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Where does Bond go after Craig?

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  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 7,042
    SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷ wrote: »
    It's very simple. Villeneuve should just give us 50 percent new & 50 percent familiar. Just balance it, and he's good to go.

    It all starts with a strong script.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited 2:30pm Posts: 19,632
    sandbagger1 wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    Bond has such a long history and diverse set of films that’s it’s unclear how much you can change it before it’s unrecognisable really. CR is arguably fairly unrecognisable compared to what came before, but it’s great. As long as it’s got Bond in it and it does action and adventure and a few gags here and there, you’ve pretty much got a Bond film.
    And yet we've all argued against changes we consider stop it from feeling like Bond, though we don't all agree what those factors are. I know you didn't have a problem with NTTD killing Bond, Felix, giving him a daughter etc, but you have (IIRC) said that Fukunaga didn't achieve that Bond movie feel; you also were visibly disappointed with our first look at First Light, whilst others were very pleased. I think I've suggested stylistic experimentation before, which you've been against, but you're much keener on playing fast and loose with the Bond character than I am.

    There's obviously more to it than "as long as it’s got Bond in it and it does action and adventure and a few gags here and there, you’ve pretty much got a Bond film."

    Edit: Sorry, that sounds more snarky than intended. I'm not putting down your opinion or trying to start a fight.

    You're right, there is more to it than that; but you're also right that it's kind of hard to define what that 'more' is. As you say, we've all tried to put our fingers on it and kind of failed, so as 007HallY says, saying 'don't change it so it's unrecognisable' is not great advice as it's hard to pin down exactly how you do that. I think the best advice is probably that old standard: don't listen to any advice.
    I think making it feel like Bond is kind of down to the feel of the person making it rather than anything too specific: for me Mendes got it where Forster didn't, and I'd have trouble explaining why. Villeneuve is no slouch and obviously has love for Bond, so I'm pretty optimistic he'll have ideas for how to update it and yet make it feel right.
  • SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷ Lekki, Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 3,022
    echo wrote: »
    SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷ wrote: »
    It's very simple. Villeneuve should just give us 50 percent new & 50 percent familiar. Just balance it, and he's good to go.

    It all starts with a strong script.

    Oh, for sure.
  • sandbagger1sandbagger1 Sussex
    Posts: 1,167
    mtm wrote: »
    sandbagger1 wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    Bond has such a long history and diverse set of films that’s it’s unclear how much you can change it before it’s unrecognisable really. CR is arguably fairly unrecognisable compared to what came before, but it’s great. As long as it’s got Bond in it and it does action and adventure and a few gags here and there, you’ve pretty much got a Bond film.
    And yet we've all argued against changes we consider stop it from feeling like Bond, though we don't all agree what those factors are. I know you didn't have a problem with NTTD killing Bond, Felix, giving him a daughter etc, but you have (IIRC) said that Fukunaga didn't achieve that Bond movie feel; you also were visibly disappointed with our first look at First Light, whilst others were very pleased. I think I've suggested stylistic experimentation before, which you've been against, but you're much keener on playing fast and loose with the Bond character than I am.

    There's obviously more to it than "as long as it’s got Bond in it and it does action and adventure and a few gags here and there, you’ve pretty much got a Bond film."

    Edit: Sorry, that sounds more snarky than intended. I'm not putting down your opinion or trying to start a fight.

    You're right, there is more to it than that; but you're also right that it's kind of hard to define what that 'more' is. As you say, we've all tried to put our fingers on it and kind of failed, so as 007HallY says, saying 'don't change it so it's unrecognisable' is not great advice as it's hard to pin down exactly how you do that. I think the best advice is probably that old standard: don't listen to any advice.
    I think making it feel like Bond is kind of down to the feel of the person making it rather than anything too specific: for me Mendes got it where Forster didn't, and I'd have trouble explaining why. Villeneuve is no slouch and obviously has love for Bond, so I'm pretty optimistic he'll have ideas for how to update it and yet make it feel right.
    But what he actually says is" So don’t f— with it, basically. There’s a lot of fertile ground for Bond, particularly the way the world is at the moment. I just hope that they don’t break what’s not broken!" [emphasis mine]

    Basically he's saying not to alter what's still working, don't update it for the sake of it. He obviously thinks no radical changes are necessary, which I would agree with. I know obviously that a fair number of people here wouldn't agree with that, and perhaps age is a factor in that.

    By the way, I've found the full article:

    https://www.goldderby.com/film/2025/goldeneye-martin-campbell-pierce-brosnan-james-bond/
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 19,632
    Yep, I posted it a few days ago in the Martin Campbell thread.
  • sandbagger1sandbagger1 Sussex
    Posts: 1,167
    mtm wrote: »
    Yep, I posted it a few days ago in the Martin Campbell thread.

    Oh sorry, I haven't read that thread. Apologies.
  • 007HallY007HallY
    Posts: 6,398
    sandbagger1 wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    sandbagger1 wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    Bond has such a long history and diverse set of films that’s it’s unclear how much you can change it before it’s unrecognisable really. CR is arguably fairly unrecognisable compared to what came before, but it’s great. As long as it’s got Bond in it and it does action and adventure and a few gags here and there, you’ve pretty much got a Bond film.
    And yet we've all argued against changes we consider stop it from feeling like Bond, though we don't all agree what those factors are. I know you didn't have a problem with NTTD killing Bond, Felix, giving him a daughter etc, but you have (IIRC) said that Fukunaga didn't achieve that Bond movie feel; you also were visibly disappointed with our first look at First Light, whilst others were very pleased. I think I've suggested stylistic experimentation before, which you've been against, but you're much keener on playing fast and loose with the Bond character than I am.

    There's obviously more to it than "as long as it’s got Bond in it and it does action and adventure and a few gags here and there, you’ve pretty much got a Bond film."

    Edit: Sorry, that sounds more snarky than intended. I'm not putting down your opinion or trying to start a fight.

    You're right, there is more to it than that; but you're also right that it's kind of hard to define what that 'more' is. As you say, we've all tried to put our fingers on it and kind of failed, so as 007HallY says, saying 'don't change it so it's unrecognisable' is not great advice as it's hard to pin down exactly how you do that. I think the best advice is probably that old standard: don't listen to any advice.
    I think making it feel like Bond is kind of down to the feel of the person making it rather than anything too specific: for me Mendes got it where Forster didn't, and I'd have trouble explaining why. Villeneuve is no slouch and obviously has love for Bond, so I'm pretty optimistic he'll have ideas for how to update it and yet make it feel right.
    But what he actually says is" So don’t f— with it, basically. There’s a lot of fertile ground for Bond, particularly the way the world is at the moment. I just hope that they don’t break what’s not broken!" [emphasis mine]

    Basically he's saying not to alter what's still working, don't update it for the sake of it. He obviously thinks no radical changes are necessary, which I would agree with. I know obviously that a fair number of people here wouldn't agree with that, and perhaps age is a factor in that.

    I suppose it depends on what's deemed to be still working. And they'll always have to update it just by virtue of making a new film. Anyway, it's a very general thing to say, and it's not overly helpful. Also a bit funny coming from the director of CR (which is quite a formula breaking Bond film, even if includes/reinterprets some of those well worn tropes).
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