The What if thread...M had been re-cast for CR 2006? page 60

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  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,518
    I personally would have loved it, but would have been stunt casting and taken focus away from the story.
    @Shardlake is 100% correct. Doesn't change that I would have loved it myself. :D
  • Posts: 12,242
    As fun as it sounds on paper, the right thing happened with getting Finney instead, who did a great job. It would have felt too gimmicky and distracting to see Connery and would take me out of the film, as much as I love him.
  • I side with the rest here: it would have taken us out of the film. Besides, Finney did such a great job as Kincaid that it would be a shame to have lost that soulful performance.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 7,999
    It’s a cute idea for a brief moment, and that’s exactly why nobody ever seriously considered it enough to pursue it. They moved on with Albert Finney.
  • DwayneDwayne New York City
    Posts: 2,598
    Thank God it wasn’t done!

    Interestingly, Julie Andrews declined making a cameo in “Mary Poppins Returns” (2018) for the very reasons that I’m glad Connery wasn’t asked. According to Ms. Andrews, the minute her face appeared on screen in the proposed cameo, the viewing public would likely say – “Ah… there is the real Mary Poppins!” – and the rest of the movie would just collapse of its’ own weight. And that wouldn’t be fair to the current set of actors. "This is Emily's (Emily Blunt) show, and I really want it to be Emily's show."
  • Posts: 1,879
    Wasn't there also talk of Connery being Bond's dad in one of the Brosnan era films as well?

    None of the former Bond actors should ever have a cameo in the series outside of the lead role. This isn't Dr. Who. Certain other characters, perhaps or call backs to Tracy or Vesper. Another rumor during the filming of TWINE I recall was all the former Bond girls were going to make an appearance at some party scene or something.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 7,999
    BT3366 wrote: »
    Wasn't there also talk of Connery being Bond's dad in one of the Brosnan era films as well?

    Yeah for DAD. Tamahori came up with the idea that during the interrogation General Moon holds up a photo of Connery telling Brosnan "you can return to your father if you tell us", a photo which was confiscated from Bond when captured. The real kicker is that it would reveal that Connery is not only Bond's father but was the very same man we saw in the 1960s Bond films, because Tamahori was pretty big on the code name theory. Obviously that was rejected by EON.
  • Posts: 12,242
    BT3366 wrote: »
    Wasn't there also talk of Connery being Bond's dad in one of the Brosnan era films as well?

    Yeah for DAD. Tamahori came up with the idea that during the interrogation General Moon holds up a photo of Connery telling Brosnan "you can return to your father if you tell us", a photo which was confiscated from Bond when captured. The real kicker is that it would reveal that Connery is not only Bond's father but was the very same man we saw in the 1960s Bond films, because Tamahori was pretty big on the code name theory. Obviously that was rejected by EON.

    Thank goodness that didn't happen.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Birdleson wrote: »
    I would have been greatly disturbed. Complete gimmick. I never want to see a Bond portray anyone but Bond in any Bond film.

    +1.
  • Posts: 2,887
    Many years ago I daydreamed about seeing a faithful adaption of You Only Live Twice where Sean Connery played Blofeld, partly for the unsettling frisson of seeing one Bond kill another, and with his bare hands no less. I thought that if Connery was ever going to return to the series, it would have to be as not merely a villain, but a superhumanly satanic one that Bond had a destiny and personal thirst to destroy.
  • OctopussyOctopussy Piz Gloria, Schilthorn, Switzerland.
    Posts: 1,081
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Birdleson wrote: »
    I would have been greatly disturbed. Complete gimmick. I never want to see a Bond portray anyone but Bond in any Bond film.

    +1.

    +2
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    edited March 2020 Posts: 4,904
    Revelator wrote: »
    Many years ago I daydreamed about seeing a faithful adaption of You Only Live Twice where Sean Connery played Blofeld, partly for the unsettling frisson of seeing one Bond kill another, and with his bare hands no less. I thought that if Connery was ever going to return to the series, it would have to be as not merely a villain, but a superhumanly satanic one that Bond had a destiny and personal thirst to destroy.

    Very interesting thought. I see most agree that it would be stunt casting of the highest order. I wouldn't have minded it but it would have been distracting. The trumped up little mod edit line would probably get even more of a laugh.

    OTT is Kincaid (as Connery) said "I see you kept the car (motioning to the DB5) I gave you." :)

    Which reminds me how is this DB5 even in this timeline of Bond?
  • Posts: 2,887
    thedove wrote: »
    Which reminds me how is this DB5 even in this timeline of Bond?

    Fanwanked into existence by Mendes? Smarter men than I have lost their minds trying to solve this puzzle.


  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited March 2020 Posts: 7,518
    Revelator wrote: »
    thedove wrote: »
    Which reminds me how is this DB5 even in this timeline of Bond?

    Fanwanked into existence by Mendes? Smarter men than I have lost their minds trying to solve this puzzle.


    Andrew James Bond retired from MI6 to Scotland, took the DB5 from Q Branch with him, married Monique Delacroix, had a baby boy (James Bond, named after himself), died in a climbing accident (or was it Operation Steel Cartridge?), James Bond was raised by Kincade and Oberhauser, grew up and joined the service, promoted to 00 by killing Carter and Dryden, swung by his dad's old car when he needed it in SF. ;)
  • RyanRyan Canada
    Posts: 692
    BT3366 wrote: »
    Wasn't there also talk of Connery being Bond's dad in one of the Brosnan era films as well?

    Yeah for DAD. Tamahori came up with the idea that during the interrogation General Moon holds up a photo of Connery telling Brosnan "you can return to your father if you tell us", a photo which was confiscated from Bond when captured. The real kicker is that it would reveal that Connery is not only Bond's father but was the very same man we saw in the 1960s Bond films, because Tamahori was pretty big on the code name theory. Obviously that was rejected by EON.

    Yeesh. Sounds like we got off easy with the CGI surfing.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    edited March 2020 Posts: 7,999
    The DB5 in SF is really not that much of a head scratcher. MI6 has been around well long before Craig's Bond was even born, and presumably there was a 00-agent or two that drove such an equipped vehicle back in the 1960s. This is confirmed in SP when Q mentions that he loaned the DB5 to Bond. Just another relic of Q branch.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 7,999
    Of course. They weren't sweating continuity, because there was nothing to sweat over.

    My fan theory about the DB5 he won in CR since we never see it again: Bond simply sold it off.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,518
    Birdleson wrote: »
    It’s not a head scratcher because it was never meant to make sense. That’s just fan speculation, the whole scene was there for nostalgia sake. EON weren’t thinking beyond audience recognition and response to the iconic car from GF. For the 50 year anniversary they weren’t sweating continuity at the expense of basking in the franchise’s history.

    This is of course true but the fan speculation is still fun.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 7,999
    Kind of like how the first five actors were the same Bond with the same general history. Brosnan Bond wasn't likely fighting Dr. No in 1962, but he probably was in 1982.

    I like to think after QOS that Craig had a ton of adventures comparable to DN-DAD, more or less.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 7,999
    The discussion of what Brosnan’s Casino Royale as his fifth film would have been like got me thinking: What if Cubby actually gave the green light to Michael G. Wilson’s original pitch of the Bond Begins concept in 1987? Not only would Dalton have unlikely gotten the part as he was at least 40+, but years later when eventually EON obtained the rights to CR they wouldn’t have likely rehashed the Bond Begins concept. Imagine the ripple effect.

    Is there much info regarding MGW’s original pitch? Was it still going to use the short story “The Living Daylights” as the basis but now with Bond on his first assignment? Would it be a period piece/prequel to the preceding films or serve as a reboot updated for the 1980s? What actor in 1987 would have perfectly embodied the more egotistical Bond that’s a diamond in the rough? Would M and Q have still been played by Robert Brown and Desmond Llewelyn much like how Dench still returned to the part? Would it have had a similar PTS to CR with Bond on his first two kills?


    All very interesting stuff to think over. I’m ultimately glad Cubby decided not to take the direction at that time and instead focus on Bond in his prime with Dalton. Still, would have been an interesting angle to take at the time, especially contrasting with the previous film featuring a 57 year Old Roger Moore.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 4,904
    I'm torn on this too @MakeshiftPython on one hand I think it would have been cool to see the tack that they would have taken given that they didn't have the rights to CR. I think they could use TLD for the new Bond. He doesn't kill the sniper and faces a reprimand by M. He rubs Saunders the wrong way with his brashness. The seeds are there.

    I do agree with Cubby that the audiences in 1987 wouldn't have wanted to see Bond become Bond. In fact as a rule I am not in favour of these "origin" stories that Hollywood seems to want to keep pushing out.
  • Posts: 15,785
    I think Pierce might have suited Mickey G's origin story Bond back in '87.
    I'm glad this never happened, though.
  • Posts: 725
    M: I never said danke.

    Bond: So you'll always have to.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 4,904
    M: I never said danke.

    Bond: So you'll always have to.

    I'm not sure I follow this comment @Benjamin_Weekly69 Nice avatar by the way.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,009
    M: I never said danke.

    Bond: So you'll always have to.

    *Hans Zimmer music kicks in*
  • edited March 2020 Posts: 2,887
    Is there much info regarding MGW’s original pitch? Was it still going to use the short story “The Living Daylights” as the basis but now with Bond on his first assignment?

    There's an extensive plot summary of the Bond origin script in Charles Helfenstein's book The Making of The Living Daylights, which is highly recommended. This script did not use any of Fleming's short story and was a completely different story. At the start it shows how Bond, an impulsive loose cannon, joined the secret service; then the story shifts to the far east to show Bond learning the ropes from a jaded older agent.

    The script, whose tone seems lighter than that of CR, definitely shows an Indiana Jones influence, and some of its ideas would later be considered but ultimately discarded in the early drafts of what became LTK. I think Cubby Broccoli made the right decision in rejecting the concept. The scenario of Bond's origins doesn't really add anything to the character or give the audience essential information. The script would have been useful for no more than introducing a young actor as Bond.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    I read somewhere that it was set in the early 70s.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 14,861
    Yeah the story itself is a pretty weird and rather unglamorous one, and Revelator is right in that it feels a bit more Romancing the Stone or Indy-styled (but without the fun) than Bond, and the Young Bond aspect doesn't feel like it lasts for very long. But maybe the synopsis doesn't do it justice. It also seems a bit weirdly paced, somehow.
    The first bit of the script where Bond is getting chucked out of places etc. seems the most interesting: they could have focused on him a bit more I think rather than the slightly strange Chinese plot. And if I remember there's an idea for a pre-title sequence/stunt which sounds pretty rubbish.

    I don't dislike the idea of doing a Bond Begins story, but this particular one didn't seem quite there.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 4,904
    Thanks for a great discussion! Special shout out to @MakeshiftPython for the idea and the following discussion. I learn something new about Bond every time we discuss.

    @Thunderfinger brings us our next discussion idea! (if you would like to suggest one please in box me and I will add it to a future discussion.)

    As we all know the original producers were an American and a Canadian. Cubby and Harry formed an unlikely alliance and get the series off the ground back in 1962. They knew the Bond from the books and saw some of the potential. However they didn't have the British sensibility. What if the original producers had been British? What difference would this had made to the series? What impact would this have had on the first films of the series?

    What say you Mi6?? What if the first producers of the series had been British instead of North American?
  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 2,482
    Perhaps the public might have taken to Dalton like they have Craig, if the gone down the route of an origin story with his Bond. Although I think they did the right think waiting till Daniel, because it's what makes Casino such a special film for me, I don't know if having Bond as rookie would elevate Daylights anymore. Dalton would have done a fantastic job of it no doubt. Plus not having the rights to Casino at that point would have been troublesome.

    Maybe Pierce would have made a good choice had they gone down that route of the origin story, with his baby face and given his age. Although I like Brosnan as Bond, I do doubt he would have had the acting jobs to pull off such a dark origin story at that point in his career
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