Coming Soon To Consoles! - The Upcoming Games Thread

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  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    I must be one of the few fans to have enjoyed Blacklist, even with the absence of Ironside.

    Ironside was spotted at Ubi HQ for a "secret project", so I think it is safe to assume that he most likely will be back as Sam Fisher. He only left, because apparently, he wasn't happy with the overly action packed Conviction. With that in mind, and the at best, lukewarm reception of Blacklist, I wouldn't be surprised if Ubisoft were bending over backwards to please Ironside, by returning the series to its stealthy roots.

    I always heard that Ironside was let go because he couldn't do both the mocap and the voice work for Sam at the same time, so he was replaced by a younger actor who could. I have always thought that was a bullsh*t PR excuse from the top on down, so what I really think happened was Ubi weren't willing to shell out what Ironside was worth and hired a cheap throwaway actor for Sam to save some money on the project (it does look rough around the edges in the final product). Nothing else makes sense to me, as only money should drive them to make such a stupid decision. Which would make sense, considering the game came out around a time when Ubi was struggling with consumers, with the infamous releases of Watch Dogs and Assassin's Creed: Unity with all their problems. Couldn't blame then for wanting to save a load of cash in that climate.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 34,247
    I must be one of the few fans to have enjoyed Blacklist, even with the absence of Ironside.

    Ironside was spotted at Ubi HQ for a "secret project", so I think it is safe to assume that he most likely will be back as Sam Fisher. He only left, because apparently, he wasn't happy with the overly action packed Conviction. With that in mind, and the at best, lukewarm reception of Blacklist, I wouldn't be surprised if Ubisoft were bending over backwards to please Ironside, by returning the series to its stealthy roots.

    I always heard that Ironside was let go because he couldn't do both the mocap and the voice work for Sam at the same time, so he was replaced by a younger actor who could. I have always thought that was a bullsh*t PR excuse from the top on down, so what I really think happened was Ubi weren't willing to shell out what Ironside was worth and hired a cheap throwaway actor for Sam to save some money on the project (it does look rough around the edges in the final product). Nothing else makes sense to me, as only money should drive them to make such a stupid decision. Which would make sense, considering the game came out around a time when Ubi was struggling with consumers, with the infamous releases of Watch Dogs and Assassin's Creed: Unity with all their problems. Couldn't blame then for wanting to save a load of cash in that climate.

    Sounds like Ubisoft: spend the smallest amount of money possible in hopes of making the most money. Surely it couldn't have cost them that much more to get Ironside back. What a shame, too.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    @Creasy47, that is truly the only thing that makes sense to me. Because dropping Ironside is like dropping Nolan North as Drake, or David Bateson as Agent 47. Like dropping Hayter as Big Boss!

    It just figures into how the company was at the time, making dumb decisions like rushing the product and cutting corners to appease those giving them pressure or to save money where they could.
  • 00Agent00Agent Any man who drinks Dom Perignon '52 can't be all bad.
    Posts: 5,163
    @Creasy47, that is truly the only thing that makes sense to me. Because dropping Ironside is like dropping Nolan North as Drake, or David Bateson as Agent 47. Like dropping Hayter as Big Boss!

    It just figures into how the company was at the time, making dumb decisions like rushing the product and cutting corners to appease those giving them pressure or to save money where they could.

    Well they did try to replace him as well for the last game. That resulted in a big fan backlash though, in no small part due to the reception of Blacklist. After that IO Interactive decided to bring him back.
  • Posts: 12,317
    I guess I'm just lucky then because they work fine for me. I thought Fallout 4 looked a lot better than Skyrim too so I think they are improving. Obviously the animations aren't great but I think the worlds they build and the freedom you have sort of makes up for it. I need to get ba
    I must be one of the few fans to have enjoyed Blacklist, even with the absence of Ironside.

    Ironside was spotted at Ubi HQ for a "secret project", so I think it is safe to assume that he most likely will be back as Sam Fisher. He only left, because apparently, he wasn't happy with the overly action packed Conviction. With that in mind, and the at best, lukewarm reception of Blacklist, I wouldn't be surprised if Ubisoft were bending over backwards to please Ironside, by returning the series to its stealthy roots.

    I always heard that Ironside was let go because he couldn't do both the mocap and the voice work for Sam at the same time, so he was replaced by a younger actor who could. I have always thought that was a bullsh*t PR excuse from the top on down, so what I really think happened was Ubi weren't willing to shell out what Ironside was worth and hired a cheap throwaway actor for Sam to save some money on the project (it does look rough around the edges in the final product). Nothing else makes sense to me, as only money should drive them to make such a stupid decision. Which would make sense, considering the game came out around a time when Ubi was struggling with consumers, with the infamous releases of Watch Dogs and Assassin's Creed: Unity with all their problems. Couldn't blame then for wanting to save a load of cash in that climate.

    Ironside was still involved in the game though so I don't think it was about money (also, Blacklist came out around the same time as Black Flag, not Unity). It was because they went for the Uncharted type thing of having the actors do all the movements and the voice instead of doing it seperately, but Ironside was too old for the physical stuff.

    I'm with @MajorDSmythe, Blacklist was great, I really liked how they sort of merged the styles of Conviction and the old games. Best since Chaos Theory for me. I think the bad press it got before it had even come out led to it being pretty underrated.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    00Agent wrote: »
    @Creasy47, that is truly the only thing that makes sense to me. Because dropping Ironside is like dropping Nolan North as Drake, or David Bateson as Agent 47. Like dropping Hayter as Big Boss!

    It just figures into how the company was at the time, making dumb decisions like rushing the product and cutting corners to appease those giving them pressure or to save money where they could.

    Well they did try to replace him as well for the last game. That resulted in a big fan backlash though, in no small part due to the reception of Blacklist. After that IO Interactive decided to bring him back.
    Jesus Christ, this is the first I've heard of this. What are these people smoking?!
    Ironside was still involved in the game though so I don't think it was about money (also, Blacklist came out around the same time as Black Flag, not Unity). It was because they went for the Uncharted type thing of having the actors do all the movements and the voice instead of doing it seperately, but Ironside was too old for the physical stuff.

    I'm with @MajorDSmythe, Blacklist was great, I really liked how they sort of merged the styles of Conviction and the old games. Best since Chaos Theory for me. I think the bad press it got before it had even come out led to it being pretty underrated.
    I simply meant that Blacklist was a product of some of Ubi's releases around that time, which were very publicly torn up for their bad productions, downgrades and poor launches that made some question if the developers were competent. Black Flag seemed to be one of the few that got out without being tarnished.

    I just don't get the mocap excuse. There's mocap actors for the action animations and voice actors for the same character in loads of game, so it's a strange move to drop the iconic voice of your whole franchise for such a senseless reason. If the decision had to be made Ubi could have at least chosen an actor similar in vocal tone to Ironside, but instead they got a young guy to play a greying Sam Fisher. Just don't understand it.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    edited April 2018 Posts: 34,247
    IO needs to leave two things alone for all installments in the future: Bateson as 47, and Jesper Kyd doing the soundtrack - his brilliance was sorely missed in this new installment. It's crazy that the older games are elevated to an almost psychological horror feel with some levels thanks to the cold level design and his haunting score. Just recently went through Blood Money again, it's all so damn good.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    @Creasy47, I hear calls for Kyd to come back all the time, though I'm ignorant of his music I'm ashamed to say. I'm interested to see where IO go in the next season and just what feedback they've taken to make the experience better. I for one would love to see some of the mechanics back that were bizarrely removed from the original beta of the first season, like some cool takedowns that should still be there. I also think it'd be cool for weapon customization to return as well as the older games' money system so that there is an actual incentive to do each level with a silent assassin rating and truly acting like 47.

    I'd also really like to see a better contracts system, where we're given more control in making a mission. It's cool that we can actually make contracts for other players with specific mission constraints, but I feel much is still limited. I wish you could control where some targets are located in the level, for instance, or how the AI would patrol the space. In the system they have now you are only allowed to walk around and mark random NPCs, which is rather boring considering that the vast majority of the AI outside of the main level targets and their guards seldom move at all. Doesn't make for much of a challenge, or given the contract designer much control.

    I'd also love to see season one's Elusive Targets freed up and made available as open contracts for players after the second run through of them is concluded, for those that want to experience the little dialogues in them but missed the contract window or failed one beforehand.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    edited April 2018 Posts: 34,247
    I don't mind the way the leveling works now, but it's pretty easy to hit Mastery Level 20, so once you do there's really not much else to work past, unless you're a completionist like me. I do miss the upgrading/customization, and I hope it makes a return in season two, alongside more weapons, something I felt season one was sorely lacking in. Anything "unique" to be found later in the game via ET's/special challenges was just a dull reskin of something that already existed. Where are the revolvers? More assault weapons? Hell, there are three ICA pistol variants that are just different colors, with no performance differences.

    They should bring back the ET's eventually but remove the rewards - that way the rewards are still exclusive, but you can still get to experience any that you missed. I'm still pissed I missed the Gary Busey ET, because it's not coming back again (some licensing issue between Square Enix/IO after their break-up is the cause for that, apparently).

    EDIT: Apparently Microsoft is set to make a big announcement on April 10th regarding original Xbox backwards compatibility - perhaps it is one and the same with this Splinter Cell announcement, and all original Xbox SC titles will be available to play on the Xbox One? Could be.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    @Creasy47, I know many fans who crave having the briefcase back, a duel wielding ability for the silverballers and some of the older aspects of the games. Hard to believe such things would be left out in a next-gen Hitman game where the limitations are less than ever before. But I'm sure that also has everything to do with who is in charge.

    Definitely agree about the ETs and keeping the exclusives locked in. I just think it's a shame to not let players at least experience each contract later on considering the additional work that goes into them and how some of the contracts actually flesh out the world more with targets who know those of the main story. I tried my first ET yesterday and was ticked at some of the aspects of them, which I detailed in the "Last video game you played" thread. It seems the ETs can randomly change the gameplay from the way the game plays in the main story, which is frustrating. While you can punch anyone without killing them in the regular levels, in ETs punching seems to be able to kill all of a sudden, which I found out the hard way when 47 decided to hit a woman in the face instead of subduing her. And because she was a protected NPC I failed immediately before I even got started on the contract.

    It's a shame the Busey contract won't be back, as I wanted to play it really badly and thought it was a cool idea.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 34,247
    Yes, yes and yes. What bugs me about the lack of briefcase is that it was obviously meant to return (such a simple feature, too) but didn't. Even the cover art features 47 carrying the damn thing. I just always loved being able to casually carry a deadly weapon around the map still dressed as 47; now, if you wish to do any sort of stealth sniping (the "stealth" aspect doesn't even work with the sniper rifles in this installment, either, which is an even bigger shame), then you have to find a proper guard outfit to get away with doing so.

    Yeah, I admire the exclusivity of it, but at the same time, it bugs me when games create limited content - why? Less isn't more in this case, and you should have everything you've crafted on offer. I hope we get some other tweaks, too come season two: I know human shields were also available in the early stages of the game, but were also removed, for some reason.

    Which ET is that? I saw you mention that a little while ago, but I couldn't think of any ET I played, or any sort of civilian/enemy/NPC on the map, that you could kill with a punch. You likely failed because you weren't meant to harm her whatsoever - the punch didn't kill her. Was subduing even an option? Usually those types of special NPC's are given a rule set so you can't even subdue them, but I guess that varies, too.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    @Creasy47, the issue you bring up about the sniper rifles is ridiculous, I agree. I'm on the Sapienza level now, which has all those Master Sniper challenges attached to it, and you literally have to expose yourself just to get to the damn church tower to do one of the challenges because you have no way to hide the sniper rifle. If we had the simple case back we could have so much freedom on these missions, and would be able to smuggle in maybe one additional gear item beyond a gun. But not having the ability to take a gun with you on the move is beyond dumb, especially since the older games had it. Why leave it out? The same with the great hostage mechanic, which was in the games as recent as Absolution. I don't see the point of diminishing the effect the player can have on the environment and NPCs. For one, it removes the ability to use the target of a contract as a hostage, which would be interesting.
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Which ET is that? I saw you mention that a little while ago, but I couldn't think of any ET I played, or any sort of civilian/enemy/NPC on the map, that you could kill with a punch. You likely failed because you weren't meant to harm her whatsoever - the punch didn't kill her. Was subduing even an option? Usually those types of special NPC's are given a rule set so you can't even subdue them, but I guess that varies, too.
    It was the most recent one, "The Guru" in Sapienza. The mission had the target in the same room as the clients who wanted me to kill the Guru (a man and a woman), and one of the mission constraints was that the woman or man couldn't be killed or I'd fail the mission. Long story short I climbed into the building where the target and these protected NPCs were and I created a noise distraction to lure one of them to where I could subdue them by overflowing a bathroom sink. The woman NPC came into the room to shut off the water, at which point I got behind her to subdue her, but 47 just flat out punched her and on the screen the text said I'd eliminated her. Then I instantly failed the contract. I was mightily ticked, to say the least.

    The only thing I can figure is that certain NPCs can't have any harm whatsoever come to them, as that is the only explanation I can think of for how 47 killed with just a punch when that only causes a knockout in the main story missions.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 34,247
    @0BradyM0Bondfanatic7, you'll be in for a treat once you get to Colorado. There's a water tower that is featured a bit north of the overall map, and getting up there and sniping anyone, anywhere, immediately results in EVERY single guard on the map knowing where you're at. Doesn't matter if you have the most silent, suppressed sniper in the game, they know - again, why this change was incorporated from previous installments, I'll never know. In hindsight, it actually seems like they just made sniping so broken, that people wouldn't even be bothered by the lack of the briefcase. And don't get me started on the absolute largest fix that season two must have, and that's the wonky detection/notoriety system.

    Ahh yes, the parameters for her aren't just solely for killing (as I mentioned previously, punching someone in the game will only ever subdue them, never results in a kill unless, of course, you're using an axe or saber or something): you cannot harm or subdue her whatsoever.

    A tip for the future: if you are playing an ET and you mess up, but it doesn't immediately result in a failure like it did for you with The Guru, you can quit to the Main Menu and try again. As long as you aren't getting that Mission Failed screen OR you aren't completing it, you can technically try it as much as you'd like. Hell, I think you can even flat out restart it and you'll be allowed to try again.

    You'll notice that aforementioned rule with some contracts: you'll be tasked with killing someone in, say, an explosion or accident, but there will be someone with them that cannot be harmed or subdued or messed with in any way, so you're responsible for luring them away, then killing the target.
  • Posts: 12,317
    @Creasy47 I think Jesper Kyd is great, love his work on the Assassin's Creed games, but I actually really liked the music in the last Hitman. From what I remember the old ones had a sort of gothic sound didn't they? Which is fine, but I loved the brassy Barry esque sound of the new one, made it feel like a Bond game.

    I still haven't finished that actually, I only played the first three episodes I think. I'll get round to it at some point.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 34,247
    @Creasy47 I think Jesper Kyd is great, love his work on the Assassin's Creed games, but I actually really liked the music in the last Hitman. From what I remember the old ones had a sort of gothic sound didn't they? Which is fine, but I loved the brassy Barry esque sound of the new one, made it feel like a Bond game.

    I still haven't finished that actually, I only played the first three episodes I think. I'll get round to it at some point.

    Quite gothic. The music in the latest installment just never really stood out to me sadly, past the Patient Zero DLC having some VERY good musical cues throughout.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    @0BradyM0Bondfanatic7, you'll be in for a treat once you get to Colorado. There's a water tower that is featured a bit north of the overall map, and getting up there and sniping anyone, anywhere, immediately results in EVERY single guard on the map knowing where you're at. Doesn't matter if you have the most silent, suppressed sniper in the game, they know - again, why this change was incorporated from previous installments, I'll never know. In hindsight, it actually seems like they just made sniping so broken, that people wouldn't even be bothered by the lack of the briefcase. And don't get me started on the absolute largest fix that season two must have, and that's the wonky detection/notoriety system.
    @Creasy47, I haven't run into too much trouble with the sniping and detection, and I think it's only natural for guards to head towards what looks like the most logic sniping position (like a water tower). I'll just have to see for myself if the guards know too quickly where I'm at, or race to me without any break in the AI, which would be a tad ridiculous. But so far I've enjoyed the AI, with just a few exceptions. Sometimes it is ridiculous how you're seen by guards while killing or subduing, or how some NPCs randomly refuse to react to things you throw. It becomes hard to tell if the AI is designed to be varied or if it's just inconsistent programming. ;)
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Ahh yes, the parameters for her aren't just solely for killing (as I mentioned previously, punching someone in the game will only ever subdue them, never results in a kill unless, of course, you're using an axe or saber or something): you cannot harm or subdue her whatsoever.

    A tip for the future: if you are playing an ET and you mess up, but it doesn't immediately result in a failure like it did for you with The Guru, you can quit to the Main Menu and try again. As long as you aren't getting that Mission Failed screen OR you aren't completing it, you can technically try it as much as you'd like. Hell, I think you can even flat out restart it and you'll be allowed to try again.

    You'll notice that aforementioned rule with some contracts: you'll be tasked with killing someone in, say, an explosion or accident, but there will be someone with them that cannot be harmed or subdued or messed with in any way, so you're responsible for luring them away, then killing the target.
    Yeah, that's what I figured: I couldn't touch a hair on the woman's head, period. The thing that annoyed me was that the contract only said I couldn't kill her, when that wasn't what I was doing at all. I had 47 ready to choke her out so that she would be knocked out, but instead he did a punch that triggered her to actually die (my screen also said I killed her after this action). It just felt like an unfair part of the level, as the devs had to know you'd try to subdue the NPCs around the target to clear the way for the kill, and they made any subdue attempts an instant kill of all things that fails the mission outright. As long as 47 isn't taking a knife to an NPC's neck, I just don't see the sense in that.

    I know there's a retry system for the ETs, basically such that you can restart the level as long as you've not completed the main mission objectives. It gives you the ability to see where the target goes and the patterns they walk to get an idea of how to kill them, then you can restart and execute your plan. Only when you kill the target or complete a supporting objective tied to the target can you no longer restart.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 34,247
    @0BradyM0Bondfanatic7, well it's not just in that example, that detection wonkiness exists with pretty much any sniper rifle usage across all the maps. It's quite annoying, because guards have a sixth sense when it comes to a sniper shot (suppressed, mind you), but then suppressed pistols they're magically oblivious to. I still say the AI/detection needs some serious re-working before season two. The AI teeters between being brain dead and having hearing akin to a dog. Just wait until you're in a closed room with an NPC, execute him with a suppressed bullet, just to have a guard two floors up immediately detect you and enter combat mode. Literally makes no sense.

    Perhaps they tweaked it for some odd reason, because when I did it, it definitely told me to not harm or subdue her. Be careful going to subdue people on stairwells too: another glitch in the game, where any attempt at doing so on a stairwell will result in 47 spinning them around and punching them right in the face. To this day, I still forget about it and it chaps my ass every time it occurs.

    I can't wait to see your thoughts on some of those escalations that involve not touching certain NPC's in any way, shape or form, while simultaneously having to kill someone in the same room as them AND hide any and all dead bodies in 90 seconds or you fail. Some of them are such a pain. There's one on Colorado that is so maddening, I've still yet to get past Level 3.

    And yes. Though I'll say it'd feel even more nerve-wracking and tense if you couldn't reload or restart at all: once you start it, you must end it. Of course, that opens the door to, say, your power going out and losing the ability to play it, but I know that already exists, unfortunately.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    @0BradyM0Bondfanatic7, well it's not just in that example, that detection wonkiness exists with pretty much any sniper rifle usage across all the maps. It's quite annoying, because guards have a sixth sense when it comes to a sniper shot (suppressed, mind you), but then suppressed pistols they're magically oblivious to. I still say the AI/detection needs some serious re-working before season two. The AI teeters between being brain dead and having hearing akin to a dog. Just wait until you're in a closed room with an NPC, execute him with a suppressed bullet, just to have a guard two floors up immediately detect you and enter combat mode. Literally makes no sense.
    @Creasy47, I see. One big issue I have with the game that I think should be fixed (and shouldn't have been such an issue anyway) is how the NPCs take damage. If you look at how games like the recent GTAs do it, if you shoot someone in the leg they will hobble away from you and if you shoot them in the arm they can drop their weapon entirely. I want this kind of feature in these Hitman games so badly because it's ridiculous that so much else about them is detailed and that aspect of the game isn't. I've run into so many times where I'm surrounded by people firing me (like when I'm screwing around doing challenges) and I shoot these guys in the chest five or six times until they finally die, despite them having zero armor on of any kind. Other times I'll shoot an NPC in the head, but I'm so far away from them at the time that the hits don't register to kill them and their character model only stutters about like they're being hit.

    I would love it if Hitman abandoned the current gunplay and went for one more realistic and interesting. If you've alerted people and need to escape, you should be able to shoot guns out of people's hands, shoot guards in the legs to take them out of the action and only allow them to shoot as they lay on the floor, unable to walk, and generally wound the NPCs coming for you so that you can actually attack strategically. As it is now you either go for a headshot or you're wasting your time.
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Perhaps they tweaked it for some odd reason, because when I did it, it definitely told me to not harm or subdue her. Be careful going to subdue people on stairwells too: another glitch in the game, where any attempt at doing so on a stairwell will result in 47 spinning them around and punching them right in the face. To this day, I still forget about it and it chaps my ass every time it occurs.
    I've run into that stairwell issue, yes. Hate those times when you've got to subdue someone at the right time but they go for the stairs and you know your opportunity is gone.
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    I can't wait to see your thoughts on some of those escalations that involve not touching certain NPC's in any way, shape or form, while simultaneously having to kill someone in the same room as them AND hide any and all dead bodies in 90 seconds or you fail. Some of them are such a pain. There's one on Colorado that is so maddening, I've still yet to get past Level 3.
    I've tried a few of the Escalations on the main levels, and they can offer a challenge. One in Paris I've still not completed demands that you have your pistol out at all times, so I spastically rush to subdue and drag enemies into hiding all while stopping every five seconds to whip my pistol out again. Infuriating!
    Creasy47 wrote: »

    And yes. Though I'll say it'd feel even more nerve-wracking and tense if you couldn't reload or restart at all: once you start it, you must end it. Of course, that opens the door to, say, your power going out and losing the ability to play it, but I know that already exists, unfortunately.
    I think they've balanced the ETs as reasonably as possible, giving enough time to do them but not an insane degree to make them more limited and exclusive. I also like that IO give you the option to restart or to do it with no restarts, depending on what challenge you like. I go for the former option, however, simply because I'm new to the game's mechanics and I want to get enough silent assassin ratings to unlock some of the outfits (especially the winter garb 47 can wear).
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe Still waiting for the Jena Malone Batwoman movie that's never going to be made.Moderator
    Posts: 11,849


    He's back. :D
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    I'm not even a big Splinter Cell fan and that had me grinning like an idiot.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    edited April 2018 Posts: 15,423
    Cool! :D

    I hope it's foreshadowing a future release in the franchise rather than only referring to this crossover with Ghost Recon. Hope Ironside returns for a solo SC title.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    I wonder how this will work, as in, will Sam become a permanent playable character in the game. It would give me a reason to pick up Wildlands on the cheap.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe Still waiting for the Jena Malone Batwoman movie that's never going to be made.Moderator
    edited April 2018 Posts: 11,849
    I hope that it will be what @ClarkDevlin says, an entirely new Splinter Cell game, but I suspect that the April 9th news will revolve around Ghost Recon: Wildlands. Bit of a waste to bring Ironside back, just for DLC.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    My thoughts exactly, Major.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    I do think that UBi must be using this opportunity to tease another Splinter Cell, while also widening the scope of Sam's world by giving him a history with the Ghosts, which has potential. There simply has to be more to it.

    I will say this, though: by getting Ironside back Ubi are already acting much smarter than they were during the time of the last game.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    I don't think the guy who replaced Ironside in the last game was bad, though. He did seem younger et al, but he wasn't bad in the slightest. In fact, he was more believable as a voice-over to Sam's face than Ironside's deep and aged voice.

    Just my two cents.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe Still waiting for the Jena Malone Batwoman movie that's never going to be made.Moderator
    Posts: 11,849
    I don't think the guy who replaced Ironside in the last game was bad, though. He did seem younger et al, but he wasn't bad in the slightest. In fact, he was more believable as a voice-over to Sam's face than Ironside's deep and aged voice.

    Just my two cents.

    But Fisher is supposed to be a verteran, so Ironside's voice fit Fisher.


    Though I agree on Eric Johnson and the hate he received. I have said before that I view the Splinter Cell games like the first few Bond films. Blacklist is OHMSS, Johnson is Lazenby, neither deserved the reception they received. With this in mind, I pray that the next Splinter Cell won't mirror DAF (in regards to the lack of effort from the lead).
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 It was this or the priesthood.
    Posts: 28,231
    I don't think the guy who replaced Ironside in the last game was bad, though. He did seem younger et al, but he wasn't bad in the slightest. In fact, he was more believable as a voice-over to Sam's face than Ironside's deep and aged voice.

    Just my two cents.
    I thought the voice acting was kind of dire from that guy, but I guess he has fans. I think the issue was the character model of Sam, because he looked much younger than in Conviction yet had gray hair, which was an odd combination. It's like he de-aged and lost his grizzled voice at the same time, which just didn't work at all.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    I don't think the guy who replaced Ironside in the last game was bad, though. He did seem younger et al, but he wasn't bad in the slightest. In fact, he was more believable as a voice-over to Sam's face than Ironside's deep and aged voice.

    Just my two cents.
    I thought the voice acting was kind of dire from that guy, but I guess he has fans. I think the issue was the character model of Sam, because he looked much younger than in Conviction yet had gray hair, which was an odd combination. It's like he de-aged and lost his grizzled voice at the same time, which just didn't work at all.
    I do see your point. And yes, in Blacklist, he does come off younger than he was in the preceding title.
  • Posts: 12,317
    00Agent wrote: »
    @Creasy47, that is truly the only thing that makes sense to me. Because dropping Ironside is like dropping Nolan North as Drake, or David Bateson as Agent 47. Like dropping Hayter as Big Boss!

    It just figures into how the company was at the time, making dumb decisions like rushing the product and cutting corners to appease those giving them pressure or to save money where they could.

    Well they did try to replace him as well for the last game. That resulted in a big fan backlash though, in no small part due to the reception of Blacklist. After that IO Interactive decided to bring him back.
    Jesus Christ, this is the first I've heard of this. What are these people smoking?!
    Ironside was still involved in the game though so I don't think it was about money (also, Blacklist came out around the same time as Black Flag, not Unity). It was because they went for the Uncharted type thing of having the actors do all the movements and the voice instead of doing it seperately, but Ironside was too old for the physical stuff.

    I'm with @MajorDSmythe, Blacklist was great, I really liked how they sort of merged the styles of Conviction and the old games. Best since Chaos Theory for me. I think the bad press it got before it had even come out led to it being pretty underrated.
    I simply meant that Blacklist was a product of some of Ubi's releases around that time, which were very publicly torn up for their bad productions, downgrades and poor launches that made some question if the developers were competent. Black Flag seemed to be one of the few that got out without being tarnished.

    I just don't get the mocap excuse. There's mocap actors for the action animations and voice actors for the same character in loads of game, so it's a strange move to drop the iconic voice of your whole franchise for such a senseless reason. If the decision had to be made Ubi could have at least chosen an actor similar in vocal tone to Ironside, but instead they got a young guy to play a greying Sam Fisher. Just don't understand it.

    There are games that do it seperately still but I think it generally looks better/more realistic if they have the actor doing both at the same time, it's one of the reasons Uncharted has always looked so good and I think most big budget games do that now. I know with Assassin's Creed for example they started doing it that way with 3 and the characters looked a lot more real and natural than in the Ezio games.

    I agree though that it wasn't a worthy trade off and it would have been a worthy sacrifice to have Ironside's voice. Didn't think the new guy was terrible though.
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