SPECTRE, most fun Bond adventure in decades?

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  • Posts: 1,469
    If we're talking "fun factor", I think CR easily beats SP, though I like SP a lot and it's fun to watch...some of SP's humor is coming back to me now. SF was certainly "exciting", and there's a certain fun factor in that. After these, for "fun factor" others that come to mind are GE, FYEO, MR, TSWLM, and of course there are others before them.
  • BondAficionadoBondAficionado Former IMDBer
    Posts: 1,884
    shamanimal wrote: »
    Are you a schoolteacher in real life?

    Anyway, I think Wizard's right, the series has never blown up some Asians in a helicopter anyway. Perhaps an idea for Bond 25?
    Which race of people would people here like to see represented with an untimely death? Perhaps we could start a thread?

    Sorry, I'll stop now.

    Now, having just met you, I wouldn't go as far as calling you a cold-hearted bastard. But it wouldn't be a stretch to imagine... You think of Asian characters as disposable individuals, rather than meaningful ones. ;P
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    Shardlake wrote: »
    SPECTRE is dire, without doubt the biggest disappointment of the series and also one of the biggest opportunities missed, it could have been so good a real triumph.

    To say it's dire is somewhat hyperbolic. It is just average.

    But I agree that it is the biggest disappointment and missed opportunity of the series and this is why we perceive it as actually being worse than it is.

    Let's be fair the Craig era, warts and all, is better than camp, moribund fare such as DAF and TMWTGG.

    bondjames wrote: »
    The only thing that really impresses me about this film is the arsty thematic elements that Mendes brings in. From the yellow filter (which finally is pulled in the last scene to suggest new beginnings) to the 'dead are alive' subtexts etc. & overall surreal spectral moodiness of it all. The film arguably works on that level. I'd go so far as to say he saved the film by inserting and accenting those elements.

    You're joking now right?

    Mendes thematic elements are about as subtle as Keith Lemon. The whole 'dead are alive' thing would be laughed out of first year film school it's so heavy handed. Actually shoving it in the audiences faces to the extent you write it down for them is both an admission that you've failed as a story teller and that they are too thick to get it.

  • QuantumOrganizationQuantumOrganization We have people everywhere
    Posts: 1,187
    Shardlake wrote: »
    SPECTRE is dire, without doubt the biggest disappointment of the series and also one of the biggest opportunities missed, it could have been so good a real triumph.

    To say it's dire is somewhat hyperbolic. It is just average.

    But I agree that it is the biggest disappointment and missed opportunity of the series and this is why we perceive it as actually being worse than it is.

    Let's be fair the Craig era, warts and all, is better than camp, moribund fare such as DAF and TMWTGG.

    bondjames wrote: »
    The only thing that really impresses me about this film is the arsty thematic elements that Mendes brings in. From the yellow filter (which finally is pulled in the last scene to suggest new beginnings) to the 'dead are alive' subtexts etc. & overall surreal spectral moodiness of it all. The film arguably works on that level. I'd go so far as to say he saved the film by inserting and accenting those elements.

    You're joking now right?

    Mendes thematic elements are about as subtle as Keith Lemon. The whole 'dead are alive' thing would be laughed out of first year film school it's so heavy handed. Actually shoving it in the audiences faces to the extent you write it down for them is both an admission that you've failed as a story teller and that they are too thick to get it.
    Perhaps the one time I agree with you on something. I approve. The filter always bugged me on SP. We were spoiled with Skyfall's Roger Deakins who made every shot
    From the London Underground to Shanghai have so much color and pop. Imagine my (and others) when Hoyte comes along and decides to piss (literally) over all these great European cities.
  • Posts: 1,162
    peter wrote: »
    @RichardTheBruce, with all due respect, how were audiences familiar with OHMSS? In '69 Bond was Connery... so who was this imposter showing tenderness, and... marrying???

    Or TLD?... I love my Bond to throw a curve ball (at the time, 13 years old, almost 14, I adored TLD), and was knocked senseless with CR; I admire (and now respect) QoS...

    SP was beautiful.
    Well cast.
    Some of the most sexy scenes I've witnessed in the franchise (lookin' at DC-007 and Sciarra widow)
    ... but... as a whole... it fails... it doesn't connect... M is weaker... "C" is just such an obvious "c" and takes away from that B-Plot (interesting, but executed terribly); Madeliene is wonderful on paper, and looks great, but, in action, unbelievable and never sells... Things like Hinx's "hook", with the nails, are never brought up again... all round half finished and half-assed...

    ... and yes, I still think this piece of beautiful shit has, and will have, value down the road..

    Wow, your ideas of sexy scenes are obviously very different from mine. For starters, mine would never involve a woman with a 4, let alone a 5 at the beginning. And yes, I realize that I am a political incorrect, sexist and misogynistic dinosaur. Still, that's how I feel.
    I might mention too, that even if his widow had been played by a real hot cookie I still would find the scene creepy.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    Shardlake wrote: »
    SPECTRE is dire, without doubt the biggest disappointment of the series and also one of the biggest opportunities missed, it could have been so good a real triumph.

    To say it's dire is somewhat hyperbolic. It is just average.

    But I agree that it is the biggest disappointment and missed opportunity of the series and this is why we perceive it as actually being worse than it is.

    Let's be fair the Craig era, warts and all, is better than camp, moribund fare such as DAF and TMWTGG.

    bondjames wrote: »
    The only thing that really impresses me about this film is the arsty thematic elements that Mendes brings in. From the yellow filter (which finally is pulled in the last scene to suggest new beginnings) to the 'dead are alive' subtexts etc. & overall surreal spectral moodiness of it all. The film arguably works on that level. I'd go so far as to say he saved the film by inserting and accenting those elements.

    You're joking now right?

    Mendes thematic elements are about as subtle as Keith Lemon. The whole 'dead are alive' thing would be laughed out of first year film school it's so heavy handed. Actually shoving it in the audiences faces to the extent you write it down for them is both an admission that you've failed as a story teller and that they are too thick to get it.
    Perhaps the one time I agree with you on something. I approve.

    I can die happy now as my whole life has been one big quest to gain your approval.
  • QuantumOrganizationQuantumOrganization We have people everywhere
    Posts: 1,187
    Shardlake wrote: »
    SPECTRE is dire, without doubt the biggest disappointment of the series and also one of the biggest opportunities missed, it could have been so good a real triumph.

    To say it's dire is somewhat hyperbolic. It is just average.

    But I agree that it is the biggest disappointment and missed opportunity of the series and this is why we perceive it as actually being worse than it is.

    Let's be fair the Craig era, warts and all, is better than camp, moribund fare such as DAF and TMWTGG.

    bondjames wrote: »
    The only thing that really impresses me about this film is the arsty thematic elements that Mendes brings in. From the yellow filter (which finally is pulled in the last scene to suggest new beginnings) to the 'dead are alive' subtexts etc. & overall surreal spectral moodiness of it all. The film arguably works on that level. I'd go so far as to say he saved the film by inserting and accenting those elements.

    You're joking now right?

    Mendes thematic elements are about as subtle as Keith Lemon. The whole 'dead are alive' thing would be laughed out of first year film school it's so heavy handed. Actually shoving it in the audiences faces to the extent you write it down for them is both an admission that you've failed as a story teller and that they are too thick to get it.
    Perhaps the one time I agree with you on something. I approve.

    I can die happy now as my whole life has been one big quest to gain your approval.
    Glad you finally admit it, old buddy.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    I still think the entire section set in Rome is one of the most entertaining sections from the entire series ( and yes, that includes the car chase!)

    The car chase is great. As in fun.
  • QuantumOrganizationQuantumOrganization We have people everywhere
    Posts: 1,187
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    I still think the entire section set in Rome is one of the most entertaining sections from the entire series ( and yes, that includes the car chase!)

    The car chase is great. As in fun.
    More like a car ride but to each their own.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 8,521
    @noSolaceleft, any man who considers himself warm blooded, yet doesn't find Monica B sexy, should get his temperature checked.

    Re: the scene: she's aching to have a man love her (love being a substitute for another four letter word I want to use), and she knows she will surrender herself to Bond. Yes, I found it erotically charged.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited July 2017 Posts: 23,883
    bondjames wrote: »
    The only thing that really impresses me about this film is the arsty thematic elements that Mendes brings in. From the yellow filter (which finally is pulled in the last scene to suggest new beginnings) to the 'dead are alive' subtexts etc. & overall surreal spectral moodiness of it all. The film arguably works on that level. I'd go so far as to say he saved the film by inserting and accenting those elements.

    You're joking now right?

    Mendes thematic elements are about as subtle as Keith Lemon. The whole 'dead are alive' thing would be laughed out of first year film school it's so heavy handed. Actually shoving it in the audiences faces to the extent you write it down for them is both an admission that you've failed as a story teller and that they are too thick to get it.
    Not at all. 'Dead are alive' is indeed heavy handed, and ruined an otherwise reasonable (and much welcomed) PTS GB. The hanging MI6 photos are also borderline director torture. However, Dench's M, White, "the big one" & "author of all yur pain" hovering over the proceedings like ghosts did lend a certain fatalistic aspect to the whole film. Initially I hated the filter. However after several rewatches I have realized that the deliberate visual & thematic elements like this are what save it, because they give the entire film a unique, otherworldly and somewhat spooky undertone which I find curiously appealing. The torture sequence is a case in point. It's an overwrought & entirely gratuitous sequence (complete with idiotic brotherly revelation), but visually & thematically it's unnerving in a clinical, 'hospital death bed' flashback like way.

    There is conversely absolutely nothing in the narrative which I find remotely worthy of praise except for White's scene, and even that one is messed up with the "Women!! Children!!" conceit. The same goes for the performances (again, apart from the White scene - perhaps explaining why it was overexposed in the trailer). There is similarly absolutely nothing in the action sequences that is not entirely 'meh' predictable (yes, the Hinx fight is visceral, but as I've mentioned elsewhere, they should have used another location to avoid comparisons to three other superior Bond films).

    So again, I think the much maligned Mendes ironically saves this film. At least I can appreciate it as thematic 'art' (even if heavy handed at times) while I concurrently lambaste it for being an unforgivable bore. The real crime is in the writing and in the dull as dishwater performances.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,110
    There isn't a lot of energy to the ways scenes are filmed in SF and SP, I've noticed. Everything seems to happen at one pace, whether it's a scene of two people talking or a car chase. I think this was refreshing to begin with, after the head-smashing whiplash-inducing editing of QoS. So not only are both these films (SP and SF) 2 hrs 20 minutes, but they also don't vary much, which adds to how long they feel. I watched LALD the other night, and comparitively the latter felt so much more snappier, and easier to enjoy. I think if there's anything Bond fans want, it's to enjoy what is happening on a visceral level. Mendes puts so much emphasis on his themes and the relationships, he sacrifices those simple moments of pure excitement and fun.
  • Posts: 6,821
    Shardlake wrote: »
    SPECTRE is dire, without doubt the biggest disappointment of the series and also one of the biggest opportunities missed, it could have been so good a real triumph.

    To say it's dire is somewhat hyperbolic. It is just average.

    But I agree that it is the biggest disappointment and missed opportunity of the series and this is why we perceive it as actually being worse than it is.

    Let's be fair the Craig era, warts and all, is better than camp, moribund fare such as DAF and TMWTGG.

    bondjames wrote: »
    The only thing that really impresses me about this film is the arsty thematic elements that Mendes brings in. From the yellow filter (which finally is pulled in the last scene to suggest new beginnings) to the 'dead are alive' subtexts etc. & overall surreal spectral moodiness of it all. The film arguably works on that level. I'd go so far as to say he saved the film by inserting and accenting those elements.

    You're joking now right?

    Mendes thematic elements are about as subtle as Keith Lemon. The whole 'dead are alive' thing would be laughed out of first year film school it's so heavy handed. Actually shoving it in the audiences faces to the extent you write it down for them is both an admission that you've failed as a story teller and that they are too thick to get it.
    Perhaps the one time I agree with you on something. I approve. The filter always bugged me on SP. We were spoiled with Skyfall's Roger Deakins who made every shot
    From the London Underground to Shanghai have so much color and pop. Imagine my (and others) when Hoyte comes along and decides to piss (literally) over all these great European cities.

    You must have popped out to the toilet during Bonds first encounter at the bar in Shanghai where they both look like Homer and Marge Simpson!
  • Posts: 1,453
    For me, the first half of SP is very engaging, but what weakens the second half is that Blofeld's plan is not thrilling or gripping enough, so the film falls back on the old "rescue the damsel in grave danger", and so the big reveal - Blofeld is "back" - feels wasted.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    edited July 2017 Posts: 23,559
    @ColonelSun
    That I agree with, sir.
    I have been longing for a return to Blofeld but he needed to be bigger than what he ultimately came off as. The large room in Rome oozes suspense and darkness. But then he's a typical 2015 villain, someone who gathers intelligence and puts it to his own advantage in some vague way. Even Elliot Carver has a clear plot ready.

    If you're going to bring back Blofeld, even in the grounded-in-reality Craig era anno 2015, you need to make him big and loud and not just Coo-coo and be done with it. So yes, I see that as a definitive flaw of the script.

    That said, I can deal with it because I'm going with everything else. But I do agree that the Blofeld is back thing feels a bit wasted.

    We never should have gotten the brother plot either. That's a sign of fatigue. Keep Bond away from the personal angel as much as possible. A little bit is fine, as we've seen in you'd be surprised how many Bond films yet, but too much, like pepper and salt, can spoil the fun.
  • QuantumOrganizationQuantumOrganization We have people everywhere
    Posts: 1,187
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    Shardlake wrote: »
    SPECTRE is dire, without doubt the biggest disappointment of the series and also one of the biggest opportunities missed, it could have been so good a real triumph.

    To say it's dire is somewhat hyperbolic. It is just average.

    But I agree that it is the biggest disappointment and missed opportunity of the series and this is why we perceive it as actually being worse than it is.

    Let's be fair the Craig era, warts and all, is better than camp, moribund fare such as DAF and TMWTGG.

    bondjames wrote: »
    The only thing that really impresses me about this film is the arsty thematic elements that Mendes brings in. From the yellow filter (which finally is pulled in the last scene to suggest new beginnings) to the 'dead are alive' subtexts etc. & overall surreal spectral moodiness of it all. The film arguably works on that level. I'd go so far as to say he saved the film by inserting and accenting those elements.

    You're joking now right?

    Mendes thematic elements are about as subtle as Keith Lemon. The whole 'dead are alive' thing would be laughed out of first year film school it's so heavy handed. Actually shoving it in the audiences faces to the extent you write it down for them is both an admission that you've failed as a story teller and that they are too thick to get it.
    Perhaps the one time I agree with you on something. I approve. The filter always bugged me on SP. We were spoiled with Skyfall's Roger Deakins who made every shot
    From the London Underground to Shanghai have so much color and pop. Imagine my (and others) when Hoyte comes along and decides to piss (literally) over all these great European cities.

    You must have popped out to the toilet during Bonds first encounter at the bar in Shanghai where they both look like Homer and Marge Simpson!
    lol. Get your eyes checked buddy!

  • Posts: 6,821
    So you're saying Bond and Severine are not jaundiced looking in that scene? Maybe you should watch it again?
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited July 2017 Posts: 23,883
    Deakins definitely injects a yellow hue to many scenes in SF. As I've mentioned elsewhere, he does it primarily with auxiliary lighting. That in combination with the use of digital cameras gives off a 'glow'. It's a richer more vibrant and lustrous contrast effect. You can see it in the new Bladerunner film too (although that looks more like a 'filter').

    Hoyte's filter in combination with traditional film cameras produces a more monotonous washed out look. Like a painting.
  • Posts: 6,821
    Fair points. I just get bit tired with the overpraise of Deakins work, and that scene in Shanghai i find the look of Bond and Severine very distracting considering its supposed to a dramatic highlight.
  • BondAficionadoBondAficionado Former IMDBer
    Posts: 1,884
    There isn't a lot of energy to the ways scenes are filmed in SF and SP, I've noticed. Everything seems to happen at one pace, whether it's a scene of two people talking or a car chase. I think this was refreshing to begin with, after the head-smashing whiplash-inducing editing of QoS. So not only are both these films (SP and SF) 2 hrs 20 minutes, but they also don't vary much, which adds to how long they feel. I watched LALD the other night, and comparitively the latter felt so much more snappier, and easier to enjoy. I think if there's anything Bond fans want, it's to enjoy what is happening on a visceral level. Mendes puts so much emphasis on his themes and the relationships, he sacrifices those simple moments of pure excitement and fun.

    Yes, what you said about the themes and relationships is quite true, but (in SF) he doesn't sacrifice exciting and visceral action for it. It has some of the most exhilarating fighting moments of the entire franchise. His recurring themes actually elevate these scenes. Watching Bond running towards the courtroom wouldn't of been nearly as interesting if they hadn't layered M's poetic speech on top.

    Also, why does nearly everyone have an issue with long Bond films?? None of them feel lengthy. OHMSS, CR, SF go by in a breeze. SP might be rather bland but it's not the runtime's fault at all. In fact, the runtime only makes me appreciate it more. On the other side of the spectrum, QoS' length understandably irritates me. I wish it was an extra 30mins longer and would help the dreadful pacing issues.

    All in all, I actually love having more footage per JB film and I wouldn't care if the following installment was nearly 3h in length.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,110
    There isn't a lot of energy to the ways scenes are filmed in SF and SP, I've noticed. Everything seems to happen at one pace, whether it's a scene of two people talking or a car chase. I think this was refreshing to begin with, after the head-smashing whiplash-inducing editing of QoS. So not only are both these films (SP and SF) 2 hrs 20 minutes, but they also don't vary much, which adds to how long they feel. I watched LALD the other night, and comparitively the latter felt so much more snappier, and easier to enjoy. I think if there's anything Bond fans want, it's to enjoy what is happening on a visceral level. Mendes puts so much emphasis on his themes and the relationships, he sacrifices those simple moments of pure excitement and fun.

    Also, why does nearly everyone have an issue with long Bond films?? None of them feel lengthy. OHMSS, CR, SF go by in a breeze. SP might be rather bland but it's not the runtime's fault at all. In fact, the runtime only makes me appreciate it more. On the other side of the spectrum, QoS' length understandably irritates me. I wish it was an extra 30mins longer and would help the dreadful pacing issues.

    All in all, I actually love having more footage per JB film and I wouldn't care if the following installment was nearly 3h in length.

    If a Bond film were 3 hours, I would rarely make it from start to finish. I prefer the peaks to be spaced closer together, and therefore a run time between 115 minutes and 125 minutes would be ideal, as that allows for the optimum complexity of narrative, without getting bogged down.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited July 2017 Posts: 23,883
    I don't mind long Bond films. I just have a problem with tedious ones, irrespective of the length. It's all about maintaining narrative tension & viewer interest throughout the run time.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    bondjames wrote: »
    Deakins definitely injects a yellow hue to many scenes in SF. As I've mentioned elsewhere, he does it primarily with auxiliary lighting. That in combination with the use of digital cameras gives off a 'glow'. It's a richer more vibrant and lustrous contrast effect. You can see it in the new Bladerunner film too (although that looks more like a 'filter').

    Hoyte's filter in combination with traditional film cameras produces a more monotonous washed out look. Like a painting.

    I have a theory about this, granted it's just a theory. Part of me wonders whether Mendes tweaked the grade rather significantly on SP to the chagrin of Van Hoytema. I may be wrong (I can't be bothered to google image search) but I don't recall Hoyte being at the World Premiere - certainly not in the line up, of which he'd be a significant member. To be fair it was a bit of blur, but that always stuck in my mind. I also don't recall, bar a couple of slight interviews, Hoyte having very much to say about the film. I'm pretty convinced that the effect is not created in camera, unlike Deakins (taking into account there's always colour work in post).
  • Posts: 1,162
    peter wrote: »
    @noSolaceleft, any man who considers himself warm blooded, yet doesn't find Monica B sexy, should get his temperature checked.

    MB as featured in the Matrix around the turn of the century - anytime, anywhere. MB almost 20 years later- just not my cup of tea.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,110
    The problem is, the run time is increasing all the time, irrespective of what story they are telling.

    Connery average run time 117 minutes

    Moore average run time 126 minutes

    Dalton average run time 131 minutes

    Brosnan average run time 128 mintues

    Craig average run time 136 minutes

  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    MB is pure sex. Period.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited July 2017 Posts: 9,117
    The problem is, the run time is increasing all the time, irrespective of what story they are telling.

    Connery average run time 117 minutes

    Moore average run time 126 minutes

    Dalton average run time 131 minutes

    Brosnan average run time 128 mintues

    Craig average run time 136 minutes

    Why is this a problem? It just depends on what story you are telling and how you tell it.

    I'm pretty sure if they announced that B25 was going to be 6 hours long and Aidan Turner playing Bond then you'd suddenly be pretty happy with long run times.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    edited July 2017 Posts: 23,559
    @Mendes4Lyfe
    The end titles alone play three times as long than in the 60s, as per modern conventions. However, I don't think you're wrong about the average feature lengths going up. Take QOS out of the equation, and I bet the Craig's run a bit longer even on average. You also left out OHMSS, and for a fair reason, but that one would have squeezed a nice 140 quality minutes between Connery's films and Moore's.

    Still, I don't see that as a problem. Even without the debate on whether or not the Venice scene is needed in CR, that film has never strained my patience, not even once, and it is one of the longest Bond flicks at 144 minutes. Filmmakers can screw things up in under 80 minutes and they can deliver excellence with over 200 minutes.

    I'm glad the producers don't succumb to the short attention span crowd and their desire to grab a burger, then barge into the theatre while the film's already begun, flashing their iPhones to see where they're going, taking their time blocking people's view while deciding who's going to sit next to whom and who brought the nachos with cheese and why nobody brought any popcorn, and evacuate the place once the hellish fire of the eternally cursed end titles begin to flame up, so that they can quickly ride to the nearest club and finish the day in intellectual numbness. I prefer things the other way: have diner, make it to the theatre in time, inhale the atmosphere, chat about what we hope the film will deliver, watch some trailers, enjoy the film, leave when the film's actually finished, then find a quiet place to contemplate the film and after that, call it a day. And if that means I spent close to 4 hours in total in the theatre, then I welcome it.

    Again, why would the fact that the Bonds, on average, are playing 15 minutes longer than they used to (I subtract the longer end titles), be a problem? Many of the longer Bond films, like OHMSS, CR, TLD, GE, SF, ... are also high on people's list. As long as a film delivers the goods and knows when to stop, what's the big deal? As a matter of fact, my biggest complaint back in 2008 was that QOS was over before it had begun. I have somewhat gotten over that by now because the home viewing experience is a bit different from the theatrical one. Still, I'm not even sure my issue really was the running time but the fact that I felt like entire reels of film hadn't even been allowed to unspool, that I was missing content to make the film more coherent. I've gotten over that too by now. Point is, I wanted QOS to have played a bit longer in favour of a good story.

    My point is, there should be no concern with the feature length of the Bonds, and certainly not with the fact that the averages per actor have gone up by 20 minutes in 50+ years time. Our concern should be with what every second of film delivers, no matter how many seconds the film counts.
  • BondAficionadoBondAficionado Former IMDBer
    edited July 2017 Posts: 1,884
    The problem is, the run time is increasing all the time, irrespective of what story they are telling.

    Connery average run time 117 minutes

    Moore average run time 126 minutes

    Dalton average run time 131 minutes

    Brosnan average run time 128 mintues

    Craig average run time 136 minutes

    Well back in the 60s they would of filmed a lot more efficiently because they did it on physical film and that costs a lot with their tight budgets. (Don't forget that a new film came out every year as well.) Editing was also a nightmare back then, so I'm sure they would naturally shoot less minutes of film. They'd plan more in advance and compromise with an average take. Nowadays they have the *luxury* to film dozens of hours of padding just for the heck of it - even if it never makes the final cut. But some eventually will "because they have it anyway" and it makes the films longer.

    Obviously they used film in all the other decades too, but they got progressively longer because of the higher budgets, the better tech and above all; the stories they were telling.

    Finally, audiences have to spend a lot more per ticket than they used to do. Back then it was maybe 4 bucks for a 100 min film and now it's like +10 bucks for 120 min. Modern audiences expect more because of the cost, but it's still around twice as expensive as before. For the studios it's a trade-off between making films longer so people are more willing to buy a ticket, and making it shorter so they can fit more viewings per day. It balances out to about a 130 min movie; which is a higher average than previous generations.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited July 2017 Posts: 23,883
    RC7 wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    Deakins definitely injects a yellow hue to many scenes in SF. As I've mentioned elsewhere, he does it primarily with auxiliary lighting. That in combination with the use of digital cameras gives off a 'glow'. It's a richer more vibrant and lustrous contrast effect. You can see it in the new Bladerunner film too (although that looks more like a 'filter').

    Hoyte's filter in combination with traditional film cameras produces a more monotonous washed out look. Like a painting.

    I have a theory about this, granted it's just a theory. Part of me wonders whether Mendes tweaked the grade rather significantly on SP to the chagrin of Van Hoytema. I may be wrong (I can't be bothered to google image search) but I don't recall Hoyte being at the World Premiere - certainly not in the line up, of which he'd be a significant member. To be fair it was a bit of blur, but that always stuck in my mind. I also don't recall, bar a couple of slight interviews, Hoyte having very much to say about the film. I'm pretty convinced that the effect is not created in camera, unlike Deakins (taking into account there's always colour work in post).
    You could be right. There is a certain uniformity to the filter which I can't imagine a quality cinematographer like Hoyte would have necessarily wanted.

    I see this kind of effect in a lot of contemporary special effects driven films too though, like Ultron, BvS & most notably Assassin's Creed, and since there was a lot of special effects touch up in SP it could have been done to hide or mask the CGI.
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