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Who should/could be a Bond actor?

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  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    Posts: 4,116
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mcdonbb wrote: »
    ClarkDevlin wrote: »
    Or Martian if Disney acquires Bond.

    >-)

    ..any professional actor appropriate for the role can play Bond.

    Personal preference I prefer the actor to be British... just like I would prefer an American actor to play Indiana Jones.

    Odd but very few if any Americans got so bent out of shape when a British actor was cast as Batman.

    Bales American accent is flawless though.

    Yes it was.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Bale also sometimes keeps his American accent for promotional interviews in the US. So many Americans wouldn't even know he was a Welshmen (if they even knew where Wales is in the first place is debatable
  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    edited August 2016 Posts: 4,116
    Sanchairs wrote: »

    Indian accents seem to me to be more resilient. I mean an Indian guy whether living in London or Houston stills sounds like an Indian guy.


    What? Are you kidding, have you met an British 'Indian' from the UK or London? Dude what you said is not cool, not cool. All the British Indians/Asians that i know sound British, no sub-continent accents, just regional British accents. 21st Century and all that...Ta.





    Didn't mean all ...but so what if they were resilient and didn't sound British at all? Are you saying a British accent is inherently superior? Look I meant no offense and there should not have been. My point was Indian accents and I mean for those folks whom have relocated from India not born in the UK don't seem to change.

    But seriously I didn't mean as a derogatory remark.

    Oh and yes I have met several with various British accents both in US and traveling to UK.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Don't worry about it mate. Some people have never visited Bradford!
  • TuuliaTuulia
    edited August 2016 Posts: 2,081
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Bale also sometimes keeps his American accent for promotional interviews in the US. So many Americans wouldn't even know he was a Welshmen (if they even knew where Wales is in the first place is debatable

    You're partially correct. Like I said many still assume he's American. Most roles offered in Hollywood - not surprisingly - require American accents (different types), so in interviews he may use the accent he is using at that particular time for his work, or is still in the process of shedding off (so sometimes the accent sounds a bit messy). He says he isn't good enough to switch an accent on and off like a lamp, that if he could he would. So it's sort of a necessity. (Or at least used to be, I don't know if he has become better at it, or if he decided to make a conscious effort not to become wholly Americanized. But he has used the English accent more the past few years.) Anyway, accents aren't necessarily all that simple for everyone (if they wanna do them well and sound as authentic as they can).

    Oh, and he's English, not Welsh, despite the popular belief.
  • SanchairsSanchairs UK
    Posts: 140
    come on it's going to be Poldark, Ben Hur or Thor. One of these three.
  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 7,653
    Sanchairs wrote: »
    come on it's going to be Poldark, Ben Hur or Thor. One of these three.

    I hope you mean Loki.

    :D
  • SanchairsSanchairs UK
    Posts: 140
    SaintMark wrote: »
    Sanchairs wrote: »
    come on it's going to be Poldark, Ben Hur or Thor. One of these three.

    I hope you mean Loki.

    :D

    There is no way they are going to give it the biggest Diva in town - he's even become Swift's beard for even more publicity.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Tuulia wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Bale also sometimes keeps his American accent for promotional interviews in the US. So many Americans wouldn't even know he was a Welshmen (if they even knew where Wales is in the first place is debatable

    You're partially correct. Like I said many still assume he's American. Most roles offered in Hollywood - not surprisingly - require American accents (different types), so in interviews he may use the accent he is using at that particular time for his work, or is still in the process of shedding off (so sometimes the accent sounds a bit messy). He says he isn't good enough to switch an accent on and off like a lamp, that if he could he would. So it's sort of a necessity. (Or at least used to be, I don't know if he has become better at it, or if he decided to make a conscious effort not to become wholly Americanized. But he has used the English accent more the past few years.) Anyway, accents aren't necessarily all that simple for everyone (if they wanna do them well and sound as authentic as they can).

    Oh, and he's English, not Welsh, despite the popular belief.

    Born in Wales to English parents, so it depends what his birth certificate says. He would be eligible to play for England or Wales sportwise. Debateable.
  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    edited August 2016 Posts: 4,116
    Nice to always get a derogatory American stab in there @suavejmf.. you represent your country very well.

    And going back to that accent conversation. I was not intending my remark to be offensive or racist. I wish now I hadn't said it but the question if some accents are more resilient to change at least to me is an interesting question. The other question is what the impact of social media and a shrinking world on the integrity of accents. I think social linguists have or already studying that.

    Anyway sorry ...but still sick of the occasional rudeness. I almost left this forum before because of it.
  • TuuliaTuulia
    edited August 2016 Posts: 2,081
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Tuulia wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Bale also sometimes keeps his American accent for promotional interviews in the US. So many Americans wouldn't even know he was a Welshmen (if they even knew where Wales is in the first place is debatable

    You're partially correct. Like I said many still assume he's American. Most roles offered in Hollywood - not surprisingly - require American accents (different types), so in interviews he may use the accent he is using at that particular time for his work, or is still in the process of shedding off (so sometimes the accent sounds a bit messy). He says he isn't good enough to switch an accent on and off like a lamp, that if he could he would. So it's sort of a necessity. (Or at least used to be, I don't know if he has become better at it, or if he decided to make a conscious effort not to become wholly Americanized. But he has used the English accent more the past few years.) Anyway, accents aren't necessarily all that simple for everyone (if they wanna do them well and sound as authentic as they can).

    Oh, and he's English, not Welsh, despite the popular belief.

    Born in Wales to English parents, so it depends what his birth certificate says. He would be eligible to play for England or Wales sportwise. Debateable.

    I find it quite interesting how these things get determined. I don't know what makes a person eligible to play for what part of the UK, but that's hardly relevant here anyway since he isn't a sportsman. I would imagine a birth certificate mentions the place of birth, and I'm not contesting the place of birth. But how is the place of birth decisive? When neither parent is Welsh, the person doesn't grow up in Wales and doesn't live there as an adult, either, and doesn't (understandably) consider himself Welsh, then why would he be considered Welsh (unlike his parents and siblings) by others? So, a Welsh-born Englishman, quite logically in my opinion. I don't see why it's even debatable. Though people still debate. But I've yet to see that happen with several other actors one could think of - for instance, Keanu Reeves is not considered Lebanese - which is interesting in itself; I guess there is just less debate when various parts of the British isles aren't in the discussion. The English-Welsh-Scottish-Irish thing seems to be a bigger deal somehow. I think that's fascinating.
  • bondsumbondsum
    Posts: 3,333
    You're quite right about Keanu Reeves, @Tuulia. I always see him as half English and half Hawaiian with a Canadian passport, certainly not Lebanese. Then again Vivien Leigh, George Orwell and Joanna Lumley were all born in India, but that doesn't make them Indian either. It just so happens their English parents happened to be stationed there when they were born. Myself, I'd argue that if an individual is brought up as a native, culturally and sees themselves as a native of that country and not their parent's or family's country, then they can call themselves a native of their birth country. Though I agree it's a complex issue.
  • TuuliaTuulia
    edited August 2016 Posts: 2,081
    bondsum wrote: »
    You're quite right about Keanu Reeves, @Tuulia. I always see him as half English and half Hawaiian with a Canadian passport, certainly not Lebanese. Then again Vivien Leigh, George Orwell and Joanna Lumley were all born in India, but that doesn't make them Indian either. It just so happens their English parents happened to be stationed there when they were born.

    Exactly. People wouldn't think of them as Indian, or Keanu Reeves as Lebanese, or Amy Adams as Italian just because they were born in those places (and I assume they themselves wouldn't either). Which makes it even more peculiar that many still argue that Bale is Welsh (despite him saying he's English) just because he happened to be born in Wales. I don't get the supposed difference in the situations. (Apart from what I said about the tug of war within the British isles.)
    Myself, I'd argue that if an individual is brought up as a native, culturally and sees themselves as a native of that country and not their parent's or family's country, then they can call themselves a native of their birth country. Though I agree it's a complex issue.

    Yes, it can be complex in some cases. What you're saying there are basically the opposite circumstances to the case I was talking about, but I do agree with your points.

  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Tuulia wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Tuulia wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Bale also sometimes keeps his American accent for promotional interviews in the US. So many Americans wouldn't even know he was a Welshmen (if they even knew where Wales is in the first place is debatable

    You're partially correct. Like I said many still assume he's American. Most roles offered in Hollywood - not surprisingly - require American accents (different types), so in interviews he may use the accent he is using at that particular time for his work, or is still in the process of shedding off (so sometimes the accent sounds a bit messy). He says he isn't good enough to switch an accent on and off like a lamp, that if he could he would. So it's sort of a necessity. (Or at least used to be, I don't know if he has become better at it, or if he decided to make a conscious effort not to become wholly Americanized. But he has used the English accent more the past few years.) Anyway, accents aren't necessarily all that simple for everyone (if they wanna do them well and sound as authentic as they can).

    Oh, and he's English, not Welsh, despite the popular belief.

    Born in Wales to English parents, so it depends what his birth certificate says. He would be eligible to play for England or Wales sportwise. Debateable.

    I find it quite interesting how these things get determined. I don't know what makes a person eligible to play for what part of the UK, but that's hardly relevant here anyway since he isn't a sportsman. I would imagine a birth certificate mentions the place of birth, and I'm not contesting the place of birth. But how is the place of birth decisive? When neither parent is Welsh, the person doesn't grow up in Wales and doesn't live there as an adult, either, and doesn't (understandably) consider himself Welsh, then why would he be considered Welsh (unlike his parents and siblings) by others? So, a Welsh-born Englishman, quite logically in my opinion. I don't see why it's even debatable. Though people still debate. But I've yet to see that happen with several other actors one could think of - for instance, Keanu Reeves is not considered Lebanese - which is interesting in itself; I guess there is just less debate when various parts of the British isles aren't in the discussion. The English-Welsh-Scottish-Irish thing seems to be a bigger deal somehow. I think that's fascinating.

    Example.....second generation Chinese people who are born in the UK to 2x Chinese born parents (with UK birth certificate) would call themselves British if they like. Same thing with Bale. Generally English people would call themselves British. Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish are still annoyed at history.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    edited August 2016 Posts: 5,131
    mcdonbb wrote: »
    Nice to always get a derogatory American stab in there @suavejmf.. you represent your country very well.

    And going back to that accent conversation. I was not intending my remark to be offensive or racist. I wish now I hadn't said it but the question if some accents are more resilient to change at least to me is an interesting question. The other question is what the impact of social media and a shrinking world on the integrity of accents. I think social linguists have or already studying that.

    Anyway sorry ...but still sick of the occasional rudeness. I almost left this forum before because of it.

    I happen to like Americans. I find them to be generally very warm people. I simply find their general experience of travel and their media coverage of other nations amusing or lacking. Not a dig, just a generalisation based on experience. The fact is that the average American hasn't been to a wide variety of Countries compared to Europeans. Also some of the best actors in the world are American...but I haven't yet experienced a realistic Brit accent from an American within film.
  • TuuliaTuulia
    Posts: 2,081
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Tuulia wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Tuulia wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Bale also sometimes keeps his American accent for promotional interviews in the US. So many Americans wouldn't even know he was a Welshmen (if they even knew where Wales is in the first place is debatable

    You're partially correct. Like I said many still assume he's American. Most roles offered in Hollywood - not surprisingly - require American accents (different types), so in interviews he may use the accent he is using at that particular time for his work, or is still in the process of shedding off (so sometimes the accent sounds a bit messy). He says he isn't good enough to switch an accent on and off like a lamp, that if he could he would. So it's sort of a necessity. (Or at least used to be, I don't know if he has become better at it, or if he decided to make a conscious effort not to become wholly Americanized. But he has used the English accent more the past few years.) Anyway, accents aren't necessarily all that simple for everyone (if they wanna do them well and sound as authentic as they can).

    Oh, and he's English, not Welsh, despite the popular belief.

    Born in Wales to English parents, so it depends what his birth certificate says. He would be eligible to play for England or Wales sportwise. Debateable.

    I find it quite interesting how these things get determined. I don't know what makes a person eligible to play for what part of the UK, but that's hardly relevant here anyway since he isn't a sportsman. I would imagine a birth certificate mentions the place of birth, and I'm not contesting the place of birth. But how is the place of birth decisive? When neither parent is Welsh, the person doesn't grow up in Wales and doesn't live there as an adult, either, and doesn't (understandably) consider himself Welsh, then why would he be considered Welsh (unlike his parents and siblings) by others? So, a Welsh-born Englishman, quite logically in my opinion. I don't see why it's even debatable. Though people still debate. But I've yet to see that happen with several other actors one could think of - for instance, Keanu Reeves is not considered Lebanese - which is interesting in itself; I guess there is just less debate when various parts of the British isles aren't in the discussion. The English-Welsh-Scottish-Irish thing seems to be a bigger deal somehow. I think that's fascinating.

    Example.....second generation Chinese people who are born in the UK to 2x Chinese born parents (with UK birth certificate) would call themselves British if they like. Same thing with Bale. Generally English people would call themselves British. Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish are still annoyed at history.

    Same thing? Those are not the same thing at all actually. Very different situations.

    I can't imagine the English/Welsh/Scottish/Irish would be a consideration in the case of 2nd generation Chinese people born in the UK - to themselves or the others. It would be either British or Chinese, wouldn't it? (Or even - at least potentially - one of English/Welsh/Scottish/Irish or Chinese. But not between English/Welsh/Scottish/Irish surely.)

    As for being called or calling oneself British vs English/Welsh/Scottish/Irish, I get what you're saying. There are two different things here, though. Of course for instance Bale is British, nothing to argue about that. However, the other thing is that he is very commonly also considered Welsh (and he keeps correcting that when it is brought up in interviews).

    So: what I don't get is why a person with English parents who grew up in England and considers himself English is considered by many to be Welsh just because he was born there, while people born in India/Lebanon/Italy (like the examples mentioned above) wouldn't be considered Indian/Lebanese/Italian only because of their birthplace. That's something I find puzzling and sort of fascinating, as well as illogical.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    edited August 2016 Posts: 5,131
    Totally agree it is very illogical and all down to being overly PC. For example if I was born and raised in China I would still be considered by the Chinese as English. But the other way round (I.e. Chinese born and raised in the UK) it is counted as rasist not refer to them as English. The UK is probably the most PC country in the world. Anyway, getting back to the topic, Bale would have made a great 007.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Totally agree it is very illogical and all down to being overly PC. For example if I was born and raised in China I would still be considered by the Chinese as English. But the other way round (I.e. Chinese born and raised in the UK) it is counted as rasist not refer to them as English. The UK is probably the most PC country in the world. Anyway, getting back to the topic, Bale would have made a great 007.
    I agree about the one-way road. If you're white and/or European/Caucasian you have less importance than the rest of those who are of different ethnicity. They'll deny you these claims, but unofficially, as that's not difficult to see, they all have more privileges than the white/Caucasians do. Or minorities in general.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Exactly. And the race card is always a trump card to play in the UK.
  • TuuliaTuulia
    Posts: 2,081
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Totally agree it is very illogical and all down to being overly PC. For example if I was born and raised in China I would still be considered by the Chinese as English. But the other way round (I.e. Chinese born and raised in the UK) it is counted as rasist not refer to them as English. The UK is probably the most PC country in the world. Anyway, getting back to the topic, Bale would have made a great 007.

    Eeh... I wasn't talking about that at all, actually, and I guess I'm giving up on trying to get my point across. As for what what you're saying there... I wasn't even thinking of that aspect in this context, but maybe you're right. I can't comment on race or PC issues in Britain, nor do I want to.
    Regarding your comment on the thread topic, yes, I imagine so.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Eh too. Your right, I didn't get your point.
  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    Posts: 4,116
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mcdonbb wrote: »
    Nice to always get a derogatory American stab in there @suavejmf.. you represent your country very well.

    And going back to that accent conversation. I was not intending my remark to be offensive or racist. I wish now I hadn't said it but the question if some accents are more resilient to change at least to me is an interesting question. The other question is what the impact of social media and a shrinking world on the integrity of accents. I think social linguists have or already studying that.

    Anyway sorry ...but still sick of the occasional rudeness. I almost left this forum before because of it.

    I happen to like Americans. I find them to be generally very warm people. I simply find their general experience of travel and their media coverage of other nations amusing or lacking. Not a dig, just a generalisation based on experience. The fact is that the average American hasn't been to a wide variety of Countries compared to Europeans. Also some of the best actors in the world are American...but I haven't yet experienced a realistic Brit accent from an American within film.

    I would agree with that. Most attempts are somewhat embarrassing. Sorry I got upset.
  • TuuliaTuulia
    Posts: 2,081
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Eh too. Your right, I didn't get your point.

    I'm sorry, but you were talking about a different thing with the Chinese etc. and I don't know how else to explain. Basically I just don't get why Bale or anyone else in similar circumstances would be somehow defined by their birthplace when that is clearly not the norm (as exemplified by the other actors used as examples). Had he been born abroad (other things being equal) I'm sure he'd be considered English, but since he was born in Wales people keep insisting he's Welsh. Maybe the illogicality of it doesn't even seem weird to British people (what with the eligibility for footie teams and such), but it sure does to me. Anyway, it's not even important, just peculiar.

    Back to topic then...
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Is it the Welsh who claim him?
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    I would imagine so.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Tuulia wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Eh too. Your right, I didn't get your point.

    I'm sorry, but you were talking about a different thing with the Chinese etc. and I don't know how else to explain. Basically I just don't get why Bale or anyone else in similar circumstances would be somehow defined by their birthplace when that is clearly not the norm (as exemplified by the other actors used as examples). Had he been born abroad (other things being equal) I'm sure he'd be considered English, but since he was born in Wales people keep insisting he's Welsh. Maybe the illogicality of it doesn't even seem weird to British people (what with the eligibility for footie teams and such), but it sure does to me. Anyway, it's not even important, just peculiar.

    Back to topic then...

    I understand now and it is peculiar. But that is how it is viewed and done in the UK. If Bale has a Welsh birth certificate he can call himself Welsh or English. I think it's silly too, but again it must be a UK thing.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 7,996
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Tuulia wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Eh too. Your right, I didn't get your point.

    I'm sorry, but you were talking about a different thing with the Chinese etc. and I don't know how else to explain. Basically I just don't get why Bale or anyone else in similar circumstances would be somehow defined by their birthplace when that is clearly not the norm (as exemplified by the other actors used as examples). Had he been born abroad (other things being equal) I'm sure he'd be considered English, but since he was born in Wales people keep insisting he's Welsh. Maybe the illogicality of it doesn't even seem weird to British people (what with the eligibility for footie teams and such), but it sure does to me. Anyway, it's not even important, just peculiar.

    Back to topic then...

    I understand now and it is peculiar. But that is how it is viewed and done in the UK. If Bale has a Welsh birth certificate he can call himself Welsh or English. I think it's silly too, but again it must be a UK thing.
    It isn't really. A friend of mine was born in Rome from Dutch parents. They were there on holiday, so he just came back and has only one passport. However, if he'd been raised there (as far as I understand it) he could've applied for an Italian one, as he'd been born AND raised there. The latter obviously beeing hard to track, so he could've gone back to Italy and applied for an Italian passport. But he'd have lost his Dutch one.

    So the basis is, it's up to the individual, which makes it easy to confuse everyone when it concerns a famous person.
  • TuuliaTuulia
    Posts: 2,081
    Thunderfinger wrote: »
    Is it the Welsh who claim him?

    Often yes, but it's also a general misconception, and others (non-British people) also generally call him Welsh. People simply seem to assume he is, I suppose because that's what a lot of the media keeps telling them. (It can be both funny and sort of sad that whenever someone correctly calls him English they get called an idiot, like an American reporter recently... or when someone - also correctly - calls him British, they get told "Welsh, actually...") Yet the only reasoning is "because he was born in Wales that makes him Welsh" which makes zero sense to me, and birthplace obviously also isn't the normal way to define origins or ethnicity.
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Tuulia wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Eh too. Your right, I didn't get your point.

    I'm sorry, but you were talking about a different thing with the Chinese etc. and I don't know how else to explain. Basically I just don't get why Bale or anyone else in similar circumstances would be somehow defined by their birthplace when that is clearly not the norm (as exemplified by the other actors used as examples). Had he been born abroad (other things being equal) I'm sure he'd be considered English, but since he was born in Wales people keep insisting he's Welsh. Maybe the illogicality of it doesn't even seem weird to British people (what with the eligibility for footie teams and such), but it sure does to me. Anyway, it's not even important, just peculiar.

    Back to topic then...

    I understand now and it is peculiar. But that is how it is viewed and done in the UK. If Bale has a Welsh birth certificate he can call himself Welsh or English. I think it's silly too, but again it must be a UK thing.

    Oh good that I managed finally, then. :) Even as just a UK peculiarity I could sort of understand it as just silliness, if it was up to the person themselves eventually, but it doesn't seem to be. He calls himself English (and has corrected the "Welsh" many times), but that seems irrelevant to most people, somehow. Not that he really cares much about it, or about other wrong ideas strangers may have of him. But I find the whole thing of how and why and by whom people's ethnicity/origins/nationality etc. are defined and decided very interesting. I've seen discussions about the issue by people who are constantly defined by others in a different manner than they would define themselves, and I get that it can be unpleasant.

    Sorry for OT - but many threads seem to be OT a lot anyway, so oh well... :P
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Michael Fassbender was born in Germany, so if he is next, expect German papers to claim him as the first German Bond.

    According to EON, Craig s Bond was born in Germany.
  • Mikah21Mikah21
    Posts: 52
    I think it'd be a really difficult choice if Craig does leave. Hiddleston doesn't really do it for me, I know he was playing a different type of character in The Night Manager, but he didn't really sell it to me. Maybe it will be someone a little more unknown if Craig quits. Then again, Michael Fassbender does sound like an interesting choice.
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