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Would Goldeneye have been a success with Dalton?

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  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    Ah - the stuff that dreams are made of. What a happy thought.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    bondjames wrote: »
    it would have been interesting to see Bond age in the role and with the times.

  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    edited July 2015 Posts: 7,314
    They almost had to recast Bond after the six year gap. Giving the public what they wanted (Brosnan) at that point was practically a no brainer. Dalton's true make it or break it moment would have been in '91 or '92 with his scrapped third film. Personally, I believe it could have been a success if it was done right. I realize that's a big if though. Just look at the success of TSWLM after the relatively disappointing box office showing of TMWTGG.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,698
    pachazo wrote: »
    Dalton's true make it or break it moment would have been in '91 or '92 with his scrapped third film. Personally, I believe it could have been a success if it was done right.
    IMO it would have cemented him as Bond and made Brosnan's Bond more gritty when he took it on... it would have been a win all around.
  • Gustav_GravesGustav_Graves
    Posts: 11,119
    Birdleson wrote: »
    I think Dalton already/still had the stigma attached to him, deserved or not, as the unpopular Bond. The film would have grossed much less had he stayed on.

    In a weird kind of way, I think both George Lazenby and Timothy Dalton made stupid choices. Timothy Dalton got the support of "Cubby" until the very end. He could have played Bond a 3rd time. And even proving the people that he could do a huge success after the disappointing box office earnings of "Licence To Kill". He had the opportunity to prove the critics wrong!

  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    Posts: 4,116
    To answer the thread question.... undeniably no. LTK was such a huge action packed and well acted ...lol sorry can't keep a straight face. LTK was a load of crap. Bond barely survived much less Dalton.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    ThAts what people used to say about OHMSS as well...
  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 7,653
    Getafix wrote: »
    ThAts what people used to say about OHMSS as well...

    They were wrong about OHMSS and right about LTK.
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 14,871
    LTK's value is a moot point. GE was a success partially because a new Bond was cast. Say what you want about Brosnan (and I was never shy of criticizing him), but he did contribute to GE's success in a way Dalton could not.
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    edited July 2015 Posts: 11,189
    Getafix wrote: »
    ThAts what people used to say about OHMSS as well...

    LTK certainly doesn't deserve to be put in the same category as OHMSS. It's got it's moments but also suffers from poor acting at times (even from Dalton occasionally) and an overall small screen feel.

    It never will be put in the same league as that film either.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    Ludovico wrote: »
    LTK's value is a moot point. GE was a success partially because a new Bond was cast. Say what you want about Brosnan (and I was never shy of criticizing him), but he did contribute to GE's success in a way Dalton could not.

    Case unproven. Look at how EON and Moore turned things around after the relative failure of TMWTGG. Dalton himself said he wanted his third to be more lighthearted.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited July 2015 Posts: 15,696
    Dalton seems to be the forgotten Bond in the eyes of the general audience. Atleast from experience I had, people can easily name Connery, Moore, Brosnan and Craig, and even if they can't remember Lazenby's name, nearly everyone knows about 'the guy who made just one film'. Dalton, however, is as if he never existed. Unless an somewhat hardcore fan mentions Dalton, IMO he'll never be talked about by the general public.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Getafix wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    LTK's value is a moot point. GE was a success partially because a new Bond was cast. Say what you want about Brosnan (and I was never shy of criticizing him), but he did contribute to GE's success in a way Dalton could not.

    Case unproven. Look at how EON and Moore turned things around after the relative failure of TMWTGG. Dalton himself said he wanted his third to be more lighthearted.

    This is true, but Dalton is no Moore. Moore was a very likeable actor, and TSWLM came at a different time, when Cubby had more control and budget. Post-LTK was a very difficult time for EON/Cubby, with studio messing about etc. Moreover, the MGM heads were against Dalton from the start, so even though he may have been able to pull off a smash with his 3rd (and he was certainly deserving of a 3rd shot), its success was by no means guaranteed with all the negativity from MGM brass, and from the US public who were really not sold on him.
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    edited July 2015 Posts: 11,189
    @Getafix. Bear in mind that Moore was liked already on both sides of the Atlantic. Connery already had two strong films to his name by GF, which was the icing on the cake.

    From what I've heard Dalton was reasonably well received in the UK but largely failed to win over the US.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,696
    IMO I believe Dalton's third would have been a hit had it been made in 1991. A third installment in 1995, 6 years after the previous outing, would be a lot more uncertain.
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    edited July 2015 Posts: 11,189
    I'm sure it would have been decent enough. A classic? I don't know. TLD and LTK each have their weaknesses and, personally, I wouldn't regard either as classics.

    I do find GE more entertaining than either of them but then again GE has been my most watched Bond film in the 20 years I've been a Bond fan.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    the robots story sounded very dodgy. I would have loved to see Dalton go to Japan. I am thinking Black Rain but as a Bomd movie. Ridley Scott directing.
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    edited July 2015 Posts: 11,189
    @Getafix's idea of a Ridley Scott directed Bond film:

    -Brosnan starts off as Bond, sits down to have a meal, suffers stomach pains and (after a lot of pain-faces) dies when Dalton bursts out of his chest.

    Dalton takes over

    :))
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    @Getafix's idea of a Ridley Scott directed Bond film:

    -Brosnan starts off as Bond, sits down to have a meal, suffers stomach pains and (after a lot of pain-faces) dies when Dalton bursts out of his chest.

    Dalton takes over

    :))

    Brosnan's response to this idea/suggestion:
    The-World-Is-Not-Enough-angry-James-Bond-Pierce-Brosnan.png
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    @Getafix's idea of a Ridley Scott directed Bond film:

    -Brosnan starts off as Bond, sits down to have a meal, suffers stomach pains and (after a lot of pain-faces) dies when Dalton bursts out of his chest.

    Dalton takes over

    :))

    Genius idea.
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 14,871
    Getafix wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    LTK's value is a moot point. GE was a success partially because a new Bond was cast. Say what you want about Brosnan (and I was never shy of criticizing him), but he did contribute to GE's success in a way Dalton could not.

    Case unproven. Look at how EON and Moore turned things around after the relative failure of TMWTGG. Dalton himself said he wanted his third to be more lighthearted.

    Moore was far more accepted in the role from the beginning than Dalton was. He had also a fanbase before Bond that cannot be compared to any other Bond. He had no apparent rival either.
  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    Posts: 7,314
    All of you make valid points. I wasn't suggesting that a third Dalton film would have been as popular as TSWLM. I do think that, with the right strategy, it could have been successful in the U.S. though. As long as they learned from the mistakes of LTK. Don't release your movie in a crowded summer market with little advertising etc.. Bond needed a makeover but I think it was more important to replace Glen at that point then it was Dalton. I do enjoy the Glen entries (mostly) but it was clear that Bond needed to upgrade to a more modern look for the 90's. So, if you had the right director, script, actors and a sleeker look it might have worked wonders for Dalton's image. Maybe.
  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    Posts: 4,116
    pachazo wrote: »
    All of you make valid points. I wasn't suggesting that a third Dalton film would have been as popular as TSWLM. I do think that, with the right strategy, it could have been successful in the U.S. though. As long as they learned from the mistakes of LTK. Don't release your movie in a crowded summer market with little advertising etc.. Bond needed a makeover but I think it was more important to replace Glen at that point then it was Dalton. I do enjoy the Glen entries (mostly) but it was clear that Bond needed to upgrade to a more modern look for the 90's. So, if you had the right director, script, actors and a sleeker look it might have worked wonders for Dalton's image. Maybe.
    pachazo wrote: »
    All of you make valid points. I wasn't suggesting that a third Dalton film would have been as popular as TSWLM. I do think that, with the right strategy, it could have been successful in the U.S. though. As long as they learned from the mistakes of LTK. Don't release your movie in a crowded summer market with little advertising etc.. Bond needed a makeover but I think it was more important to replace Glen at that point then it was Dalton. I do enjoy the Glen entries (mostly) but it was clear that Bond needed to upgrade to a more modern look for the 90's. So, if you had the right director, script, actors and a sleeker look it might have worked wonders for Dalton's image. Maybe.

    Agreed. Despite my disdain for LTK.. Dalton deserved better and better direction I do truly appreciate what Dalton wanted to accomplish with his interpretation.
  • ThomasCrown76ThomasCrown76 Augusta, ks
    Posts: 757
    Aside from fanboys jerking off to Lazenby, most people still don't give a shit about him. Dalton at least was an actor
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,335
    Birdleson wrote: »
    When I jerk-off to Lazenby it's always in the kilt. I don't care what he's wearing.
    Hahaha It's TRUE! :))

    sorry...couldn't help it.

  • ThomasCrown76ThomasCrown76 Augusta, ks
    Posts: 757
    You got some on your chin. Mayo ?
  • GetafixGetafix
    edited July 2015 Posts: 11,425
    A slight stiffness coming on @Birdleson?
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Getafix wrote: »
    Nah, it's the worst. I'd take Newman's drone over Serra's sonic vomit.

    Serra is awful, just awful. The ending song The Experience of Love is the worst entry in the series. So unbondian.

  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 17,890
    Like all of these sort of "what if?" questions, we'll never know the answer. All is speculation...
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    Posts: 11,189
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    Nah, it's the worst. I'd take Newman's drone over Serra's sonic vomit.

    Serra is awful, just awful. The ending song The Experience of Love is the worst entry in the series. So unbondian.

    I don't mind the Serra score in the film, but I agree that EOL doesn't fit at all. It's ok up until Serra starts singing then...aaaahhh.
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