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NO TIME TO DIE (2021) - First Reactions vs. Current Reactions

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  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,691
    After watching NTTD (& feeling like the last third was a Twilight Zone goof on me somehow), I watched SPECTRE to compare, and I had a pleasant enough time with it despite the cuckoo nonsense. Last night I watched Skyfall, and I was surprised how much I didn't hate it (until NTTD it was my least favourite Craig entry). In fact, it left me feeling nothing at all. And then it hit me- I've been desperately trying to like Craig's Bond for the last 13 years. Basically, everything after Quantum Of Solace has been, more or less, a hot mess for me. NTTD was like the final straw. There are too many other Bond movies I can just throw on & enjoy without reservation.
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,417
    Guess you can't force it
  • BirdlesonBirdleson Moderator
    edited November 2021 Posts: 2,161
    chrisisall wrote: »
    After watching NTTD (& feeling like the last third was a Twilight Zone goof on me somehow), I watched SPECTRE to compare, and I had a pleasant enough time with it despite the cuckoo nonsense. Last night I watched Skyfall, and I was surprised how much I didn't hate it (until NTTD it was my least favourite Craig entry). In fact, it left me feeling nothing at all. And then it hit me- I've been desperately trying to like Craig's Bond for the last 13 years. Basically, everything after Quantum Of Solace has been, more or less, a hot mess for me. NTTD was like the final straw. There are too many other Bond movies I can just throw on & enjoy without reservation.

    Even if I enjoyed (most of) the films, it has been a constant struggle for me to warm to Craig's Bond, as well. Maybe even in QOS. I do rank him third in his portrayal of the character, but I simultaneously care for his Bond the least.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,691
    Birdleson wrote: »
    chrisisall wrote: »
    After watching NTTD (& feeling like the last third was a Twilight Zone goof on me somehow), I watched SPECTRE to compare, and I had a pleasant enough time with it despite the cuckoo nonsense. Last night I watched Skyfall, and I was surprised how much I didn't hate it (until NTTD it was my least favourite Craig entry). In fact, it left me feeling nothing at all. And then it hit me- I've been desperately trying to like Craig's Bond for the last 13 years. Basically, everything after Quantum Of Solace has been, more or less, a hot mess for me. NTTD was like the final straw. There are too many other Bond movies I can just throw on & enjoy without reservation.

    Even if I enjoyed (most of) the films, it has been a constant struggle for me to warm to Craig's Bond, as well. Maybe even in QOS. I do rank him third in his portrayal of the character, but I simultaneously care for his Bond the least.

    Funny, Quantum Of Solace is his shining gem to me, and it was produced under the least favourable circumstances. Less was more in this Century IMO.
  • BirdlesonBirdleson Moderator
    edited November 2021 Posts: 2,161
    That's why I pointed that one out. I think it's great and he's great in it, but it is also where I started realizing that I really did not like that Bond as a "human being".
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,691
    Birdleson wrote: »
    That's why I pointed that one out. I think it's great and he's great in it, but it is also where I started realizing that I really did not like that Bond as a "human being".

    I think that Craig was set on the course of severe 'blunt instrument' from jump, partially because of the Bourne movies that came out in the same year that DAD did...
  • BennyBenny In the shadowsAdministrator, Moderator
    Posts: 14,882


    I thought this video was quite interesting.
  • MinionMinion Don't Hassle the Bond
    Posts: 1,165
    Benny wrote: »


    I thought this video was quite interesting.

    I take issue with some of his factual inaccuracies. Maybe this is petty, but I shut the video off when he claimed Bond retires to Goldeneye, when in reality it was a set they built. That would be such an easy thing to Google and fact check.
  • goldenswissroyalegoldenswissroyale Switzerland
    Posts: 4,398
    Minion wrote: »
    Benny wrote: »


    I thought this video was quite interesting.

    I take issue with some of his factual inaccuracies. Maybe this is petty, but I shut the video off when he claimed Bond retires to Goldeneye, when in reality it was a set they built. That would be such an easy thing to Google and fact check.

    I understand that this mistake bothers you. I didn't realize any other mistakes and enjoyed this video a lot. Several good references I didn't think of.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    Birdleson wrote: »
    That's why I pointed that one out. I think it's great and he's great in it, but it is also where I started realizing that I really did not like that Bond as a "human being".

    The only weird moment to me is the breakfast scene. I know it was important to show Bond with his family, to show that he would've had something to really live for... but nevertheless it was a weird moment.

  • StamperStamper
    Posts: 372
    That white polo Bond wears there in that scene and during the forest chase is just... weird. I find it pretty ugly when compared for example with the Sunspel navy polo from the CR beach resort scene.
  • George_KaplanGeorge_Kaplan Not a red herring
    Posts: 565
    Stamper wrote: »
    That white polo Bond wears there in that scene and during the forest chase is just... weird. I find it pretty ugly when compared for example with the Sunspel navy polo from the CR beach resort scene.

    It's not a polo shirt, it's a Henley. It's similar to a polo shirt but it doesn't have a collar.
  • StamperStamper
    Posts: 372
    Oh I get it. Don't like the look of these it's kinda Die Hard 4-5.
  • FeyadorFeyador Montreal, Canada
    Posts: 735
    sworddevil1 wrote: »
    slide_99 wrote: »
    MrsAuralSects wrote: »
    slide_99 wrote: »
    Nothing in DAD is an unforgivable as making Bond and Blofeld adoptive brothers. It just screams, "We can't derive any real drama from this premise, therefore we'll give the hero and villain an irrelevant past relationship that doesn't actually affect the plot in any way in order to trick the audience into thinking this movie has emotional resonance."

    Bond doesn't ask to be taken to his 'adoptive brother' in Belmarsh....in fact I can't recall the word brother being used at all in NTTD....

    It doesn't matter if they don't use those specific words. Blofeld flat out says that he killed his father because he preferred Bond over him and wanted him treated as a little brother. It's in the dialogue.
    so where exactly does tricking the audience come into play?
    Giving the hero and villain a common origin is a shallow and comic bookish way of trying to generate drama where there isn't any. They could have just had Blofeld be Blofeld, a supervillain who wants to control global surveillance who has no personal connection to Bond, and had basically the same movie.

    And it would have been much better.
    matt_u wrote: »
    Birdleson wrote: »
    That's why I pointed that one out. I think it's great and he's great in it, but it is also where I started realizing that I really did not like that Bond as a "human being".

    The only weird moment to me is the breakfast scene. I know it was important to show Bond with his family, to show that he would've had something to really live for... but nevertheless it was a weird moment.


    I wonder it it's true that the pocket knife that Bond uses to cut up the apple for Mathilde is the same one he used to cut fragments Of Patrice’s bullets from his chest In Skyfall?
  • FeyadorFeyador Montreal, Canada
    Posts: 735
    Benny wrote: »


    I thought this video was quite interesting.

    From the comments to the video, some of them facetious, others a stretch and possibly mistaken:

    1. Q says to Moneypenny "Don't touch that" which is a line we often hear Desmond Llewellyn's Q say to Bond.

    2. The hairless cat is a nod to Mister Bigglesworth, Dr. Evil's cat in the Austin Powers movies.

    3. Don't know if someone mentioned in before, but in conversation between Safin and Madeleine in clinic, Safin talks about the flower on the table. This flower (digitalis) was used to poison Bond in Casino Royale.

    4. Towards the end of the novel YOU ONLY LIVE TWICE ; "Kissy wondered what moment to choose to tell Bond that she was going to have a baby."

    5. The perfume atomiser that safin gave Madeline is similar in design and plot device to the perfume atomisers that’s Blofeld gave his angels of death in OHMSS. Both were gold cylinders given to beautiful women and both hid a biological agent meant to cause death.

    6. FYEO has more nods than we thought
    - Both Madeline and Melina witness a parents murder. Melina kills Gonzales as Bond was attempting to question him, while Madeline inadvertently kills Blofeld as Bond was questioning him.
    - A visit to the grave of a lost love would be interrupted by an attack by Blofeld, who has a minor role in both films and is eventually killed.

  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    How about SPECTRE getting Bond's DNA from the toothbrush he uses in his outdoor shower in Jamaica? Valdo holds it in his hands while preparing Heracles in front of Primo.
  • imranbecksimranbecks Singapore
    Posts: 972
    Stamper wrote: »
    That white polo Bond wears there in that scene and during the forest chase is just... weird. I find it pretty ugly when compared for example with the Sunspel navy polo from the CR beach resort scene.

    Not a polo shirt.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,526
    Feyador wrote: »
    sworddevil1 wrote: »
    slide_99 wrote: »
    MrsAuralSects wrote: »
    slide_99 wrote: »
    Nothing in DAD is an unforgivable as making Bond and Blofeld adoptive brothers. It just screams, "We can't derive any real drama from this premise, therefore we'll give the hero and villain an irrelevant past relationship that doesn't actually affect the plot in any way in order to trick the audience into thinking this movie has emotional resonance."

    Bond doesn't ask to be taken to his 'adoptive brother' in Belmarsh....in fact I can't recall the word brother being used at all in NTTD....

    It doesn't matter if they don't use those specific words. Blofeld flat out says that he killed his father because he preferred Bond over him and wanted him treated as a little brother. It's in the dialogue.
    so where exactly does tricking the audience come into play?
    Giving the hero and villain a common origin is a shallow and comic bookish way of trying to generate drama where there isn't any. They could have just had Blofeld be Blofeld, a supervillain who wants to control global surveillance who has no personal connection to Bond, and had basically the same movie.

    And it would have been much better.
    matt_u wrote: »
    Birdleson wrote: »
    That's why I pointed that one out. I think it's great and he's great in it, but it is also where I started realizing that I really did not like that Bond as a "human being".

    The only weird moment to me is the breakfast scene. I know it was important to show Bond with his family, to show that he would've had something to really live for... but nevertheless it was a weird moment.


    I wonder it it's true that the pocket knife that Bond uses to cut up the apple for Mathilde is the same one he used to cut fragments Of Patrice’s bullets from his chest In Skyfall?

    If so I’m surprised no one has ID’d the knife; it would be the pocket knife to have for a Bond fan.
  • imranbecksimranbecks Singapore
    Posts: 972
    matt_u wrote: »
    How about SPECTRE getting Bond's DNA from the toothbrush he uses in his outdoor shower in Jamaica? Valdo holds it in his hands while preparing Heracles in front of Primo.

    Wow you're right. I can't believe I never noticed that till now.

    51693719254_7bdf53380b_b.jpg
    51693309218_668f24e542_b.jpg
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    imranbecks wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    How about SPECTRE getting Bond's DNA from the toothbrush he uses in his outdoor shower in Jamaica? Valdo holds it in his hands while preparing Heracles in front of Primo.

    Wow you're right. I can't believe I never noticed that till now.

    Yep! Plus Bond has the SF scar from Patrice's bullet. It's visible in Matera as well when he's laying on the bed.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,477
    imranbecks wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    How about SPECTRE getting Bond's DNA from the toothbrush he uses in his outdoor shower in Jamaica? Valdo holds it in his hands while preparing Heracles in front of Primo.

    Wow you're right. I can't believe I never noticed that till now.

    51693719254_7bdf53380b_b.jpg
    51693309218_668f24e542_b.jpg

    That's rich, I never caught that. Same with me not realizing for a good while that it's Madeleine's hair that Safin has in her office. Seems obvious now.
  • MrsAuralSectsMrsAuralSects
    Posts: 214
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    imranbecks wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    How about SPECTRE getting Bond's DNA from the toothbrush he uses in his outdoor shower in Jamaica? Valdo holds it in his hands while preparing Heracles in front of Primo.

    Wow you're right. I can't believe I never noticed that till now.

    51693719254_7bdf53380b_b.jpg
    51693309218_668f24e542_b.jpg

    That's rich, I never caught that. Same with me not realizing for a good while that it's Madeleine's hair that Safin has in her office. Seems obvious now.

    Good one, I didn't get it before either and I've seen the film 9 times
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    edited November 2021 Posts: 2,930
    Was that breakfast scene part of a re-shoot? Craig looks like he's lost a lot of muscle mass in that Henley photo. Anyway, I got that the hair was Madeleine's, but I missed that Bond had peeled the apple with the knife that he'd used to dig out the bullet in SF!
  • George_KaplanGeorge_Kaplan Not a red herring
    Posts: 565
    Did anyone catch Wilson's cameo at the SPECTRE party? Got it on my first viewing surprisingly.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited November 2021 Posts: 7,526
    George_Kaplan wrote: »
    Did anyone catch Wilson's cameo at the SPECTRE party? Got it on my first viewing surprisingly.

    Yes! Took my two viewings but I did catch it.

    I've mentioned it before but I think this is where Grace Jones' cameo would have been... even when Bond says "SPECTRE agents... all of them." It almost feels like that line was written for some sort of cameo appearance.

    A nod to MayDay being a SPECTRE agent would have been cool I think.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    Posts: 2,930
    NickTwentyTwo wrote: »
    when Bond says "SPECTRE agents... all of them." It almost feels like that line was written for some sort of cameo appearance.
    Good call, Nick.

  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    NickTwentyTwo wrote: »
    George_Kaplan wrote: »
    Did anyone catch Wilson's cameo at the SPECTRE party? Got it on my first viewing surprisingly.

    Yes! Took my two viewings but I did catch it.

    I've mentioned it before but I think this is where Grace Jones' cameo would have been... even when Bond says "SPECTRE agents... all of them." It almost feels like that line was written for some sort of cameo appearance.

    A nod to MayDay being a SPECTRE agent would have been cool I think.

    The Taschen book mentions that May Day was meant to be Bond’s friend and she would’ve appeared in Jamaica.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,526
    matt_u wrote: »
    NickTwentyTwo wrote: »
    George_Kaplan wrote: »
    Did anyone catch Wilson's cameo at the SPECTRE party? Got it on my first viewing surprisingly.

    Yes! Took my two viewings but I did catch it.

    I've mentioned it before but I think this is where Grace Jones' cameo would have been... even when Bond says "SPECTRE agents... all of them." It almost feels like that line was written for some sort of cameo appearance.

    A nod to MayDay being a SPECTRE agent would have been cool I think.

    The Taschen book mentions that May Day was meant to be Bond’s friend and she would’ve appeared in Jamaica.

    Oh really? Crazy.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,025
    Yeah she was supposed to distract Logan Ash while Bond and Leiter talked private.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    edited November 2021 Posts: 2,930
    Ah, that's right. Mind you, how great would it have been if MayDay had been in a Jamaica scene as Bond's friend but had then been at the SPECTRE party in Cuba too and the 'all of them' line had been his realisation that she'd been feeding them information all along? That'd work, no?
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