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Will EON Blow it?

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  • AlexanderWaverlyAlexanderWaverly
    Posts: 2,115
    Shardlake wrote:
    EON can only hope to emulate the quality & consistency that Nolan has with the Bat Trilogy so far, seriously Burton's Batman films look ridiculous next to Nolan's as for Schumacher's the less said the better.

    Nolan has emulated the blockbuster to heights not seen before whether you don't like dark serious films or not you can't deny he hasn't, we hardly got thoughtful Hollywood films he changed that with Batman and Inception.

    If Skyfall echoes Nolan's films than I'm happy, they have a quality rarely seen in Hollywood these days.

    Please stop denying QOS was not influenced by Bourne, it's silly just admit it and deal with it, I like the film but QOS suffered by trying to emulate these films, they even used the same second unit director, CR had it's own feel and I hope SF strikes out with a similar tone but Solace was trying to be Bourne, so many saw it, it's just sore Bond fans who can't admit it, try and talk themselves into thinking it isn't so but I'm afraid it is.

    As for Skyfall I believe we'll get the film we hoped QOS would be and 2012 Bond will own Bourne.

    Note the Bourne references in this 2005 New York Times article:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/15/movies/MoviesFeatures/15bond.html
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,692
    AlexanderWaverly wrote:
    Note the Bourne references in this 2005 New York Times article:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/15/movies/MoviesFeatures/15bond.html

    "For both Ms. Broccoli and Sony, executives said, the model was Jason Bourne, the character Matt Damon successfully incarnated in two gritty spy movies for Universal Pictures, "The Bourne Identity" and "The Bourne Supremacy.""
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    Posts: 12,837
    Will EON blow it?

    After QOS was a let down, and considering all the hype for this one, I'm sort of worried about it too. Still, I like most of what I've seen so far, the only things I don't like the sound of is M being used more again and Q being younger.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    DaltonCraig007 wrote:
    AlexanderWaverly wrote:
    Note the Bourne references in this 2005 New York Times article:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/15/movies/MoviesFeatures/15bond.html

    "For both Ms. Broccoli and Sony, executives said, the model was Jason Bourne, the character Matt Damon successfully incarnated in two gritty spy movies for Universal Pictures, "The Bourne Identity" and "The Bourne Supremacy.""

    If that's true they failed immensely. The characters are complete opposites.
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    edited June 2012 Posts: 12,837
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote:
    DaltonCraig007 wrote:
    AlexanderWaverly wrote:
    Note the Bourne references in this 2005 New York Times article:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/15/movies/MoviesFeatures/15bond.html

    "For both Ms. Broccoli and Sony, executives said, the model was Jason Bourne, the character Matt Damon successfully incarnated in two gritty spy movies for Universal Pictures, "The Bourne Identity" and "The Bourne Supremacy.""

    If that's true they failed immensely. The characters are complete opposites.

    Exactly. CR is nothing like Bourne and the only thing Bourne influenced in QOS is the shaky cam and the editing for the action scenes. The characters are very, very different.

    CR/QOS Bond is a rookie who is tough but makes mistakes and is still learning to be classic Bond. Bourne is an expert assassin, far from a rookie.
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    I think Royale was Bond, QOS was a Bond film with the Bourne style and it didn't suit it, we had a great PTS and the opera sequence was Forster's finest moment but it was all too fast at times and lacked the elegance of CR.

    I would never agree the character was Bourne like Craig presented Bond more like IF's character than Moore or Brozzer could ever but QOS looked like a Bourne films too often, it didn't suit it and sequences like the roof top chase & the boat chase were shot far too fast and just disorientated more than entertain, look EON knew they'd made a mistake and so did Craig, it's just some Bond fans want to ignore this as they feel acknowledging their love has been influenced by the new kid on the block is too much.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,046
    Nolan isn't very good at directing action sequences anyway, not yet at least. But if the trailers for The Dark Knight Rises are anything to go by, then it looks like he's improving. His strength was always in the non-action material.
  • JWESTBROOKJWESTBROOK
    Posts: 5,745
    CraigMooreOHMSS wrote:
    Nolan isn't very good at directing action sequences anyway, not yet at least. But if the trailers for The Dark Knight Rises are anything to go by, then it looks like he's improving. His strength was always in the non-action material.

    Haha wrong thread bud :)
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    edited June 2012 Posts: 8,046
    JWESTBROOK wrote:
    CraigMooreOHMSS wrote:
    Nolan isn't very good at directing action sequences anyway, not yet at least. But if the trailers for The Dark Knight Rises are anything to go by, then it looks like he's improving. His strength was always in the non-action material.

    Haha wrong thread bud :)

    Wow, what the hell happened there? :/ Point still stands anyway haha. Apologies!
  • The_ReaperThe_Reaper
    Posts: 1,092
    Here's the General Consensus for QoS on Rottentomatoes, where it is currently rated "fresh" at 65% positive reviews:

    Brutal and breathless, Quantum Of Solace delivers tender emotions along with frenetic action. Not as good as franchise reboot Casino Royale, but still an impressive entry to the Bond canon.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    Yes, EON blew it during the Brosnan era. Since then they have done a reasonable job of not blowing it. I really hope Mendes has done a good job on SF but I am not letting my expectations go too high. If it is as good as QoS I will be satisfied. I am quietly confident that it will be better.
  • The_ReaperThe_Reaper
    Posts: 1,092
    I'd say QoS suffers more from high expectations than anything else. CR was so good, so well recieved people though QoS was gonna be another world beater and it wasn't. I think it's awesome and I love that it's different from most other Bond films. Think of it as a coda to CR and a companion to the vibe and feel of LTK, in that it is a revenge flick. We need variety in the series to keep it fresh.

    QoS ain't perfect. I don't like the editing either but it is hardly a poor film. It made tons of cash, is critically lauded and has been a solid entry in the series. They won't blow it with SF. I feel like it will be a good balance, a well rounded fun film.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    The_Reaper wrote:
    I'd say QoS suffers more from high expectations than anything else. CR was so good, so well recieved people though QoS was gonna be another world beater and it wasn't. I think it's awesome and I love that it's different from most other Bond films. Think of it as a coda to CR and a companion to the vibe and feel of LTK, in that it is a revenge flick. We need variety in the series to keep it fresh.

    QoS ain't perfect. I don't like the editing either but it is hardly a poor film. It made tons of cash, is critically lauded and has been a solid entry in the series. They won't blow it with SF. I feel like it will be a good balance, a well rounded fun film.

    Well said. People make absurd criticisms of QoS around here. If nothing else, it is a huge improvement on all those awful Brosnan films. For that, at least, we should be grateful. I no longer worry that EON will completely blow it. With DC as Bond and Mendes directing that would be pretty difficult.

  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,692
    Getafix wrote:
    Well said. People make absurd criticisms of QoS around here. If nothing else, it is a huge improvement on all those awful Brosnan films

    That's just, like, your opinion, man.
  • identigraphidentigraph
    Posts: 1,052
    I personally am not impressed by QOS but maybe it will grow on me over time, who knows.
    I know a lot of casual Bond fans who were so dissapointed by QOS and definitley thought it was the worst one of the lot, I know one guy who took the DVD back to the shop because it thought it was so bad, so maybe the expectations for Skyfall aren't that high in the general public anyway?

    But one persons rubbish is another's treasure, I like TMWTGG and LTK and other fans think these are complete Sh**e, so nothing is definitive!
  • JBFan626JBFan626
    Posts: 1,497
    Check out this (rather negative) essay regarding the trailer and poster. I don't necessarily agree with it, but the author does raise some points about the potential for EON to actually blow it:

    <url>http://n007.thegoldeneye.com/film_commentary/skyfall_teaser_campaign.html</url>;

    If you haven't visited this site, the author provides a collection of very detailed analyses of the Fleming novels. Makes for an interesting read.

    This is the concluding paragraph:

    "Thus the 007 film series, six years since its reboot in 2006. Status: it's muddled in its own uneasiness with itself. Moreover, since the founding of the Craig dynasty, the series has actually worsened, drifting in slow decline—creatively, existentially, and even in stature, as it becomes increasingly eclipsed by blockbusters such as the Bourne series, Christopher Nolan's very Bondian Batman franchise, and the very Bondian Mission: Impossible – Ghost Protocol. That the Skyfall teaser poster and trailer give few clues to signal a new James bond film tell us a lot about the sensibilities of the filmmakers, but also express the quiet implosion of the series as it dissociates itself from its own legacy."
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    JBFan626 wrote:
    Check out this (rather negative) essay regarding the trailer and poster. I don't necessarily agree with it, but the author does raise some points about the potential for EON to actually blow it:

    <url>http://n007.thegoldeneye.com/film_commentary/skyfall_teaser_campaign.html</url>;

    If you haven't visited this site, the author provides a collection of very detailed analyses of the Fleming novels. Makes for an interesting read.

    This is the concluding paragraph:

    "Thus the 007 film series, six years since its reboot in 2006. Status: it's muddled in its own uneasiness with itself. Moreover, since the founding of the Craig dynasty, the series has actually worsened, drifting in slow decline—creatively, existentially, and even in stature, as it becomes increasingly eclipsed by blockbusters such as the Bourne series, Christopher Nolan's very Bondian Batman franchise, and the very Bondian Mission: Impossible – Ghost Protocol. That the Skyfall teaser poster and trailer give few clues to signal a new James bond film tell us a lot about the sensibilities of the filmmakers, but also express the quiet implosion of the series as it dissociates itself from its own legacy."

    Harsh but I see where theyre coming fom.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 5,994
    Meh. The author clearly is upset with the Craig casting and is looking for a way to tear down the film, sight unseen.

    What he doesn't seem to grasp is that Eon/Mendes are deliberately keeping a lot of the film under wraps in the tweets and trailer. The marketing strategy has changed for a spoiler-crazy era.

    And then there's this howler:

    "Oddly, though he's a relatively young actor, Craig is essentially too old to play the British agent with any credibility."

    Elsewhere on the site, he proclaims FYEO as one of the best three Bond films.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited June 2012 Posts: 15,692
    that article was quite harsh..... I don't agree with it.
  • JWESTBROOKJWESTBROOK
    Posts: 5,745
    DaltonCraig007 wrote:
    that article was quite harsh..... I don't agree with it.

    Same here. If your going to attempt to convince me, you're going to have to go in depth. Just saying 'its bad because there is something better and it's trying something new' sounds immature and very unprofessional.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    I agree that there is a problem with the producers not really being sure what Bond is about any more. Is he the old queen and country imperialist of the past, or a doubt-ridden Guardian-reading Bourne type character? As a Guardian reader I'd actually prefer it if Bond was a little more sure of himself and what he's doing.
  • JBFan626JBFan626
    Posts: 1,497
    Also, what do you guys think of the critique that both the poster and the trailer really don't show or tell us anything about the film? Is this a bad sign?
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,692
    JBFan626 wrote:
    Also, what do you guys think of the critique that both the poster and the trailer really don't show or tell us anything about the film? Is this a bad sign?

    The teaser poster and teaser trailer for CR really didn't tell much about the film other than 'Bond is back !'... which is the same case here. Let's wait for the theatrical poster/trailer to learn more about the film.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    DaltonCraig007 wrote:
    JBFan626 wrote:
    Also, what do you guys think of the critique that both the poster and the trailer really don't show or tell us anything about the film? Is this a bad sign?

    The teaser poster and teaser trailer for CR really didn't tell much about the film other than 'Bond is back !'... which is the same case here. Let's wait for the theatrical poster/trailer to learn more about the film.

    I was underwhelmed by the teaser but am not worrying too much about it. Could be a bad sign or could mean nothing.
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    The Teaser for once was just that, too many trailers give away to much the teaser for Skyfall did it's job, it intrigues and tantalises us and that is what it's supposed to do. Seriously CR is much better than any of the MI films and the equal of any of The Bourne's. Nolan has set the bench mark but I think people are going to get a pleasant surprise with Bond 23, QOS was a stumble and too Bourne like, SF will be classic Bond with a contemporary spin and make it's mark in 2012.
  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 7,653
    JBFan626 wrote:
    Check out this (rather negative) essay regarding the trailer and poster. I don't necessarily agree with it, but the author does raise some points about the potential for EON to actually blow it:

    <url>http://n007.thegoldeneye.com/film_commentary/skyfall_teaser_campaign.html</url>;

    If you haven't visited this site, the author provides a collection of very detailed analyses of the Fleming novels. Makes for an interesting read.

    This is the concluding paragraph:

    "Thus the 007 film series, six years since its reboot in 2006. Status: it's muddled in its own uneasiness with itself. Moreover, since the founding of the Craig dynasty, the series has actually worsened, drifting in slow decline—creatively, existentially, and even in stature, as it becomes increasingly eclipsed by blockbusters such as the Bourne series, Christopher Nolan's very Bondian Batman franchise, and the very Bondian Mission: Impossible – Ghost Protocol. That the Skyfall teaser poster and trailer give few clues to signal a new James bond film tell us a lot about the sensibilities of the filmmakers, but also express the quiet implosion of the series as it dissociates itself from its own legacy."

    Thank you for this "other opinion" which is harsh and thus will not be very popular with the folks that are convinced that this next vehicle is oscar worthy and a big hit. After QoB I have my reservations.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 5,994
    JBFan626 wrote:
    Also, what do you guys think of the critique that both the poster and the trailer really don't show or tell us anything about the film? Is this a bad sign?

    I feel like the critique is missing the point. From the press conference onward, they've been trying to keep an air of mystery about SF--not mentioning the characters' names at first, the oblique Twitter shots. Not telling us much about the film is completely intentional. It's kind of cool.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    JBFan626 wrote:
    Also, what do you guys think of the critique that both the poster and the trailer really don't show or tell us anything about the film? Is this a bad sign?
    That's a great sign. I want to be surprised.
  • thelordflasheartthelordflasheart
    Posts: 1,370
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote:
    JBFan626 wrote:
    Also, what do you guys think of the critique that both the poster and the trailer really don't show or tell us anything about the film? Is this a bad sign?
    That's a great sign. I want to be surprised.

    Agreed - it's great to not have spoilers and as @echo said it's very obviously (well, maybe to everyone but the author at TheGoldenEye) intentional.

    "Moreover, since the founding of the Craig dynasty, the series has actually worsened, drifting in slow decline—creatively, existentially, and even in stature..."

    Huh? They really lost me at this point. Many people (including me) think that the series is at a creative high and that its "stature" is quite good. Existentially? What do they even mean by that?

    The fact that they say "the Craig dynasty" (WTF?) makes me think that they're unhappy with the casting of a certain actor...
  • FromCanadaWithLoveFromCanadaWithLove Canada
    Posts: 612
    It's kind of silly to look at movie's with a scoreboard. SkyFall has potential. It's all in the director, I think.
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