Detailed gunbarrel music guide + Gunbarrel music ranking game

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  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,957
    Not much wrong with this one for me, I feel like I must've ranked it higher. Although these 80s ones perhaps get a bit rote for Barry, I just love 'em. Feels like proper Bank Holiday Bond to me, vamp all divided up, riff on strings, plenty of triangle... lovely stuff. Perhaps the least unique of any of Barry's gunbarrels if you know what I mean, but nothing wrong with it at all.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 6,788
    A reliable, if unexceptional, gunbarrel cue.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 5,979
    Agreed.

    OP is the first Bond film I saw in the theater, so I will always have a soft spot for this gunbarrel (and PTS, which has a lot of good cues).

    That being said, it is not the most exciting one. TLD did a similar gunbarrel, better.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    Posts: 6,730
    mtm wrote: »
    Feels like proper Bank Holiday Bond to me, vamp all divided up, riff on strings, plenty of triangle...
    :))
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,957
    Heh! I'm not sure how to put it: you know what I mean- instead of four long notes, Barry does his thing where it becomes 12 or so more fiddly notes :)
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    edited December 2023 Posts: 6,730
    Yes, I know exactly what you mean. I love that description! And I do find this one to be a "happy place" kind of gunbarrel.

    ---

    Time to reveal yet another gunbarrel. Number 13 is none other than...

    A VIEW TO A KILL



    We're all over the place here. The highest place achieved by AVTAK was 2nd, and the lowest was 23rd. 4 people ranked it in the ones, 3 people ranked it in the tens and 3 people ranked it in the twenties. It scored 126 points.

    I was that 2nd place. AVTAK is without a doubt one of my favorite gunbarrel cues. I love its lean arrangement and fast tempo. The riff played on flutes and clarinets plus trumpets (and sans violins) sounds really cool, and the brassy fanfare at the end of the cue sounds both cool and dangerous. I also love the simple percussion, that triangle roll that, when unaccompanied by tambourine, I find to be evocative of something high tech, of blinking lights or circuitry or something, which suits the subject matter of the film.

    How do you feel about this gunbarrel cue and its place in the ranking game?
  • Posts: 85
    Hey, so I’ve got a lot to catch up on here so forgive me for the spiel! No Time To Die ranked 22nd place for me, simply because of how derivative it is of Thomas Newman’s effort in Spectre. It’s probably reflective of the time constraints they were facing in making the score, but Johnny Marr playing the chromatic B/C/C#/C ostinato feels like a wasted opportunity. Imagine if he’d been able to let rip with the full Bond theme on his guitar…

    I ranked Die Another Day in 17th place. It probably should have been a little higher, on reflection. I like that Pierce Brosnan finally gets the trademark B suspended fourth chords at the start of the gun barrel and that the Bond vamp is back on the electric guitar. Both elements have been missing since Licence To Kill, so it’s a nice link to the past. David Arnold was obviously aware of this, given that it was the 40th anniversary of the franchise. The cymbal crashes, shrieking brass and electronic drum pattern are also ace.

    I’m not sure why I placed Quantum Of Solace higher at 13. It’s neat hearing what is essentially ‘The Name’s Bond…James Bond’, arranged for the gun barrel sequence. The prominent triangle and tambourine hark back to John Barry. The electric guitar has always bothered me slightly though, in that it’s lost in the mix of the rest of the orchestra. The panning also sounds slightly off to my ears.

    The Spy Who Loved Me is a fairly skippable entry at #20 for me. I miss the ‘bullet’ hits which had been customary up until this point. I agree that it sounds like a mistake in the arrangement when the ostinato is interrupted by the Bond vamp to sync with the bullet. The ‘bubbly’ synth at the end probably worked at the time, but it’s dated badly.

    I think I ranked Tomorrow Never Dies the lowest out of everyone, at number 23. I don’t have an aversion to it per se and I commend David Arnold for trying something different with the structure (I recall him saying that he wanted to end the gun barrel with a ‘musical question’, as no-one had done that before). However, it’s just a little dull and creates little sense of drama or anticipation of what’s to come in the movie. I do like Arnold’s use of ‘col legno’ though - getting the string players to hit their strings with the wooden side of their bows as a percussive effect.

    I placed the Spectre gun barrel in third place - higher above everyone else it seems! I LOVE this arrangement. I’m a big fan of the music under the company logos and Thomas Newman’s unexpected shift to the C major chord and then to A major before the crescendo into the traditional B suspended fourth chords is very exciting. Even though the Bond vamp is missing, you have prominent pizzicato double bass and bongos! It’s like From Russia With Love all over again! I’m sentimental about this arrangement as I remember guessing in the cinema whether the gun barrel would be back at the start of the film or not. I was overjoyed when it was, particularly with this terrific arrangement.

    I placed Octopussy in 15th place (behind A View To A Kill, but ahead of Moonraker). As everyone has documented, Barry didn’t hugely change the structure or arrangement of his gun barrel from Octopussy to The Living Daylights, but there are subtle differences. I’m a fan of the strings carrying the vamp in this version and I like the subtlety of the trumpets accentuating every other note. I’m also a sucker for the tambourine/triangle combo Barry loved, as well as the cellos playing the ostinato with the added E at the bottom. This gun barrel plods along with poise, almost like a military procession, which was probably a conscious choice of Barry’s leading into the opening scene on the airbase. It’s probably why it’s so brass-heavy too.

    Question for @mattjoes: can we rank all the scores like this next?! ;)
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,957
    It’s kind of the same but quicker, so my OP comments pretty much apply here!
    What I don’t get is how it can have a quicker tempo and yet still fit the same onscreen graphic sequence?
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    Posts: 6,730
    I do like Arnold’s use of ‘col legno’ though - getting the string players to hit their strings with the wooden side of their bows as a percussive effect.
    I like this too, sounds really good when played together with the timpani.

    Even though the Bond vamp is missing, you have prominent pizzicato double bass and bongos! It’s like From Russia With Love all over again!
    Good call on the bongos. There are barely any bongos in the gunbarrel sequences. It's an instrument that could get more use.

    This gun barrel plods along with poise, almost like a military procession, which was probably a conscious choice of Barry’s leading into the opening scene on the airbase. It’s probably why it’s so brass-heavy too.
    Absolutely, it's got a strong military feel, which does tie into the opening scene.

    Question for @mattjoes: can we rank all the scores like this next?! ;)
    Actually, this game was inspired by @GoldenGun's numerous ranking games, and he already hosted one for the scores, a couple of years ago. It provided an opportunity for some very interesting conversation. Here's a link:
    https://www.mi6community.com/discussion/20375/quick-big-mi6-music-score-ranking-game

    mtm wrote: »
    What I don’t get is how it can have a quicker tempo and yet still fit the same onscreen graphic sequence?
    The music is played faster, but the difference in length is short enough not to be too noticeable. The most clear evidence of a faster tempo in AVTAK is that Bond fires his gun a beat after the riff starts playing, whereas in OP, the gun is fired a beat before the riff starts playing. The other "tell" is that in AVTAK, the Bond theme is practically over when the white circle reaches the lower right corner of the screen, whereas in OP, the cue reaches the same musical point only when the circle is expanding to present the first shot of the film.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 6,788
    Thank you for mentioning that @mattjoes :) I really appreciate it.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    Posts: 6,730
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    Thank you for mentioning that @mattjoes :) I really appreciate it.
    You're welcome.

    ---

    Anybody got some further thoughts on AVTAK, before moving on to another reveal?
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 5,979
    mtm wrote: »
    It’s kind of the same but quicker, so my OP comments pretty much apply here!
    What I don’t get is how it can have a quicker tempo and yet still fit the same onscreen graphic sequence?

    There is a sameness to OP-AVTAK-TLD. I mean, they're all classic and better than others that we have yet to see on this list (coughEricSerra/cough).

    Because the music's so close, I tend to rank the music on these three gunbarrels the way I rank the films themselves. TLD > OP > AVTAK
  • Now we’re at my lowest ranked Barry gunbarrel with AVTAK. The tempo being sped up is a bit odd to considering Barry slows down the tempo later on during the Eiffel tower chase. Like I said before, these last few Barry scored Gunbarrels do tend to rank lower in my estimates unfortunately.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    edited December 2023 Posts: 6,730
    The Number 12 gunbarrel music is...

    MOONRAKER



    Ranked between 1st and 18th place by our voters, Moonraker received 2 votes in the ones and 8 votes in the tens. It scored 132 points.

    I ranked it in first place. I remember the first time I watched the film and heard this cue, I was surprised by how weird it sounded, especially the gunshot chords. It wasn't that I liked it or disliked it, I just couldn't quite process it. Some comments I have found on YouTube express confusion and annoyance over this arrangement:
    Worst gunbarrel music ever, sounds like the orchestra is cleaning their wind instruments.
    That's the same impression this gunbarrel music always gave to me, I really found it hard to assimilate what it sounded like the first times. Sounds really... weird, as if it's being played by rusty bass horns.
    buh-duh BWWAAHM
    buh duh!! BWWWAAAAAHMM
    buh duh duh deh deh!!
    Yeah this intro is really dissonant and hysterical, not a very clean recording for a Bond intro - - which is strange because so much of John Barry's score for this film is so grandiose and lush
    It’s terrible and all the instruments are out of tune (editor's note: they're not)
    (sources: 1, 2)

    Eventually, I came to the conclusion that I wasn't bothered by the arrangement, and over the years I've come to really love it. It sounds dramatic, exciting and, yes, very quirky—even while sharing an orchestral style with gunbarrels like OP, AVTAK and TLD, this one is unlikely to be mistaken for those.

    The gunshot chords in the intro have a very jarring quality: they sound, for lack of a better word, ugly, and they're matched in 'ugliness' by those gunshot responses (the low notes in response to the chords), which are usually arranged to have a slightly brassier sound, but here are more prominent in their use of woodwinds. The bass drum also gives these low notes a strangely savage touch. But once again, these qualities don't bother me; in fact, I really enjoy them. It's like metal music in orchestral form.

    Later on, when playing parts of the riff together, the horns and trumpets achieve a rather cold and metallic sound that I also love. The use of orchestral instruments for the riff (not exclusive to MR, of course) is also welcome, because there are specific notes that are played staccato (short and precise), a great little touch that doesn't come across in the same way when the riff is played on guitar. I also love hearing the Bond theme played on violins.

    The subtle touch of having the tambourine emphasize the off-beat gives the whole cue a refreshing energy and sense of drive that other gunbarrels don't have. This isn't a slow, march-like version of the Bond theme as in the OP and TLD gunbarrels—this is action music. It's even got more of a driving feel than the Connery gunbarrels.

    I appreciate this gunbarrel music even more seeing that some of the latest gunbarrel cues have had a more generic sound, and we're unlikely to get anything like this in the near future, especially after the GoldenEye score, whose negative reception had consequences that last to this day. The cue sounds like Barry, who had arranged the Bond theme for eight films in the past, saying "let's go nuts." I don't know if he felt that way about it, but the music sure sounds that way to me, even if its arrangement shares certain basic elements with other gunbarrel cues, so it's not quite as out there as something like GoldenEye.

    How do you feel about this gunbarrel and its place in the ranking game?
  • R1s1ngs0nR1s1ngs0n France
    edited December 2023 Posts: 2,019
    MR came at #12 for me as well.
    It is a truly unique sounding gunbarrel that is instantly recognizable.
    The opening riff, in particular, sounds very ‘clean’ - like it was recorded in your own living room.
    Every other gunbarrel opening has this distant, echoey effect, but this one sounds almost ‘unplugged’
    I like it a lot.
    Such a shame this one wasn’t included in the MR soundtrack as it’s a truly great variation (same with FRWL).
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    edited December 2023 Posts: 6,730
    R1s1ngs0n wrote: »
    The opening riff, in particular, sounds very ‘clean’ - like it was recorded in your own living room.
    Every other gunbarrel opening has this distant, echoey effect, but this one sounds almost ‘unplugged’
    Very good observation, the clean sound of the instruments adds to the effectiveness of the opening chords.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 6,788
    I find this version slightly more distinctive than the other variations of this gunbarrel music. In hindsight though I’d say the faster AVTAK track and the cleaner TLD one are my preferred versions .
  • Moonraker was ranked at #16 for me. I actually quite like Barry’s orchestration of the Bond theme in general throughout this film, including the gondola chase.
  • Posts: 85
    I ranked A View To A Kill in 14th place. I really do like the sense of urgency to this gun barrel, assisted by the rather manic triangle, which resembles an alarm. Does anyone else find the timing slightly off when the triangle stops, mid-vamp? Evidently the tempo was too quick for the tambourine to join in, hence its omission. Notice the lack of reverb on the opening chords, compared to the arrangement in Moonraker/Octopussy/TLD, which is more sustained. It’s a cleaner and more crisp arrangement overall, with pizzicato double bass mirroring the cellos playing the ostinato. I like that touch (you hear it in the Spectre gun barrel too).

    I ranked Moonraker in #16th place. What strikes me about this gun barrel is how sparse the instrumentation is. To my ears, there are only brass instruments playing the suspended fourths, no woodwind, nor strings. There’s a bass drum on the third chord, but by Barry standards this is pretty minimal. I spat out my tea reading some of the YouTube comments, particularly the one about the ‘orchestra…cleaning out their instruments’ :D. There’s a definite attack to the opening notes of the brass and also a bite to the violins as they play the vamp, quite staccato. I’m a fan of the tambourine and triangle combo, which creates a ‘giddy up’ feel in the rhythm section (imagine trotting along on a horse to it and you’ll know what I mean haha). There’s a discernible lack of woodwind overall; if you listen closely you can hear clarinets playing the chromatic ostinato with the cellos, but that’s about it. That’s why I rank Octopussy, AVTAK and TLD higher, because of their fuller instrumentation. Also as we’ve discussed quite a bit before, the recording quality of the Moonraker score is substandard compared to other Bond films, which doesn’t help matters.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    edited December 2023 Posts: 6,730
    Moonraker was ranked at #16 for me. I actually quite like Barry’s orchestration of the Bond theme in general throughout this film, including the gondola chase.
    Yeah. The "Bondola" chase music is one of my favorite action cues in the Bond films. It was a lot of work, but also a pleasure, to recreate it with virtual instruments. The cue has a lot in common with the gunbarrel music.

    I ranked A View To A Kill in 14th place. I really do like the sense of urgency to this gun barrel, assisted by the rather manic triangle, which resembles an alarm.
    Interesting how the same instrument can be evoke different concepts or feelings in each person. The triangle does enhance the sense of urgency of the cue.

    Does anyone else find the timing slightly off when the triangle stops, mid-vamp?
    You might have an edited film rip of the gunbarrel which has circled around the net (which I also have), in which the triangle does appear to stop mid-vamp. I suspect the person who edited the audio couldn't help this when mixing and combining different elements, taken from different audio stems, to try to avoid sound effects. In the film, the triangle plays the full vamp, and only stops when the sustained E minor chord starts (that is, at the very end of the cue, barely audible in the film because of the helicopter).

    I’m a fan of the tambourine and triangle combo, which creates a ‘giddy up’ feel in the rhythm section (imagine trotting along on a horse to it and you’ll know what I mean haha).
    I agree, I like this very much.

    There’s a discernible lack of woodwind overall; if you listen closely you can hear clarinets playing the chromatic ostinato with the cellos, but that’s about it.
    It's harder to notice in a stereo mix, but listening to a surround mix, one can tell are more woodwinds, in fact, not any less than in the latter Barry gunbarrels.

    Also as we’ve discussed quite a bit before, the recording quality of the Moonraker score is substandard compared to other Bond films, which doesn’t help matters.
    If (when) the score is re-released, it will be very interesting to hear how the gunbarrel music sounds.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    edited December 2023 Posts: 6,730
    The Number 11 gunbarrel music is...

    DR. NO



    Ranked between 1st and 25th place, Dr. No received 4 votes in the ones, 4 votes in the tens and 2 votes in the twenties (both of which were for the 25th place). This gunbarrel scored 137 points.

    I ranked it in 25th place. The opening electronic music (which I hope to hear in its entirety one day) is certainly interesting, as is the explosive use of the Bond theme after the gunshot, but for me, this gunbarrel can't compete with the other ones, which generate more sustained excitement. Having said that, I still appreciate this one in its own way, as it creates its own unique sense of quiet anticipation for the gunshot. I ranked this gunbarrel behind Casino Royale '06, but in hindsight, I should have reversed them, as the use of the Bond theme, albeit partial, gives it an advantage.

    How do you feel about the Dr. No gunbarrel?
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,957
    Interesting, I didn't realise that Atoms In Space has never really been made available.
  • R1s1ngs0nR1s1ngs0n France
    Posts: 2,019
    I adore this gunbarrel and ranked it 2nd.
    Beep-Beep-Beep-Big Ben-Boom-Bond Theme.
    So 60s and yet so modern. Can’t get enough of it.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Kicking: Impossible
    Posts: 6,730
    I would love to hear Atoms in Space in full. Who's going to visit the Daphne Oram archive with a hidden microphone and record the whole thing for us?

    R1s1ngs0n wrote: »
    I adore this gunbarrel and ranked it 2nd.
    Beep-Beep-Beep-Big Ben-Boom-Bond Theme.
    So 60s and yet so modern. Can’t get enough of it.
    Now that you mention it, it's especially interesting to hear that electronic music today, considering it was cutting edge stuff back in the day. And it has aged well.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,957
    I think it’s quite interesting that, considering they started so close to each other and are both still going strong today, Bond and Doctor Who both started with some pioneering electronic music made by an trailblazing woman from the BBC Radiophonic Workshop!
  • MalloryMallory Do mosquitoes have friends?
    edited December 2023 Posts: 2,057
    R1s1ngs0n wrote: »
    I adore this gunbarrel and ranked it 2nd.
    Beep-Beep-Beep-Big Ben-Boom-Bond Theme.
    So 60s and yet so modern. Can’t get enough of it.

    Trivia time. Do you know where the beeps appear in another Bond film?
  • Dr. No I had a #1. It isn’t the quintessential Bond gunbarrel, but my lord it’s hard to top that original recording of the Bond theme. I’m also a fan of the electronic noises that starts the film off; I’d like to think that audiences were intrigued and curious when they first saw this opening back in 62, before being blown away by the loud gunshot being fired by Bob Simmons, all before leading into that legendary recording.

    As a side note, my favorite gunbarrel will always be the Bob Simmons version; it’s perfection imo.
  • R1s1ngs0nR1s1ngs0n France
    Posts: 2,019
    Mallory wrote: »
    R1s1ngs0n wrote: »
    I adore this gunbarrel and ranked it 2nd.
    Beep-Beep-Beep-Big Ben-Boom-Bond Theme.
    So 60s and yet so modern. Can’t get enough of it.

    Trivia time. Do you know where the beeps appear in another Bond film?
    No idea. But if I had to guess, maybe DAF in the satellite control room?
  • MalloryMallory Do mosquitoes have friends?
    Posts: 2,057
    R1s1ngs0n wrote: »
    Mallory wrote: »
    R1s1ngs0n wrote: »
    I adore this gunbarrel and ranked it 2nd.
    Beep-Beep-Beep-Big Ben-Boom-Bond Theme.
    So 60s and yet so modern. Can’t get enough of it.

    Trivia time. Do you know where the beeps appear in another Bond film?
    No idea. But if I had to guess, maybe DAF in the satellite control room?

    It's not DAF, though you're not a million miles away. It is a "more recent" Bond film.
  • Posts: 85
    Mallory wrote: »
    R1s1ngs0n wrote: »
    I adore this gunbarrel and ranked it 2nd.
    Beep-Beep-Beep-Big Ben-Boom-Bond Theme.
    So 60s and yet so modern. Can’t get enough of it.

    Trivia time. Do you know where the beeps appear in another Bond film?

    You hear them on the track 'Kiss Of Life' from the Die Another Day soundtrack. I always thought that was a nice little tip of the hat to the 40th anniversary of the franchise by David Arnold :)
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