NO TIME TO DIE - Questions Thread (SPOILERS!)

edited October 7 in No Time To Die (2021) Posts: 4,345
Like many, I have some questions that I was hoping people could answer. I'm sure others have questions too....So let's share them!
  1. I am curious though, since Bond was in close contact with M, Q, Moneypenny and Safin, is it safe to assume that they too are infected with the strain of Heracles that is lethal to all Spectre agents and Blofeld? Does this mean they pose a risk of spreading the contagion to others whose DNA makes them genetically predisposed to die from Heracles? Does this mean Safin's plan succeeded as strains of Heracles are out in the world?
  2. Also, who was Safin going to target with Heracles? He wanted to make 'the world a better place.' He took out all of Spectre, so was it just targeting bad buys and their families? Was it ever explained that he was targeting certain genetic groups? Obruchev did mention targeting ethnic minorities, right?
  3. I totally missed the part of the plot which explained that dioxin was used to kill Safin's family. Can someone briefly recall the dialogue?
  4. What was the painting that Safin was getting hung up in his lair?
  5. Who played the woman with the fringe in Safin's lair?
  6. How many times did Safin shoot Bond?
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Comments

  • zebrafishzebrafish <°)))< in Octopussy's garden in the shade
    Posts: 3,282
    I also had questions like these, but I think it is not good to over-analyze the plot, it might take some of the fun out of this movie.
    However, here is my take on the first point:
    1. It depends on what these nanobots really are. I presume they cannot replicate, so will be diluted a lot and can be washed off the hands with soap or something else. This works well with most kinds of viruses and bacteria. Madeleine was freshly bathed in the stuff, so Bond caught a lot on his hands. Down the line dilution effects should finish the stuff off. But if they replicate in your body, who knows? Better not thread into the abyss...
  • MalloryMallory Are you ready to get back to work?
    edited October 7 Posts: 1,444
    As for 5, my assumption is she was meant to be Safin’s henchwoman, but they rewrote it so Primo was there instead (as per MGW saying they liked Bensallah and added him in more). Hence she is there then sorta disappears.

    Also I thought that after initial infection (via an aerosol, see Cuba party or Maddie spraying it on), subsequent reinfection was via touch only, hence Bond touching Maddie (via wrist) then touching Blofeld (via strangulation). Hence Safin saying he can never touch them again.

    I think Safin was just selling Heracles to the highest bidder. He had just moved in and mentions “meeting the first buyers” and two boats approaching the island.
  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 941
    As for 3. Mr White poisoned his family with a meal at a party for Safin's family, there was a toxin that poisoned them all and it gave Safin his disfigurement I believe. Although in Safin lair later, its hinted at that Safin's mother died at his feet.
    I think they put that Safin backstory exposition at the wrong point in the film, because we're meant to be sold on Bond's love for Madeline and Mathilde's reveal. There was a lot to take in at that point, perhaps Q or Safin himself could have revealed that exposition later
  • MalloryMallory Are you ready to get back to work?
    Posts: 1,444
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    As for 3. Mr White poisoned his family with a meal at a party for Safin's family, there was a toxin that poisoned them all and it gave Safin his disfigurement I believe. Although in Safin lair later, its hinted at that Safin's mother died at his feet.
    I think they put that Safin backstory exposition at the wrong point in the film, because we're meant to be sold on Bond's love for Madeline and Mathilde's reveal. There was a lot to take in at that point, perhaps Q or Safin himself could have revealed that exposition later

    Didnt Safin say she (his mother) died in child birth?
  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 941
    Did he? I thought Bond said, is that what happened to you? When Safin mentioned Bond dying at Mathilde's feet. But then he did say what mother wouldn't sacrifice herself for her child

    I'll be honest mate you might be spot on. Safin's dialogue was so one note it was tricky to absorb at points
  • ImpertinentGoonImpertinentGoon Everybody needs a hobby.
    Posts: 610
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Did he? I thought Bond said, is that what happened to you? When Safin mentioned Bond dying at Mathilde's feet. But then he did say what mother wouldn't sacrifice herself for her child

    I'll be honest mate you might be spot on. Safin's dialogue was so one note it was tricky to absorb at points

    I think you are right. They talk about her dying at his feet, as I recall it. No idea how that means that she died for him, but maybe that it over-interpreting.

    As for the questions @Pierce2Daniel posed:
    3: Madeleine and Bond talk about that in Mr. White's secure room.
    4: I think the paintings are supposed to be Water Lilies by Monet. That was my first connection and in the moment I thought there might have been a famous theft of some of them and this is a nod to Dr. No and the Goya, but at least the wiki entry doesn't say anything about a theft. Maybe it is just about them being quite famous and expensive in auctions, or there is a deeper meaning that is escaping me.

    A question I have:
    Was Obruchev a plant by Safin from the very beginning, meaning him developing Heracles and then stealing it where the plan from the very beginning or did Safin get to him while he was already working on it? And what was Safin's comment about "they think they need you" or something like that about?
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    edited October 7 Posts: 3,461
    Heracles has been secretly developed for 10 years so I believe Safin just corrupted Obruchev even before SPECTRE got interested in possessing the weapon.
  • zebrafishzebrafish <°)))< in Octopussy's garden in the shade
    Posts: 3,282
    I noticed that M was responsible for everything that happened in Obruchev's lab. If any of this came to light, it would be a scandal of the greatest magnitude. I think M's career and possible his life as a free man would be finished after this.
  • ImpertinentGoonImpertinentGoon Everybody needs a hobby.
    Posts: 610
    zebrafish wrote: »
    I noticed that M was responsible for everything that happened in Obruchev's lab. If any of this came to light, it would be a scandal of the greatest magnitude. I think M's career and possible his life as a free man would be finished after this.

    After the previous M let Hackers into MI6's infrastructure by clicking on a random link sent to her, her successor first kills his superior, C, and undoes a monumental shift in British foreign policy that must have been years in the planning and then turned around and created an uncontrollable weapon of mass destruction and let it get out.
  • Marc_Ange_Drac0Marc_Ange_Drac0 Sao Paulo
    Posts: 6
    Guys, first of all, i’m very pleased to be back at a Bond forum again. Last night I’ve got the opportunity to watch, and as an old fan, every new movie has an inch of a previous movie - - intended or not by the producers.

    What were your references re. previous movies? OHMSS is quite obvious, YOLT due the Death Garden, Ash’s death reminding Emile Locque’s death (sir Roger must hated this part)… what else have you guys saw?


    For me, OHMSS is a high influence. Bioterrorism, Blofeld, the score (btw, Hans Zimmer had nailed that!), the love story, the “resignation” from the Secret Service.

    Safin’s island have a Moonraker-esque look with a future visual, and the aniquilation plan. On the other hand, you may recall Dr. No with those guys dressed up like scentists (or whatsover), Safin’s fashion, Felix in Jamaica, etc.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 4,407
    Guys, first of all, i’m very pleased to be back at a Bond forum again. Last night I’ve got the opportunity to watch, and as an old fan, every new movie has an inch of a previous movie - - intended or not by the producers.

    What were your references re. previous movies? OHMSS is quite obvious, YOLT due the Death Garden, Ash’s death reminding Emile Locque’s death (sir Roger must hated this part)… what else have you guys saw?


    For me, OHMSS is a high influence. Bioterrorism, Blofeld, the score (btw, Hans Zimmer had nailed that!), the love story, the “resignation” from the Secret Service.

    Safin’s island have a Moonraker-esque look with a future visual, and the aniquilation plan. On the other hand, you may recall Dr. No with those guys dressed up like scentists (or whatsover), Safin’s fashion, Felix in Jamaica, etc.

    Personally didn’t get the MR reference, it was all very YOLT to me, including the island between Japan and Russia (was really hoping for a Tiger Tanaka cameo, like maybe he video calls M to ask what the hell is happening on the island).

    TLD was brought in too with the V8 of course.
  • marcmarc Universal Exports
    Posts: 1,596
    And what was Safin's comment about "they think they need you" or something like that about?
    I think he meant SPECTRE needed Obruchev, but he was already sure SPECTRE wouldn't be successful because of his own plot. So they were deluded into thinking Obruchev would help them.
  • goldenswissroyalegoldenswissroyale Switzerland
    Posts: 2,897
    The shot of the hall where workers stood in the water in pink (?) protective suits was a DN reference (imo) not only because of the suits but also because of the shape of the hall, somehow similar to No's room in the finale.
  • goldenswissroyalegoldenswissroyale Switzerland
    Posts: 2,897
    My question: When did Primo change the side from a SPECTRE henchman to Safin's henchman? Why wasn't he killed in Cuba? Was his DNA not part of the data bank of Obruchev?
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited October 7 Posts: 4,407
    My question: When did Primo change the side from a SPECTRE henchman to Safin's henchman? Why wasn't he killed in Cuba? Was his DNA not part of the data bank of Obruchev?

    Safe to say he switched sides when Blofeld died. Madeline does a bit of exposition here before she chucks the tea in his face later into the film.
    It’s possible that he just wasn’t close enough to the gas to be affected, and ran off in time (I can’t remember this bit explicitly).
    I wonder too if it’s possible Primo was a double agent working for Safin who infiltrated Spectre, but I doubt it.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited October 7 Posts: 4,624
    Primo switches sides when he's approached by Logan Ash. When Q is analysing Blofeld's eye, we see Primo meeting Ash, so I'm assuming this is when he is recruited.

    I don't think he was affected by the virus because it seemed the virus was only targeting high-ranking members, with all the henchmen and bodyguards seemingly unaffected. Remember, Paloma and Bond still had people to fight after SPECTRE had been wiped out.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 3,461
    Don’t forget that Safin deliberately spared his life in Cuba in order to hire him.
  • Posts: 784
    Great idea for a thread - I was about to start the same one myself. I'm going for my second viewing tomorrow, so hopefully I can clear some questions up then. But if not:

    -What is the motivation for Ash and Obruchev to work with Safin? Just money?

    -What exactly is the nature of Heracles? Is it a virus, or is it nanobots? It's often phrased as nanobots, meaning very small robots that you would presumably build in something like a microprocessor factory. But then we're shown all the workers at Safin's lair apparently farming something (?), and what look like incubator tanks, and the whole garden of death . . . what's going on here?

    -What is Safin's motivation? He wanted to kill Spectre to avenge the death of his family. But what's the motivation for killing millions around the world? Kill who, exactly? Or is it just selling the weapon to the highest bidder? Those three things seem to compete in the film and remain unclear to me.

    -Is the Noh mask ever explained? How/why does that become Safin's calling card?
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 4,407
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Primo switches sides when he's approached by Logan Ash. When Q is analysing Blofeld's eye, we see Primo meeting Ash, so I'm assuming this is when he is recruited.

    I don't think he was affected by the virus because it seemed the virus was only targeting high-ranking members, with all the henchmen and bodyguards seemingly unaffected. Remember, Paloma and Bond still had people to fight after SPECTRE had been wiped out.

    Oh yeah these are much better answers.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    Posts: 72
    Safin's an ardent eugenicist who believes in culling the 'unproductive' elements of the world's population as part of a Great Reset. He wouldn't be the first multi-billionaire rumoured to harbour those beliefs, after all!
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    edited October 7 Posts: 4,469
    I would have liked more Noh mask...in particular in the scenes with Mathilde. Say Safin told her to put on the mask in the garden, etc. This is the section of the film that needed more of the bizarre to undercut the sentimentality of Bond/Madeleine/Mathilde.

    Also, sheesh, if you're going to do the Garden of Death, show a proper execution by Safin there.

    Why did Mr. White say his wife "left long ago"?

    Who gave the signal to blow up Vesper's grave and why was there a fresh Spectre calling card there?
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    edited October 7 Posts: 3,461
    Because you don’t tell that your wife has been killed to strangers… not to mention enemies…

    Perhaps they used the excuse of the divorce all the time. Madeleine too speaks about a divorce…
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    Posts: 4,624
    echo wrote: »
    Why did Mr. White say his wife "left long ago"?
    I mean apart from just being an obvious thing they didn't really worry about in terms of continuity, I imagine it could be interpreted as not only White not wanting to be too familiar with Bond and giving his whole families history, but you could also say he feels extremely guilty about what happened so just said: "she left".
    echo wrote: »
    Who gave the signal to blow up Vesper's grave and why was there a fresh Spectre calling card there?
    The signal was given by the owners of the graveyard. We see the phone hanging in the little room when Bond follows the kid if I remember correctly. As for the card, I mean it still could've been there a little while, the flowers definitely had been there for quite a bit. It's just a good quality calling card :D
  • marcmarc Universal Exports
    Posts: 1,596
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Primo switches sides when he's approached by Logan Ash. When Q is analysing Blofeld's eye, we see Primo meeting Ash, so I'm assuming this is when he is recruited.
    That would be interesting; in this case, Blofeld would have witnessed 'live' how the man who was his only connection to the world outside switched sides, and could do nothing about it.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited October 7 Posts: 4,407
    marc wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Primo switches sides when he's approached by Logan Ash. When Q is analysing Blofeld's eye, we see Primo meeting Ash, so I'm assuming this is when he is recruited.
    That would be interesting; in this case, Blofeld would have witnessed 'live' how the man who was his only connection to the world outside switched sides, and could do nothing about it.

    I like that a lot. The whole bionic eye thing was great; his three goons carrying the eye around the Havana party was so cool.

    I kind of like how there was a second 00 number in play for the second half of the film but you never find out what the number was (assuming when Nomi gave Bond 007 back, she would have just inherited whatever number they gave Bond).

    Hearing Bond refer to someone else as 007 I thought was just awesome as well. I really like the balls they had when writing this film. The uber-traditional fans will always have Dr. No, and now we as an entire fanbase have 25 films with all the more variety.
  • Jukebox_JimJukebox_Jim Ireland
    Posts: 5
    Hi everyone. Just back from a second viewing and really enjoyed it again.

    Few questions, What was the urgency in blowing up the island? I know those boats were on the way but couldn't they have been intercepted or taken out just a little bit later? Cancel the missiles and get Bond out. Was it a case of not wanting other countries becoming involved in the whole thing? Could they have then kept Bond in isolation while Q or someone else figured out a solution? I think the bullets he took probably would have finished him anyway but just curious!
  • marcmarc Universal Exports
    Posts: 1,596
    I also like the bionic eye idea a lot.

    The way Nomi's bickering was written was sometimes too much imo, but she was involved in several great action scenes; so it was really good to have her and Bond as the action team in the finale.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    Posts: 4,624
    Hi everyone. Just back from a second viewing and really enjoyed it again.
    What was the urgency in blowing up the island? I know those boats were on the way but couldn't they have been intercepted or taken out just a little bit later?
    I think it was just because of the boats and they couldn't risk it. I mean if you think about it, the time it would've taken them to stop the missiles (if you can stop missiles I don't know how that works), get Bond out, send a team out to open the doors, and send the missiles over again - the boats would've arrived and either have collected the nanobots or whatever. Also, it depends on Safin because say Bond just left with Nomi, Madeleine and Mathilde, Safin would've still been alive to meet with the arriving boats, and even with Safin dead, these people would still have access to these dangerous weapons - whoever they were.
  • Jukebox_JimJukebox_Jim Ireland
    Posts: 5
    Thanks for the reply, Denbigh. You make some great points. I think I now reckon that the strike had to happen as other countries getting involved would nearly gaurantee the nanobots getting out. I'm also now ok with Bond sacrificing himself in that moment for the sake of his new family and potentially infecting others. It's been a wild half hour for me 🤣
  • Posts: 2
    ~Heavy spoilers~🍿
    ~Long Read~📖

    I think the overall problem with this movie is that they are trying to pick up the pieces left behind from spectre, and none of whats in that movie landed or felt legitimate or earned. I Actually like Lea Seydoux as an actress who played Madeline and was excited that she was the new bond girl in spectre, but the execution of their love story was so contrived, that in the end I really didn't care or believe it was a legitimate romance. Even the people who made that movie knows what's wrong with it. Why would they double down on it?

    The writing and execution in the first quarter of the this movie was pretty good up to a point but the basis for the characters just weren't there for me, again cuz it so heavily relies on spectre. You could call this spectre 2 tbh

    The concept of Bond having a child and the fact that it's a daughter on top of it Is actually a genius move as a concept on paper, its kinda like poetic justice for him. The idea that he has to really commit and care and actually be responsible for someone more than yourself. Having that character be his daughter could have been deeply profound in that way. They could have also addressed his relationship with women through the daughter character. That would be addressing the misogyny and faults in his character. Maybe even could address the vesper Lind history that made Bond unable to commit to any real relationships with women because of how his heart was basically ripped out of his chest by Vesper. I'll give Daniel Craig this, he knocked it out of the park with this movie in terms of his acting, especially in a few key scenes. He made me really feel like he realises his life has just turned upside down the moment he saw his daughters eyes. He genuinely made me tear up couple times in the film if I'm being honest. Any scene with Bond and his daughter was elevated by Craig's acting, and almost made up for some of the lackluster writing in the film. He made me really feel Bonds urgency and angst from her safety being in jeopardy. The daughter aspect, if it was utilised more and written better, could have had the potential to make this something really special and powerful. You could potentially really disect Bond through the daughter character, break his character down, address his issues and still feel like everything organically came together, cuz there could be a central focal point for it all, his new daughter. Come to think of it, it's actually not that dissimilar to the concept of what they did for wolverine in Logan.

    Ok...Ana de armas was a total smoke show in this role! Holy hell she was good. Her character was badass, playful and intrigueing and that made her even sexier. I didn't think she could get more attractive but this role definitely did it. She should have been Bonds sidekick throughout the movie and become friends with him instead, moving away from a potentially cliched romance. Maybe there could have been a throughline in the film with him becoming sort of her mentor along the way since he's pretty much the most seasoned agent and she's insecure with how good she is. You can even still have the "saying no" scene later in the movie as their partnership grows and maybe some awkwardness leading to a back and forth conversation. Maybe he tells her about Vesper. Wnatever. Something like that would have felt organic, served as character development for Bond and some more three-dimensional depth to her character. Makes the "saying no" moment maybe actually mean something in the movie rather than a throwaway comedic jab at Bonds character.

    LaShawna Lynch was fine. The hate for this movie for her being 007 and ppl just assuming that this is more of her movie than James bonds or she's taking power away from Bond and she's taking over, screw feminism, PC agenda pushing bitches, etc etc... I never subscribed to any of that nonsense. It's almost like people are trained and groomed these days to react like that without ever giving anything a chance....hey wait a minute🤔. I like her as an actress, was looking forward to see her performance. Problem is I never understood her character's initial hostility with Bond, I was like why is she going undercover and manipulating him into bringing her back to his place just to stick it to him and show him up. Could of had the same conversation in a different way maybe in a conventional way, idk doesn't matter. I have a feeling that her character doesn't like Bond for his history of misogyny and filandering, but nothing about him as an agent. So the writers prolly decided they should have her characters main reason for not liking bond to actually be a general critique of men in society??? not cuz she has a grudge against him, or he always sucked at his job, or from some personal altercation with him. That's the type of shoehorning of PC agendas that sane ppl of the audience are talking about. Give her a real reason not to like Bond and you can still have her give him shit about his relationship with women. Also you'd think they would have just started out as platonic competition instead of trying to one up and literary sabotage each other's missions when they both have literally the same goal, especially when the stakes are potentially so high. You think maybe she would look up to bond a little, wouldn't the new agents and recruits look up to bond? Wouldn't they all want to secretly be like him, not as a person, but as an agent? Since when is going by the book and putting down your legendary predecessors an interesting character trait. Aren't you supposed to like her by the end of the movie? They didn't give any real scene or event that gets them to respect each other to follow through on squashing the animosity, so what was the whole point? At least Naomi Harris's character didn't have all this nonsense. No newcomer is just going to give a middle finger to the previous guy when he's freaking James Bond, he should be a legend amongst new agents. This whole thing of Bond being out of his time and too old was addressed in Skyfall and spectre so that stuff felt tired. I have no problem with the ideals that were being pushed to be PC and give Bond some me too'ing, but the execution is too forced. At least itsl not as bad as Disney's Star wars tho. There is a way to do this people, organically, where it doesn't feel like a soapbox.

    Side note, felt the action was a bit underwhelming in this movie. It peaked with the scene in the first half with that goon shooting away at Madeline's window in the car and James just letting it happen while he deliberates wether to trust her or not. Great Bond moment and was narratively creative. This whole scene is totally Bond and badass. You believe Bond would be an asshole and do something like that. For the most part though this series has lost its edge especially in the action scenes, starting with some parts of Skyfall and heavily with spectre. They just came across as made to look pretty and expensive and putting more effort into the camera work trying to get everything in one one shots rather than making the action actually exciting. You guys remember the parkour scene leading to the shootout at the embassy in Casino Royale?! Those action scenes have so much edge to them, you feel the danger bond is in. Editing is one of the most important components to action scenes and these just feel like constantly unnecessary long takes. Now we even have parts where he is just walking right out in the open, firing his gun vaguely in bad guys direction, on a set that probably costed 1/4 of the movies budget. Even holding his gun from the hip at times and still casually just hitting his mark every time. All the while with the bond theme blaring in the background. Did the same thing in spectre at the desert scene. Just seemed like a total waste and honestly a bit lazy. The SUV Chase was ok I guess but it has Bond literally nudging his car into the bad guys cars just once and they go flying in to some convenient obstacle or hit a ramp that launches them into a flip. A lot of the action is like this and it comes off as just lazy even though they spend hundreds of millions of dollars making these movies.

    All that being said I didn't hate the movie, if you watch it just as a spy drama it's not that bad. I didn't get bored really that much even tho it's almost 3 hrs. So take that for what it's worth. There's annoying bits of comedy and one liners that come off as awkward rather than funny. Always thought that kind of stuff didnt fit for Craig's films. Rami Malek was good, but underrutilized. His characters ultimate goal was not really clearly defined, at least to me, but I think he served his purpose in the movie. Nothing more nothing less. For me I didn't mind bond dieing, and the film for the most part earned it, was done decently enough.

    It's certainly better than quantum of solace and spectre. A serviceable end to Daniel Craig's era. Although, I have noticed things about these last 3 films and they make me feel that ever since The Dark Knight came out, the people behind these films have been trying to copy Chris Nolan's aesthetics, that should stop. But that's a whole nother conversation.

    Thanks for reading.
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