’t do too bad a job, in the end, all things considered. But I don’t think the next actor will have that involvement.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 8,501
    No problem @CrabKey and @LucknFate , and thank you @LucknFate !
  • ImpertinentGoonImpertinentGoon Everybody needs a hobby.
    Posts: 1,351
    peter wrote: »
    Subtext is an underlying idea that's not deliberately stated.

    I thought there was plenty of subtext for the V-8: Fifteen years ago a young James Bond won an Aston Martin DB5 in a gambling match. He fell in love with this car and , over the years, bought one or two other models, keeping them in storage. The V-8 was one of them.

    Is it subtext, when we the viewers make up a backstory for some storybeat that isn't explained? I take back my hyperbolic statement that there is no subtext to it, but basically just doing the Skyfall reveal again and then doing nothing else with the car is a bit lame, don't you think? And didn't Fukunaga specifically state something along the lines of "It doesn't have to make sense. Mendes got the DB5. I think the V8 is cooler, so I did a cool reveal scene for it, like he did with the DB5"?
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 8,501
    @ImpertinentGoon , I believe Cary did say that, but it doesn’t mean he didn’t shoot the scene without some kind of subtext on his part.

    Considering Bond’s history, and this Bond’s history in particular (‘06-21), it’s not hard to imagine what this subtext may be…

    And yes, when it comes to subtext, the artist will take the information that he has shared with us within the story and/or the history of the character (whether Bond, or Superman or Hannibal Lecter…) and layer his/her scenes with it.

    We will never exactly know what the artist is thinking, and to a degree, subtext IS up to the individuals in an audience. That’s what makes art so subjective….
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 5,979
    peter wrote: »
    Subtext is an underlying idea that's not deliberately stated.

    I thought there was plenty of subtext for the V-8: Fifteen years ago a young James Bond won an Aston Martin DB5 in a gambling match. He fell in love with this car and , over the years, bought one or two other models, keeping them in storage. The V-8 was one of them.

    Re: PWB:

    She is one of the most talented writers working at the moment.

    Her comments seem more self deprecating and maybe even reverential to Daniel Craig, than anything else...

    She actually had a difficult job to do on NTTD: outside of character work (which she excels at), she was also brought on board to work on the depiction and exposition of the Heracles Project. Exposition is deadly, and when it's "on the nose", it's absolutely brutal to listen to in a film.

    PWB took a sci-fi concept and made it palatable for worldwide audiences. That is a difficult job, tremendously difficult to simplify it, not make it sound "scripty", and assured that most audiences understood what the concept was.

    @peter, you're right. It makes sense that Bond would collect a few cars--I mean he's supposed to die before 40 and what else is he going to spend it on? ;)
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 8,501
    echo wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    Subtext is an underlying idea that's not deliberately stated.

    I thought there was plenty of subtext for the V-8: Fifteen years ago a young James Bond won an Aston Martin DB5 in a gambling match. He fell in love with this car and , over the years, bought one or two other models, keeping them in storage. The V-8 was one of them.

    Re: PWB:

    She is one of the most talented writers working at the moment.

    Her comments seem more self deprecating and maybe even reverential to Daniel Craig, than anything else...

    She actually had a difficult job to do on NTTD: outside of character work (which she excels at), she was also brought on board to work on the depiction and exposition of the Heracles Project. Exposition is deadly, and when it's "on the nose", it's absolutely brutal to listen to in a film.

    PWB took a sci-fi concept and made it palatable for worldwide audiences. That is a difficult job, tremendously difficult to simplify it, not make it sound "scripty", and assured that most audiences understood what the concept was.

    @peter, you're right. It makes sense that Bond would collect a few cars--I mean he's supposed to die before 40 and what else is he going to spend it on? ;)

    We are reading from the same page, @echo !
  • Posts: 1,707
    Nolan would make a questionable director for Bond, at best, because it needs to have pacing, clarity and CHARM.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,025
    My biggest concern would be his control of the sound mixing. What he tried with his most recent films was atrocious.
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,554
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Phoebe Waller-Bridge admits James Bond producers rejected her early ideas for No Time To Die screenplay because they were 'too camp'

    'I should naturally have done a lot of Bond research... I didn't do a huge amount of research for it,'
    'I'm not very good at homework. That says a lot. Sometimes it is frustrating when you say, "I think this is genius," and they are like, "Next time."'

    'It is fun playing in someone else's sandpit for a while as you learn stuff,' she added. 'I certainly learned what my Bond film would be like.
    'I learned how mine might have been slightly too camp. A bit misogynistic really. Daniel [Craig] knows that character better than anyone"


    Firstly, I know we as fans care too much about the series, but these sort of quotes frustrate me. How do you get to write for a prestigious series like Bond and not care enough to do your homework.

    Honestly you could tell watching the scenes PWB had a hand in writing (M scene, Blofeld, Cuba scenes, in particular) because the interactions were so jarring between characters, they felt like entirely different characters.

    So going forwards I hope EON employ writers who care enough to do their homework, not just use these iconic characters to tell the stories they choose.

    I disagree with that statement.....

    Based on what?

    Just my opinion, but I don't think it that way, I mean is Craig really knows the character better than anyone? Sounds to me like an exaggeration.

    For me personally, I just don't believe that Craig knows the character better than anyone, he did played the character well, but knows the character better than anyone?

    As much as I liked Craig as an actor, but this opinion is a bit too far.

    I look at it as a practical matter. Every actor who played Bond at least a couple of times likely knew the character better than the actor who preceded him. I'm going to assume that they all read the books (Craig said he did). But Craig had 20 films to also work from. By comparison, Brosnan had 16. Dalton only had 14. And so on.

    From that standpoint, I expect the next Bond to know the character better than anyone.
  • Posts: 3,279
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Phoebe Waller-Bridge admits James Bond producers rejected her early ideas for No Time To Die screenplay because they were 'too camp'

    'I should naturally have done a lot of Bond research... I didn't do a huge amount of research for it,'
    'I'm not very good at homework. That says a lot. Sometimes it is frustrating when you say, "I think this is genius," and they are like, "Next time."'

    'It is fun playing in someone else's sandpit for a while as you learn stuff,' she added. 'I certainly learned what my Bond film would be like.
    'I learned how mine might have been slightly too camp. A bit misogynistic really. Daniel [Craig] knows that character better than anyone"


    Firstly, I know we as fans care too much about the series, but these sort of quotes frustrate me. How do you get to write for a prestigious series like Bond and not care enough to do your homework.

    Honestly you could tell watching the scenes PWB had a hand in writing (M scene, Blofeld, Cuba scenes, in particular) because the interactions were so jarring between characters, they felt like entirely different characters.

    So going forwards I hope EON employ writers who care enough to do their homework, not just use these iconic characters to tell the stories they choose.

    I disagree with that statement.....

    Based on what?

    Just my opinion, but I don't think it that way, I mean is Craig really knows the character better than anyone? Sounds to me like an exaggeration.

    For me personally, I just don't believe that Craig knows the character better than anyone, he did played the character well, but knows the character better than anyone?

    As much as I liked Craig as an actor, but this opinion is a bit too far.

    I think Dalton was the only actor who really got a grip on the Fleming Bond character. I would argue he knew the character better than anyone, as he researched the Fleming books meticulously.

    After that I'd probably say Connery, as he spent time with Fleming, and had to create and adapt the screen character from scratch, as there was nothing before it to compare to.

    He understood the essence of the character, and it also helped that he embodied many of the characteristics naturally, without needing to act.

    Craig's interpretation was not bad, but I never really saw the Fleming Bond much. In NTTD the exchange two hander scene with Blofeld is probably the most far removed moment from the Fleming Bond that I have ever seen on film. Yes, it is even further removed than all the tongue-in-cheek moments from the Moore era, and the OTT amateur dramatics from the Brosnan era.

    That one scene alone in NTTD concluded for me that Craig didn't really understand Bond as much as he claimed he did.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    Posts: 2,928
    Bond calling Franz 'Blofield' during the Belmarsh scene in NTTD - written into the script as a way of goading or undermining? Or a slip of the tongue that no one picked up at any point?
  • JustJamesJustJames London
    Posts: 203
    Franz was his “brother” Blofeld was the thing that destroyed that. Bond answers to ‘007’ as though it is a name, which makes it a name (one he gave up to Nomi at this point). Franz is the man, Blofeld is the killer (and it’s a lime taken from Fleming) and you can argue the same is true for layers of Bond — ‘James’ is the man, ‘Bond’ is the professional, and ‘007’ is the tool, the killer, the blunt instrument.
    Blofeld is the identity tied to Spectre, and all that entails. So when he dies it is as that identity.
    Which of course is something similar to what happens at the end, depending on who is communicating via radio etc. Madeline calls him James, Q tends towards ‘Bond’ and M towards ‘007’ showing the relationships… a shift in naming shows a shift in how the characters are thinking at the time.
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    edited March 2023 Posts: 3,390
    JustJames wrote: »
    Franz was his “brother” Blofeld was the thing that destroyed that. Bond answers to ‘007’ as though it is a name, which makes it a name (one he gave up to Nomi at this point). Franz is the man, Blofeld is the killer (and it’s a lime taken from Fleming) and you can argue the same is true for layers of Bond — ‘James’ is the man, ‘Bond’ is the professional, and ‘007’ is the tool, the killer, the blunt instrument.
    Blofeld is the identity tied to Spectre, and all that entails. So when he dies it is as that identity.
    Which of course is something similar to what happens at the end, depending on who is communicating via radio etc. Madeline calls him James, Q tends towards ‘Bond’ and M towards ‘007’ showing the relationships… a shift in naming shows a shift in how the characters are thinking at the time.

    Never thought of that, that's interesting.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    edited March 2023 Posts: 5,979
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Phoebe Waller-Bridge admits James Bond producers rejected her early ideas for No Time To Die screenplay because they were 'too camp'

    'I should naturally have done a lot of Bond research... I didn't do a huge amount of research for it,'
    'I'm not very good at homework. That says a lot. Sometimes it is frustrating when you say, "I think this is genius," and they are like, "Next time."'

    'It is fun playing in someone else's sandpit for a while as you learn stuff,' she added. 'I certainly learned what my Bond film would be like.
    'I learned how mine might have been slightly too camp. A bit misogynistic really. Daniel [Craig] knows that character better than anyone"


    Firstly, I know we as fans care too much about the series, but these sort of quotes frustrate me. How do you get to write for a prestigious series like Bond and not care enough to do your homework.

    Honestly you could tell watching the scenes PWB had a hand in writing (M scene, Blofeld, Cuba scenes, in particular) because the interactions were so jarring between characters, they felt like entirely different characters.

    So going forwards I hope EON employ writers who care enough to do their homework, not just use these iconic characters to tell the stories they choose.

    I disagree with that statement.....

    Based on what?

    Just my opinion, but I don't think it that way, I mean is Craig really knows the character better than anyone? Sounds to me like an exaggeration.

    For me personally, I just don't believe that Craig knows the character better than anyone, he did played the character well, but knows the character better than anyone?

    As much as I liked Craig as an actor, but this opinion is a bit too far.

    I think Dalton was the only actor who really got a grip on the Fleming Bond character. I would argue he knew the character better than anyone, as he researched the Fleming books meticulously.

    After that I'd probably say Connery, as he spent time with Fleming, and had to create and adapt the screen character from scratch, as there was nothing before it to compare to.

    He understood the essence of the character, and it also helped that he embodied many of the characteristics naturally, without needing to act.

    Craig's interpretation was not bad, but I never really saw the Fleming Bond much. In NTTD the exchange two hander scene with Blofeld is probably the most far removed moment from the Fleming Bond that I have ever seen on film. Yes, it is even further removed than all the tongue-in-cheek moments from the Moore era, and the OTT amateur dramatics from the Brosnan era.

    That one scene alone in NTTD concluded for me that Craig didn't really understand Bond as much as he claimed he did.

    TLD is one of my favorites, and I love Dalton's portrayal. He had the advantage--as did Craig and Connery--to launch his Bond with a pretty close Fleming adaptation. Strawberry jam and all.

    But I never got the impression that Connery was trying to follow Fleming's Bond. It's as if he had his own swagger.

    The others (except for Lazenby, who squandered it) never had that Fleming opportunity.
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    edited March 2023 Posts: 3,390
    echo wrote: »
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Phoebe Waller-Bridge admits James Bond producers rejected her early ideas for No Time To Die screenplay because they were 'too camp'

    'I should naturally have done a lot of Bond research... I didn't do a huge amount of research for it,'
    'I'm not very good at homework. That says a lot. Sometimes it is frustrating when you say, "I think this is genius," and they are like, "Next time."'

    'It is fun playing in someone else's sandpit for a while as you learn stuff,' she added. 'I certainly learned what my Bond film would be like.
    'I learned how mine might have been slightly too camp. A bit misogynistic really. Daniel [Craig] knows that character better than anyone"


    Firstly, I know we as fans care too much about the series, but these sort of quotes frustrate me. How do you get to write for a prestigious series like Bond and not care enough to do your homework.

    Honestly you could tell watching the scenes PWB had a hand in writing (M scene, Blofeld, Cuba scenes, in particular) because the interactions were so jarring between characters, they felt like entirely different characters.

    So going forwards I hope EON employ writers who care enough to do their homework, not just use these iconic characters to tell the stories they choose.

    I disagree with that statement.....

    Based on what?

    Just my opinion, but I don't think it that way, I mean is Craig really knows the character better than anyone? Sounds to me like an exaggeration.

    For me personally, I just don't believe that Craig knows the character better than anyone, he did played the character well, but knows the character better than anyone?

    As much as I liked Craig as an actor, but this opinion is a bit too far.

    I think Dalton was the only actor who really got a grip on the Fleming Bond character. I would argue he knew the character better than anyone, as he researched the Fleming books meticulously.

    After that I'd probably say Connery, as he spent time with Fleming, and had to create and adapt the screen character from scratch, as there was nothing before it to compare to.

    He understood the essence of the character, and it also helped that he embodied many of the characteristics naturally, without needing to act.

    Craig's interpretation was not bad, but I never really saw the Fleming Bond much. In NTTD the exchange two hander scene with Blofeld is probably the most far removed moment from the Fleming Bond that I have ever seen on film. Yes, it is even further removed than all the tongue-in-cheek moments from the Moore era, and the OTT amateur dramatics from the Brosnan era.

    That one scene alone in NTTD concluded for me that Craig didn't really understand Bond as much as he claimed he did.

    TLD is one of my favorites, and I love Dalton's portrayal. He had the advantage--as did Craig and Connery--to launch his Bond with a pretty close Fleming adaptation. Strawberry jam and all.

    But I never got the impression that Connery was trying to follow Fleming's Bond. It's as if he had his own swagger.

    The others (except for Lazenby, who squandered it) never had that Fleming opportunity.

    Connery had stated that he found the Bond character in the books dull, so he had to add some swagger in the character, and it's been said that Connery's Bond was actually the wish fulfillment of Terrence Young, it's his version of the character, he had wanted for Connery to play it, and Connery added swagger in it.
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