James Bond on Blu-ray/4K

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  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    Posts: 5,442
    Blu-ray is generally good enough for me, but I will dip into 4K if the quality of the film transfer is an improvement or fixes issues that were in the last format. SUPERMAN ‘78 is one example for me that served as an improvement. JAWS is a revelation.
  • edited August 2020 Posts: 2,406
    Blu-ray is generally good enough for me, but I will dip into 4K if the quality of the film transfer is an improvement or fixes issues that were in the last format. SUPERMAN ‘78 is one example for me that served as an improvement. JAWS is a revelation.

    The discs are way too expensive, they're like £20 each when you can get a Blu-ray for £8, Blu-ray 1080p is good enough, it reveals the details that you would see in a cinema that DVD just can't. It's at 24fps like film is meant to be. Would only consider buying UHD discs if my projector broke and I had to get a new one, and only then if the discs were cheaper. Even then I can't imagine replacing my blu-ray discs in the way I've been replacing my DVDs with the blu-rays. And iTunes etc. give 4K but no lossless audio ...
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    Posts: 5,442
    It is expensive, and I’m pretty selective about buying movies on any format. I only have four UHD discs. Part of it helps that I sell discs of films I no longer really want to own anymore. I used to buy tons of DVDs in my college years, so many out of whim and blind purchases.
  • Posts: 15,747
    I'd be interested in a 4K collection as I never made the jump from DVD to Blu-ray (I still buy DVDs too). But the cost of upgrading all my existing equipment, like a new TV and all, will probably keep me from investing in 4K.
  • RyanRyan Canada
    Posts: 608
    I only own one UHD so far. My plan is to just buy future releases of films on the format since they come in the dual packs anyways. For the most part it seems like the price difference is only $5 or so (where I am, anyways). I doubt I'll ever be too concerned with replacing my many DVDs and Blus with the format but I will cherry pick some of my favourites.
  • kuifje_007kuifje_007 Belgium
    Posts: 7
    I have got Blu-ray Bond 50 set. It's my first Blu-Ray. I am surprised to see Dutch subtitles had some wrong spelling in every Bond-movies. How is that possible? I never saw any wrong spelling in DVD's. Do you have any remark about the subtitles of Bond 50 set?
  • JWPepperJWPepper You sit on it, but you can't take it with you.
    Posts: 512
    kuifje_007 wrote: »
    I have got Blu-ray Bond 50 set. It's my first Blu-Ray. I am surprised to see Dutch subtitles had some wrong spelling in every Bond-movies. How is that possible? I never saw any wrong spelling in DVD's. Do you have any remark about the subtitles of Bond 50 set?

    I'm from The Netherlands. Never noticed any real spelling errors in the older films. Only Quantum of Solace has lots of grammatical errors. But that disc was just copied from the original release and it was a rush job to get the Dutch subtitles done.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 35,383
    I'm solely interested in the Connery-Brosnan era now, as several films throughout would benefit tremendously from a 4K upgrade, but the Craig films left a lot to be desired for me (at least CR and QoS, the two that mattered most. SF was ridiculously good looking).
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    Posts: 5,442
    CR and QOS are unfortunately stuck at 2K as that’s how they were mastered digitally. For true 4K or better they’d have to go back to the original negatives and recut EVERYTHING from scratch. SF and SP were done at 4K, so that’s why they hold up better.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 35,383
    CR and QOS are unfortunately stuck at 2K as that’s how they were mastered digitally. For true 4K or better they’d have to go back to the original negatives and recut EVERYTHING from scratch. SF and SP were done at 4K, so that’s why they hold up better.

    Good point, which would likely never happen. I was just shocked at how much I preferred my blu-ray copies of CR and QoS to those in 4K, the differences were so blunt and instantly recognizable. I got to the Madagascar chase in CR and turned it off, it looked so bland and overcast, and I managed maybe five minutes of the PTS of QoS before turning it off.
  • JWPepperJWPepper You sit on it, but you can't take it with you.
    Posts: 512
    CR and QOS are unfortunately stuck at 2K as that’s how they were mastered digitally. For true 4K or better they’d have to go back to the original negatives and recut EVERYTHING from scratch. SF and SP were done at 4K, so that’s why they hold up better.
    Skyfall was shot in 2K.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    Posts: 5,442
    JWPepper wrote: »
    CR and QOS are unfortunately stuck at 2K as that’s how they were mastered digitally. For true 4K or better they’d have to go back to the original negatives and recut EVERYTHING from scratch. SF and SP were done at 4K, so that’s why they hold up better.
    Skyfall was shot in 2K.

    I meant mastered at 4K. And technically, the film was shot at 2.8K, with aerial shots being done at 5K.
  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,729
    either way guys, since CR and Qos were shot on film, if remastered they could be made into true 4k. Skyfall cannot.
  • 007InAction007InAction Australia
    Posts: 1,428
    either way guys, since CR and Qos were shot on film, if remastered they could be made into true 4k. Skyfall cannot.

    That's disappointing considering the technology they have nowadays.
    Maybe in the future ?
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    edited August 2020 Posts: 5,442
    Knowing the process it would take to remaster CR/QOS at 4K or above, it would likely be way too cumbersome an exercise and too expensive to even attempt. Ultimately, if they were good enough for theaters back in the mid-to-late 2000s, they're good enough as they are. At least as long as the home video mastering is properly done.
  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,729
    either way guys, since CR and Qos were shot on film, if remastered they could be made into true 4k. Skyfall cannot.

    That's disappointing considering the technology they have nowadays.
    Maybe in the future ?

    Probably not just because of the science behind it. Film is like a living object. It has no definitive resolution as such but when they digitally scan it, the most they can get out of 35mm is 4K I believe. Whereas something like Skyfall which was just shot digitally in 2.8 k is just that. That was the resolution and pixels recorded on the day, there is no extra matter from which a 4K copy could be produced in the true sense of the word.
    Knowing the process it would take to remaster CR/QOS at 4K or above, it would likely be way too cumbersome an exercise and too expensive to even attempt. Ultimately, if they were good enough for theaters back in the mid-to-late 2000s, they're good enough as they are. At least as long as the home video mastering is properly done.

    I actually have a question here. So when I buy the bond50 blu ray set or whatever. Those old bond films from the 60s,70s.... look incredible. Stunning. Were they remastered to 2k, because if so then it’s not outside the wheelhouse for bond, and if not then how do they look so amazing.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    Posts: 5,442
    either way guys, since CR and Qos were shot on film, if remastered they could be made into true 4k. Skyfall cannot.

    That's disappointing considering the technology they have nowadays.
    Maybe in the future ?

    Probably not just because of the science behind it. Film is like a living object. It has no definitive resolution as such but when they digitally scan it, the most they can get out of 35mm is 4K I believe. Whereas something like Skyfall which was just shot digitally in 2.8 k is just that. That was the resolution and pixels recorded on the day, there is no extra matter from which a 4K copy could be produced in the true sense of the word.
    Knowing the process it would take to remaster CR/QOS at 4K or above, it would likely be way too cumbersome an exercise and too expensive to even attempt. Ultimately, if they were good enough for theaters back in the mid-to-late 2000s, they're good enough as they are. At least as long as the home video mastering is properly done.

    I actually have a question here. So when I buy the bond50 blu ray set or whatever. Those old bond films from the 60s,70s.... look incredible. Stunning. Were they remastered to 2k, because if so then it’s not outside the wheelhouse for bond, and if not then how do they look so amazing.

    As far as the blu-ray discs made from 2008-2012 go, here's the breakdown of how they were remastered:

    DN, FRWL, GF, TB, YOLT, OHMSS, DAF, LALD, TSWLM and MR were all remastered at 4K from the original film negatives by Lowry Digital. 4K remastering was still a very expensive proposition at the time they were done, so instead of remastering all 20 films back in the mid-2000s MGM only focused on the older films as they were much dirtier and needed more work.

    For TMWTGG, FYEO, OP, AVTAK, TLD, LTK, GE, TND, TWINE, and DAD, Lowry Digital simply used the existing HD video copies of the films as the basis for their remasters, cleaning up the dirt and other artifacts. If you wondered why the 80s and 90s films never looked as visually incredible as the 60s and 70s films on blu-ray, this is partly why. It wasn't until 2015 that the latter films would actually get a proper 4K remaster, which you can only currently watch on streaming platforms like iTunes, Amazon, and Vudu.

    For why CR and QOS can't get a 4K remaster like the other films is because they were never mastered on actual film. The film footage was scanned at 2K and mastered digitally. All film prints people saw in theaters were simply based on the digital masters.
  • M_BaljeM_Balje Amsterdam, Netherlands
    edited August 2020 Posts: 3,847
    Se's dvd of the 80's movie are great too and i think there is no reasen why this can't look great on BD too. Octopussy SE dvd's for example looks better in my BD player then Twine.

    I own couple movies on BD in 4K who have more grain then need. I am more happy with my none 4K BD disc 2009 version in 2012 keepcase of three movies from Sony then i have possible have been with 4K versions from 2013.

    The room/space of 4K disc in my opnion should be used for higher resultion for bigger tv, more episodes on one disc, more extra s with more subs. Long movie one disc insteed of two and better audio. Or option to consider to at two movies on a disc. Disney proofs enough that 50GB disc not be enough to give more extra's, there are lazy for using extra BD or atleast DVD9 DVD or having trouble to at in 3D. Another mistake that are no 4K 3D players. And why bother about 4K disc when there already have trouble to release some on BD.
  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,729
    either way guys, since CR and Qos were shot on film, if remastered they could be made into true 4k. Skyfall cannot.

    That's disappointing considering the technology they have nowadays.
    Maybe in the future ?

    Probably not just because of the science behind it. Film is like a living object. It has no definitive resolution as such but when they digitally scan it, the most they can get out of 35mm is 4K I believe. Whereas something like Skyfall which was just shot digitally in 2.8 k is just that. That was the resolution and pixels recorded on the day, there is no extra matter from which a 4K copy could be produced in the true sense of the word.
    Knowing the process it would take to remaster CR/QOS at 4K or above, it would likely be way too cumbersome an exercise and too expensive to even attempt. Ultimately, if they were good enough for theaters back in the mid-to-late 2000s, they're good enough as they are. At least as long as the home video mastering is properly done.

    I actually have a question here. So when I buy the bond50 blu ray set or whatever. Those old bond films from the 60s,70s.... look incredible. Stunning. Were they remastered to 2k, because if so then it’s not outside the wheelhouse for bond, and if not then how do they look so amazing.

    As far as the blu-ray discs made from 2008-2012 go, here's the breakdown of how they were remastered:

    DN, FRWL, GF, TB, YOLT, OHMSS, DAF, LALD, TSWLM and MR were all remastered at 4K from the original film negatives by Lowry Digital. 4K remastering was still a very expensive proposition at the time they were done, so instead of remastering all 20 films back in the mid-2000s MGM only focused on the older films as they were much dirtier and needed more work.

    For TMWTGG, FYEO, OP, AVTAK, TLD, LTK, GE, TND, TWINE, and DAD, Lowry Digital simply used the existing HD video copies of the films as the basis for their remasters, cleaning up the dirt and other artifacts. If you wondered why the 80s and 90s films never looked as visually incredible as the 60s and 70s films on blu-ray, this is partly why. It wasn't until 2015 that the latter films would actually get a proper 4K remaster, which you can only currently watch on streaming platforms like iTunes, Amazon, and Vudu.

    For why CR and QOS can't get a 4K remaster like the other films is because they were never mastered on actual film. The film footage was scanned at 2K and mastered digitally. All film prints people saw in theaters were simply based on the digital masters.

    Ah thanks, I get it now, that's a good point. Since CR and QOS were probably put together in the Digital Intermediate, they would have to recut the entire film right. Yeah its unlikely even though possible.

    I guess the only thing I would ask then is, are you sure that those streaming copies of the 80's and 90's films were actually remastered from film to be 4k, how do you know that they didn't just upscale them from the HD master they already had (kind of like what happened to CR and QOS)

  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    edited August 2020 Posts: 5,442
    It was confirmed that MGM had those 80s and 90s films remastered for DLCs copies back in 2015. I did screencap comparisons between the blu-rays and the 4K remasters and there’s definitely signs of improvement that not a simple upscale could have accomplished. Even better, the new 4K editions fixed some issues that Lowry made with the blu-rays, like how they accidentally got rid of the earthquake effect in AVTAK by stabilizing the image.
  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,729
    It was confirmed that MGM had those 80s and 90s films remastered for DLCs copies back in 2015. I did screencap comparisons between the blu-rays and the 4K remasters and there’s definitely signs of improvement that not a simple upscale could have accomplished. Even better, the new 4K editions fixed some issues that Lowry made with the blu-rays, like how they accidentally got rid of the earthquake effect in AVTAK by stabilizing the image.

    Wow that’s really cool. It actually makes me much more excited for a 4K box set because somehow I had this thought that they wouldn’t bother to remaster them again but I’m super glad that they have
  • M_BaljeM_Balje Amsterdam, Netherlands
    edited August 2020 Posts: 3,847
    It turn out that BD with new coverart with 007 in Gold of For Your Eyes Only not including same disc with extra's as first release. Turn out that a lot of extra's are missing and even have less extra's then SE dvd.

    http://www.dvdinfo.be/bespreking.php?id=9087
    After i send the reviewer a message, he confirmd that back cover said there more extra's credit, but those are not on it.

    I remember i heard there messing around with CR2006, but this is new to me and made me curious or other movies have same problem. Also rase another quistion or the 50 years set from 2012 realy include first correct disc or wrong disc.
  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,729
    Considering a new home distributer has the rights (Universal) and a new bond film is coming out (maybe) how come we haven't heard anything about a 4k physical release or box set?
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    Posts: 5,442
    There hasn’t been any news of who’s handling the home video distribution. As far as I know, Universal is only handling the international theatrical distribution.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 35,383
    Considering a new home distributer has the rights (Universal) and a new bond film is coming out (maybe) how come we haven't heard anything about a 4k physical release or box set?

    The earliest it'll come is coinciding with the 4K/blu-ray release of NTTD, which I imagine (provided it meets its current release date) would arrive by late March at the latest. Hopefully, provided there are plans in store to release 4K versions of all the non-Craig titles, we hear something in the next few months regarding their release.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    Posts: 5,442
    Updated my post for GE to include LaserDisc screencaps. Also added a new screencap to show the POV from Bond's camera as he's tracking Xenia, as I think that really illustrates how badly cropped the UE DVD was.

    https://007homemedia.blogspot.com/2020/09/goldeneye-1995.html
  • JWPepperJWPepper You sit on it, but you can't take it with you.
    edited September 2020 Posts: 512
    Updated my post for GE to include LaserDisc screencaps. Also added a new screencap to show the POV from Bond's camera as he's tracking Xenia, as I think that really illustrates how badly cropped the UE DVD was.

    https://007homemedia.blogspot.com/2020/09/goldeneye-1995.html

    HUGE difference between Blu-ray and 4K also! The DNR on the blu-ray is heavy. The Itunes 4K version has a much more film-like appearence.

    The cropping on the UE is also a real shame.
    So, we need those 4K blu-rays now:-)
  • Posts: 15,747
    Updated my post for GE to include LaserDisc screencaps. Also added a new screencap to show the POV from Bond's camera as he's tracking Xenia, as I think that really illustrates how badly cropped the UE DVD was.

    https://007homemedia.blogspot.com/2020/09/goldeneye-1995.html

    Wow, that's really bad!
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython The Black Lodge
    Posts: 5,442
    JWPepper wrote: »
    The Itunes 4K version has a much more film-like appearence.

    It's an aspect I've been glad to see happen to all the films that didn't get the proper 4K treatment back in the 2000s. And this is just from iTunes. On physical media it'll feel like a genuine refresher.
  • tonesmalones09tonesmalones09 Minneapolis
    Posts: 27
    Sorry if this has been asked before (searching in these forums is not user-friendly) but are the 4k UHD versions available to rent on Amazon the same transfers as the versions on iTunes?
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