Where does Bond go after Craig?

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  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 2,520
    I've only seen Blade Runner and Dune, I'll be honest as much as the world and scope impressed me, both did seem to drag at points.

    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited March 2 Posts: 5,869
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,113
    This is worst case scenario for someone like me. Villeneuve is just more of the Craig bond.

    Having said that, some news is better than the neverending abyss.
  • FeyadorFeyador Montreal, Canada
    edited March 2 Posts: 735
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.
    I haven't followed this closely (sorry) but I gather Villeneuve has expressed public interest in doing Bond? If you'd only ever seen Incendies or Polytechnique you probably wouldn't come away from those films with anything but a repellent feeling for the very idea of violence itself, fantasy or otherwise. Those films left a strong impact on me, so I find it astonishing at first glance the very idea of him doing Bond ....

    But perhaps he's changed or I've misinterpreted his personal feelings regarding them. Or maybe he would intend something mildly subversive ... I just don't see him doing it for the money, power and spectacle. But then of course I don't really know ...
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,562
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,059
    Who's to say Craig couldn't be lured back for an afterlife Bond film.

    Or there's the longtime Zombie Bond concept.

    images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSkrhWga34QMey-NCfOBkFPOb7Xdtm_1dIAvpflqC1xWQK0vpyy

    S5FBwJzgmMPnqz3kVknfSvcSGX2TlPaZpwfHUNNyK0Y.jpg?auto=webp&s=4b070c11c2f8f29576eccff4a266a7f6059d2626
  • Posts: 1,525
    peter wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    CrabKey wrote: »
    @Peter - I would find that argument more compelling if Bond hadn't been blown to smithereens at the end of the film with James Bond Will Return in the credit roll. That was an unambiguous message that Craig won't be back. Sort of a suck it up Craig fans, a new Bond is on his way. Not having killed Connery left the door open for two more comebacks.

    Of course all of this grows from the frustration of fans who are tired of waiting and who, like myself, prefer to be irrational occasionally.

    @CrabKey , I’m not sure what you’re responding to? The gap between films? I’m not clear how the gap is tied to the end of NTTD? It says Bond will return, but that somehow also was a message to “Craig fans to suck it up”? I’m not being facetious, I don’t understand what you’re saying (as a huge Craig fan, I didn’t feel I had to suck up anything after the film? As a fan of Craig, I enjoyed seeing his last film, and I’m happy that we have been promised another Bond film, knowing a recast is happening….).

    Craig's Bond is dead and buried. He says no one expects his return.

    Yes, I think we all get that, but I don't think that's what @CrabKey was getting at, since it's in reply to one of my posts, and I've never once questioned that Craig is ever coming back.

    Maybe he thinks the gap is pointless for that reason.

    Yes, exactly! Thank you.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    edited March 2 Posts: 4,121
    Considering how many James Bond alumni Denis Villeneuve has cast in his movies over the years, it wouldn't surprise me. I still wouldn't mind him or Christopher Nolan, or whoever EON goes with. I trust EON, and a new director is just as exciting as a new Bond novel author.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,113
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.
  • George_KaplanGeorge_Kaplan Not a red herring
    edited March 2 Posts: 566
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited March 2 Posts: 8,113
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.

    That's my point, for me Villeneuve is very similar to what we have been getting.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,562
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.

    That's my point, for me Villeneuve is very similar to what we have been getting.

    Yet you seem to want a new Moore/Brosnan era, whatever that means. (Both had very different films in their era.)
  • Posts: 2,954
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    I've only seen Blade Runner and Dune, I'll be honest as much as the world and scope impressed me, both did seem to drag at points.

    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?

    I’d give Prisoners a watch. Sicario on paper is more ‘Bond-esque’, but I’d say that’s the best thriller he’s ever made.

    Anyway, I’ve said before apart from Prisoners I tend to find Villeneuve’s films a tad dull too, but very well made. He wouldn’t be my first choice, and I don’t know how well he understands Bond - none of us do- but it’s also worth saying we also don’t know what kind of Bond film he’d give us. I’d reserve judgments if he was announced as the director until we see the film itself.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited March 2 Posts: 8,113
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.

    That's my point, for me Villeneuve is very similar to what we have been getting.

    Yet you seem to want a new Moore/Brosnan era, whatever that means. (Both had very different films in their era.)

    If the bond series is a pendulum, its about time it started swinging back in the other direction, that's all it means. Similar to Brosnan after Dalton or Moore after Connery.

    Denis Villeneueve would have too much in common with the recent films, it wouldn't feel like a departure into something new.
  • edited March 2 Posts: 731
    talos7 wrote: »
    That needs to see the light of day quickly
    🤔

    It can't be Bond. The new actor needs a longer gap. ;)
  • Posts: 2,954
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.

    That's my point, for me Villeneuve is very similar to what we have been getting.

    Yet you seem to want a new Moore/Brosnan era, whatever that means. (Both had very different films in their era.)

    If the bond series is a pendulum, its about time it started swinging back in the other direction, that's all it means. Similar to Brosnan after Dalton or Moore after Connery.

    Denis Villeneueve would have too much in common with the recent films, it wouldn't feel like a departure into something new.

    But the Moore, Brosnan, and Connery eras all had a variety of different films in their eras. It’s not as simple as a pendulum swinging back and forth either. Moore’s era came after DAF which some would argue is a Moore film which happened to feature Connery. TLD retained some of the humour and certainly plot ideas from the later Moore films. GE is a much darker and character driven Bond film which very much feels like it came after LTK.

    And as I said, I don’t think we can tell at the moment what Villeneuve would hypothetically give us.
  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 2,520
    @Denbigh @DarthDimi @007HallY cheers guys I'll check them out
  • George_KaplanGeorge_Kaplan Not a red herring
    Posts: 566
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.

    That's my point, for me Villeneuve is very similar to what we have been getting.

    Yet you seem to want a new Moore/Brosnan era, whatever that means. (Both had very different films in their era.)

    If the bond series is a pendulum, its about time it started swinging back in the other direction, that's all it means. Similar to Brosnan after Dalton or Moore after Connery.

    What would such a film look like? What would we be returning to?
  • Posts: 105
    Denis Villeneueve would have too much in common with the recent films, it wouldn't feel like a departure into something new.
    Exactly - with Villeneuve as director we would most likely get a slow, humorless movie. I like some of his movies like Blade Runner 2049, but I don't think his style is what the Bond series needs right now.
    Even worse, since it will be the first movie of a new era, it will influence the whole era even if Villeneuve only directs the next movie.

  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,113
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.

    That's my point, for me Villeneuve is very similar to what we have been getting.

    Yet you seem to want a new Moore/Brosnan era, whatever that means. (Both had very different films in their era.)

    If the bond series is a pendulum, its about time it started swinging back in the other direction, that's all it means. Similar to Brosnan after Dalton or Moore after Connery.

    What would such a film look like? What would we be returning to?

    Essentially drama and the type of grounded characterisation of the Craig films taking a back seat to pure escapism and breezy adventure.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 8,548
    CrabKey wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    peter wrote: »
    CrabKey wrote: »
    @Peter - I would find that argument more compelling if Bond hadn't been blown to smithereens at the end of the film with James Bond Will Return in the credit roll. That was an unambiguous message that Craig won't be back. Sort of a suck it up Craig fans, a new Bond is on his way. Not having killed Connery left the door open for two more comebacks.

    Of course all of this grows from the frustration of fans who are tired of waiting and who, like myself, prefer to be irrational occasionally.

    @CrabKey , I’m not sure what you’re responding to? The gap between films? I’m not clear how the gap is tied to the end of NTTD? It says Bond will return, but that somehow also was a message to “Craig fans to suck it up”? I’m not being facetious, I don’t understand what you’re saying (as a huge Craig fan, I didn’t feel I had to suck up anything after the film? As a fan of Craig, I enjoyed seeing his last film, and I’m happy that we have been promised another Bond film, knowing a recast is happening….).

    Craig's Bond is dead and buried. He says no one expects his return.

    Yes, I think we all get that, but I don't think that's what @CrabKey was getting at, since it's in reply to one of my posts, and I've never once questioned that Craig is ever coming back.

    Maybe he thinks the gap is pointless for that reason.

    Yes, exactly! Thank you.

    Well color me stupid ...
  • George_KaplanGeorge_Kaplan Not a red herring
    edited March 2 Posts: 566
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.

    That's my point, for me Villeneuve is very similar to what we have been getting.

    Yet you seem to want a new Moore/Brosnan era, whatever that means. (Both had very different films in their era.)

    If the bond series is a pendulum, its about time it started swinging back in the other direction, that's all it means. Similar to Brosnan after Dalton or Moore after Connery.

    What would such a film look like? What would we be returning to?

    Essentially drama and the type of grounded characterisation of the Craig films taking a back seat to pure escapism and breezy adventure.

    That’s what I thought you meant, and I just don’t think that’s possible, or for the best.

    I love the older films. Three of my top five are 60s films, and there are certain classic elements that I felt were lacking from the Craig era. But the fact remains that the films have depth now that they never used to. Reverting back to even a Brosnan style of Bond film, with comparatively surface level character drama wouldn’t be a reinvention, it would be a regression.

    The series is not simply a pendulum swinging back and forth, it’s been in a constant state of evolution since the beginning. Adapting to new actors, writers, and directors, as well as external things like world events, changes in society, attitudes, innovations in filmmaking, etc. Ultimately, we just have to accept that some of the changes made during the Craig era, such as the increased focus on character and emotional conflicts, are permanent. To go back would be like the series becoming more two-dimensional.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    edited March 2 Posts: 8,548
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.

    That's my point, for me Villeneuve is very similar to what we have been getting.

    Yet you seem to want a new Moore/Brosnan era, whatever that means. (Both had very different films in their era.)

    If the bond series is a pendulum, its about time it started swinging back in the other direction, that's all it means. Similar to Brosnan after Dalton or Moore after Connery.

    What would such a film look like? What would we be returning to?

    Essentially drama and the type of grounded characterisation of the Craig films taking a back seat to pure escapism and breezy adventure.

    That’s what I thought you meant, and I just don’t think that’s possible, or for the best.

    I love the older films. Three of my top five are 60s films, and there are certain classic elements that I felt were lacking from the Craig era. But the fact remains that the films have depth now that they never used to. Reverting back to even a Brosnan style of Bond film, with comparatively surface level character drama wouldn’t be a reinvention, it would be a regression.

    The series is not simply a pendulum swinging back and forth, it’s been in a constant state of evolution since the beginning. Adapting to new actors, writers, and directors, as well as external things like world events, changes in society, attitudes, innovations in filmmaking, etc. Ultimately, we just have to accept that some of the changes made during the Craig era, such as the increased focus on character and emotional conflicts, are permanent. To go back would be like the series becoming more two-dimensional.

    Bravo @George_Kaplan …. Whether one agrees with your assessment, or not, this is certainly the best description, and the truth, of the ongoing life of agent James Bond, in film. He is always in a state of flux. Even within each actor’s tenure the character is active and morphing to the times. He’s never static. And he’s never gone backwards. The Bond of Dr. No is quite a bit different in just about every way to the one who showed up in DAF; the Bond in LALD was different to the one in TMWTGG, is different to the one seen in TSWLM….

    Bond moves forward and is malleable to present times. There are archetypal traits that will always remain true to the character, but the series would never have survived the last 60 years if he wasn’t the man of today….
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,113
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.

    That's my point, for me Villeneuve is very similar to what we have been getting.

    Yet you seem to want a new Moore/Brosnan era, whatever that means. (Both had very different films in their era.)

    If the bond series is a pendulum, its about time it started swinging back in the other direction, that's all it means. Similar to Brosnan after Dalton or Moore after Connery.

    What would such a film look like? What would we be returning to?

    Essentially drama and the type of grounded characterisation of the Craig films taking a back seat to pure escapism and breezy adventure.

    That’s what I thought you meant, and I just don’t think that’s possible, or for the best.

    I love the older films. Three of my top five are 60s films, and there are certain classic elements that I felt were lacking from the Craig era. But the fact remains that the films have depth now that they never used to. Reverting back to even a Brosnan style of Bond film, with comparatively surface level character drama wouldn’t be a reinvention, it would be a regression.

    The series is not simply a pendulum swinging back and forth, it’s been in a constant state of evolution since the beginning. Adapting to new actors, writers, and directors, as well as external things like world events, changes in society, attitudes, innovations in filmmaking, etc. Ultimately, we just have to accept that some of the changes made during the Craig era, such as the increased focus on character and emotional conflicts, are permanent. To go back would be like the series becoming more two-dimensional.

    You could make this case in the late eighties, that reverting back to comedic, charming bond after Dalton would be a regression, but ultimately Brosnan brought in a whole new generation of fans by doing exactly that. I don't know what is meant by "it's not possible" - how so? EON don't have the resources? Ofcoure it's possible, and a lot of Bond fans have been yearn for a return to standalone missions with a more breezy feel. The franchise literally still exists because of how adaptable it can be, if it had stuck with hardboiled thrillers forever the series might not have made it to 10 entries, let alone 25.
  • Posts: 2,954
    peter wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.

    That's my point, for me Villeneuve is very similar to what we have been getting.

    Yet you seem to want a new Moore/Brosnan era, whatever that means. (Both had very different films in their era.)

    If the bond series is a pendulum, its about time it started swinging back in the other direction, that's all it means. Similar to Brosnan after Dalton or Moore after Connery.

    What would such a film look like? What would we be returning to?

    Essentially drama and the type of grounded characterisation of the Craig films taking a back seat to pure escapism and breezy adventure.

    That’s what I thought you meant, and I just don’t think that’s possible, or for the best.

    I love the older films. Three of my top five are 60s films, and there are certain classic elements that I felt were lacking from the Craig era. But the fact remains that the films have depth now that they never used to. Reverting back to even a Brosnan style of Bond film, with comparatively surface level character drama wouldn’t be a reinvention, it would be a regression.

    The series is not simply a pendulum swinging back and forth, it’s been in a constant state of evolution since the beginning. Adapting to new actors, writers, and directors, as well as external things like world events, changes in society, attitudes, innovations in filmmaking, etc. Ultimately, we just have to accept that some of the changes made during the Craig era, such as the increased focus on character and emotional conflicts, are permanent. To go back would be like the series becoming more two-dimensional.

    Bravo @George_Kaplan …. Whether one agrees with your assessment, or not, this is certainly the best description, and the truth, of the ongoing life of agent James Bond, in film. He is always in a state of flux. Even within each actor’s tenure the character is active and morphing to the times. He’s never static. And he’s never gone backwards. The Bond of Dr. No is quite a bit different in just about every way to the one who showed up in DAF; the Bond in LALD was different to the one in TMWTGG, is different to the one seen TSWLM….

    Bond moves forward and is malleable to present times. There are archetypal traits that will always remain true to the series would never have survived the last 60 years if he wasn’t the man of today….

    Exactly. Hell, the Bond of DN is different to the Bond of FRWL.

    On the whole, even with this constant evolution, I'd say the character's been remarkably consistent considering. EON have always understood and kept the fundamental traits of the character alive and have always had a deference to the novels. It's a good mixture.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    edited March 2 Posts: 5,985
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.

    That's my point, for me Villeneuve is very similar to what we have been getting.

    Yet you seem to want a new Moore/Brosnan era, whatever that means. (Both had very different films in their era.)

    If the bond series is a pendulum, its about time it started swinging back in the other direction, that's all it means. Similar to Brosnan after Dalton or Moore after Connery.

    What would such a film look like? What would we be returning to?

    Essentially drama and the type of grounded characterisation of the Craig films taking a back seat to pure escapism and breezy adventure.

    Look at the world around us right now. Nothing is breezy. There's a lot of geopolitical menace looming, including, possibly, from my own country. :(

    I don't think we're headed for a lighter Bond.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,113
    echo wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Are there any Villeneuve films anyone would recommend? Something more in line with what his Bond would be like?
    Probably Sicario. I wouldn't say this gives any insight into what he would do with Bond but probably the closest thing within his current filmography.

    @Jordo007
    I agree with @Denbigh that Sicario is probably the best film to explore Villeneuve's filmmaking besides his sci-fi films.

    @Mendes4Lyfe
    I don't quite see why Villeneuve would surely provide more of the Craig Bond. He has never done anything even remotely like Bond. Martin Campbell had made some sex comedies and courtroom dramas before doing GE. Not exactly very Bondian. In hindsight, I don't think GE resembled anything he had done before, yet he knocked that film out of the park.

    Also, there's not a lot of "news" here. Villeneuve doing Bond next is mostly conjecture and wishful thinking from fans. There are far more film projects to be mysterious about than Bond.

    I just don't think based on his filmography Villeneuve is going to be a champion of the Moore/Brosnan bond returning.

    Who said anything about the Moore/Brosnan Bond returning? I for one am looking for something entirely new.

    That's my point, for me Villeneuve is very similar to what we have been getting.

    Yet you seem to want a new Moore/Brosnan era, whatever that means. (Both had very different films in their era.)

    If the bond series is a pendulum, its about time it started swinging back in the other direction, that's all it means. Similar to Brosnan after Dalton or Moore after Connery.

    What would such a film look like? What would we be returning to?

    Essentially drama and the type of grounded characterisation of the Craig films taking a back seat to pure escapism and breezy adventure.

    Look at the world around us right now. Nothing is breezy. There's a lot of geopolitical menace looming, including, possibly, from my own country. :(

    I don't think we're headed for a lighter Bond.

    Sounds like a lighter Bond is more needed than ever.
  • edited March 2 Posts: 2,954
    I mean, the way these things usually work is that each new Bond actor's first film carries over elements from the previous era, but the new Bond themselves tends to be distinct in some way from the previous one.

    Perhaps what we'll get then is a more breezy, humorous (perhaps even lighthearted) Bond along the lines of Brosnan in GE or Connery in DN or GF, in a film that skews towards darkness in similar ways to the later Craig films. Doesn't sound dissimilar to GE really...
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 5,985
    CR is a response to 9/11 more than to Brosnan.

    GE is a response to Dalton's unfortunate failure, but also to the end (!) of the Cold War.

    Eon always incorporates current events as well as recent non-Bond films.

    It's how Bond films have survived.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 7,983
    This article has some interesting comments from O’Connell and addresses “the gap” between films and why it’s not a bad thing.

    https://screenrant.com/james-bond-casting-chances-jack-oconnell-response/
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