SPECTRE - Press reviews and personal reviews (BEWARE! Spoiler reviews allowed)

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  • Posts: 14,104
    RC7 wrote: »
    patb wrote: »
    Thanks for all the reviews, there is a pattern forming that all or most of the faults seem to fall on the shoulders of the script writers (and Mendes for not sorting it), so are we saying that with the great cars, great cast, great location, great PTS, great photography etc it had the potential to be a cast iron classic but the scriptwriters have failed to deliver?

    If you want The Godfather, you aren't going to get it. If you want rollicking good fun, with a perfectly measured blend of ingredients then you'll love it. Like a lot of the best Bond films it's beautiful nonsense. I can understand misgivings about SF, because when the plotting goes are wayward you're still left with quite a moody film. This just sweeps along and anyone who isn't a little thrilled with it is probably taking it a bit too seriously.

    Yet I think it's much darker than any Bond movie so far. We've had parricide and torture before, but not like that.
  • MayDayDiVicenzoMayDayDiVicenzo Here and there
    Posts: 5,080
    See, I thought the torture scene wasn't nearly as effective as the one in CR.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    I was wincing watching it , I thought it was scary, I wouldn't
    Like to be in that position.
  • Lancaster007Lancaster007 Shrublands Health Clinic, England
    Posts: 1,874
    Nice to see the gun barrel at the start and Bond leave with the woman at the end. Will probably enjoy it more on second viewing.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    Now the wait until Feb or March to get it on Bluray :D
    " My Precious " ;)
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,135
    See, I thought the torture scene wasn't nearly as effective as the one in CR.

    Have to agree.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited October 2015 Posts: 9,117
    Following on from Fitzochris a quick list of bullet points now its had time to sink in a bit. Will need more viewings to compose a proper review.

    Amazing

    - The moment when I realised Bond was going to eject himself I felt like a little boy again. Although execution a bit lacking. Would a proper shot of him ejecting from the car and a union jack parachute been too much? Probably but sod it - I wanted it.

    - The torture scene from Colonel Sun. Yes it was toned down (still a bit strong for a 12A) but amazed we got it at all.

    Good

    - Gunbarrel at the beginning with an improved design from the last two.
    - Frenetic helicopter fight. The most G force in a Bond film since MR.
    - Opening Goodfellas shot.
    - The Q's lab scene.
    - Andrew Scott
    - Hinx's entrance.
    - The humourous use of the gadgets in the car chase.
    - Mr White scene.
    - 'Stay!'
    - Plane sequence.
    - Train fight.
    - A proper villain's lair.
    - The cat.
    - Ernst getting Donald Pleasance's scar.
    - Madeline walking off and leaving Bond had shades of Gala at the end of Fleming's MR.
    - Proper locations after SF's endless studio sets.


    Bad

    - The design of the GB still not brilliant.
    - Dont really care for the caption after the GB. Why cant the dot open up on the action like it always has done?
    - Not sure I like all this veering off the Fleming piste and tinkering with Bond's past.
    - The title song. Saying its outright bad is probably a bit harsh. Theres some great sweeping strings in there and it builds nicely but then meh.
    - Not sure about the story. So Bond tracks the lair via White's computer and then fetches up at the station and Blofeld randomly sends a car for him? I presume Denbigh is tracking Bond and then tipping off Ernst.
    - Bond destroys the whole lair with one shot? And you thought the hotel in OOS was volatile.
    - The climax. The whole thing in the MI6 building felt tagged on and Blofeld really should have just flown away. To have him blown up twice was ridiculous. Not even sure we need Blofeld at the end at all. Just stopping Denbigh would have been enough and then one final scene of Blofeld with the scar saying 'I'll be back' or some such.

    Plain awful

    - Thomas Newman: Are you taking the piss? Literally identical to SF. The character nods to MP and Judi Dench are fine but the helicopter fight underscored with Barry's 'Hes Dangerous' for example would have been epic rather than serving up a plate of SF's score warmed up in the microwave.
    - 'I love you'. I thought Vesper and Bond couldve done with a couple more scenes to be totally believable but this was ridiculous. Shared a hotel room and a train journey together and thats it - theyre in love. Utter bollocks.






  • See, I thought the torture scene wasn't nearly as effective as the one in CR.

    Actually, yes, one note on that scene. Blofeld tells Bond the second needle will penetrate a certain part of his brain that will effect his ability to recognise people. Sure, okay. Bad news then. The needle goes in and then has zero effect on Bond. What gives?
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    I think @Fitzochris he said if it hit the right nerve, it would have the desired
    effect ............ So I guess he missed ? Or being told " She loved him" ?
    Although, it is a bit of a mistake :))
  • Posts: 6,396
    How much product placement did everyone notice this time around? Omega and Heineken were pretty much hard to miss (as always) but I can't remember too much else.
  • SirHilaryBraySirHilaryBray Scotland
    Posts: 2,138
    Fitzochris wrote: »
    Okay. Overall I think it was the best Bond since CR but not without a few quibbles.

    GOOD POINTS:

    * Gunbarrel back at the start with a Binder design.
    * One of the best PTS's in the age of modern Bond.
    * The locations (up until London).
    * The return of Blofeld and his cat
    * That train fight.
    * "Good evening".
    * Craig's Bondian dialogue delivery.
    * The use of the Bond theme in Newman's score.
    * The Rome meeting.
    * Mr White.
    * The Bond girl.
    * The DB9.
    * Q
    * M

    THE BAD:

    * Everything else about the gunbarrel.
    * The majority of Newman's score in the latter half of the film.
    * Blofeld's motivation.
    * The fact that no one else on the train reacted to the carnage of Bond and Hinks kicking each other to bits.
    * "I love you." In fact that was a real WTF? moment.
    * Cataclysmic action in London again.
    * The fact Bond brought down a helicopter without regard for the public.
    * The fact after said helicopter is brought down, Bond and co freely wander onto the bridge with little or no opposition from the police.


    Why does M tell the Police "Mallory, 00 Division". Considering "00" section no longer exists it was part of the story duh! why not say "Mr Mallory SIS" or something along those lines. The Dialog is truly awful at time. I know they wanted to pay homage but paying homage to Lupe's "I love you". Logan, Purvis, Wade are finished for me. It is time for fresh blood on the writing front. Seydoux spoke before that she though her and Craig had great chemistry on set, it sadly did not translate to screen. Inside the old MI6 building at the end "Do you trust me" while they fall I expect Zimmer Dark Knight theme to begin playing. It a bloody frustrating film, as it start so well.

    1. How does Bond and Madeleine know when they get to the train station that a car would come for them?

    2. When Bond is being tagged, why is he surprised and not knowing what to expect or asking what it is when he has already had the same thing fitted in CR?


    But then you have some amazing moments the PTS. The car chase is great but not long enough, I love Bond with the mouse - "who are you working for?". The fight on the train was great but over far too soon, expect the rest of its on the chopping room floor. The torcher scene totally Room 101 1984 Orwellian excellence.

    For me Logan, Purvis & Wade produced not enough dialog which utilised the amazing cast. Mendes was way out of his depth and focussed so much on action he sacrificed real substance. This could have been the best Bond ever but for me they blew it in the second half, the ending was woeful and does not leaving me wanting more. Craig as Bond is excellent but I have a real problem with how much he seems to be enjoying himself too much.

    The film should have been driven by Bond's continued desire to hunt down Quantum and avenge Vesper. The need for the story to be personal and related to Bond was just not required. The love story in Spectre is not required.



  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    Moneypenny getting a nice new phone. ;)

    On the subject of the drills in the torture scene, Shame Bond didn't
    Say something like
    " So you're going to " Bore" me to death !"
  • Posts: 1,552
    DrGorner wrote: »
    " So you're going to " Bore" me to death !"
    That would have been a groaner...

  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    Oh yeah I forgot!

    Probably the very worst thing of the film: Repeated use of the term 'The 00 program' WTF?

    This isnt Bourne. Its the 00 section in books and films. Always has been always should be. We're not Americans for christ's sake.
  • MayDayDiVicenzoMayDayDiVicenzo Here and there
    Posts: 5,080
    I'm surprised you've not mentioned Tanner, @Wiz. Him popping up in the finale really takes the biscuit.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited October 2015 Posts: 9,117
    I'm surprised you've not mentioned Tanner, @Wiz. Him popping up in the finale really takes the biscuit.

    You bastard. You really know how to wind me up!! Rather appropriately my mind had completely forgotten the charisma black hole was even in the film.

    Seriously just what is the point of this guy? 3 films in and he just gets three lines of exposition and then serves zero purpose whatsoever every single time. Has he done a single thing in any of his films that has had any bearing on anything at all? Please just put him out of my misery. Its bad enough all MI6 staff seem to be at Bond's personal beck and call (yeah f**k you 009 Bond's nicked your DB10 and anything you need you'll have to sort for yourself because Q has nipped off to Austria) but do we really need to bloat the cast further by having this empty suit tagging along at every juncture. Just quietly pack him off to Dignitas and no one will notice.

    He's been in more films than Naomi, Ben and Ralph but ask anyone leaving the cinema if they can name his character and no one would have a clue. Most people probably didnt even notice he was present half the time.

    Its like Rory just keeps turning up on set and thinks if he keeps his head down no one will notice and they'll just keep paying him.

    Never in the field of the dramatic arts has such a dull, pointless character been portrayed by such an unremarkable actor. Honestly I'd sooner see Smithers or Colthorpe back next time round.
  • Posts: 6,396
    @TheWizardOfIce How I've missed reading your posts. :)
  • Posts: 3,164
    The big problem with the Bond/Madeleine relationship - the progress is.too jarring. One criminal thing they did was rewrite the hotel scene and nix the exchange about Vesper on the train - in the leaked scripts these two bits provided a much needed middle point to the progress of their relationship, and it made the eventual ending more earned IMO.
  • MayDayDiVicenzoMayDayDiVicenzo Here and there
    edited October 2015 Posts: 5,080
    Absolutely golden, wiz!
  • edited October 2015 Posts: 11,175
    I really enjoyed the film too and am looking forward to seeing it again. It got a bit too cheesy during the helicopter sequence and the car chase for me (especially as Craig was suited and booted whilst doing these). However when the film was at its peak, it was superb. The train fight was a personal highlight as was the "what shall we do now" comment (a cheesy moment that worked IMO).

    Having read 1984 last year, I appreciated the Orwellian moments and themes in the film relating to surveillance by the government ("not an pleasant feeling being watched is it"). The drilling torture sequence (for me) echoed the final of that book and was rightly uncomfortable to watch.

    While I did not have the same "buzzing" feeling I got from SF on walking out of the cinema, I knew i'd just seen a firm top 10 Bond film. I suspect it will probably hold up better than its predecessor too.

    It's a strange film actually, at its lightest Spectre is quite daft and I felt there were times we were slipping back into caricature Bond. However, at its darkest the film is more disturbing than anything we've seen from Craig.

    8/10

  • Posts: 6,396
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    I really enjoyed the film too and am looking forward to seeing it again. It got a bit too cheesy during the helicopter sequence and the car chase for me (especially as Craig was suited and booted whilst doing these). However when the film was at its peak, it was superb. The train fight was a personal highlight as was the "what shall we do now" comment (a cheesy moment that worked IMO).

    Having read 1984 last year, I appreciated the Orwellian moments and themes in the film relating to surveillance by the government ("not an pleasant feeling being watched is it"). The drilling torture sequence (for me) echoed the final of that book and was rightly uncomfortable to watch.

    While I did not have the same "buzzing" feeling I got from SF on walking out of the cinema, I knew i'd just seen a firm top 10 Bond film. I suspect it will probably hold up better than its predecessor too.

    It's a strange film actually, at its lightest Spectre is quite daft and I felt there were times we were slipping back into caricature Bond. However, at its darkest the film is more disturbing than anything we've seen from Craig.

    8/10

    That was my feeling too. I couldn't quite put my finger on it at first but on the drive home I realised that I didn't have the same 'high' as I had from seeing CR and SF for the first time.

    Still, a fine effort though and probably an 8/10 rating from me also.
  • Am I the only one who enjoyed this more than SF?

    SF isnt that great on repeated viewings. It dwells too much on Bond "not being fit" and, a few good overseas segments aside, all that London caper grates. The final scenes in Scotland should have been epic but end up being like a bunch of adults playing Home Alone.

    SP feels like a proper Bond film right through. Only the ending being in London let's it down in that regard.
  • aaron819aaron819 Switzerland
    Posts: 1,208
    I agree with you @Fitzochris. SF after a few viewings I started to hate it and CR and OHMSS started to become my #1. But now after seeing SP I absolutely love it and it's my new #1 favourite James Bond film.
  • Posts: 11,175
    The climax was also a little too silly for me. Lucky Craig manages to hit the helicopter from a relatively far distance with a small handgun.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    Well he had just been down in the shooting range. :D
  • Posts: 11,175
    DrGorner wrote: »
    Well he had just been down in the shooting range. :D

    Good point. For some reason it reminded me of Saw when Bond saw those photos of Vesper, LeChiffe etc.

    Also, what are the odds @Getafix won't be happy about a certain cameo appearance?

  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    Unless I missed a photo, I thought it funny, that Dominic Greene gets a
    Mention, but no photo. Almost as if even Spectre doesn't recognise QOS. ;)
  • DCisaredDCisared Liverpool
    Posts: 1,326
    DrGorner wrote: »
    Unless I missed a photo, I thought it funny, that Dominic Greene gets a
    Mention, but no photo. Almost as if even Spectre doesn't recognise QOS. ;)

    You did miss it his photo was there ;)
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    :)) I must look closer, the next time.
  • Posts: 4,622
    From all the reviews I have read, both positive and negative, I think I am going to love this film.
    Two Imax viewings followed by 4 regular cinema viewings should do it. Maybe a couple more if it stays in cinema long enough.
    I may be begging both Craig, and dare I say it, even Mendes, to come back and do the obvious Fleming inspired sequel.
    I know I will still hate the song though.
    Nothing can salvage that. Will have my OHMSS equipped headphones ready to go!
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