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The James Bond Debate Thread - 336 Craig looks positively younger in SP than he does in SF.

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  • MrBondMrBond Station S
    Posts: 2,044
    Agree- this is one utter dissapointing endning. There wasn't much of tense or pace. It has always felt a bit "meh" to me.
  • RogueAgentRogueAgent
    Posts: 12,506
    DarthDimi wrote:
    <font color=tomato size=4><b>THESIS 203</b></font>

    <font color=blue size=7><b>FYEO's climax was too down-to-Earth, even for a more 'serious' Bond film.</b></font>

    Disagree. Certainly one of Roger's better films. Felt it was abit of an anticlimax. Was hoping he would throw Kristatos off the cliff instead of the ATAC!
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,028
    disagree. but i have to admit that for me the tension lies in the feeling of the cold war, and that setting might be lost on those born after 1989. but with that feeling, it's an extremely tense finale.
  • BeatlesSansEarmuffsBeatlesSansEarmuffs
    Posts: 3,564
    I quite enjoyed the climax to FYEO. "That's detante, comrade!" In the context of its time, this was a perfect finale, and a very satisfying chaser after the excesses of MR.
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 5,634
    Wasn't so much 'down to earth' as 'up from earth' maybe, as Bond goes 'up in the world' to face Kristatos at the Saint Cyrils monastery. The biggest issue, as before, is that it takes so damn long for anything to occur. Moore seems to take forever to reach the summit and it's easy to lose interest after so many viewings. Even when you reach the top and Aris gets killed (Skyfall similar), and Bond throws away the ATAC device to prevent Gogol from having, nothing really much occurs. Poor ending, poor last twenty minutes even, as what came before was a very decent and straight faced adventure. Easily Moore's last truly fine James Bond outing. All said, going against thesis on this one
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    edited April 2013 Posts: 23,626
    <font color=tomato size=4><b>THESIS 204</b></font>

    <font color=blue size=7><b>"The cinema was a duller place before 007." [Dilys Powell of The Sunday Times on Thunderball.]</b></font>
  • M_BaljeM_Balje Amsterdam, Netherlands
    edited April 2013 Posts: 4,460
    Re: 204: The cinema was a duller place before 007."

    I think i must agree. The Saint whyle it be from 1962 too the first 3 seasons be in Black and White. From my point of view Bond movies from that time and 70's are viewable too because it stil exist or people around it, atleast you know who Sean Connery be, but don't have any idea about Gary Grant.

    That Mad Men be in color and pick up thing's to show in present day people don't know because there not exist yet. A reasen i also like to see Mad Men go to in to the 70's, shame that wil end after season 7 (1968/1969).
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    edited April 2013 Posts: 12,837
    Agree. Bond kickstarted the 60s spy craze and pretty much invented the big budget action blockbuster.

    Without Bond we probably wouldn't have Indiana Jones, Austin Powers and countless others.
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    Posts: 4,422
    DarthDimi wrote:
    <font color=tomato size=4><b>THESIS 204</b></font>

    <font color=blue size=7><b>"The cinema was a duller place before 007." [Dilys Powell of The Sunday Times on Thunderball.]</b></font>

    Agree

    Before 007 you had the "kitchen sink dramas" (of which Harry Saltzman was involved in), and that was weighing cinema down.

    Then you had 007, with his take on modern sex qupping and violence, plus all the pretty locals Bond frequented, which allowed cinema audiences to get out of their humdrum lives.

  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 7,653
    Disagree, that would disqualify so many great movies that have given me more fun or as much fun as a token 007 movie.

    Anybody who agrees has still a lot to see when it comes to movies, and that makes me kind of jealous.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,028
    I agree. Not on the basis that there weren't any good films out, or going to come out that weren't influenced by Bond, but the sheer amount of films that were would've made cinema duller then it is now. I mean, no Bond, no Bourne, No Austin Powers, no Johnny English, no Get Smart, no..... etc.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    I have to agree with this one, no matter how many other great films have been out since the inception of cinema. I can't think of many series where the newest film's release is so palpably celebrated. When you go to see a Bond film it is an event of the highest cinematic order, and its history of rocking the box office reflects that. The premieres are always the biggest and the excitement the greatest for the newest Bond adventure.
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 5,634
    There was lots of great theater releases before Bond, but of course Bond was responsible for so many spin offs and spoof series such as (the awful) Austin Powers so there was more variety for the cinema-going audience to enjoy. Before 1962, there was (of course) a near plethora of films with substance with celebrated actors such as James Stewart, James Cagney and even John Wayne giving stellar performances, but Bond took the Spy phenomenon to a new level and introduced so many other things for audiences to indulge in

    Thesis seems accurate enough
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,028
    And of course skyrocketing Sean Connery's career, which for instance made 'the man who would be king' possible
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,626
    <font color=tomato size=4><b>THESIS 205</b></font>

    <font color=blue size=7><b>"Moore looked in better shape than in the previous Bond film, Octopussy" [John Brosnan on A View to a Kill]</b></font>
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,333
    Disagree. To me Roger looked to be in great Shape in Octopussy. In AVTAK he looked alot older and a little bit on the frail side.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    edited April 2013 Posts: 13,350
    He may have been in better shape but if by "better shape" you include the look of his face, certainly not.

    God knows what else John Brosnan said about A View To A Kill... ;)
  • TuuliaTuulia
    Posts: 2,081
    Samuel001 wrote:
    He may have been in better shape but if by "better shape" you include the look of his face, certainly not.

    Yup. Just saw AVTAK yesterday and Octopussy a week ago. He looked ok in Octopussy, but far too old for the job in AVTAK.

  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 23,626
    I disagree myself. Moore still did things convincingly in OP but he was a trifle too aged for the job in AVTAK IMO.
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    edited April 2013 Posts: 12,837
    Completely disagree. I thought he was fine in OP but seemed to have aged pretty badly in AVTAK.

    Most of the time he still managed to do a great job but whenever there was an action scene it was just embarrassing.
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    Posts: 4,422
    Hmm, tricky one.

    If one is going by Moore's body, he doesn't look too bad, certainly better than Octopussy. (take the hot tub scene).

    However time stands still for no man, and Sir Rog, looks past it, so

    Disagree
  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 7,653
    Roger Moore always cut a Saintly figure, but even I have to admit that perhaps AVTAK was one movie too much. The movie was still a very decent spy-movie, and with Mr. Steed around they should have made better use of STeeds skills.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,904
    He was looking passed it in FYEO, and looked progressively worse all the way up to the abysmal AVTAK, which is horrid in every aspect.

    If were are saying that Moore looked in better shape in AVTAK, than in OP, then I would disagree.

  • AgentJamesBond007AgentJamesBond007 Vesper’s grave
    Posts: 2,630
    I disagree. Roger looked older in OP but still plausible as James Bond but in AVTAK, he looked like he was out of place. And he looked like he aged badly in the two years in between, as he looks like a grandfather.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,459
    Definitely disagree with thesis 205. Roger was indeed in fine form in Octopussy but there was a very noticeable decline in AVTAK.

    Who is John Brosnan? Can anyone tell me, please? (UK critic? I have no idea ...)

    And I agree with thesis 204.
  • 00130013
    Posts: 1,817
    Disagree. Not only he looked older but different and weird.
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 5,634
    From what I can ascertain from the latest thesis, which is that, Roger Moore appeared in better condition for A View to a Kill than Octopussy, then it's a bit of a nonsense. Moore still looked plausible in the part by Moonraker, but with the advent of the 1980s, things started to deteriorate rapidly. For Your Eyes Only was a great success though. Can't disagree with thesis more on this one. You saw more of Moore's stunt double in 1985 than the actor himself. At least in Octopussy, Roger was a bit more, ever present, so to speak
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,333
    Moore had a lot of stunt doubles in AVTAK according to this.
    http://theincrediblesuit.blogspot.com/2012/02/blogalongabond-view-to-kill.html
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 5,634
    Murdock wrote:
    Moore had a lot of stunt doubles in AVTAK according to this.
    http://theincrediblesuit.blogspot.com/2012/02/blogalongabond-view-to-kill.html

    'Fairly certain that's Vladimir Putin'. Heh..

    good find @Murdock
  • identigraphidentigraph
    Posts: 1,052
    he may have slimmed down a bit from OP to AVTAK (possibly due to only signing on late for OP) but in the face he had definitley aged a lot from OP.
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