The Controversial Mathis Death Scene in Quantum of Solace (2008)

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  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    edited March 2013 Posts: 28,694
    My friends...gents..chaps... I implore you

    I can confirm that @Pierceuhhh and and @TOFANA007 are two different internet users....there's no secrets on this front. They are quickly becoming trusted members here on the boards.

    I am sorry to my fans i have not been posting here recently (Iam having a bad experience (I am battling cancer)....like Robin Gibb = I draw strength from his personel battle (but he deid now?) erm..not sure. Is there perhaps a Gibb curse? Barry is next
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=6j2eX1UGe_E#t=5m17s
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=MrDQjOgmdvo

    just 2 of my fav performances .... what better way to tribute the man?

    DarthDimi wrote:
    Pierceuhhh wrote:
    Then why move the body at all?
    Bond went out of his way to DISRESPECT the body!

    MOD EDIT: double post merged.

    Throw the body out of sight. That way Bond can buy himself some time. He may only win a few minutes but things may depend upon exactly that.

    Then why does he sit around cradling Mathis for about 1min+ and then stand around talking to Camilla next to the dumpster?

    And these fans are? From the oddly similar account users to the cancer comment I don't know what to even think or believe at this bloody point.
    banging-head-against-brick-wall.gif
  • ChristartosChristartos Banned
    edited March 2013 Posts: 114
    Relax my friend...Brady: YOU are among friends here

    Let get this thread back on track as I assure you we are not the same person... pierecuhhh i think has a sporting injury? perhaps during sportfit training ? TOFANA007 said he was injured in battle in Bosnia/Hrvatska but I cannot confirm. As i said i have cancer. Different experiences unfortunately... but now we make things better:

    On track: Mathis: I seriously cannot remember anything he did in QoS except die, and that's only because I watched the video about an hour ago.
  • Posts: 498
    Relax my friend...Brady: YOU are among friends here

    Let's get this thread back on track...make things better

    On track: Mathis: I seriously cannot remember anything he did in QoS except die, and that's only because I watched the video about an hour ago.

    Perhaps you should watch it again then.

  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Relax my friend...Brady: YOU are among friends here

    Let get this thread back on track as I assure you we are not the same person... pierecuhhh i think has a sporting injury? perhaps during sportfit training ? TOFANA007 said he was injured in battle in Bosnia/Hrvatska but I cannot confirm. As i said i have cancer. Different experiences unfortunately... but now we make things better:

    On track: Mathis: I seriously cannot remember anything he did in QoS except die, and that's only because I watched the video about an hour ago.

    That is exactly what @Pierceuhhh says all the time. You aren't fooling anyone, old chap. I will never understand this desire to have multiple accounts that some members have...
  • Posts: 4,400
    Back on track please. The more attention you give assholes like this the more they enjoy it.

    So.................................
    I think the argument that Bond threw Mathis's dead body into the trash as it would buy him a precious few hours to get out of La Paz opposed to leaving him on the street is not at all tenable. The fact is Bond only disposes of Mathis's body and leaves the policemen bodies on the road. The question then is why did Bond feel obliged to pick Mathis up and dump him; why not leave him? It is indeed arguable that Bond went out of his way to disrespect the body.
  • Posts: 1,492
    The fact is Bond only disposes of Mathis's body and leaves the policemen bodies on the road. The question then is why did Bond feel obliged to pick Mathis up and dump him; why not leave him? It is indeed arguable that Bond went out of his way to disrespect the body.

    As someone explained it is the quickest burial that time will allow. Bond cared for Mathis as his face showed when he cradled his body but was in a very shutdown place. As he said, Mathis would have understood.

  • PierceuhhhPierceuhhh Banned
    edited March 2013 Posts: 104
    Pierce2Daniel is correct... It is more disrespectful to put a friend's body IN GARBAGE than to leave it on the street.

    The fool Paul Haggis just did not think it thru.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,524
    Pierceuhhh wrote:
    Pierce2Daniel is correct... It is more disrespectful to put a friend's body IN GARBAGE than to leave it on the street.

    The fool Paul Haggis just did not think it thru.
    Talking about being disrespectful...
  • Posts: 4,400
    Pierceuhhh wrote:
    Pierce2Daniel is correct... It is more disrespectful to put a friend's body IN GARBAGE than to leave it on the street.

    The fool Paul Haggis just did not think it thru.

    speaking very literally, it is a very disrespectful thing Bond did. But given the situation; Mathis was already dead, Bond knew there was no point taking him to a hospital and he didn't want to leave his friend on the side of the road. So he had to make good of the bad situation; hence leaving him in the dumpster. It was a burial of sorts and the only one Bond could do with the time he had, it wasn't a particualry ceremonial thing to do but there was a slight ritual to it. Camille can't understand, but Bond knew Mathis would likely not have cared.

  • PierceuhhhPierceuhhh Banned
    edited March 2013 Posts: 104
    He would not have cared about being left on the street either.
    So why did Bond do anything?
    All he did was desecrate a corpse...
  • TOFANA007TOFANA007 Banned
    Posts: 89
    chrisTARTOS cheers friend.

    was in war of independents for Croatia. 1991-95 Did lot of thing ill never forgot, meet good people..

    didd some bad things too to chill yoursoul

    back to Matthis.

    just put yourself in Bonds posstion. if your good friend die, what would you do? dishonor his memory? throw him in garbagecan? No leave him for parameddics so they can propperly do whatever to his boddy.

    oince again neal puurvis and whoevr else wrot it just don t think it thru and now we have lost beloved character that never will come back and return.. I have lot of ideas, if eon production is reeding this. PM me and il give you ideas for bringing it back to roots of series i am serious

    sent from my verizon 3g

    verizon- bringing the world together in peace
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    We will likely all end up buried in a six foot hole, so why are we getting worked up about a body being tossed in a bin? As Bond said, Mathis wouldn't have cared, and probably would have laughed at the idea of ending up there. I am pretty sure dead people don't really care one way or another (considering they are dead!), especially Mathis who understood the risks of his job, as Bond does.

    Many of you are getting all worked up over a scene that was likely constructed last minute and might not have been in the script in the first place. Don't dwell too much on it, folks.
  • Posts: 4,400
    We will likely all end up buried in a six foot hole, so why are we getting worked up about a body being tossed in a bin? As Bond said, Mathis wouldn't have cared, and probably would have laughed at the idea of ending up there. I am pretty sure dead people don't really care one way or another (considering they are dead!), especially Mathis who understood the risks of his job, as Bond does.

    Many of you are getting all worked up over a scene that was likely constructed last minute and might not have been in the script in the first place. Don't dwell too much on it, folks.

    I'm certain a lot of thought went into the sequence. Daniel Craig is not the sort of actor to just point and shoot, before he did Bond he made a name for himself in British art-house cinema. Say what you want about Forster's suitability to direct a Bond film, but I can assure you the guy is a clever filmmaker who likely would thought into the scene. his sentimentality just clearly doesn't match a lot of folks on these boards. This is one of the reasons I really want a director's commentary from Forster!

  • I wasn't shocked by the manner in which Bond put Mathis in a skip. Better that than left on the road. As Bond said Mathis wouldn't have cared. Death is part of their job and they knew that it can also come to them and once they're dead, there's nothing they can do about it. Bond hasn't got time to be sentimental. His got a mission to complete.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    edited March 2013 Posts: 11,139
    To add to my earlier post, I agree with the poster who said Bond dumping Mathis' body in the dumpster was his own sort of metaphorical burying as opposed to leaving the body on the street like a dog. I know some people who take death seriously in what may be some strange ways; they don't care what happens to their bodies just so long as they don't suffer a dog's death i.e. their bodies left out on the street. In some cultures it's the most dishounarable way to die, so I've been told.
  • ChristartosChristartos Banned
    Posts: 114
    We will likely all end up buried in a six foot hole, so why are we getting worked up about a body being tossed in a bin? As Bond said, Mathis wouldn't have cared, and probably would have laughed at the idea of ending up there. I am pretty sure dead people don't really care one way or another (considering they are dead!), especially Mathis who understood the risks of his job, as Bond does.

    Many of you are getting all worked up over a scene that was likely constructed last minute and might not have been in the script in the first place. Don't dwell too much on it, folks.
    Brtady I would be careful ..don't disrespect others believes. I myself am a Christian man as I know many others here are. Partly why I chose the name CHRISTArtos in addition ot it being the name of villain christartos in for your eyes only.
  • PierceuhhhPierceuhhh Banned
    Posts: 104
    Many of you are getting all worked up over a scene that was likely constructed last minute and might not have been in the script in the first place. Don't dwell too much on it, folks.

    But chap... are we AS FANS not owed more than to have slap dash stuff with no reason or rhyhm put into it on our screens. The old movies had scrips bu Maibaum... Mankenwicz... giants of Bond writing. Why are old movies scorned... they never have scenes that poorly thought out...

  • ChristartosChristartos Banned
    Posts: 114
    He needed to put Mathis in the bin because he was going to set it on fire and chant "the fire rises the fire rises" but cops show up so he couldnt
  • edited March 2013 Posts: 174
    Interesting reading all he opinions on this scene.

    What if the roles were reversed and it was Bond that was dead in Mathis arms, what would Bond want Mathis to do?
    Well, as Bond has always put his love for country and the job before EVERYTHING else in his life I don't think it would be strange to expect him to not care what happened to his dead body. After all he would now see himself as completely useless, like a piece of rubbish/garbage. So for Bond to do this to Mathis does not seem strange to me at all.

    The holding of Mathis in his arms I think has more to do with Bonds guilt over his mistreatment of Mathis and the friendship that had come after this, both professionally and personally.

    That's my opinion on the scene, for what's it worth?
  • SandySandy Somewhere in Europe
    Posts: 4,012
    doubleoego wrote:
    To add to my earlier post, I agree with the poster who said Bond dumping Mathis' body in the dumpster was his own sort of metaphorical burying as opposed to leaving the body on the street like a dog. I know some people who take death seriously in what may be some strange ways; they don't care what happens to their bodies just so long as they don't suffer a dog's death i.e. their bodies left out on the street. In some cultures it's the most dishounarable way to die, so I've been told.

    Very true, I think that was the idea. He couldn't do much for Mathis but at least he took him from the middle of the street.
    One of the things that bother me most about QoS (although it is no secret to anyone here that I rate it highly) is the very fact that they killed Mathis. I love the character and was so excited when he was introduced in CR. Giannini had such a wonderful chemistry with Craig. I really wanted to see further of him in the films but what is done is done.
  • Posts: 498
    Sandy wrote:
    Very true, I think that was the idea. He couldn't do much for Mathis but at least he took him from the middle of the street.
    One of the things that bother me most about QoS (although it is no secret to anyone here that I rate it highly) is the very fact that they killed Mathis. I love the character and was so excited when he was introduced in CR. Giannini had such a wonderful chemistry with Craig. I really wanted to see further of him in the films but what is done is done.

    Exactly. You get that wonderful aura of the Craig-Mathis Chemistry which plays well on screen.
  • ChristartosChristartos Banned
    Posts: 114
    Skyfail wrote:
    Sandy wrote:
    Very true, I think that was the idea. He couldn't do much for Mathis but at least he took him from the middle of the street.
    One of the things that bother me most about QoS (although it is no secret to anyone here that I rate it highly) is the very fact that they killed Mathis. I love the character and was so excited when he was introduced in CR. Giannini had such a wonderful chemistry with Craig. I really wanted to see further of him in the films but what is done is done.

    Exactly. You get that wonderful aura of the Craig-Mathis Chemistry which plays well on screen.

    Yes I agree...when I saw Mathis interact with Daniel Craig first time I got chills..shaking

    wow what a performance Mathis...this calls for a celebration

  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    We will likely all end up in a six foot hole, so why are we getting worked up about a body being tossed in a bin? As Bond said, Mathis wouldn't have cared, and probably would have laughed at the idea of
    We will likely all end up buried in a six foot hole, so why are we getting worked up about a body being tossed in a bin? As Bond said, Mathis wouldn't have cared, and probably would have laughed at the idea of ending up there. I am pretty sure dead people don't really care one way or another (considering they are dead!), especially Mathis who understood the risks of his job, as Bond does.

    Many of you are getting all worked up over a scene that was likely constructed last minute and might not have been in the script in the first place. Don't dwell too much on it, folks.
    Brtady I would be careful ..don't disrespect others believes. I myself am a Christian man as I know many others here are. Partly why I chose the name CHRISTArtos in addition ot it being the name of villain christartos in for your eyes only.

    How am I disrespecting anyone's beliefs? I am voicing my opinion for Fleming's sake.
  • Have to stick up for the bradybunch resident in chief - he's just making a point about the character Mathis that he wouldn't care how he went as Bond said, it was not in his nature.

    As for disrespecting religious beliefs, people who worship the creed and not the message do a fine job of that all by themselves.



  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 17,777
    Sorry, I've only just emboldened the text from my article quoted in my opening post in this thread for added emphasis.
  • JRRJRR
    edited April 2013 Posts: 74
    Bonds life, is life and death wedded from the time he becomes mission active, he faces circumstances, which can be wholly unfair, even being a seasoned operative he doesn’t possess a foresight apart from the honed instinct of bitter experience.

    When events change and present themselves to his complete disadvantage and people around him are killed, he as with any human will be torn, between complete sadness, regret and then the immediate sense of needing to survive before he ends with equal ill fate.

    James Bond may appear to be cold and severed from the compassion, to which a situation deserves, the aloofness easily criticised, his character being compared to a sociopath, when in reality his decisions are forced, the conditions he is reacting to have very real and devastating consequences should he not detach and become pragmatic.

    To deal with a friend as he did seems totally callous; analysing from another angle, it is possible Bond had several reasons for moving the body, not only to try to disassociate from the immediate connection with himself, and confuse the reasons surrounding Mathis death, but also to delay the police from finding him and perhaps even to create the illusion that Mathis hadn’t died so soon after being shot and was able to stagger to the industrial waste bin and fell in trying to evade being found in the vain hope he would survive long enough to reach medical help.

    Bonds comment, “Mathis was not the sort to care”, suggests that he was reasoning that Mathis knew and clearly understood the ugliness of a clandestine existence and in the event of dire circumstances; survival would become the only choice.

    Bonds dealing with the resulting set of unpalatable factors meant Camille and he could stay alive, the way in which he managed was a calculated resolution to having few options.

    Mathis was a good character, one that could have remained in future films, I know this is pure conjecture, but this thread enjoys varied opinions.
  • Have to stick up for the bradybunch resident in chief - he's just making a point about the character Mathis that he wouldn't care how he went as Bond said, it was not in his nature.

    As for disrespecting religious beliefs, people who worship the creed and not the message do a fine job of that all by themselves.

    So true. Some religions have gone around torturing and burning people for centuries but god forbid they carry on like they have nothing to atone for or be ashamed of. The Swedes made a saint out of one such murderer, if I could I'd dig his bones up and publicly piss on them. I just love these "glass housers".

    This is something I spoke of in my QOS review on my originals thread. It's very controversial to say the least, maybe even more than Forster himself. I never much liked that and initially hated the idea. But then I thought about the situation. If you are Bond in this situation, your choices are (a) load him back in the car and drive off with his corpse. You don't have time to leave him at the hospital and have to get out of town A.S.A.P so while it's morally the right thing you would want to do, it's not an option if you want to survive. You certainly don't want to drive around with the corpse past a hospital trip. Or (b) leave him there like they did. Do you leave him like a bum in the street, easy to find for anyone especially the national police, or do you try to hide the body to buy time? It seems to be that the scene will forever be found in distaste but given the circumstances, it's hard to argue that Bond had a better move. I think some people want to believe anything bad about Craig's Bond and would run with this, but I don't think Craig's Bond was anything but sad for the loss of his friend and given another option would have never treated Mathis' corpse in this manner,





  • samainsysamainsy Suspended
    Posts: 199
    I thought he was in there becuase he wanted no one to find Mathis.
  • Posts: 7,653
    The whole situation was just badly written and at no time we really get some conviction that Mathis after all that has happened in CR is the right person to accompany 007 on this trip to South America.

    The death of Mathis was just one of those badly thought out moments in the script, a waste of a brilliant character and actor in a poor movie.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,447
    SaintMark wrote:
    The whole situation was just badly written and at no time we really get some conviction that Mathis after all that has happened in CR is the right person to accompany 007 on this trip to South America.

    The death of Mathis was just one of those badly thought out moments in the script, a waste of a brilliant character and actor in a poor movie.

    While I do enjoy QoS, I do agree that a lot of the script was rushed, and Mathis was just an absolute waste. Give us some terrible DAD like film (brush it under the rug, make it a two-minute supernatural film) that resurrects Mathis somehow. Like Brady and I spoke of before, it would have been great (and made sense) to put an action sequence there: have Camille drive while Bond lays in the back seat with Mathis and they talk. Then, they start being pursued, and Bond fights them off with his PPK. An action sequence that makes sense AND we keep Mathis around? Yes, please.
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