The Alternative Diamonds are Forever.

barryt007barryt007 Getting counselling by Sir Roger over Kara Milovy
edited March 2017 in Bond Movies Posts: 17,675
Thinking about DAF and the ending on the oil rig etc got me recollecting the other option that DAF was going to be,as explained here on Wikipedia,to save me time :

'The original plot had as a villain Auric Goldfinger's twin, seeking revenge for the death of his brother. The plot was later changed after Albert R. Broccoli had a dream, where his close friend Howard Hughes was replaced by an imposter. So the character of Willard Whyte was created, and Tom Mankiewicz was chosen to rework the script. The adaptation eliminated the main villains from the source Ian Fleming novel, mobsters called Jack and Seraffimo Spang, but used the henchmen Shady Tree, Mr. Wint and Mr. Kidd.

Richard Maibaum's original idea for the ending was a giant boat chase across Lake Mead with Blofeld being pursued by Bond and all the Las Vegas casino owners who would be sailing in their private yachts. Bond would rouse the allies into action with a spoof of Lord Nelson's famous cry, "Las Vegas expects every man to do his duty." Maibaum was misinformed; there were no Roman galleys or Chinese junks in Las Vegas, and the idea was too expensive to replicate, so it was dropped.

Maibaum may have thought the eventual oil rig finale a poor substitute, but it was originally intended to be much more spectacular. Armed frogmen would jump from the helicopters into the sea and attach limpet mines to the rig's legs (this explains why frogmen appear on the movie's poster). Blofeld would have escaped in his BathoSub and Bond would have pursued him hanging from a weather balloon.The chase would have then continued across a salt mine with the two mortal enemies scrambling over the pure white hills of salt before Blofeld would fall to his death in a salt granulator. Permission was not granted by the owners of the salt mine. It also made the sequence too long. Further problems followed when the explosives set up for the finale were set off too early; fortunately, a handful of cameras were ready and able to capture the footage'.


How do you feel about this DAF against the one filmed ?

Personally i think it would have had a more satisfying ending with the salt mine scene but the rest of the ideas seem to be worse !!

Or do you think of any other ideas that may have made DAF better in your opinion ?
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Comments

  • That plot seems just as bad as the original. DAF could never be salvaged unless it had entire different cast of actors and an entirely different plot. It could have been great if the producers/writers would have made it a meaningful revenge plot with a darker tone. The single biggest missed opportunity in the franchise.
  • DJCLE84DJCLE84 formerly HASEROT ---has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    edited March 2011 Posts: 4,258
    after years of watching Diamonds Are Forever - it seems weird to picture any other ending to it.... but, i do wish Blofeld was finally dispatched in more drawn out and personal manner.... but, the style of Diamonds Are Forever, with Sean coming back for one last go - is almost in way dismissing the style of OHMSS altogether... which is funny, because they'll still go on to reference it throughout the series from time to time..

    the film is what it is - it couldn't have really pushed itself much worse than it was, but it would've taken a lot more - A LOT more, to improve it..
  • Quoting haserot:
    the film is what it is - it couldn't have really pushed itself much worse than it was, but it would've taken a lot more - A LOT more, to improve it..
    Well put!
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    edited March 2011 Posts: 16,238
    I love the idea of a group of diamond smugglers discretely being assimilated by a third party. It has a hitchcockian feeling to it. If only they could have brought in Bond fully loaded with hatred and Tiffany as the tormented girl she is in the novel, it would have given the film a totally different dynamic. Of course DAF would have been more serious too if I had something to say about it. I’d leave out all the silly stuff, and there’s plenty of that, and the entire oil rig scene would have to be rewritten. You see I don’t mind a confrontation between Bond and his nemesis on an oil rig. It could stage a few tremendously thrilling scenes, especially when pressure’s building in the pipes and you just know the thing’s out of control. But like I said, my version of DAF would be different, (more) serious and therefore probably a less ‘pleasant’ film to watch.
  • DJCLE84DJCLE84 formerly HASEROT ---has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    Posts: 4,258
    @DarthDimi

    I feel the same exact way - but about TMWTGG...
  • NicNacNicNac Moderator
    Posts: 6,615
    The DAF ending was certainly limp and disappointing. It needed more urgency.

    Basically anything would have been an improvement.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 12,914
    DAF is 4th in my ranking, can't see how its awesomeness could possibly be improved. One little gem of a movie.
  • Posts: 1,497
    I have two opposing feelings on DAF:

    1. It is one brilliant, happy accident, quintessential Bondian experience
    2. Had Lazenby been in it, it would have been a completely different film and probably the best of the series.

    As it currently stands, revisionist history aside, DAF is fantastic. Given that Connery returns with Guy Hamilton directing and the overall campy feel of the film, I don't think it could have been made much better. I think the whole Goldfinger twin/Lake Meade boat chase/salt mine chase would have been a terrible idea for this adaptation.

    I only have nit-picky things to add. I wouldn't have Tiffany firing that maching gun and falling over board, and perhaps Blofeld should have been dispatched in a more satisfying way. Also, all of the deleted scenes should have been left in to make that whole Plenty plot hole bit less confusing. Also why did they edit out Sammy Davis for crying out loud? He IS Vegas!

    If DAF had been Lazenby's film, DAF should have followed the book, to include the Spang brothers. Also I would have incorporated the You Only Live Twice novel bits with Blofeld to end the Blofeld trilogy. The Salt Mine chase could have worked as Lazenby's revenge story. The Lazenby/Savalas finale was much more physical, and the Salt Mine scenes could have played up to this rivalry. Lastly, we couldn't leave out Irma Bundt, but they would need another actress, since Ilsa Steppat passed away shortly after OHMSS

    That's all I'd say though. I'm certainly happy with the DAF we have.
  • Posts: 946
    My alternative DAF would be to film it like the novel was written. Add in Blofeld as the smuggling mastermind behind the Spangs, have Bond go after him with revenge filled hate and boom, ya got something special there.
  • Posts: 1,859
    Okay???? I can't comment on the goldfinger thing. I've never read the original novel but i think that was the only way the film could be saved.
  • Posts: 4,732
    I really wish the whole armed frogmen/weather balloon/salt mine thing had been used. I absolutely love DAF, but in all honesty, the climax is a bit of a shabby ending to a great Bond movie. It would have been really exciting to see Bond and Blofeld duke it out one last time before Blofeld's ultimate fate. After the Blofeld Trilogy of YOLT, OHMSS, and DAF, we were sort of left expecting a grand finish to the sinister SPECTRE leader. It never ceases to amaze me how the best ideas for Bond movies get cut or become deleted scenes.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,192
    The frogman would have added a lot to the end of Diamonds Are Forever, as would Bond's battle to the death with Blofeld in the South African salt mine to the lackluster finale we had - on such a great location as well.
  • Posts: 4,732
    Agreed! That oil rig would have been a real treat- if the finale had been what was originally planned. You can just picture the original climax in your head. I bet that would have raised DAF up as one of the better Bond movies in many people's minds.
  • Posts: 562
    The DAF ending was certainly limp and disappointing. It needed more urgency.
    More urgency? The monotonous countdown didn't do it for you?

    ;;)
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    edited June 2011 Posts: 3,260
    DAF is perhaps the weirdest film in the series. The diamond trail is interesting but made unnecessarily convoluted. Tiffany/Bond tracking the diamonds and Wint/Kidd tracking them are intriguing dramatically. The locations work beautifully--particularly South Africa, Amsterdam, and even Vegas, which was much more a Bondian playground then than now.

    With Connery and without the revenge plot, it would have played better as the follow-up to YOLT. Even the moon buggy might have worked. It wasn't that far a leap from YOLT.

    With Lazenby and after OHMSS, they would have had to strip much of the campiness away. That wouldn't have been impossible, but it probably would have required recasting Blofeld (in drag!), Tiffany (falling off the rig!), Wint, and Kidd (murderous, humorous gays!), as all are played for camp value. The Willard Whyte storyline isn't terrible (because Howard Hughes was fascinating) but again the role would have to be recast, and in a tougher film, Blofeld would have killed him.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 12,914
    Yes I would have loved to see Lazenby's revenge flick in DAF... But I also loved Connery's DAF, as I put in #3 in my ranking !! So I can't really decide...
  • Posts: 4,732
    @DaltonCraig007: Same here! I was very pleased with Connery's performance in DAF, but I would have also liked to have seen Lazenby as 007 for a second time around, with a revenge plot on Blofeld and SPECTRE.
  • Posts: 1,497
    With Connery and without the revenge plot, it would have played better as the follow-up to YOLT. Even the moon buggy might have worked. It wasn't that far a leap from YOLT.
    I have always said that DAF as it was made should be treated as a follow up to YOLT. It works great in this sense. OHMSS should be treated as a standalone film.

  • Posts: 4,732
    Personally, I don't have any comlaints about the revenge pre-title sequence of DAF. People always act like it wasn't enough, but seriously, what more could have been done? Bond tracked down his arch-enemy, beat him up, and tossed him into a boiling mud pit! Presto! Bond believes he's killed the real SPECTRE leader, and that's that. It's not his fault that was a Blofeld double. Besides, you'd think he'd be content to leave it at that.
  • Posts: 1,497
    @00Beast: Indeed, that scene is brilliant. As I said as a "non-OHMSS follow up" it works great. There was no love storey between Connery's Bond and Tracy, so why even mention it? They don't, yet on the other hand they don't completely leave the loose end of Blofeld open either. It worked perfectly in the context of the film.

    While we're championing the DAF opening scene...You forgot to mention one of the best deliveries of "Bond, James Bond" in the series, rivaled only by Connery himself in Dr. No, followed up by the two handed bikini-flip choke. Total awesomeness. Is there anything 1971 Connery Bond can't do? Truly legendary.
  • Posts: 4,732
    You're right, JBFan626! That "Bond...James Bond" before the bikini choke is a really good one. It's delivered sharply, to-the-point, and with authority!
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,192
    You're right, JBFan626! That "Bond...James Bond" before the bikini choke is a really good one. It's delivered sharply, to-the-point, and with authority!
    It's also dubbed. The "correct" version can be heard in some of the trailers for the film, found on the UE DVD.
  • Posts: 1,497
    It's also dubbed. The "correct" version can be heard in some of the trailers for the film, found on the UE DVD.
    Is the dubbed version a better take? That would be the reason why I think they would dub it in--to give it an extra exlamation point.

  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,192
    It's also dubbed. The "correct" version can be heard in some of the trailers for the film, found on the UE DVD.
    Is the dubbed version a better take? That would be the reason why I think they would dub it in--to give it an extra exlamation point.

    Not at all in my opinion. You can just tell Connery seems off and it doesn't even really sound like him saying that "Bond. James Bond" compared to the scene that follows with Marie only seconds later.
  • Posts: 4,732
    @Samuel001: That is very true. In the following scene he sounds much different than his previous line. I'd never noticed that until you brought that up!
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    edited June 2011 Posts: 13,192
    25 seconds in is how it should have been in the finished film:

  • I must say the original version sounds so much more like Connery than the dubbed version.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,192
    I must say the original version sounds so much more like Connery than the dubbed version.
    The same problem occurred with The Living Daylights, a much better take from Dalton was in the trailer but never made it into the film.
  • Posts: 4,732
    Man, that original Connery "Bond...James Bond" was much better than that cheap dubbed line.
  • Posts: 1,497
    Yes, agreed, the final version is much stronger than the dubbed version.

    But Connery has such a towering presence, that even with the dubbing, makes for a great scene.
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