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To throw a spanner in the works here, I found a lot of Craig's fights to be over-choreographed after CR. They lost something for me from film to film. I think Brosnan's were the same. He peaked early and then fell off a bit. With that in mind, it almost makes the actor's abilities irrelevant.
@talos7 , the Die Hard fight choreography stands the test of tim; it’s incredible, visceral and exciting. That was seven years before Goldeneye.
And Bean’s execution also is as good as anything… I just found one dance partner in the Goldeneye fight, better than the other.
I agree. I wouldn’t say that I didn’t find some of the later Craig fights enjoyable, but there is a night and day difference for me between the Stairwell Fight in CR, and the Shanghai Skyscraper fight in SF. Same for Brosnan too; a huge night and day between the fights of GE and TND.
Could not agree more. If he is cast as Bond, I'm out. And not because he is black. There are several black actors I would be fine with. He ain't one of them.
I think a big part of it is concept too. CR leant a bit more into the idea that Bond could actually get hurt and even struggled against certain opponents (there’s certainly some very ‘polished’ looking choreography in that film, but you also have things like the stairwell fight that showcases that idea). SP and NTTD on the other hand showed a Bond who was older/in his prime and had a good deal of training in his arsenal. It’s even a bit of a gag in SP that ordinary goons aren’t capable of restraining Bond.
There’s also an element of how these fights are shot/edited. Some films in general make very poor choices in these areas which are then blamed on the fight choreography (ie. The Dark Knight Rises).
I think the best Bond fights are the ones that look like actual scraps, where Bond even struggles a bit - the train fight in FRWL, the club scene in TMWTGG, the Travelyan brawl in GE, the stair fight in CR etc.
The issue isn’t with your opinions @peter, I’ve said at least twice now that you’re entitled to them. But you can’t expect to make biased claims about an actor/film you dislike without getting some kind of push back.
As you may’ve noted : I’m not pushing back on your love of Brosnan. You think he’s great. I don’t. I replied about athleticism, you don’t agree, the world still spins.
But mark my words, you WILL be converted…
But I’m also on record that it’s my opinion that TND is Pierce’s best, and I thoroughly enjoyed the first half of the film. I didn’t like the second half at all, but that was more to do with direction and had nothing to do with Brozz.
I’ve also been on record that although I’d rather have had Dalton back, or Fiennes or Neeson play Bond, it’s my belief that Pierce was the right man for the job in ‘95, and I don’t think that anyone would have put 007 back on the map, as he did. So although he’s not my cup of tea, and although I’d rather have had other actors fill the lead role, I can also see and I truly believe that it was only Brozz that could have delivered a mega hit and announce to the world that James Bond was indeed back!
So my opinions on the man are a little more nuanced as I respect his place in 007’s film history…
I blame Mendes.
I can completely understand preferring one over the other but both are striving for two completely aesthetics; the stairwell is meant to be brutal and gritty while the skyscraper is stylish, cool and surreal. I love them both ; comparing them is like comparing apples to oranges.
Everyone blames Mendes.
Even just on a basic level compare the chase scenes in CR and QOS - in the former we see Bond struggling, even taking shortcuts or brute force in order to keep up with the parkour expert. In QOS he gets banged around a bit, but even falling from great heights he just keeps going. I always felt it betrayed what CR was trying to do and robbed the film of a sense that Bond could legitimately get hurt or die (even in his fight with Green at the end there’s a strange lack of tension despite the fact the villain is wielding an axe - it just feels as though Bond is obviously going to come out on top). SF, for all its stylised sequences, lets the story/context do the work. We see Bond at his best getting injured during the PTS so we’re legitimately not sure how he’ll fare during his later fight with Patrice, and indeed any subsequent chases or stand offs.
Agreed 100%. Bourne perhaps may have been too much of an influence on QOS in that regard. Ironically I think it’s the reason why of all the Bourne films, I still prefer Identity.
Haha, true! For what it’s worth I think its high points are elsewhere rather than its action sequences.
There’s definitely a bit of Bourne in the Craig era in general. But yeah, it seems to come out most in QOS.
I feel the same way - Identity is the only Bourne film for me.
Actually, having said that, I like the Renner-led Legacy, but I'm very much in the minority there.
It’s the only film in the series that works on its own two feet. I actually remember reading somewhere that Matt Damon felt there didn’t need to be any sequels after Identity at one time.
Some fun viewpoints on where Bond should go next.
But he denied it literally on the same day that he later went on Colbert show and confessed to having a part in bond 25. These are the kind of Hollywood games that are played all the time, I remember Cillian Murphy being interviewed by Simon Mayo and Mark Kermode before the release of The Dark Knight Rises and watching him squirm as the hosts tried to get him to admit he was playing the scarecrow again.
I'm not saying Nolan is definitely doing Bond 26, but I think his comment about the rumours "not being true" doesn't rule him out of eventually being the man they go with. It looks like EON aren't even at the stage of thinking about directors yet, we aren't likely to see the next film until the late 2020's.
I loooove ATJ, but dislike Mescal probably more than anyone here. I don't think I would be able to muster up any excitement for Bond 26 if he is cast.
Either would be a tremendous disappointment for me.
I just don't know who they could cast. Casting a Bond movie (in any role) is one of the hardest things for me.