Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (30th June 2023)

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  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 15,423
    I just went to see the stars arrive at the premiere: I almost never do it (haven’t gone to see a Bond premiere since CR) but I thought I’ve got to see Harrison.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou. I can still hear my old hound dog barkin'.
    Posts: 8,788
    In preparation for seeing DOD, I just watched ROTLA again tonight. Not sure I'll do this with the other three.

    But for forty-plus years I've been wondering how Indy got into the U-boat (at around 1:38:07, or was it 1:37.08? - not sure right now), after everyone asking "Where is Indy?" you see Harrison Ford in a German navy uniform, obviously inside the U-boat. And only after that, you see him climbing up the sub on the outside toward the deck with everyone on the "pirate ship" cheering him on. But there is no way he could have got inside of the U-boat either way, nor got outside of it before it docked in the underground bunker.

    My main gripe with ROTLA for over forty years. Still possibly the greatest movie of its kind for all time.

  • Posts: 1,759
    From what I have seen from the Indy fans posting reviews, you have to lower your expectations and understand that this movie was never going to be on par with the original trilogy. Just go in expecting a later-day Ford on one last fun adventure - another episode with our favorite explorer. I think if we do that, we'll all have a good time.

    That's what I did and had a good time.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited June 2023 Posts: 15,423
    j_w_pepper wrote: »
    In preparation for seeing DOD, I just watched ROTLA again tonight. Not sure I'll do this with the other three.

    But for forty-plus years I've been wondering how Indy got into the U-boat (at around 1:38:07, or was it 1:37.08? - not sure right now), after everyone asking "Where is Indy?" you see Harrison Ford in a German navy uniform, obviously inside the U-boat. And only after that, you see him climbing up the sub on the outside toward the deck with everyone on the "pirate ship" cheering him on. But there is no way he could have got inside of the U-boat either way, nor got outside of it before it docked in the underground bunker.

    My main gripe with ROTLA for over forty years. Still possibly the greatest movie of its kind for all time.

    No, he never goes inside the U Boat. I think I have heard some folks say there's someone who looks a bit like him, but it's not Indy. Indy just rides on the top of the boat; famously he was supposed to use his whip to lash himself to the periscope, which they did film and you can catch a quick glimpse of him there during the montage as we see it sailing, but I think maybe they just edited it so that it didn't submerge. U Boats at that time spent most of their time on the surface I think.

    My main gripe with it, and to my mind its only flaw, is that we're never prepared for Indy having the knowledge not to look in the Ark. I just feel like that needed a mention somewhere earlier. It is actually in the Bible, but I think it needed repeating in the film.
  • BennyBenny In the shadowsAdministrator, Moderator
    Posts: 14,924
    mtm wrote: »
    I just went to see the stars arrive at the premiere: I almost never do it (haven’t gone to see a Bond premiere since CR) but I thought I’ve got to see Harrison.

    You didn't get any photo's while you were there?
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 5,092
    What's with all the long run times in modern movies? Do the studios think longer will get more people to come out because it's an "epic"? Used to be the studios wanted leaner run times to get more screenings in the theatres. Theatre owners liked that too as it meant larger crowds.

    Raiders 115 minutes
    Doom 118 minutes
    Crusade 127 minutes
    Skull 122 minutes
    Destiny 142 minutes according to some!

    The Flash was longer than it needed to be, in my opinion. Craig's movies were a similar tale with CR starting at 144 minutes, then 106 minutes QOS, SF 143 minutes, SP 148 minutes and then NTTD at a whopping 163 minutes. I miss the 2 hour movie it seems to be a relic, will we ever get back to shorter run times?

  • Posts: 3,169
    thedove wrote: »
    will we ever get back to shorter run times?
    Avatar II (192 min) and John Wick 4 (169 min) disapproves of this message :-)
    Likewise, will we ever get back to a box office top 10, that isn't just sequels and remakes?

  • HildebrandRarityHildebrandRarity Centre international d'assistance aux personnes déplacées, Paris, France
    Posts: 468
    It's released tomorrow in France, and that's when I plan to see it. I don't expect much after talking to the friend I've mentioned or reading other reports, but Raiders of the Lost Ark was one of the first films that I saw in a theater (outside of Disney), when I was 7, and I'm glad to go for one last ride.
    So, here's hoping that there will be more films filled with epic adventures and great characters, even if they're not named Indiana Jones.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou. I can still hear my old hound dog barkin'.
    Posts: 8,788
    mtm wrote: »
    I think I have heard some folks say there's someone who looks a bit like him, but it's not Indy. Indy just rides on the top of the boat; famously he was supposed to use his whip to lash himself to the periscope, which they did film and you can catch a quick glimpse of him there during the montage as we see it sailing, but I think maybe they just edited it so that it didn't submerge. U Boats at that time spent most of their time on the surface I think.
    I'll try and send a screencap, and I'm pretty sure it's Harrison Ford in that scene I mentioned before he climbs up the hull on the outside (in fact, I've been pretty sure each of the 15 or so times I watched that film). Your observation that U-boats spent most of their time on the surface is correct, and they might have solved that issue by not editing the scene you mention (lashing himself to the periscope). But nevertheless the captain in the movie expressly gives the order to dive ("Tauchen!") when it all happens. So either way, I think someone messed up here.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited June 2023 Posts: 15,423
    Oh yes you're quite right, he does say dive and there's flashing lights and klaxons and everything, I'd forgotten that. But Ford's not inside the boat- you don't mean the Captain himself do you? In the leather coat who climbs down the ladder. He looks a bit like Ford, but he's the same guy who gives the order to dive.
  • For those in the UK, there is an hour long Sky Arts programme at 8pm tonight about Harrison Ford's career. Channel 147 on my telly, not sure about other channel options
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 15,423
    That's great, thank you.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,071
    I’ll be seeing this Friday evening.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,677
    Looking like a possible $140 million worldwide opening for this one:

    https://deadline.com/2023/06/indiana-jones-and-the-dial-of-destiny-box-office-projection-2-1235425453/
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 15,423
    A nice legacy trailer they've added.

  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou. I can still hear my old hound dog barkin'.
    edited June 2023 Posts: 8,788
    mtm wrote: »
    Oh yes you're quite right, he does say dive and there's flashing lights and klaxons and everything, I'd forgotten that. But Ford's not inside the boat- you don't mean the Captain himself do you? In the leather coat who climbs down the ladder. He looks a bit like Ford, but he's the same guy who gives the order to dive.
    Rather than bother with that particular scene of ROTLA we talked about, I rather opted to watch TLC tonight. I left out TOD since it is actually a prequel of ROTLA, and I don't know if I'll make all four Indy movies before Friday. But I once more thoroughly enjoyed TLC in its entirety, accepting the pseudo-religious bullshit just as much as I did with ROTLA. As long as you don't believe any of it, you're thoroughly entertained.

    I'm still thinking about posting that screencap of ROTLA and someone telling me that it isn't Ford inside the U-boat, but I must pass for tonight.

  • goldenswissroyalegoldenswissroyale Switzerland
    Posts: 4,410
    @j_w_pepper
    You mean the guy at 2.58 in this clip? He looks a bit like Ford, but I paused it and checked without any lights in the room to have a good contrast...and I'm sure that it isn't Ford. This guy looks younger and different.

    https://youtube.com/watch?v=tzX2IEEZ8-E&t=179s
  • Posts: 8
    Anyone have a copy of ON THE RED CARPET DIAL OF DESTINY program that was shown on ABC NY or LA? I have Bond video stuff to trade or could pay for a copy. Thanks
  • Posts: 1,458
    Well, I loved Indy 5. Harrison Ford gives such a beautiful performance. It's miles better than Crystal Skull, and I preferred the story to Temple of Doom, although the staging of the action, while certainly good, does lack that Spielberg clarity, imagination and magic touch. Mangold and the writers do work hard to recapture the spirit and heart of the original trilogy. The end I found very emotional. I'm not sure I get the negative reviews, but there you go.
  • goldenswissroyalegoldenswissroyale Switzerland
    Posts: 4,410
    @ColonelSun Great to read that you liked it that much. I hope I will feel the same.
  • edited June 2023 Posts: 3,169
    Oh man.... Just when I thought I was getting too old for action movies (maybe because most action blockbusters nowadays defy gravity and are largely shot in front of a green screen), I suddenly feel all young again after having watched DOD. It reminded me why I fell in love with actionmovies in the first place, with its real stunts in real locations.

    You keep hearing stuff like "lower your expectations" but I actually prefer this over the moody and dark TOD. It's fun and fastpaced, like TLC. A great swan song.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou. I can still hear my old hound dog barkin'.
    Posts: 8,788
    Zekidk wrote: »
    Oh man.... Just when I thought I was getting too old for action movies (maybe because most action blockbusters nowadays defy gravity and are largely shot in front of a green screen), I suddenly feel all young again after having watched DOD. It reminded me why I fell in love with actionmovies in the first place, with its real stunts in real locations.

    You keep hearing stuff like "lower your expectations" but I actually prefer this over the moody and dark TOD. It's fun and fastpaced, like TLC. A great swan song.

    Good to read this, along with @ColonelSun's impression. I'm really looking forward to seeing it on Friday afternoon.
  • edited June 2023 Posts: 6,682
    j_w_pepper wrote: »
    Zekidk wrote: »
    Oh man.... Just when I thought I was getting too old for action movies (maybe because most action blockbusters nowadays defy gravity and are largely shot in front of a green screen), I suddenly feel all young again after having watched DOD. It reminded me why I fell in love with actionmovies in the first place, with its real stunts in real locations.

    You keep hearing stuff like "lower your expectations" but I actually prefer this over the moody and dark TOD. It's fun and fastpaced, like TLC. A great swan song.

    Good to read this, along with @ColonelSun's impression. I'm really looking forward to seeing it on Friday afternoon.

    Yes, must say I'm also feeling more positive about it now. @Zekidk and @ColonelSun are reputable and trustworthy people ;), so I'll take their word for it.
  • Haven't been around lately and missed the last dozen pages but I got my tickets! Really stoked for this film. I'm happy to hear the positive reactions, and glad there are mixed ones too so I can at least temper my expectations.
  • Posts: 12,316
    Awesome to see several members here really liked it. I am running through all the films again with just KOTCS left. Those first 3 are all so magnificent in my eyes, contender for my all time favorite trilogy.
  • Posts: 5
    I saw Dial of Destiny this morning and happy to report I quite liked it. In contrast to a lot of critic reviews I actually thought the first 20 minutes were quite disastrous, a lot of rubbery CGI and fake looking action sequences, but the film stabilised itself when it moved forward to 1969 and I found it mostly enjoyable and satisfying as an adventure film from that point on. Not necessarily as an ACTION adventure (no action film with a 79 year old lead was going to be that octane) but it had the necessary beats you'd expect from an Indiana Jones film and delivered them a lot more smoothly than Crystal Skull did. Even though the fourth entry had a stronger first half hour, overall Dial of Destiny is a better and more satisfying film.

    I found the last five minutes quite awkwardly managed (I wasn't sure whether re shoots were involved or not) which left me in a less good mood than I may have had been if it had stuck the landing, but the preceding hour and fifty minutes were decent, bordering on pretty good.

    Would give a solid but not crazed recommendation to general audiences.

  • For those comments earlier querying the U boat scene in Raiders, Indy did attach himself to the boat with whip as u-boats didn't generally submerge all that often due to diesel fumes inside etc. There are pictures of deleted scene online and in excellent Making of trilogy Book by a guy called Rinzler a few years back.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou. I can still hear my old hound dog barkin'.
    Posts: 8,788
    In preparation of DOD, I now watched KOTCS again. Loved it once more. I'm rather certain that if KOTCS had been the first Indiana Jones movie, everyone would be raving about it like they do about ROTL. And yet...I think it still is only my No. 4 so far among the four. Still it's (for me) quite a good movie for sheer enjoyment, and nothing to complain about. The actors are priceless, whatever their function (including the much-hated Ray Winstone role). Everything is spot-on, maybe except some of the CGI.

    Anyway, I still find it fantastic how they transferred the Indiana Jones story from the late 1930s to 1957. I love even the scenes with Shia LaBeouf (although he has an obviously misspelled name) pretending to be Marlon Brando. It's really a worthy part of the IJ franchise, whatever people may say about it.

    I'm really looking forward to see DOD on Friday afternoon, and I'm very confident that I won't be disappointed.
  • HildebrandRarityHildebrandRarity Centre international d'assistance aux personnes déplacées, Paris, France
    edited June 2023 Posts: 468
    It's fine, a little better than what I expected. It's not in the league of the original three but it's some old-school adventure. As Colonel Sun said, it lacked the clarity of Spielberg's direction (which belongs to a museum), but even Spielberg these days wouldn't be in a capacity to deliver it.

    The weak points are Helena's motivations, which basically change every time the action requires them to do, the dialog, which is a little on the nose and doesn't have many memorable lines outside of the callbacks, and the climax which should be majestic but rings a little hollow. And of course, in a tribute to modern-day filmmaking, it's overstuffed, with a couple of sequences that could have been cut short or too many henchmen (Billy Magnussen may have a blast with the script, but his character is basically the same as in No Time to Die).

    But Ford is engaging, especially every time he accepts to show his age or talks about the past, PWB does the best of what she was given, the teen sidekick is good (even if he's partly a rehash of Half Moon), the big action set pieces are varied, and 1969 New York is enough of a thing of the past to fit within the whole nostalgic charm of the franchise. And of course, it has John Williams' final score, and it's always a blast to hear these big themes gain life on the screen.

    And, naturally, none of the big claims by the YouTubers has any validity. Nothing suggests that Helena Shaw could be Indy's spiritual heiress in more films, and the "multiverse" thing was an obvious fabrication. It's just one more Indy adventure, with an aging Harrison Ford, which plays it a little too safe for the most part but still delivers.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 15,423
    Ford is great, PWB is great, the film hits a real high point when they get to Tangier; it’s really fun. There is too much capture/escape through the middle, and I could have done with more gags. But it has tension and danger and fairly shocking violence where Crystal Skull went for cartoonishness, and it has a great deal of heart, especially towards the climax. It’s a worthy Indy movie, well worth a watch.
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